Talk:Lagos

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[edit] History source

What's the source for the history account as it is now in the article and in History of Lagos? Also, references are lacking for the rest of the article. — mark ✎ 13:11, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

I have altered this a bit and added sources. The old content is now on History of Lagos. This should be referenced and fleshed out further, IMO. Nach0king 15:32, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
i have corrected a few things the Name Eko was given by a king and the slave trade in lagos began in the 18th century not the 15th i have also added a paragraph about the end of the slave trade as i think it adds to the history showing it was ended by the will of the people through the monarch with the help of the british not by the british. Akintunde 2;20,25 March 2006
Yes, I think it is better this way. However, above all, we should cite reliable sources, otherwise the article will not meet the verifiability guideline. Which sources did you use? — mark ✎ 13:49, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

An observation has been gleamed from this article.

If, the city has built up surrounding the founding town or city, Then, Lagos is similiar to the city of London and Rome, Also then, two sets of laws exist for Lagos, Nigeria because of development. Therefore, a set of laws exists for the historical island city of EKO and another set of laws for the surrounding metropolis. Rodeney123 13:57, 3 February 2007 (UTC) rodeney123 2007-02-03

[edit] Better pictures

Some of these pictures here don't look that good, such as the one showing a hazy, unbclear view of Lagos and the boring picture of a Lagos dirt street. We should get some better pictures. — Stevey7788 (talk) 20:26, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

How did all references to "Nigeria" come to be replaced by "Portugal"?

[edit] INTERACTIVE MAPS

Interactive maps of Lagos: Address search, find my nearest, points of interest, postcode search, driving directions

http://www.ceaser-web.com


[edit] MAP

I dunno how to add pics, can sum1 add a map of nigeria showin where lagos is like they have on the page for abuja

[edit] City infobox

Can someone fill in the blanks including a city location map for the info box? Eman007

[edit] Capital status

When, exactly, did Lagos officially cease to be the capital of Nigeria? I thought it was 1991 when Abuba finally gained the status, but according to History of Lagos it in fact happened much earlier. An encyclopedia I have downstairs says it happened in 1980 but I can't find that confirmed online; is it true? Did Nigeria go for 11 years without a capital? Does anyone have a good source for this important info? Nach0king 09:42, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

It IS 1991. Lagos was the capital until 1991, however the construction of Abuja in the Federal Capital Territory was already underway in the 1980s. Abuja before the 1970s was non-existing. - Qasamaan 09:33, November 26, 2006 (UTC)
Thanks a lot for the info! Can you add a source with that to the article? It would help a lot. Cheers¬ Nach0king 19:06, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Thanks for advancing IPAs

Whoever's responsible for the readjustment on the IPAs, thanks :). Qasamaan 08:24, 3 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Population

2006 census have not been accepted yet. The senate rejected the figure .. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Views20071 (talk • contribs) 11:37, 14 December 2007 (UTC)


I placed a contradict tag on this article because the data in the info box contradicts the text of the article itself, which says population estiamtes "vary considerably, but generally range from 12 to 18.5 million." The infobox says Lagos is home to "Between 10.5-15 million" people. Even stranger, it puts the urban and metropolitan area estimates at 9 million? How can the metropolitan area have less people than the city proper?

I realize that no one can say precisely--or even generally--how many people this sprawling city has. But if we're going to include estimates in the article, let's make sure they're consistent.--The Fat Man Who Never Came Back 13:08, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

Population listed by various sources:

  • UN World Urbanization Prospects: 10,886,000 (2005-07-01) [1] (Urban agglomeration concept)
  • World Gazetteer: 9,229,944 (2007-01-01) [2] (seems to refer to Lagos state - how is that different from the "city of Lagos"?)
    • World Gazetter lists Lagos metro area as 11,615,563 [3]
  • 1991 Nigeria Census: 5,195,247 (as listed in [4])

