User talk:LaSaltarella/Archive 2

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[edit] References

I've done what I can, but I'm having computer problems (I believe Wikipedia altered something in their code which can't get past my firewall), so it was very hard going - I'm having to work on an old, slow laptop. Which brings up the point - always indicate PDFs, so people on old computers/browsers will know not to attempt to download them :-)

I've changes many refs just to give you a sample of the work needed - you will need to go through the diffs of all of my changes to see the kinds of things I did.

I don't use cite news, because the cite templates stink. They chunk up the size of the article, give irregular results, and don't use a consistent style across the different templates. So, on news sources, I just typed them out manually. You can type anything you want in between ref tags, and it comes out exactly as you type, without all the extra garbage from the cite templates. News sources (all sources) need author (last name first), article title, publisher, publication date, and last access date on websites. Many of your news sources weren't identified as such, and didn't include the author or the publication date - you need to go through and check them all. For example, The Transcript was indicated as a websource, not a news source, and had no authors and pub dates - check all of them.

Another important consideration on websources is that future readers need to be able to locate the source should the links go dead or change. That means you should provide the full and complete name on the article - something like OWU Catalogue won't help someone find the source if the article name changes in future versions of the catalog, so please go through every source and make sure you've used the correct title. I fixed several of those.

Also, not all of your named refs were used correctly. Sources which are only used once don't need to be named - just adds extra KB to your article. Sources which are used more than once should point to the same named ref - I found occurrences where you hadn't used the same named ref to point to one source - need to go through and check all refs for repeats.

If you review all of the diffs of the ones I did change, you'll see what kind of review work you still need to do throughout. Looks like you're on your way to an FA - good luck~ Sandy (Talk) 15:20, 23 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Looks good

If PR is completed, and I see the GA status is reached, WP:FAC is the way to go. Good job!-- Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk  20:03, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] No

I'm fairly crazy-busy, but I also have a touch of ADD, so what have you got? Nina Odell 22:28, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

I've officially lost interest for the time being. You've done excellent work. I particularly like the first image and caption. Note my edit summaries for my own personal guidelines on style. Style is great, but it's readability that really matters. You do want this article to be read, right? Get an "average" friend to read it on the screen and where-ever they yell stop the madness, consider my suggestions. TTFN,, Nina Odell 23:01, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] League of copyeditors, and OWU

Yes, I'm still a member (if technically inactive, in that I haven't been involving myself in whatever activities the league may have been promoting). However, I'll help on the OWU article, which at first sight actually looks not bad.--A bit iffy 22:54, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] OWU article after copyedit

I think the article looks really good. I only see two things that I forsee might cause issues with the FA reviewers. I believe the introduction to the article should be a summary of the article itself, not an introduction to the topic of the article. Also, there's still a few lines at the end of a few paragraphs that are uncited. That might be okay, or it might not, depending on the opinions of the FA reviewers. Other than that, I think the article looks great and you've done some really good work. Cla68 23:18, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

Uncited sections (last sentence(s) of the following paragraphs):
Depression years, 1st paragraph.
Emphasis on Internationalism, 4th paragraph
Community relations, 3rd paragraph
Organizations and activities, 2nd paragraph
Housing, 2nd paragraph (Hayes Hall)
Athletics, last paragraph
Administration, 1st and 2nd paragraphs
Alumni, 4th paragraph (...with Julia Louis-Dreyfus.)

Putting citations at the ends of all the paragraphs shows that the article is entirely cited. The intro shouldn't need to be cited as long as it's clear that it's just a summary of the main body of the article. I've seen, however, that if the intro makes any strong assertions of fact, reviewers will want it cited anyway even if it's repeating cited passages from the main body of the article.

