Talk:Kwasizabantu
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[edit] Attention: Wikipedia
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Re: KwaSizabantu
The entry concerning KwaSizabantu is inaccurate and misleading. There is no way that this Christian mission can be described as a “sect.” KwaSizabantu Mission emphasizes the historic Protestant doctrines and welcomes speakers from a wide variety of Evangelical denominations to their pulpits and as guest speakers at their various conferences. A wide variety of mainstream Evangelical books are available at their conferences, and mainstream Protestant speakers such as Dr. James Dobson and James Kennedy are frequently broadcast on their Radio Kwezi.
It is also completely false to state that: “the movement emphasizes glossolalia…” as the movement is not in any way charismatic, nor are the speaking of tongues practiced at KwaSizabantu Mission.
As someone who has visited KwaSizabantu Mission frequently over the last 20 years, I do not know what the source is on these outrageous claims concerning KwaSizabantu, but I would recommend that enquirers visit www.kwasizabantu.com.
KwaSizabantu does not support any political party, and far from being legalistic, the mission upholds the Bible as the Word of God and that Salvation is only possible by the grace of God, received by repentance and faith in the Lord Jesus Christ alone.
Written by Dr. Peter Hammond, Chairman of the Reformation Society (info@ReformationSA.org).
Peter Hammond is a man of Kwa Sizabantu,: The Board of Eiders has lost all confidence in Dr. Hammond`s ability to properly perform his missionary duties with integrity. His representing the cause of Christ and the Church of Christian Liberty is bringing irreparable harm to both. Therefore, the Church of Christian Liberty hereby rescinds its ordination and commission of Peter C. Hammond as a missionary to the people of Africa. Further, as we who are charged with caring for the souls of our members (Hebrews, 13.17, Revelation 21. 6-8) we direct Dr. Hammond to do the following:
A. Spend three days in fasting and prayer, seeking from the Lord a spirit of repentance. B. Resign as a Director of Frontline Fellowship and any other Christian organization in which we holds a position of leadership. C. Cease immediately from all mission and teaching or preaching endeavors. D. Either face to face, or where that is not possible, by written communication, confess his sins against the numerous persons and organizations he has harmed or offended.
After the Eiders`meeting of October 22, 2003, in which we ruled against Dr. Hammond and determined to revoke his ministry credentials, we received an e-mail from Dr. Hammond requesting that we accept his resignation of his affiliated membership with the Church of Christian Liberty. This request will be given due consideration in the near future, but our ecclesiastical ruling and disciplinary directive to him as a longstanding affiliate member of our church stands.
We pray that God will have mercy on Peter Hammond and bring him to true repentance.
Board Eiders Church of Christian Liberty
he didn`t come back, he went to KSB. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.57.113.199 (talk) 15:06, 17 January 2008 (UTC)
[edit] More feedback on this matter:
The previous article about Kwasizabantu is unfortunately poor on facts. For instance Kwasizabantu does not emphasize "glossolalia" and miraculous healings. Kwasizabantu mission is doctrinally Evanglical and not charismatic or have any special doctrine of a "fundamentalist Christian sect" nature. The confession of beliefs is on the mission's website: www.kwasizabantu.com (on the left-hand bar where it says "Confession". Being Evangelical the mission upholds the Bible as God's Word and that salvation is only possible through repentance of sins and faith in the Lord Jesus Christ. Kwasizabantu Mission does not have a list of rules called the "Standard". That type of legalism belongs to groups like the Amish in the USA who have something called the "Ordnung". The mission works on an interdenonimational basis and does not require Christians to leave their church and join Kwasizabantu. The mission feeds at least 1200 people at every meal and is running a number of projects to help finance the mission so that every it is free for everyone who visits the mission or seeks help and prayer. Kwasizabantu is also involved in caring for Aids orphans and the terminally ill. Written by Rev K. Olsen (a minister at Kwasizabantu for the past 30 years) Tel: +27 32 4815500 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.8.13.66 (talk • contribs)
- (comment moved from article): the information is directly based on the relinfo.ch article linked. I've placed {{fact}} in accordance with your comment though until this is sourced more closely. dab (ᛏ) 12:17, 7 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Glossolalia and miraculous healing allegations completely false
I would suggest that the Glossolalia (speaking in tongues) and miraculous healing allegations be either removed or placed under Criticisms (at the worst), because a look at the KwaSizabantu website and all articles by KwaSizabantu Mission make it clear that Glossolalia and miraculous healing are not emphasised. Looking at all the sermons preached for the past 30 years or more (a catalog is available on the website at KSB Cassette Ministry) there is barely any mention of speaking in tongues or miraculous healing. (By the way, because of the many nationalities during each sermon, the sermon is translated into languages such as, Zulu, Sotho, Portuguese, French, Afrikaans, German, and other languages, but speaking in tongues as the allegation goes is simply not practiced during services, neither is emphasized). The sermons that do mention speaking in tongues, places it on a very firm Biblical basis (i.e. that the Bible is the final authority).
