User talk:Larrythefunkyferret/Archive

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Jak 3

The point of my picking apart the article in this manner is so that editors like yourself can see how one person (i.e. me) might see every aspect of a section, and I would not have been so critical if it were not specifically asked. I was merely trying to point out what might be implied by the tags. It was not my intention to dissuade anyone from editing this article. I would ask that the people who have edited this article continue editing this article, and I had just hoped to offer some perspective to help them to do so. Obviously you care about the state of this article. Please try to look at it from an outside perspective (taking my comments into account), and then see if you still think you can't help it along. Someone can always polish out the details later. ~ JohnnyMrNinja 08:04, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Replied on my talk page. ~ JohnnyMrNinja 07:53, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Replied on talk page again. ~ JohnnyMrNinja 07:12, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

Re: Ocarina of Time

Seems good to me. I see that there's a list of Ocarina of Time characters, so you can link all of them mentioned in the story. It's a very well-known game, so you should be able to get it referenced sufficiently. It will probably undergo modification and re-shaping over time, but make sure that the plot doesn't become bloated. It is more susceptible to this due to the game's enormous popularity and relatively large story. Remember, I commented on the gameplay—this needs expanding more urgently than the story needs shortening. Furthermore, I've noticed that there is a paragraph for each race—this is excessive and redundant considering there is alreday an article covering these races. Just have a very brief summary. I'd help out, really, but I'm busy with homework and the Fire Emblem articles. Thank you. Good luck. Ashnard Talk Contribs 09:39, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

You're going to have to explain to me what cut-happy means. I really have no idea what your message was about. Thank you. Ashnard Talk Contribs 08:23, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
I made a big mistake. I had made an error an stated "story" instead of gameplay. What I meant was "gameplay". I'm really sorry for the cock-up. Ashnard Talk Contribs 21:34, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for your understanding. I feel like a moron. Good luck with the article! Ashnard Talk Contribs 21:40, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
Hello. I've removed the tag for the plot because that's been fixed now. As for gameplay, a few suggestions:
  • It says that it has RPG elements, yet it doesn't sufficiently clarify what these are or explain them
  • The third paragraph can applies to all Zelda games, make it clear that this function isn't exclusive to OoT. Actually, the whole paragraph isn't needed.
  • Same for the last paragraph.
  • What about Epona?—this is actually a revolutionary feature in the Zelda series.
  • What about the eponymous Ocarina?
  • Maybe mention some specific side quests
  • How 3D affects gameplay
  • The use of stealth
  • Basically, anything that is specific to Oot.
  • The paragraph on time travel needs to be elaborated upon massively—it's the main theme of the game.
  • Mention combat system

I hope that this helps. Good luck. Ashnard Talk Contribs 16:19, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

LTTP story rewrite

Thanks for redoing the summary. I edited it to improve flow and clarify some things. Just two things, though:

  1. Most of the basic information in the Prelude section is stated in the second paragraph, but there is no longer any mention of the Sacred Realm, other than a sentence in the Gameplay section. Perhaps it should be briefly mentioned that the Dark World is a corrupted version of the Sacred Realm in the beginning of the second paragraph along with the other backstory info.
  2. The part about the "seven wise men" being retconned to "seven sages" could still be kept, just in the form of a footnote.

At the beginning of the game, a young boy named Link is awakened by a telepathic message from Princess Zelda, who says that she is locked in the dungeon of Hyrule Castle. As the message closes, Link finds his uncle ready for battle, telling Link to remain in bed. However, Link ignores his uncle's command, and after his uncle leaves, follows him to Hyrule Castle. When he arrives, he finds his uncle seriously wounded. Link's uncle tells Link to rescue Princess Zelda, giving him a sword and shield. Link navigates the castle and rescues Zelda from her cell, and the two escape into a secret passage through the sewers that leads to a sanctuary.

Link is told by a man in the sanctuary that Agahnim, a wizard who has usurped the throne, is planning to break a seal made hundreds of years ago. The seal was placed to imprison a dark wizard named Ganon in the Dark World. Agahnim intends to break the seal by sending the descendants of the wise men who made the seal into the Dark World; the only thing that can defeat him is the Master Sword, a sword forged to combat evil. To prove that he is worthy to wield it, he needs three magic pendants. After retrieving the pendants, Link takes them to the resting place of the Master Sword. However, just as Link draws the sword from its pedestal, Zelda telepathically calls him to Sanctuary, informing him that Hyrule Castle soldiers have just arrived. Link arrives at Sanctuary moments after the Soldiers have vacated it, where he learns from the dying man that Zelda has been removed to Hyrule Castle. Link goes to rescue her, but arrives too late; Agahnim sends Zelda to the Dark World. Link defeats Agahnim in battle, but is also sent to the Dark World.