--Polaron | Talk 21:18, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

Lagos State apparently contains not only the metro area. As in this article, the population info isn't the best! I agree that we should strive for consistency - but where to start? Nach0king 13:34, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Where to start? Well, this article says there was a 2006 census, and provides numbers even though the numbers are contested...: http://www.ipsnews.net/news.asp?idnews=36529[5] I'm not sure what Wiki's rules are for references. So, I'll leave the corrections for someone else. 68.60.59.250 10:27, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Size relative to Ibadan

Twice now I've reverted edits saying that Ibadan is a larger city than Lagos. I doubt that personally, plus there's nothing in the Ibadan article to substantiate that claim. Perhaps the IP user is trying to make some statement about Ibadan being the largest indigenous city in Nigeria, but whatever the case it's unclear. I'll keep reverting until it's substantiated or clarified. - Draeco 22:20, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Scam Central

I'm surprised that no mention of the massive email and fax scams coming specifically from Lagos are covered in this article. I've personally seen where these scams are conducted. And while I was in Nigeria, I personally witnessed the large amount of scam artists operating in Lagos. I think a section should be devoted to the crime in that city. Jtpaladin 19:57, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

Interesting subject. As a native Lagosian, I think more effort is needed, or a little, into doing this asap. Don't you think? - Omar 180 18:03, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
I did that, and some idiot anon tried to remove the paragraph. I put it back. If he comes back, I'll block him. WhisperToMe 22:12, 9 March 2007 (UTC)
Well done. Jtpaladin 14:07, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

User:Aadebayo did it (I.E. removed the section) again! [6] - I told him, in all caps, to stop doing it. WhisperToMe 22:35, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

Aadebayo added ""The contributor of this section is from a place where it is the norm for people to be killed because they are black, yet I do not see any reference to that point in his city"" - Since this was commentary, I excised this line. I responded to this on my commentary. WhisperToMe 05:35, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

I don't think the email scams is that big a deal because afterall for the city with the highest scammers it is not stated on their page!!

Well, do you believe that Chamber of Commerce Groups would be that willing to admit serious negative flaws of their cities/places? I doubt it. WhisperToMe 14:37, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

I have removed this information. While this information is important in giving a holisitc view of life in Lagos; I think, in line with almost every other country and city article, crime references should be reserved for the "Crime in Nigeria" article which is currently entitled "Nigerian organized crime." Ajisekanla 10:12, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

  • But it is also something somewhat specific to Lagos, the suburbs of Lagos, and the Igboland areas. 419 does NOT happen in the north. Also, I would add info to the Amsterdam article about 419 that comes there, but I need a source first. WhisperToMe (talk) 18:24, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
  • Your statement sounds a lot like Original Research. I do not dispute that Advance Fee Fraud commonly originates from Nigeria, but to categorically say that it does not originate from the North… As I have said before in line with practice on the majority of country and city pages, this information should be limited to their “Crime” pages irrespective of origin. Ajisekanla (talk) 12:14, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

I have removed (currently) unsubstantiated entries relating to Advance Fee Fraud along with an excerpt from another editor's talk page on the issue that was (apparently) erroneously posted in the main article. The complete entry deleted follows:

[edit] 419 advance fee fraud

Many 419 advance fee fraud scams are based out of Lagos. Several neighborhoods, such as Festac Town, are main operation areas of scammers, who use shady cybercafes to implement scams. Six areas, including Oluwole, contain many businesses that produce false documents used in scams [7] [8].

The EFCC was established in 2003 to eradicate scamming networks [9].

Please note the following: - The link: http://www.nextwebsecurity.com/419news.asp referring to set up of the Nigerian Economic and Financial Crimes Commission (EFCC) does not work. There is an official site which should be used: http://www.efccnigeria.org/ - The links indicating that this activity is centred in Lagos is misleading and should not be considered a primary source because: a. the articles are written by media that are neither able, nor responsible for properly assessing the prevalence in Lagos vis-à-vis other Nigerian cities. Direct links from government or NGO sites would be more accurate sources.

