Talk:List of Middle-earth weapons/Archive 2

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[edit] Why the emphasis on Jackson movies?

A list of Middle-earth weapons shouldn't include movie-only weapons. These should be mentioned in the movie articles, and a link to there provided from here, but there is no need to raise these movie-only weapons to the same status as weapons found in the books. The whole structure of the Tolkien articles should be centred around the books and their author, with the film articles being subsidiary to that. Carcharoth 01:18, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

I couldn't agree with you more. I basically just left the "movie" section of this list as I found it, but I can definitely see a strong argument for removing it completely. Does anyone else have an opinion on this? Otherwise I'll just go for it (making sure we retain any useful information in relevant articles). --Alataristarion 01:45, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
Just one note - if you remove text from this article, and reinsert it into other articles, please make clear in the edit summaries where the text is being moved to and where it came from, and that you personally did not write it (unless you did). This is important to maintain attribution under the GFDL (the license by which people release their contributions to Wikipedia). If you are not sure, please ask. See also WP:SPLIT for the problems with splitting up text. Carcharoth 03:19, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
Sgt. Gothmog (race unspecified in book), Lurtz, and any other original Orcs should be removed from List of Middle-earth Orcs then. I'll put them in List of original characters in the Lord of the Rings film trilogy. General information about movie weapons and armor details can be covered elsewhere - like Uruk-hai crossbows (basically, there's a lot more plate armor in the Jackson films while Tolkien mostly writes about scale and chain mail, since Middle-earth probably isn't as medieval as Jackson or rather John Howe depicted it). Where to put Hadhafang and lhang? Uthanc 08:25, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
The information on Hadhafang and lhang won't be lost as it will be included in the individual articles at least. --Alataristarion 09:08, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Problem with double redirects and copy-paste instead of move

This article was recently copy-pasted from Weapons of Middle-earth and a redirect placed there. See here. The article should have been moved, not copy-pasted. Could editing please stop until this has been repaired? (I'll try and do it tomorrow). Also, the redirect was put in place without fixing the double redirects. See Special:Whatlinkshere/Weapons_of_Middle-earth to see all the double redirects that haven't been fixed. Please read WP:MOVE for details. Please ask if you have any questions. Carcharoth 03:25, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

Oops, didn't see this. Uthanc 08:25, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
I'm sorry about this, I created the new name too quickly without reading the stuff I should have first. I'll try to fix the double redirects that came up as a result. Thanks for catching this and letting me know. --Alataristarion 08:52, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
It's OK. It can be repaired fairly easily. Depending on the amount of editing that has taken place (I see that Alataristarion did some formatting stuff and a small sentence, but Uthanc did a fairly extensive rewrite), would either of you two object to having this article deleted (you'll have to both sign a {{db-author}} speedy deletion template) so that we can effectively go back to the last version at Weapons of Middle-earth before it was turned into a redirect, and then move it (and the page history) here, then you two can re-add your edits and we will have effectively merged the edit history at both articles. If you two agree to this, I propose the following steps:
  • (DONE) Move this talk page to a subpage of Talk:Weapons of Middle-earth (it will effectively be an archive), for example Talk:Weapons of Middle-earth/Archive 2 Talk:List of Middle-earth weapons (it will effectively be an archive), for example Talk:List of Middle-earth weapons/Archive 2.
  • (DONE) add the db-author speedy deletion template to List of Middle-earth weapons.
  • (DONE) Wait for the article and talk page (which will now be a redirect) to be deleted.
  • (DONE) Revert Weapons of Middle-earth to version before redirect and move to the list title.
  • (DONE) Archive the old discussion.
  • (MOVED TO NEW TALK PAGE) Restart discussion on the talk page.
  • (MOVED TO NEW TALK PAGE) Re-do the missing edits.
Does this sound OK? Carcharoth 14:04, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
Fine with me. I've saved the last edited version to my hard drive. How do we go about it? Like this> (using <nowiki>): Uthanc 18:07, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

{{db-meta|This page was mistakenly created, no one other than its original authors, [[User:Alataristarion]] and [[User:Uthanc]] have made substantial edits, and they request its deletion or have blanked the page. (<small>[[WP:CSD#G7|CSD G7]]</small>).|self=yes}}

That sounds fine. I'll move the talk page now, and archive the current talk page at that location. I think Alataristarion will be fine with this, and if you make clear that this is just a deletion to fix page history, it should be fine (point any queries towards this discussion). Could you go ahead with the db request? Thanks. Carcharoth 23:43, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Naming Anglachel and Narsil articles

I believe Gurthang is more significant than Anglachel, and possibly Andúril more than Narsil, but the swords' articles are named after their first iterations. What to use? Is there any policy or consensus on this? Uthanc 08:25, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

I wanted to include both names in the list, since 1) in many respects they function as two different weapons in terms of history, time of use, etc and, more importantly, 2) it makes looking up a specific weapon in the list easier if both names are listed. However, for the individual articles themselves, I just created Anglachel since it was first in alphabetical order, and Narsil already existed. I could definitely see an argument for switching these around though, since you're right, Gurthang and Andúril are probably the more significant names. --Alataristarion 09:05, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
I agree, with the proviso that this brings up all sorts of spoiler issues. But hey, this is not really crucial plot point, so it shouldn't be a problem. Carcharoth 13:42, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Explanation of strange archive history

This archive page was created by a move and then edited after the move. This is because of various contortions while fixing a cut and paste move. More explanatory links will be added here later if needed. Carcharoth 00:21, 28 December 2006 (UTC)