One final thought, I'm currently working on an article (Guadalcanal campaign) that, like the OWU article, has a lot of sub-articles. Instead of trying to bring the main article to FA status first, I'm taking each sub-article to FA status. Once all of the sub-articles are at FA (I'm a little more than halfway there), I believe the main article will be much easier to take to FA because it will be basically a summary of the all the FA-level sub-articles. We'll see how it goes. Cla68 23:39, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Role account

This account looks rather like a role account. I'm surprised you haven't been given a username block per WP:USERNAME: "Names that imply an official role or a role greater than that of a standard user". I strongly suggest you request a username change at WP:CHU. Hesperian 23:19, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

  • Hi Hesperian, thank you for your message. This was a topic of discussion 2 weeks ago. I was alerted that my username might cause some confusion. I will request a name change today. Feel free to suggest good candidates. :-) WikiprojectOWU 23:23, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
    • Congrats on your new user name. Hesperian 06:18, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Nice work

The Ohio Wesleyan University article looks great! You have put a ton of work into it and it shows. I will gladly support it for a FA when you nominate it (although I will still have to take a more extensive look and might have a few more suggestions ;) ). But, honestly, it looks really nice! Good work! -Bluedog423Talk 04:39, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Article Copyedit

During the mid-19th century, the school focused on its curriculum and fund raising, significantly increasing the school's endowment.

  • How did it focus on its cirriculum?
  • I remembered why I disliked this sentence: the syntax of "signficantly increasing" is ambiguous. The sentence might be saying:
  1. By focusing on both its cirricuculum and fund raising, the school significantly increased its endowment.
  2. By focusing on its fundraising, the school significantly increased its endowment; the school also focused on its cirriculum.
  3. By focusing on its cirriculum, the school significantly increased its endowment; the school also focused on its funding. (Unlikely, but allowed by the sentence)
      • Perhaps add another sentence noting what changed as it "focued on its cirriculum", and add a (see X).

The new ideal of specialization brought an emphasis on professional preparation for the Doctor of Philosophy degree and on travel and study in Europe.

  • Please make this clearer. Perhaps "The specialization encouraged professional prepation for the Doctor of Philosophy degree and exchange study in Europe"?
    • Your suggestion is better than the original statement. Thanks! WikiprojectOWU 02:09, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Two Rhodes Scholars from Ohio Wesleyan were selected during 1905-1910.

  • Sorry, I should have fixed this. "from Ohio Wesleyan" should be moved to after "were selected" to avoid ambiguity.
    • I'll add your suggestion! WikiprojectOWU 02:09, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

During the Welch presidency in 1905, it was decided that despite the expansion and the institution's name, Ohio Wesleyan University was to remain a college instead of a university. The Bachelor of Science degree was dropped, leaving only the Bachelor of Arts. Academic requirement for the bachelor's degree were cut and the emphasis on Latin and mathematics came to an end during the 1920s.

  • Who decided the expansion? (This is the problem with passive voice). This is just confusing: "and the institution's name, Ohio Wesleyan University was to remain a college instead of a university." The above sentences should probably be rewritten in active voice.

During the Hoffman years, the Academy and the School of Business ended in 1916. The Academy had started in 1842 as apreparatory school and throughout its seventy-five years of existence frequently outnumbered the college in enrollment.

    • The administration under president Welch was the deciding authority that the structure of the university at the time was not sustainable. WikiprojectOWU 02:09, 9 January 2007 (UTC)
      • Oh I see. Maybe this is better: "In 1905, the Welch administration decided to expand the university." I am still confused about what follows "and the institution's"
  • I am confused about the Academy,
    • It was one of the academic bodies of Ohio Wesleyan University functioning much like a prep school. WikiprojectOWU 02:09, 9 January 2007 (UTC)
      • Could you add this information to the article?

The 1930s were marked by the effects of The Great Depression.

  • What does this add?
    • It provides context for the two administrations, especially because some of the problems were financial. WikiprojectOWU 02:09, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Ties with the Methodist church withered in the 1920s,[42] causing much debate in the 1930s among Board members resulting in a current loose historic affiliation.

  • The two successive -ing phrases are inelegant—"which resulted", perhaps? Why "in a current" and not "in the current"?
    • You are right, this needs to get changed. WikiprojectOWU 02:09, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

In 1951-1954, Thomson and Bashford Hall, originally men's dorms were built.

  • Is "originally men's dorms" renaming "Thomas and Bashford Hall? If so, you need to put another comma after "dorms".
  • True. WikiprojectOWU 02:09, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

The 1960s were a period of conflict between faculty and administrators regarding administrative structure and control.[47] The result of the conflict was news statement of aims stressing values rather than religious goal statements, a more internationalized curriculum, a Women's Studies Program, an International Business major and a change to a new calendar with three 10.5-week terms.

