Talk:Liberum veto

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[edit] Not exactly

Contrary to what the article states, the Latin term "Liberum veto" does not mean the same as "I freely forbid". Explanation: "veto" is a temporal verb which is rendered correctly as "I forbid". The only attribute to a temporal verb in this language may be an adverb (like English "freely" is an adverb), and to make this a Latin equivalent of English "I freely forbid" it has to be "libere veto".

"Liberum" however, is an adjective (like English "free" is an adjective), and so according to Latin grammar cannot stand by a temporal verb. So, it seems to me, the only correct explanation is to take the "veto" as an artificially substantivized verb: 'Liberum "veto"' in Latin or 'Free "I forbid"' in English (just at this point it occurred to me, that it is the standard way of rendering it in Polish, as 'wolne "nie pozwalam"' - apparently the Polish translation was done by a lot better Latinist than the one who wrote the article). 82.210.159.30 21:35, 9 July 2007 (UTC)

I agree. "I freely forbid" is certainly not correct. If I remember my History classes correctly, it means "The free men's Veto", describing the right of the "free" (i.e. members of the nobility = liberi) to say "veto" ("I forbid!"). In this context, "veto" is a noun, describing the act of raising a veto (or the right to do so) and "liberum" is the plural possessive case. If nobody objects, I will change the article. --Markusle 12:23, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Er, no. "Liberum" can't be the plural possesive. The plural possesive ending is -orum (-um alone only in few fixed exceptions, "liber" doesn't belong to them). "Liberum" is singular nominative in the neuter gender: free "veto", where veto is to be taken as a noun. 83.7.50.139 (talk) 02:07, 28 December 2007 (UTC)