However, I restate that this information should be restricted to the “Crime in Nigeria” page. Your rationale that because "it happens" does not justify it's inclusion on the city or country page, when there is clearly a separate article dedicated for this information. Placing it under "Economy" implies that this is a significant part of economic activity, which it is not.

For example: black people in America are subject to systemic institutionalised racism as evidenced by stiffer prison sentences than white defendants committing the same crime. There are numerous online and paper articles, court reports, and academic studies supporting this information, does that justify the inclusion of this information on a US city or country page?

The same could be said about credit card fraud in the US, kidnapping in Mexico or the drugs trade in Thailand.

I also object to the tone of your message, are you trying to intimidate me by “warning” me not to do the very thing Wikipedia was created for? Namely contribute to an environment where people proximate to information are allowed and encouraged to enhance the knowledge of people less proximate.

Your responsibility as an administrator is to ensure impartiality and the accurateness of articles, not to strong arm dissenting views or push one particular view point above others. Remember encyclopaedic material must be verifiable. As an online encyclopaedia, all articles should share common structural themes, exceptions should be minimised. I believe that this is a glaring exception which you seem particularly intent on maintaining. Why is that?Ajisekanla (talk) 12:19, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

I question the neutrality of this entry which appears to be mainly composed of "Original Research" and should probably not be added until more appropriate sources can be provided. I still support the opinion that this should not be on this page in line with the body of Wikipedia country and city pages. Ajisekanla (talk) 13:13, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Lagos as a Municipality

The article, at the beginning, makes note Lagos not being a municipality, but that can't be right. I don't see how it is any different than say Sydney in Australia, which is composed of many local governments, but definitely has a central one City of Sydney. Lagos Island LGA would most definitely be what this is about, and the article should reflect that. So, what is the population of Lagos Island? If every 'city' had its page about its metro, we'd have to redo the whole site. The fact is that every city has an urban area, and many urban area central cities, are in fact, just as small as Lagos Island or smaller. This would be like doing an article on Paris or San Francisco, and having the article cover the entire metropolitan/urban area consisting of all of the different administrative divisions. This article should reflect Lagos Island, the central administraitve division, in population and description. Why even bother having a page on Lagos State, at all, if all we're going to do is list the population of Lagos State for Metropolitan Lagos? Someone find the information for Lagos Island and let's get this fixed. --Criticalthinker 07:07, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Not all of Lagos State was formerly the city of Lagos. The former city of Lagos consisted of Lagos AND Victoria Islands as well as a section of the mainland. WhisperToMe 14:40, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
I know that, and that's really my point. If this article is about Metropolitan Lagos, the statistical division that consists of 16 local area governments, then the article should reflect that. I just found the population statistics of 2006 for each local government area. What I'm going to do is add up the 16 local government area populations, and post that population, and perhaps, this article should be renamed "Metropolitan Lagos". I'm not so sure you're getting what I'm saying. --Criticalthinker 05:40, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

I don't think that the Lagos Island LGA should appear in the infobox as the "city" (municipality) level of Lagos. The municipality level was disbanded in the 1970s, we have to live with it. There is no City of Lagos in the administrative sense. Presenting Lagos Island as the "city" of Lagos is a misreprensation. What about Victoria and Ikoyi islands which are not part of Lagos Island LGA? Godefroy 16:40, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

This is no different than the City of Sydney which is the central local government area of the statistical metropolitan Sydney in Australia. --Criticalthinker 04:00, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Map of Metropolitan Lagos