  • All the action is relegated to nouns: "period of conflict", "the result", "news statement", "aims", and "a change". Rewrite it with more action in verbs. I missed a typo: "curriculum" should be "cirriculum".
    • I will change it. Thanks! WikiprojectOWU 02:09, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Construction and fund raising continue to be significant initiatives in the school’s strategic planning.

  • Too vague. State the idea more specifically. Rintrah 13:23, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
    • I will try to make it more clear. WikiprojectOWU 02:09, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Oh, if I've changed the content unwittingly, I should be glad for you to correct me. Rintrah

I just remembered another point: it is better to avoid acronyms unless they're strictly needed. Perhaps you could change "OWU" to "Wesleyan University"? Rintrah 13:28, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

  • In older school publications I see both "Ohio Wesleyan" and Wesleyan and less so OWU as ways to refer to the school. I need more opinions on this one as this may generate some disagreements among editors. WikiprojectOWU 02:09, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

I'll start on Academics if I have time. Rintrah 04:06, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Thank you for all your comments! Your suggestions are very helpful! Thank you once again!WikiprojectOWU 02:09, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Actually, many of my suggestions are out-of-date—I didn't check your changes.

One suggestion: Can you clarify "religious goal statements"? Rintrah 06:25, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Further Suggestions

My computer is very slow and it's difficult to find the relevant text among the forest of references. I sometimes make mistakes because the text is hard to read in the edit box (and I'm too lazy to copy the text elsewhere). Do you mind if I suggest the changes here?

with 10% from underrepresented groups

Can you reference the sentence for readers who want to know what these groups are?

Ohio Wesleyan is accredited by The Higher Learning Commission and is a member

I would put a comma before "and" to make the sentence easier to read; each clause is fairly independent, anyway.

For the class of 2010, Wesleyan admitted approximately 54% of its regular decision applicants and achieved a yield rate of 28%.[60] In 2005, the college accepted 40% of its international applicants.

Inconsistent verbs: "admitted" (first sentence) and "accepted" (second sentence). Choose one or the other. "For the class of 2010" seems redundant; I'd change it to "In 2010".

Approximately 35% of accepted applicants were granted merit aid in the form of internal scholarships.[62]

"merit aid in the form of" seems redundant. I suggest removing it.

An index criteria examining gay-affirmative policies places Ohio Wesleyan among the nation's gay-friendly colleges,[68] and the university enacts policies to meet the six criteria areas developed by the Campus-Pride organization on recruiting and supporting students from a lesbian, gay, bi-sexual, and transgender population.

"An index criteria" is ungrammatical (like "an cars"). I suggest "An index which examines...". Is there a difference between "gay-affirmative" or "gay-friendly"? If not, I suggest using the latter. I would also change the ", and" to "; moreover," to break up the sentence, which has two long independent clauses linked by ", and". It still seems wordy and needs to be rearranged to improve flow.

As of 2006, women constitute 35% of the tenured professors and earn 93.8% of what male professors earn, numbers suggesting favorable gender indicators for OWU.[66]

I suggest changing the comma to "—" and "suggesting" to "which suggest".

Ohio Wesleyan students receive a liberal arts baccalaureate-only residential experience.

"receive an X experience" is a poor way to construct a sentence. Can you rewrite this?

High participation in formal exchange programs constitutes a third aspect of the school's international focus.

"aspect"→"target", maybe?

Founded by Conrad Kent in 1988,[96] the Salamanca program provides an opportunity for the exchange of approximately one hundred students and faculty between the Ohio Wesleyan and the University of Salamanca in Salamanca, Spain.

I suggest: "The Salamanca program, founded by Conrad Kent in 1988, oversees the exchange of approximately one hundred students and faculty between the Ohio Wesleyan and the University of Salamanca in Salamanca, Spain."