To save the once-peaceful Hyrule, Link must rescue the seven descendants of the wise men from dungeons scattered across the Dark World, defeat Ganon, and reclaim the Triforce. Once these seven maidens have been freed, they use their power to break the barrier around Ganon's Tower, where Link faces Agahnim again. After Link defeats Agahnim the second time, Ganon rises up from Agahnim's body, turns into a bat, and flies off. Link gives chase, finally confronting Ganon in another tower in the Dark World. After an epic battle resulting in Ganon’s demise, Link touches the Triforce and is granted his greatest wish: that Hyrule be restored as it was before Agahnim came. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Enok Walker (talk • contribs) 22:46, August 29, 2007 (UTC)

AoL plot rewrite

Hi there, I don't know if you'd noticed, or if it makes any difference, but I'd already began to discuss the issue in the "Plot tone" post. Zixor 14:45, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

I really don't know whether or not it addresses those issues, as I didn't particularly read it (As I've already written my own, very accurate account), and I don't know that the tag's concerns were even valid to begin with. I have the impression that you removed a lot, but I really didn't feel like a working out a detailed comparison of the two, as I feel that my proposed solution is ultimately a much better one, and one which will eliminate the need for future revision. Zixor 18:43, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

I do understand, and agree with you. -and I've already given my sentiments as to the solution in that post. Sorry if I sound rude, but I feel as if I'm repeating myself; and I feel that the answer is simply in finding a way to implement my idea. Zixor 04:19, 9 September 2007 (UTC)

About a bot edit

I noticed that your bot tagged Protoss as having a plot summary that is too long. I'm not sure if it's a big deal, but as it is a character page and not a story, I'm not sure why it did that. Any thoughts? Larrythefunkyferret 05:35, 15 September 2007 (UTC)

Hi, thanks for your message, SmackBot does not generally add tags, but merely dates those that are already there. Regards, Rich Farmbrough, 07:39 15 September 2007 (GMT).
No problem. There is a resistance among some Wikipeadians to to much "in universe" description as "fancruft". I sympathise with but do not share this view (although support stylistic measures to keep "in universe" and "out of universe" clearly labelled, and to avoid WP:OR - fan hypotheses). There is possibly some legitimacy in that a really extensive plot summary (as we once had for, I think it was, the fifth Harry Potter book) could conceivably constitute breach of copyright. Anyway, perhaps the person who added the tag can enlighten you further. Rich Farmbrough, 10:14 16 September 2007 (GMT).

Protoss

Well, 1 - it isn't a character article, and 2 - it does have a plot summary, if you'll look, and an overly long one at that. The Clawed One 23:09, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

Re: SC species

I'm afraid its unlikely. Its been a deliberate decision not to have any significant plot or history details in the species, past only what is contextually necessary - which isn't much, other than that in the Xel'Naga section. The style seen in the Terran Confederacy section is what we're trying to get in relation to factions and lore: "how" it functions rather than "what" it does, with only brief plot development. The story of the series is adequately covered by not only the game articles, but also by the character articles, so any major coverage in the species article will only be repetition. The main real-world focus of the article is supposed to be on the gameplay development of StarCraft, as the characters one attempts to focus on the development of the story and the locations one (still being done, will follow after the species) will focus on the mapping and creation of the worlds.

However, I will use anything in the current articles that is useful: you may notice that the gameplay sections for the Protoss and Zerg are modified versions of their counterparts in the current articles. In any case, if you want to help on this draft please do. I'd particularly like you to look at the Xel'Naga section of the draft: its the only major coverage of history in the article and I feel its a bit long-winded. Maybe you could be able to do something with it? -- Sabre 13:12, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for your work on the Xel'Naga section, its much better now. In regards to the incubator, I think Neonatal intensive care unit comes closest, but its only barely describable (that doesn't sound like a word) as such. Its almost egg-like in function in the novel, using Protoss and Zerg genetic "energy" to sustain itself until it can hatch in full growth. -- Sabre 16:55, 20 October 2007 (UTC)

Brood War

Considering how good a job you did on the draft Xel'Naga section I was wondering if you could look over something else for me and attempt to shorten it. I recently redid the story section over at StarCraft: Brood War#Plot with the objective of cutting back the plot detail drastically. I've at least halved the size of the section, but its still not quite what I was after: if you look at the StarCraft article you will see only really short paragraphs for each of the three episodes. It might just be because Brood War's storyline has so many more twists and turns in its story that it can't be shortened further, but could you look over it and see if there is anything further you could cull? -- Sabre 19:36, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for your help. The people over at the WP:VG still think its a bit long, but I can't see anything further that we can cut. -- Sabre 19:24, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Re: Your Revert to Freelancer