I am the person who uploaded the map of Metropolitan Lagos's 16 LGAs from the German Wikipedia. I see someone put the map at the beginning of the infobox. I would like to draw people's attention to an error in this map. The map shows Lagos Islands larger than it is really. In fact, there are two islands: Lagos Island and Ikoyi Island, but the current German map shows them as a single island and name the whole thing as "Lagos Island", which is wrong. In fact the western part of this "Lagos Island" is the real Lagos Island. It is a LGA. The eastern part is Ikoyi Island, which is part of Eti-Osa LGA. Someone should correct the map to include the eastern part inside the Eti-Osa LGA. You can see a detailed map of the area here (note that there's only a small channel separating Lagos and Ikoyi islands, which is not shown on this map): [10]. On this other map from the Nigerian statistical office, you can see the administrative borders of the LGAs: [11]. The map is a bit complicated to read, but it's the best I've found for administrative limits. Could someone with map making skills then correct the map? Godefroy 18:27, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

  • I can not do anything about that, but thanks for bringing it up so that someone can fix that. Out of curiosity, are Ikoyi Island and Victoria Island really islands anymore? It appears from some bad aerial photographs I've seen that they can only technically be considered islands, especially Victoria Island. --Criticalthinker 23:22, 8 July 2007 (UTC)
    • I have had a go at fixing up the map, and referred in the text to the building over of smaller creeks which has fused some of the islands. Rexparry sydney 03:43, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] crime section

A section on crime, well referenced, has been added. I have refrained from more sensationist descriptions of crime even though that makes the section short. Crime is a serious problem in Lagos which is why a section is present.Congolese 03:16, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

I have removed this information, because: (a)The two references are out of date (circa 2003) - the Economist reference comes from a South African talk page; and (b)I think, in line with almost every other country and city article, crime references should be reserved for the "Crime in Nigeria" article which is currently entitled "Nigerian organized crime." Ajisekanla 09:42, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

But street crime in Lagos is high, isn't it? - The Economist.com Cities Guide certainly is no "South African talk page" (how do you know the Lagos piece is from 2003?). And Nigerian papers have been much more outspoken just recently: "the menace of insecurity has reached a frightening dimension" (Guardian, Sept. 6, 2007), "insecurity of life and property, symptomised by violent robberies, the raping of women, kidnappings, and other forms of criminality, is clearly on the rise" (Nigerian Tribune, Sept. 12, 2007), Nigeria is "a nation under siege by hoodlums" (Leadership, Sept. 3, 2007). That's why Fashola is introducing military patrol now (Vanguard, Oct. 29., 2007). - Cheers, Ankimai 10:17, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Hey, Ankimai, I agree that the section should be added. Aji seems to be upset by the 419 additions, but unless there is a consensus not to include them... WhisperToMe (talk) 04:27, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

  • Whispers comments here, originate from an ongoing content dispute on the Nigeria talk page regarding Advance fee fraud's relevance to the Nigerian economy.
  • Unsubstantiated references to crime that are not verifiable should not be included. The Economist "report" is a city guide designed for visitors from Johannesburg. A lot of the information on that page is dated (the last reviewed date is on the site), including some of the crime information.
  • Crime references are not included on other country or city pages and their inclusion on this page would be an exception. However, if most editors think otherwise, Ankimai's excellently sourced references are great and deserve a mention. Ajisekanla (talk) 11:14, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
  • I think that crime is so bad in Lagos that it deserves a brief, even almost cryptic mention. There does not need to be a long, sensationalist description that one might find in a tabloid newspaper. Crime references are normally not made in other city articles because crime is not so bad. The Youngstown, Ohio article is a featured article and it has had crime references for months/years. That city used to have a lot of crime. Congolese (talk) 06:06, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, now that we have the sources we can make the section :) - In the Festac Town section there are various newspaper articles describing that area as having 419 fraud. WhisperToMe (talk) 10:06, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

  • References to advance fee fraud activity centering around Festac are, still, poorly sourced. Ajisekanla (talk) 14:10, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Lagos City, Lagos Island or Lagos State

The information in this article crosses over the differences between the three and I suggest information be restructured to reflect the differences. E.g. the Local Government Area (LGA) only relates to Lagos Island, while the article seems to refer to "Greater Lagos," including the outlying areas of the mega-city. Ajisekanla (talk) 11:49, 30 November 2007 (UTC)