That is everything I can remember in my second run-through. (I'm up to Campus.) Rintrah 07:59, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

My internet connection is better now. I shall implement the suggested changes. I wish someone would work on University of Melbourne with the same keenness as you've worked on Wesleyan.
I like your new name. :-) Rintrah 17:29, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
That would be great! No one has dedicated so much work to University of Melbourne as you have to Ohio Weselyan. Sorry I haven't spent more time on the latter; I will try to do more this week.
As to your name, I like any Italian or Spanish name which suggests dancing—especially lively dancing. Rintrah 08:29, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Rename

As requested, I have renamed you. You can now log in with your new username. Warofdreams talk 02:56, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Nice name

Hi LaSaltarella,

Nice name. What's it mean?

By the way, I haven't had a chance to look at the OWU article recently. I'll givve you some more feedback soon.

Lovelac7 05:38, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Was checking my watchlist and saw the talk page for LaSalarella and couldn't figure out who it was. It completely threw me for a loop, but I definately prefer it over your old name. The old name was ok, but it did look somewhat authoritative and misleading... so I approve. I too wondered if there is something more to the name. So I did a name search and found out that Saltarella is an ant sized super here[1], a 1912 movie[2], or an Italian musician/instrument.Balloonman 21:10, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] RE: Ohio Wesleyan University

Pardon me, I was away from wiki. Are you still developing this article atm? Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 06:21, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Well, I'll try an give it a read in the next week sometime, if that's ok. Regards, Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 06:34, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Problematic Sentences

I ran through it again and came across these problematic sentences:

Academic requirement for the bachelor's degree were cut

As in prequisites, course requirements, or what?

Ohio Wesleyan students receive a liberal arts baccalaureate-only residential experience

Not clear. In fact, I don't know what it means.

Ohio Wesleyan appears to hold a positive relationship with the City of Delaware.

Vague. Perhaps it says Ohio Wesleyan has strong community ties—I have no idea.

I need a fresh pair of eyes to continue; namely, sleep. Rintrah 03:36, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Another look

I will take another look at OWU in the next few days - I took a quick look just now and it looks much improved. I did notice that the University Hall captions say it was built in different years (1893 and 1898, IIRC), so which is right? Sorry it took me a while to get to you - your post on my talk page was unsigned and it took me a while to realize who you were on my watchlist - I also like your new username. Keep up the good work, Ruhrfisch 04:31, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Campus

I struggled with the campus section, which is not as well written as the sections before it. Here are sentences I want amended:

Located 20 minutes north of Columbus

Can you convert this to kilometers? I don't know whether 20 minutes is the same for a Ferrari driven by a hot-head as for a broken down Mini.

The student-led Columbus Initiative is located in Hamilton Williams Campus Center. Started in 1989, the program is an experiential learning partnership between the college and Columbus Public schools. More than 150 Ohio Wesleyan students tutor and mentor underprivileged pupils from Columbus, Ohio.

The first two sentences need to be merged, because the first one is rather dull on its own. Can you elaborate on (or define) "experiential learning partnership"? I don't understand it. Are the 150 students from the Columbus Initiative? If so, the connection should be made clear.
I still don't understand what "experience + learning" means precisely. The words have broad definitions.

The community-based Wesleyan Ambassadors (ISAP) promotes cultural diversity and ethnic awareness within the local community.

Can you explain this? It is vague on its own. Rintrah 09:25, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
Can you add your sentence instead? The above sentence is unsatisfying. Rintrah 12:33, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

I slept in today. I am more awake than yesterday. Rintrah 09:34, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Yup. You probably won't guess where I live correctly on your second try either. *grin* Rintrah 09:40, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
Actually, I already gave it away before (sort of). Rintrah 09:41, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Ok, more sentences:

More than 150 Ohio Wesleyan students from this program tutor and mentor underprivileged pupils from Columbus, Ohio.

Is it implying a difference between mentoring and tutoring?
It is fair to say that it does. The program matches kids with Wesleyan students and as a college student who serves as a mentor you care about the kid's wellbeing in addition to helping him or her with school. LaSaltarella 01:02, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

In 2004, the University received a donation to rehabilitate the historic Strand Theatre in downtown Delaware.