I noticed that you reverted my work on Freelancer (computer game). Since I wish to better myself, and because I would like to avert a potential revert war, I would like to know what I did wrong, so as to not make that mistake in my next attempt. Larrythefunkyferret (talk) 05:00, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

Well, you capitalized the 'L' in 'looking', you cut out the important beginning where the space station was destroyed, you don't explain what 'odd things' are happening in Manhatten to justify your later statements, and there seemed to be a very big hole between the two paragraphs that you created in your edit, so I presumed your edit to not be a very helpful one, so I reverted it. Sorry for any inconvenience. WinterSpw (talk) 19:18, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

Let me preface this with the fact that I am a Freelancer virgin. Everything I know about the story comes from the plot summary, and it did not impress on me the importance to the overall plotline of the stuff I cut. Now I'll be the first to admit that I'm probably not the best guy to reduce the story line (as the {{plot}} tag demands); I just did it because noone else would. However, if you think I removed vital information, feel free to reinclude what you, as (I assume) one who is more knowledgeable of the subject, feel is important. With your permission, I will restore the shortened summary, and ask you to restore any vital plot points that you feel are neccessary; in short, I'm asking for your professional help. I will wait for your response. Whatever your decision, thank you for your time. Larrythefunkyferret (talk) 23:41, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

No, I'm not a 'Freelancer virgin', but I am a person who has good reading skills. Your shortened plot summary reduced the justification of some of the plot events; I did not clearly interpret the plot of the game from that summary. You may revert my edit into yours again, but with some minor additions of detail so that it is more comprehensible to new readers that know nothing about the game. Once you are done, you may remove the {{plot}} tag. WinterSpw (talk) 01:34, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

Freelancer Virgin - One who has never played the game "Freelancer". I am also a "Starcraft" virgin and "Halo" virgin. In fact, with the exception of "Luigi's Mansion" and "Billy Hatcher", I'm a virgin to every game on the list on my user page, as indicated by the note at the bottom of the list. Just clarifying that.

Also, since you understand the importance of the stuff I cut, could you explain it to me, please?

  • The space station being destroyed seemed only to explain why he was looking for a job; I didn't get any character development from it, so I didn't see the importance of knowing why he was out of a job, thinking that it be more important to know that he was out of a job.
  • The odd things; were you hoping for examples? Because I can provide those, if that is what you mean. Good point.
  • The big hole was what I percieved to be a pointless series of events mearly depicting the hero running from the bad guys, possibly with some fights interspersed. As it seemed like mission summary, I figured that it could be cut, buut if it was indeed important to talk about how much he fled from Manhattan, so be it.

I thrive on constructive critisizm, which I'll assume you were providing, per WP:FAITH. Thank you. Larrythefunkyferret (talk) 03:36, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

Oh, then I am a so-called 'Freelancer virgin', but I have played the demo and it's pretty fun. =P
  • Wasn't the event of the space station being destroyed like the catalyst for the fighting/hostility between the two sides?
  • Yea I was hoping for some clarity: Ship destroyed > Looks for job > Jun'ko? > Job with Liberty Security force on Manhattan > Odd things > Another Security Force officer tries to kill Trent? > ...?
  • Maybe he possibly meets some important characters along the way besides Jun'ko, and there should be justification as to why he has to flee the planet.
Maybe we should have someone else help edit the article that has played the game before, in order to confirm this plot. WinterSpw (talk) 05:57, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

If we were to continue with the analogy, a demo might be considered "foreplay", but I'm not sure.

  • Assuming that the two sides you mentioned are the humans and the Nomads, it wasn't a catalyst for anything. Rereading it, though, I found that the Nomads destroyed the station because of an artifact that was on the station. The player character got it from one of the other survivors, who was shot by a Security Force officer. The officer then turn his weapon on our hero, and the rest is history. This artifact also explains why he had to escape from New York, which is unnasociated with the film by this name. I'll reconsider its inclusion.
  • I'll pick out one or two of the biggest examples of "odd things", in addition to the assassination attempt.
  • I'll check again to see if there are any characters in that part of the game that are important to the overall plot.

