Talk:Line of succession to the throne of Luxembourg

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Flag of Luxembourg Line of succession to the throne of Luxembourg is within the scope of WikiProject Luxembourg, a collaboration intended to improve the coverage of the Grand Duchy of Luxembourg at the English language Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, you can visit the project page..
Start This article has been rated as Start-Class on the quality scale.
Mid This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the importance scale.

Are the Grand Duke's cousin Prince Robert and his children not in the line of succession? Should we add Prince Dedo of Saxony? Is he followed by his nephew Rüdiger Prinz von Sachsen, and by Rüdiger's sons? What would happen to the succession if there were no dynastic male line descendants of any of William IV's daughters? john k 03:44, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Luxembourgian

Also, is "Luxembourgian" a word? john k 13:38, 10 November 2006 (UTC)

The CIA World Factbook gives the adjective as "Luxembourg". Charles 19:07, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
Should we move to Line of succession to the throne of Luxembourg, perhaps? That seems the most natural way of putting it. john k 21:24, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
It does seem the most natural to me but some corners may oppose as all of the articles are similarly named (just playing the devil's advocate). I would go for it though, yes. Charles 01:52, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
Luxembourgian is indeed a word and all other articles are similarily named, so if you want to move this one, I'd prefer to have all other similar articles moved to the "throne of ..." format, as well. —Nightstallion (?) 19:58, 27 November 2006 (UTC)
Can you provide any support for "Luxembourgian" being a word? john k 21:55, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
Dictionaries. Merriam-Webster, Random House, WordNet, and American Heritage Dictionary all use 'Luxembourgian' as the adjectival form of 'Luxembourg'. As such, it has been adopted as the Wikipedia convention (see WikiProject Luxembourg). Bastin 22:15, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
So they do. It's a deeply unfortunate word, though. john k 14:12, 26 April 2007 (UTC)
It's a most fortunate word. It means that one doesn't get confused between the country (Luxembourg), the demonym (Luxembourger), the language (Luxembourgish), and the adjective (Luxembourgian). Very few countries are so fortunate. Bastin 00:46, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
Even if many of those forms were the same, context avoids confusion. It still is a most unfortunate word. Charles 03:35, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
Whilst there is no doubt that context often avoids confusion (particularly vis-à-vis the country name), it is not necessarily true in the other cases. What does 'Dutch book' mean? A book written in Dutch or written by a Dutch person? With Luxembourgian versus Luxembourgish, it's explicit, yet the words maintain the same root, so the meaning is obvious and unambiguous (unlike Dutch, British, American, and so on). Bastin 16:44, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.


The page was moved by another user without discussion, contrary to conventions, and an administrator is required to move it back. Whilst there is disagreement about what the adjectival form of 'Luxembourg' is - whether it is 'Luxembourgian', 'Luxembourgish', or 'Luxembourg' - Wikipedia:WikiProject Luxembourg has decided that standardisation about one or another is important, and that the chosen form is 'Luxembourgian'. The capitalisation of the 't' is uncontroversial, as it matches the lines of succession for other countries, as well as being the name before this move. Bastin 11:42, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

How about getting WikiProject Luxembourg to follow an EU publication rather than arbitrarily deciding and then holding the rest of Wikipedia hostage to their decisions? Charles 12:42, 26 August 2007 (UTC)
EU publications aren't law. In the absence of a legally-mandated term, in English, one usually relies on what is called a dictionary to define words. Since, in this case, dictionaries don't agree, and don't prescribe one word over another, we have prescribed one to ensure uniformity. We're not holding the 'rest of Wikipedia hostage'; we're editing articles only about Luxembourg. And, since we're the people that are writing those articles to begin with, that means we're enforcing internal discipline in naming conventions. Bastin 12:45, 26 August 2007 (UTC)
There is no ownership of articles. Also, try a quick search of luxembourgish site:*.lu and luxembourgian site:*.lu and compare the number of English language results you get from each search, which searchs all sites with the top level domain .lu. Charles 12:52, 26 August 2007 (UTC)
Wikipedia:WikiProject Luxembourg does not seem to have discussed this particular issue. The Oxford English Dictionary says that Luxembourgeois is the adjective "of or pertaining to Luxemb(o)urg or to its inhabitants". The OED does not list "Luxembourgian" or "Luxembourgish" (although it does list "Luxemburgisch" for the language). Since there is such dispute about this point, I suggest that the appropriate name for this page is "Line of succession to the throne of Luxembourg" (in spite of the fact that the other line of succession pages use an adjectival form - at least now that somebody has changed them all). Noel S McFerran 15:27, 26 August 2007 (UTC)
I personally prefer Luxembourgish as that's the term I learned to use as a native Luxembourger. But I also think we need consistency between articles, which Bastin has enforced very well so far. At this point I'd recommend moving this article back to it's original designation until we can find a consensus for all Luxembourg related articles and entries. Maybe we should move this discussion to the Project's talk page (I only noticed the discussion by chance taking a glimpse at Bastin's talkpage).--Caranorn 15:33, 26 August 2007 (UTC)
Wikipedia is not consistent... However, I do think all of the other entries should be moved to "Luxembourgish" as "Luxembourgian" is a very rare thing to hear to these English ears. What you were taught about "Luxembourgish" being the adjective is seemingly most correct. Charles 15:39, 26 August 2007 (UTC)
I am very happy to see a debate about this, and by all means move this to the WikiProject page. However, I think that, until and unless a change is agreed across the board, it shouldn't be done piecemeal. Bastin 16:11, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

I agree with Noel. "throne of Luxembourg" is the best idea here. john k 17:48, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

  • Support "throne of Luxembourg", as above. If the project finds evidence that Luxembourgeois is most common in English, fine; but we shouldn't be making stuff up. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 22:39, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
Comment there was no talk of luxembourgeois which obviously is not an english term, rather the dispute is between luxembourgish and luxembourgian, neither of which seems to be made up.--Caranorn 11:15, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
The fact that neither of those terms appears in the Oxford English Dictionary (as opposed to luxembourgeois which does) surely counts for something. It would seem, however, that there is not an established adjectival term in English for Luxembourg. Another common usage is merely to use the noun as an adjective (e.g. "Luxembourg exports"). Noel S McFerran 11:43, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
  • Support "throne of Luxembourg", as above. -Ulla Flag of Sweden 08:22, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

This article has been renamed from Line of succession to the Luxembourgish throne to Line of succession to the throne of Luxembourg as the result of a move request. --Stemonitis 13:49, 31 August 2007 (UTC)