From whom? How was the Univeristy to rehabilitate the historic theatre? Was it the responsibility of the Architecture faculty?
I am providing the quote from the announcement: "Delaware attorney and Ohio Wesleyan alumnus Peter Manos '47, who donated the building, has long envisioned enriching the performing arts in the city. Gift money from a donor who prefers not to be identified at this time will cover the purchase of the Strand business from the Amatos and provide funds to support operational and program improvements for the theatre." LaSaltarella 01:02, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

The university and the City of Delaware sponsor several events in town throughout the year:

Most of what follows has nothing to do with Ohio Wesleyan. I suggest you cut most of it. Rintrah 13:23, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
Are you referring to the last two paragraphs (fifth and sixth)? The fifth paragraph covers the relationship with the Arts Castle, which is a former OWU building and many of the classes are taught by college professors. The sixth paragraph covers only town activities but I tried to contextualize them in how the school is involved in the activities. Any changes are more whan welcome. LaSaltarella 01:02, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] black red cap

The image page has two opposing copyright notices, When you click on the image it has a page here(uploaded 6 Jan 07) with a copyright notice and this fair use rationale

Source: Barbara Tull. Fair use rationale:
  • Low resolution image
  • Used to illustrate the Red and Black cap worn on campus in the 1920s.
  • Lack of free alternative

Additionally it has a GFDL free license on the same page which is being picked up from the commons(uploaded 5 Jan 07) version of the image. This ambiguarity needs to be addressed, since a copyrighted version exists you'll need to document why its now a free licensed image. Gnangarra 01:23, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

As you've cleaned uup the Wikipedia version I took the liberty of deleting the page here, now the article points directly to the commons image so problem fixed. Gnangarra 09:30, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Helpful comments

Please look at Galena's comments on my talk page regarding Wesleyan: User_talk:Rintrah#Re:_Wesleyan. I might need your help to make some sentences clearer, because you know more about the university than I. Rintrah 04:57, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Article coming along good

After seeing that there were no factual verification issues and the fact the lead is well written, I think the Ohio Wesleyan University article is cming along just fine. Well that's pretty much all I can say. Good, luck. Many of the League of Copyeditors have been working on the article as of late. And it reads good in my opinion.Showmanship is the key 17:11, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Wesleyan suggestions

Sounds good. Rintrah 02:20, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Response

Hey, I really don't think there would be much benefit to putting OWU through another peer review. I'd suggest that after the League of Copyeditors have completed their editing and stability has been reached, to put it up as a FAC. I wouldn't say that I really have more experience with the process than you do, however.

It looks great to me, and I would support it as an FA. I'm sure they'll be a few people opposing it for very minor things that you should be able to fix quickly.

One thing that sometimes bothers me is when people oppose an article based on two minor grammatical errors or so. It would take less time to fix them in the article than to oppose and point them out to have somebody else fix them. But the ironic thing is, I am probably one of those people I find annoying! I try to avoid it to the best of my ability, though. I guess it might be to suggest that one should go through the entire article looking for similar instances, but in OWU's case would be pointless because the article has clearly gone through a thorough copyedit from several individuals. Sorry for the random tangent.

Anyways, good luck! I'm confident it will pass as an FA in the semi-near future! -Bluedog423Talk 05:38, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] More Wesleyan copyedits

Hi there,

I'm taking over the edit for this article from Rintrah, and have a couple of questions:

Twentieth Century section:

"The registrar stated that, in these years, student intake "[increased] from eastern states and from Ohio cities, the number of foreign students".

  • The last part of this quote seems out of context--is part of it missing?

Today section:

"Wesleyan also participates in fundraising. An athletic fundraising campaign began in 2005."

  • This paragraph is a little weak. Can you add more details?

That's it for now. I'll let you know if I have more as I progress through the article. Galena11 22:01, 18 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] University of Wisconsin-Madison

On 24 December 2006, I put up the UW-Madison article for Featured Article. It failed miserably, due in part to the fact that I had almost no idea what the criteria were for FA. I have now made considerable revisions. You had originally opposed at Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/University of Wisconsin-Madison/archive1. Would you please consider looking over the article over again, and tell me how you would vote this time if it were put up for FA again? University of Wisconsin-Madison Thanks! – Lordmontu (talk) • (contribs) 20:51, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

Thank you for replying to my request! – Lordmontu (talk) • (contribs) 04:03, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Don't expect much progress on Wesleyan this week....