I'll start looking for someone who has played the full version. If you find someone, could you let me know? I'll do the same for you. Larrythefunkyferret (talk) 07:58, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

I found a guy that has agreed to help; his name is CABAL. He has already trimmed it, and I was planning to trim it some more (though nothing serious). Just thought you'd want to know. Thanks for your help, WinterSpw. Larrythefunkyferret (talk) 23:32, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

Re: Hotel Dusk

Hi Larry(?), I reverted it because of a few things:

  • Hyle Hyde (I think this is a typo)
  • Louis isn't a hotel guest, he's a bellhop who works there.
  • Louie is Louis' nickname, given by Kyle.
  • Mila technically isn't a "hotel guest".
  • Mila never assists anyone, as she's unable to speak.
  • Dunning did not take Mila "in an effort to make them stop investigating him."
  • Nile would not kill Dunning if he stopped painting.
  • Dunning never ever faked his own death.
  • Kyle is searching for the items, as his job as a salesman. Upon finding evidence of Bradley, he searches for clues of him, not the "mystery" of Dunning.
  • Kyle never "soon" finds clues of Jenny, that happens near the very end.
  • Kyle doesn't investigate Dunning early in the game.
  • He meets Mila and Louis way before any sign of Dunning appears.
  • Kyle already knows who Louis is, so he didn't "meet" him for the first time.
  • It doesn't mention 'Osterzone', which makes it incredibly confusing.
  • Dunning didn't start Hotel Dusk, it existed long before he took over, and did NOT own Hotel Dusk as a way to hide, because it was originally a hideout for Nile.
  • That would mean Dunning would be "hiding" from Nile, when it used to be their hideout???
  • Nile isn't exactly a "mob", it's a group of crime syndicates.
  • There are 10 chapters in the game, Dunning grabs Mila at Chapter 9. He doesn't take her "partway" (which would mean around Chapter 5 or so)
  • Kyle investigates Dunning's clues at chapter 9, he meets Louis/Mila at chapter 1 or 2.
  • Dunning did not forge paintings, as he created all of them himself (under the name of Osterzone)
  • He did not create paintings as a "living", he did it with the intention of returning Jenny back.
  • The summary is too heavily focused on Dunning as a painter.
  • "Kyle discovers Dunning's secret anyway." - Actually, Dunning confesses.
  • Dunning isn't an artist, he's a painter.
  • "He soon wanted out" - It never explains why he wanted to stop painting.
  • "Kyle is able to convince Dunning that his secret his safe with them" - Never happens.
  • "so Dunning lets them and Mila go." -- that's a brief ending. What happened to Kyle, Louis, or Mila?

And something that really caught my eye:

  • "Dunning is willing to kill Kyle and Louie to protect this secret" - Nonsense.

Upon reading it, the original (longer one) makes alot more sense, and explains more of the story in-depth and the history. If I didn't know about Hotel Dusk and read it, I'd have alot of questions such as:

Why did Hyde has check into Hotel Dusk? Why is he there?
How does he meet Louis and Mila?
How and where did he find clues?
Why does Dunning's secret matter to Hyde anyway?
How would taking someone lower someones' suspicions? Wouldn't it raise their suspicions?
Why do Louis and Mila help Kyle anyway? Aren't they hotel guests? Whats the point?

What I got out of it: There is some guy in a hotel, who finds mysterious clues about the owner. He meets two people in the hotel, and they help him find clues about the owner. The owner grabs one of them, and they find the owner. The owner reveals his secret, they promise to keep it, then they all go (somewhere, don't know where).

The thing is, Hotel Dusk is a very, very long game, and can't be summed up in two paragraphs.
Will this help? I didn't mean to be mean or anything. If you'd like, you can take the original and go on from there. Thats what I always do, before editing a summary. Aileza (talk) 00:32, 25 November 2007 (UTC)
Ooh, just read your TP (says you haven't played most of em). So if want, I can edit and trim it for you while you do other stuff on your project. :) Aileza (talk) 01:07, 25 November 2007 (UTC)
Sure, no problem. ^_^ Aileza (talk) 03:41, 25 November 2007 (UTC)
Just wanted to let you know I'm almost done the summary beforehand. Happy Holidays! Aileza (talk) 04:25, 15 December 2007 (UTC)
I finished the summary but my other computer (the one with the text file) crashed on me around a week ago. It's currently in repairs, and I should get it back in possibly 1-2 weeks, sorry about this...! (Happy New Year) Aileza (talk) 01:49, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

And...it's uploaded! Luckily, I got it back sooner than I expected. I fixed up some minor errors, and reworded it to make sense. I looked it over, and everything seems to be okay. In my opinion, it's a decent summary. You can skim-read it and if there's anything hard to understand, please don't hesitate to tell me. :] Aileza (talk) 01:52, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

Archive This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.