Talk:List of Macintosh software

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

To-do list for List of Macintosh software: edit · history · watch · refresh

Here are some tasks you can do:
Articles for deletion This article was nominated for deletion on September 11, 2006. The result of the discussion was keep.
Articles for deletion This article was nominated for deletion 14/3/2008. The result of discussion was Keep.

Contents

[edit] Article scope?

How does this compare to List of Macintosh software? Is this only a list of apps written _by_ Apple? Peter S. 20:29, 18 December 2005 (UTC)

List of Apple software seems to be arranged by name while List of Macintosh software is arranged by category. Both could be useful in finding software so maybe in the intro to each they should mention something like “if you want it arranged by type/name view List of Macintosh software/List of Apple software”. If you wanted to merge the two Macintosh has more links to it then Apple does.--E-Bod 05:45, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

It looks really superfluous to me to have two lists. Let's merge them into List of Macintosh software, sorted by category, do you agree? What do we do with all those small icons? I kinda like them, but they also add clutter... Peter S. 10:11, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

I’m Not sure if the articles should be merged but it’s worth a discussion. I already added the Merge template to spark discussion and so people viewing ether page know there is a similar page. This tag should also mark the article out and bring in people to discuss it. I am new to Wikpidia so don’t let me talk you into it. I don’t object to Merging them. As far as the Icons go I Like them and maybe we should find ones for the rest. I am moving the Discussion to Talk:List of Macintosh software because that is were the merge tag links the discussion to.--E-Bod 21:40, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

List of Apple software has

 This article is part of WikiProject Macintosh. This means that the WikiProject has identified it as an article pertaining to the Macintosh, but is not currently working to improve it. WikiProject Macintosh itself is an attempt to improve, grow, standardize, and attain featured status for Wikipedia's articles related to Macintosh and Apple Inc. We need all your help, so join in today!
??? This article has not yet received a rating on the assessment scale.

So the other page has some advantages over this one

I added a link to List of Apple software on IAPP that makes more sense linking to List of Apple software than List of Macintosh software because all the "iApps" are together. If we merge them into Macintosh then we could fix the link I made.--E-Bod 21:56, 7 March 2006 (UTC)
Also List of Apple software contains lots of un written article links while this list only allows links to written articles--E-Bod 22:14, 7 March 2006 (UTC)
That is actually a very good point for a non-merge. I haven't made up my mind yet. Peter S. 22:19, 7 March 2006 (UTC)
I oppose a merge. While the 2 lists will have some overlap, the scope of this list is to list all software by Apple, whether it has an article or not at this point. Dread Lord CyberSkull ✎☠ 12:09, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
Ok. I think we all agree that the articles should not merge. Should I Remove the Merge tags now or wait a while first (or somebody else can remove them if they feel so compelled). Also any recommendations about having the articles reference each other so somebody can choose the article they want to read. I don't know the best way to phrase it. maybe something like
"For an alphabetic unabridged list see List of Apple software" "for a categorized main list see List of Macintosh software"
--E-Bod 22:25, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
I think we should wait a few more days. When we remove the merge notes, we should clarify the "List of Apple software" article and say what it's rules are and why it can stand on its own. Peter S. 00:58, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Policy: No Win apps etc.

There is a big catalogue of windows software that runs on Mac OS inside Parallels Workstation, and a whole lot of X11 apps run on Mac OS with the help of X11. But are they "Macintosh software"? I'd like to suggest that we require listed applications to run directly on Mac OS, i.e. not needing emulators, other OS or other compatibility layer enhancers like X11. We might create another list for those special cases, if anyone is interested. I suggest we make this an official policy here. Anybody disagree? Peter S. 13:03, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

Siuch a policy seems resonable to keep the artricle length managable. Mac applications like the Mac version of OpenOffice.org or Mac version of Gimp which require X11 to run, should be listed in a seperate article on X11 Mac Apps. --Cab88 11:46, 21 April 2006 (UTC)
Also, I think there should be a differentiation between OS X applications and "classic" applications. Theshibboleth 06:10, 23 November 2006 (UTC)
It's important to distinguish between classic applications, which don't run on Mac Intel (imo they shouldn't appear in this article), PPC-only applications, which run emulated on Mac Intel, and Intel/universal which run at full speed on current hardware. Windows applications don't belong to the list of Macintosh software much more than Apple II or PDP-8 applications (to make this clearer, we could rename the article "list of Mac OS software"). Distinction between Cocoa/Carbon, X11, and Java/Swing is less clear, because they can abide by Mac guidelines to some extent. Matlab (Java/X11) is a good example: not very well integrated, but the Mathworks have tried... Engelec 11:52, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] And many more...