Hi! I'm sorry to say that I probably won't be able to do much work on Wesleyan this week due to my work schedule. I've c/e'd to "Traditions"--maybe Rintrah can pick up my slack this week. Galena11 19:59, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Welcome to VandalProof!

Thank you for your interest in VandalProof, LaSaltarella! You have now been added to the list of authorized users, so if you haven't already, simply download and install VandalProof from our main page. If you have any questions, please feel free to contact me or any other moderator, or you can post a message on the discussion page. Prodego talk 03:06, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Orphaned fair use image (Image:Connect2OWU.gif.gif)

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[edit] You Rang?

Hi, sorry about the really slow relpy... I haven't been signing on lately. Let me know if you can still remember your question. Hoffeld 13:42, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

I'm at Hoffeld@gmail.com if you want to contact me. Thanks! Hoffeld 21:05, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Wesleyan

Hi. I think I have free time tomorrow; so I'll probably run through those sections then. Today is definitely ruled out because I've only had three hours sleep; the wine and alcohol I consumed at a picnic, moreover, is adding to my drowsiness. The article, when I last checked it, looked quite decent. Although the last section looks difficult, I'll do what I can. I hope the article passes the FAC vote. Rintrah 07:47, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

I haven't been able to edit the article today because I've had a terrible headache. I will tomorrow, probably. Rintrah 11:31, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

I went ahead and copyedited the article. I spent most of my time in the Traditions section, which, I suspect, I did not finish. I did one of the two sections you requested, too; see the note on the Wesleyan talk page for my advice. The Alumni section was too daunting, especially for one as tired as I. When I am more awake, I will move the comments I left in the article source here; so you can address them, in turn.

Your last comment stimulated my curiosity. I didn't know anyone outside Australia said "no worries".

Anyhow, good night (or morning). Rintrah 15:27, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Activism at Ohio Wesleyan University

  • I corrected the refs to the correct use of named refs; please have a look at the work I did, and read WP:FN - you had an important mistake there, which resulted in incorrect referencing (Murchland refs were pointing to Tull because you hadn't given them a name).
  • This looks wrong - needs a specific page number: ^ Burtchaell, pp. 174-326.
  • Your blockquotes are not correctly referenced - they say who said the quote, but they don't have a reference pointing to where to find the quote. You need to add a ref at the end of each statement indicating who said the quote.

SandyGeorgia (Talk) 14:44, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

There's nothing wrong with the format; the statements need to be cited. You say "who" said it, but you don't tell readers where to find it. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 22:28, 4 February 2007 (UTC)
I'll go look and put a {{cn}} where you need to cite. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 22:32, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Queries

I have some queries about the Administration section:

It started as a girls' athletic fête held at the Monnett Athletic Club for Mothers Day. All events were held at the Monnett Campus...

The two sentences appear to contradict each other. They were held first at the Club, and then the campus? They were held in the club in the campus?

Disobedient students were tossed into the Sulphur Spring.

What is the Sulphur Spring?

focusing on an issue of concern to the liberal arts

Which one?

Orchesis... "Fresh-X"

What are these? Rintrah 13:10, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

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[edit] Orphaned fair use image (Image:Owulogo 2.gif)

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[edit] Wesleyan Copyedit Complete!

You're all set and ready to go. Good luck with your FA bid! Galena11 23:45, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Reply

Ok, sounds good to me. I will definitely support it when you nominate it for FA status. I cannot recall another university article that has been through so many revisions/editing cycles by so many different editors as the OWU article has. Clearly, that is a reflection of the hard work you have put in to get help from others as well as the extensive editing you have done yourself. Most likely, there will be some minor issues brought up by people, but I think anything anybody gives you will be easy to fix. Also, everybody has a different opinion on how something should be stated, how it should look, etc. and there is no such thing as a perfect article. Obviously, one could continue to find issues forever and ever if you really wanted to. I think OWU, however, meets the FA criteria. Good luck! -Bluedog423Talk 01:23, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Methodist Colleges tp box

I notice you participated in a prior discussion on the Template talk page for Methodist Colleges. I just posted this on the talk page and hope that you could return.


