Talk:List of Kid Nation participants

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This article was nominated for deletion on 8 February 2008. The result of the discussion was keep.

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the List of Kid Nation participants article.
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Contents 1 (5K-4D-5M) 2 category 3 The Other 36 Kids 4 Guylan? 5 More AfD 6 order of names 7 Zach 8 41 kids. Hmm...

[edit] (5K-4D-5M)

Considering that the "vote" came in at 5 Keep, 4 Delete, and 5 Merge (into a Participants article), I think that to say "the result" was for deleting the articles / redirecting them isn't even close to an accurate statement. Better said, there was no clear consensus, but there was consensus to keep the content in one way or another. Generally, those "voting" keep indicated that merging them together into this article here would be preferable. I think that, putting a 9-4, is as close to consensus as is usually seen.

Thusly, in the Spirit of Wikipedia and the Nature of Persecution-Seeking, I'm creating the page that was actually the general consensus (far more than any other given option).

VigilancePrime (talk) 07:37, 29 November 2007 (UTC)

Actually, I'm kind of happy with the result. Honestly, I voted keep before I realized merging them into this article was an option. I think it is the best compromise for both sides because one, it reduces the number of articles with questionable notability (in other words, it gives the deletionists less to complain about) and two, we don't have to lose any information that was already in those articles, which makes us happy. At least this way we can add information about the other kids who aren't as notable as these seven. Even though they wouldn't stand a chance having their own article, any information that we can add for them here would be perfectly legitimate. Ospinad (talk) 14:37, 29 November 2007 (UTC)

Agreed. VigilancePrime (talk) 18:19, 29 November 2007 (UTC)

Not sure how judgement day works. The mod redirected the articles to Kid Nation? And I take it that the information is being fished out from the original articles and placed here? The merged data is a stronger article, should anybody attempt to nominate it. Can editors redirect the links to this page and to the entry for each person instead of the main article? MMetro (talk) 08:17, 30 November 2007 (UTC)

Nor I. Yes. Correct. Agreed. Done. VigilancePrime (talk) 12:17, 30 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] category

I've created a new category (Lists of reality show participants, if there was already one like it then I couldn't find it) to put this article in it, and I also tried to populate it with as many similar articles that I could find. Maybe we can look to some of them for ideas on how to format and expand this article? Ospinad 15:50, 30 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The Other 36 Kids

Is there a plan to put in entries for the other 36 kids? DoubleVibro (talk) 01:06, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

Go for it! :-) VigilancePrime (talk) 01:15, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

I went and included all the participants listed at IMDB and linked to their IMDB pages. More work in needed, including adding an intro line for each kid and linking their CBS.com page. This is not all 40, as IMDB only lists, I think, 30 of them (give or take). VigilancePrime (talk) 20:33, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Guylan?

Was Guylan really raised by animal trainers, and is he really wiccan? Pancakeparty (talk) 01:25, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

Yes to the first; he mentioned this in one of the later episodes. As for the latter, I do not know directly. Check out the links; they may have that information (I'm not the one who put that in there). VigilancePrime (talk) 02:21, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

I put it there. He says it at the very end of the interview he gave during episode #4 (the religion episode). It wasn't shown during the episode but you can see it at cbs.com here: http://www.cbs.com/primetime/kid_nation/video.php?mode=kids&kid=14&showid=163697&autostart=1 Ospinad (talk) 15:48, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] More AfD

Well, There's another AfD (Vote for Deletion) for the Laurel McGoff article. As one can see, Laurel clearly has enough content to have a standalone article, as a couple others within this page may eventually have (some have quite a bit of info). We (meaning myself (talk) and Pak21 (talk), the pusher for deletion) would appreciate comment and "votes" on the page, be they Keep or Delete. Have a great day everyone! VigilancePrime (talk) 20:33, 19 December 2007 (UTC) :-)

Sophia Wise could easily get her own article too, but I don't think either are notable enough yet. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.162.58.225 (talk) 22:29, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] order of names

does anyone else think it would be better if the names were in order by first name? Since their last names were never said during the show and we basically just got their last names from imdb (not to mention the fact that not all 40 kids are included because we don't know the last names of some of them) I just think it would be easier to find a specific kid if it were in order by first name. Ospinad (talk) 15:52, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps, but are typical Wikipedia articles of this nature not ordered by last name? We COULD link each kid's name from the KN page to the specific section on the List page. I don't know if there's really any precedent for that, though, and could be seen as over-linking. There's no great solution for this, only a couple decent ones. I think it would be best to err on the side of WikiPrecedent and WikiConsistency. VigilancePrime (talk) 17:20, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Looking through the articles in the [Category: Lists of reality show participants] it seems that there hasn't really been a consistent way of ordering these types of articles. For example, The Amazing Race 1 contestants listed them by first name in no particular order, List of The Apprentice candidates (UK) lists them by order of last name and List of Big Brother 7 HouseGuests (U.S.) lists them by order of first name (even though all their last names are known). Ospinad (talk) 17:59, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Since several of the kids not included here nor (apparently) at the IMDB (eg: "Alex") don't even have a last name provided (at least not at the official CBS site), I think it would be appropriate to re-order them in order of first name. This is how it is done at the CBS site. I am going to experiment with first name and then last name in parentheses when known - for example John (Smith), and see how that goes over. It is probably better to have a complete list with a unique style, due to the structure of the series and age of the participants, as opposed to leaving kids off because they are not included at the IMDB and their last name is not currently (or at some point was not apparently) available. It is also conceivable that some of the kids were provided with a "stage name" surname for the series, for privacy concerns. Officially the kids are called by a first name only, and I think it makes some sense for us to carry on in that style, at least for aphabetizing of the list purposes. --T-dot ( ^Talk/contribs ) 16:55, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

Good idea with the parentheses! I expect that ill be the best solution. VigilancePrime (talk) 17:01, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Zach

Is this note about Zach ("In the first episode of Kid Nation, Jonathon Karsh was saying some were poor. And some were rich and they showed Zach, which suggests he is rich.") really necessary? Not only is it poorly written, it doesn't seem particularly encyclopedic If no one objects, I'll remove it. 69.236.71.61 (talk) 08:52, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Agreed, and already done. Classic example of Synthesis. It certainly may be true, and the producers may have intended for us to think so, but we can't really state it as a fact without something a little more concrete. --T-dot ( ^Talk/contribs ) 20:29, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

Excellent, thank you! 69.236.87.51 (talk) 08:25, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] 41 kids. Hmm...

Somehow after adding in all the missing kids, I ended up with a total of 41 rather than 40. There are two "Leilas" listed - Leila Mallouky and Leila McMichael, both here and at the IMDB, but only one Leila at the CBS site (no surname provided). I wonder if there is a mixup in given first names, or if one kid is using a middle name as a given name. I think miss Mallouky is the correct one, but the IMDB has them both. I suspect miss McMichael may be one of the other girls who did not have a last name provided by CBS. Anyone got the truth? Thanks. --T-dot ( ^Talk/contribs ) 20:37, 28 December 2007 (UTC)