There are hundreds, perhaps thousands, of additional applications available for the Macintosh. A whole category (i.e., Business and Finance) is missing. Among these are multiple products from Trendsetter Software: http://www.trendsoft.com You'll find additional products here: http://www.software4mac.com

Thousands, of course, but this list is limited to applications which have a WP article. Engelec 11:59, 23 November 2006 (UTC)


I'm also wondering why there is no link to Apple's own database at Macintosh Products Guide. Also, can I move the applications called defunct to List of old Macintosh software? Any objections? Connectionfailure 07:56, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
Hi, I started List of old Macintosh software and you're welcome to move any application there that can no longer run on the latest intel Macs. If it is no longer produced, but can still run fine, please leave it on this page here. Thanks! Peter S. 15:26, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Proposed Deletion

Removed PROD. If you think this should be deleted, I suggest you start an AfD discussion.Klausness (talk) 00:50, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Split

For this article to be useful at all, it should be split between the distinctly different OSes Mac OS X and Mac OS -Halo (talk) 08:51, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

The way I understand it, this page contains all apps that still run today on Macs (so, in effect, Mac OS X apps). Anything that doesn't run in the latest OS may be listed at List of old Macintosh software. Enobeno (talk) 23:42, 20 March 2008 (UTC)
That's my understanding, too. Since it's been at least a year or two since any new Macintoshes have been able to run pre-OS X software, it would make sense to move all such software to the list of old macintosh software. Klausness (talk) 14:07, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Then I'm going to boldly move this article to List of Mac OS X software, and move the other to List of Mac OS software -Halo (talk) 12:22, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was no consensus. JPG-GR (talk) 18:17, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

List of Macintosh software → List of Mac OS X software — Similarly, the current List of old Macintosh software will be moved to List of Mac OS software. —Halo (talk) 12:26, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Survey

Feel free to state your position on the renaming proposal by beginning a new line in this section with *'''Support''' or *'''Oppose''', then sign your comment with ~~~~. Since polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account Wikipedia's naming conventions.
  • Oppose. I would disagree with the move. There is a lot of software that is available for both OS X and the old Mac OS, and with your suggested move, that would be appropriate for both lists, creating a lot of needless redundancy. Also, there will eventually be OS X software that is no longer available, and that should then go to the list of old software. I think most people would not expect a list called "List of Macintosh Software" to include only obsolete software. "List of Macintosh Software" is where most wikipedia users would expect to find current software, so that's where current software should be listed. Klausness (talk) 12:31, 23 March 2008 (UTC)
  • It wouldn't be redundancy because Mac OS X software is significantly different from Mac OS software - it has a different set of UI guidelines, a different set of widgets, is a different programming environment and the platforms aren't inherently compatible with each other. List of Macintosh Software should be a disambiguation page between the two operating systems. What you're proposing is that the page should be "List of current Macintosh software", except that's not what it's named and isn't anywhere near as useful. By visiting a page called "List of Mac OS X software" I'd expect, well, a complete-ish list of Mac OS X software, and if I visited "List of Macintosh software" I'd expect a complete list of Macintosh software. -Halo (talk) 12:43, 23 March 2008 (UTC)
Except that most people don't think of "Macintosh software" as referring to only OS 9 and earlier Macintosh software. As far as most people are concerned, "Macintosh software" is software that's designed to run on their Macintosh (which is probably running OS X). There's an argument to be made for merging the list of old macintosh software into the list of macintosh software (in fact, that's what I first suggested in the AfD discussion), but I now think it's worth keeping the lists separate because some people have an interest in historical software. Klausness (talk) 01:05, 24 March 2008 (UTC)
Anything that is just pre-OS X (like Claris Works) is already obsolete. All lists should be merged, with one section for still-supported software and one section for all other software. Althepal (talk) 01:19, 24 March 2008 (UTC)
I'd be OK with merging the two lists, too. But I think having "List of Macintosh software" as the list of obsolete software and "List of OS X software" as the list of current software is a bad idea. Klausness (talk) 11:39, 24 March 2008 (UTC)
  • I actually like it the way it is: Macintosh is a term everybody understands. The simplest title refers to current software, and the same title with "old" added refers to software that no longer runs. Your suggestion ("of Mac OS X" / "of Mac OS") is difficult to understand and it requries professional know-how to spot and understand the difference. Enobeno (talk) 23:38, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Discussion

Any additional comments:
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.