I discovered two sources listing Methodist colleges and universities the first is the International Association of Methodist-related Schools, Colleges, and Universities (IAMSCU) founded in 1991 which describes its members as Methodist-related schools, colleges, and universities and those with a Methodist tradition from throughout the world. the other is the directory of untied methodist related colleges, from The Untied Methodist Church in the US. Both are from the General Board of Higher Education websites:

From these sources this template seems pretty accurate, however it is missing several universities

Both the University of Puget Sound and Duke University are listed and the last elections for board of Directors are January 25, 2007 see here so this list seems pretty up to date, any objections to adding them back to the template?

- thank you Astuishin 18:20, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

Dear Astuishin,

Burtchaell's book "The dying of the Light" has a very extensive chapter on the progression and the eventual demise of the relationship between Ohio Wesleyan and the UMC over the past 150 years. If you would like to be very particular about the meaning of the association and the list that you have found on the web, I know you may run into issues of notability, as some have already suggested on the template's talk page. I know the issue will be, as it has been, controversial among many WP editors. Thank you for your time! LaSaltarella 22:12, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Astuishin"

LaSaltarella, thank you for your post, I'm unfamiliar with the book you cited earlier but I would be happy if you could share the passages relevant to this discussion with me. however, Although have not read it I'm confident that the book posses no fact the would refute the information presented on the United Methodist Church's General of Education Website. Were you objecting to the placement of OW in the template box? If it is a question of nobility I think I have the capability to source that. I'm glad of your concern, Objections? - thank you Astuishin 22:27, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
Great, I hope we can smooth over this snag. Good luck OWU with FA status, I think the article looks great, it has improved tremendously over the past 6 months - thank you Astuishin 23:39, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] RE: Ohio Wesleyan University

Sorry I forgot all about that. OK, I read the article over. I'll try to offer some thoughts ... though keep in mind this is just the opinion of me - one person. Do with it what you will:

  • Some of the article seems over-congratulatory. The 2nd paragraph of the article seems to me especially guilty of this. Similarly, the 2nd paragraph of Academics - Profile section Wesleyan admits students of all cultures, lifestyles and socio-economic backgrounds; how many schools do not; does it really have any Congo forest people, or Mali nomads? This occurs throughout the article, can be rather tedious, and, I suspect, may produce hostility in the FAC. Could you maybe tone it down?
    • The issue of bringing something like diversity in a school article is that many schools pay lip-service to the concept for PR purposes. Stating the statistics in a relative context pretty much says how the school compares on several dimensions of the concept to other schools. LaSaltarella 02:04, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
  • The article can be very boring at times, owing to numerous lists and stats. 80 kilobytes is big for this kind of article, you could maybe cut it down by removing some of the excessive detail. e.g.
    • The actual size is much less than 80k. Half of that size is due to the reference section. LaSaltarella 02:04, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
    • WU has partisan political groups ranging from liberal to conservative, such the College Republicans and the College Democrats, and several activism awareness groups such as ProgressOWU, Black Men of the Future, Student Union on Black Awareness, PRIDE, ECHO, Amnesty International, and Rafiki Wa Afrika. Due to the school's proximity to Columbus, the Ohio state capital, many politically-inclined students serve internships for state representatives
    • The university and the City of Delaware sponsor several events in town throughout the year: the Delaware Arts Festival, the Little Brown Jug, the Delaware County Fair, and the Castle Arts Affair.[114] The Delaware Arts Festival is an annual event held the weekend after Mother's Day on the streets of Historic Downtown Delaware.[115] The festival hosts over 170 booths featuring works of local, regional, and other artists. OWU professors chair the committees that select winners.[116] The Little Brown Jug,
    • This kind of thing bores people.


  • The Academics-profile section in particular has an excessive amount of statistics; could this be converted into a table? Also, is there a reason why all the statistics in that secition are numerical (e.g. 20 %) but Fifty-nine percent of Wesleyan students claim no religious affiliation? And what is a yield rate?
    • Great comment about yield rate! Thank you! I should fix it. The overall amount of statistics is related to my first comment above and the need for thorough referencing to what some may see as controversial claims. Also, numerical stats can not start a sentence, so that's why there is a difference. LaSaltarella 02:04, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
  • There is excessive detail on the biography of one man, Mark Huddleston; a short one or two sentence summary should do. It would be better to expound of the President's historic role within the administration generally, what he's expected to do; some other info on how the board actually operates could be seen as more helpful.
    • That's a helpful comment and I will think how I can include something like this. LaSaltarella 02:04, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
  • Wesleyan's first president, Edward Thomson, stated in his inaugural address on August 5, 1846 that Wesleyan was "a product of the liberality of the local people." - this looks like the article writer has misinterpreted Mr Thomson's speech - although you may not have - because it seems to be saying "the local people were generous in creating this college", rather than (article interpretation) "the locals are liberals, and this college has been built for that reason."
    • The actual reference makes it clear what Thomson meant by liberality and his position on slavery. I think user:Rintrah shortened the paragraph at some point, and may have sacrificed the nuance of the quote in the context, but overall what it states is actually still true and verifiable. LaSaltarella 02:04, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
  • History -Founding: What is meant by university "of the highest order"? Meaning is unclear.
    •  :-) It's better if we leave it like that or else it might become POV. LaSaltarella 02:04, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
  • Is the heading Campus expansion and fundraising suitable for a section which spends most of the time discussing other events, such as exchange programs, cutting the BSc. degree and the closer of the Academy and School of Business?
  • Likewise, the title Twentieth century: years of change might be misleading as 1) change is the main feature of all these sections, and all three sections cover the 20th century.
    • I agree, but I couldn't come up with a better title. Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated! LaSaltarella 02:04, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
  • In 1979-1982, the campus newspaper The Transcript severely criticized Wenzlau's presidency blaming it for "severely affecting the reputation of the college" - you mean in one of those years (79, 80, 81 or 82), or at an unknown date between these years, or in once every four year campus paper? I.e. you need to fix In 1979-1982
    • I will make it more clear. The controversial exchange between the Transcript and the president was over the course of several years in several articles and official presidential statements. LaSaltarella 02:04, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
  • promoted exchange study in Europe - this late 19th century exchange system is potentially interesting but not explained, whereas the Emphasis on internationalism section goes into long detail about efforts in Africa and Japan at the same point in time
    • Good points. I don't know how to make it more thourough without sacrificing compactness. LaSaltarella 02:04, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
  • Should the Emphasis on internationalism, a title potentially interpretable as POV, cover exchange. This implies that the exchange program is part of a unique Wesleyan ideology, whereas most American colleges so far as I'm aware have exchange programs of some kind
    • It is a reflection of commitment to international diversity that most schools may have hard time backing up with equivalent statistics. LaSaltarella 02:04, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
  • In the Twentieth century: years of change section, does "eastern states" include Ohio, or is it meant to refer to those on the coast?
    • You are right. I should fix that. LaSaltarella 02:04, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
  • It isn't very clear what, in the Twentieth century: years of change section, seven distribution requirements means. This should perhaps be clarified for the unfamiliar.
    • I will fix the wording. LaSaltarella 02:04, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
  • In the housing section, you might wanna rephrase Approximately 200 upper-class students live in Small Living Units (SLUs), since that phraseology could imply people of high social or economic status, rather than senior students.
  • In 2005, attention was directed to the religious insensitivity of the historically-based name. - this statement is potentially POV - the article looks like it's endorsing this view of the name; should be rephrased explaining who suddenly made an issue of the name and why.
  • I didn't expect to read the opening Numerous Ohio Wesleyan alumni have been associated with social justice. and then to hear about a Nazi collaborator in the same paragraph. :)
    • Another WP editor inserted the last alumna and it omitted may generate POV bias. Awkward, I know. LaSaltarella 02:04, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
  • There is some detail missing which I personally think - you may reasonably disagree - ought to be in the article. What's the tuition? How does the university contribute to the economy of the surrounding area? How does it contribute to the culture? Are the sports teams popular with the local residents, or just students and graduates? And, yeah, one of the most interesting parts of the article - the mascot - where is he? We need a picture. :)
    • There is a picture of the article and I'll check if the tuition should be included (because it quickly becomes outdated). LaSaltarella 02:04, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
  • Anyways, I hope that's somewhat helpful. There are a couple of typos I spotted ... I'll try and fix them. Regards, Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 00:54, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
    • Thank you! It is indeed very helpful! LaSaltarella 02:04, 19 February 2007 (UTC)