The following is a quote from KSB's website, under the question, "Does KSB believe in extra-Biblical revelation?" (note: Glossolalia or speaking in tongues is not even discussed on the KSB website)
"Although we accept that God can work through miraculous means, if He so wishes, the Word of God stands supreme as the ONLY measurement of truth and the will of God. We do not identify ourselves with extra-Biblical revelation since the Scriptures are complete and nothing can be added to them. All dreams, visions etc, should be checked against the Word of God. No Christian should feel compelled to act upon "a message" which someone else claims is from the Holy Spirit. Every believer is accountable to God and must hear from Him alone regarding His will. Kwasizabantu is generally skeptical about the claims by extreme groups who receive "special revelations".
This should make it clear that the allegation that KSB Mission emphasizes Glossolalia and miraculous healing is false and should be removed.
- you are right. The point is based on the relinfo article,
- Die im Rahmen der Erweckung in Kwasizabantu aufgetretenen Phänomene wie Zungenrede und Heilungen führten zu einigen Debatten um die Positionierung des Werkes zwischen Evangelikalismus und Charismatik. Erlo Stegen selbst ist kein Freund der Pfingstbewegung und vertritt deshalb die Lehre einer von der Bekehrung zeitlich getrennten Taufe im Heiligen Geist nicht. Die Zungenrede wird folglich nicht als jedem Christen zugänglich gesehen. Stattdessen wird eine Gabentheologie vertreten, die von je unterschiedlichen Gabenzuteilungen an die einzelnen Gläubigen ausgeht. So erhält sich Stegen eine gewisse Distanz zur Pfingstbewegung. Den traditionellen evangelischen Cessationismus, die Lehre, dass die Geistesgaben mit dem Ende der apostolischen Zeit aufgehört hätten, muss Stegen aber ebenfalls verwerfen. Zusammenfassend steht Stegens Lehre zu Geistwirkung und Geistesgaben den Gepflogenheiten in modernen charismatischen Gemeinden recht nahe.
- viz, Stegen is taking a sort of hybrid position between charismatic groups and mainstream protestantism. The article also says that this has led to debates about the group's classification. Our article here should reflect this by stating that Stegen has been located (I assume, by critics) as way out among charismatic loonies, but that his position is actually more moderate. dab (ᛏ) 11:44, 21 August 2006 (UTC)
I've removed "According to reports by former members, Stegens claims to be directly guided by God, via channelling by his assistant, Hilda Dube", as it is simply slander as such claims are no-where recorded. See my input on "important points to consider". I would also like the page still to be changed as suggested in those points (for which proof was given), and the page placed under "Chistian evangelism" or "Evangelical Christianity" where it belongs.
I've also removed the "sect" statement, as it is biased, whereas it has been shown that KwaSizabantu holds to mainstream orthodox Protestant theology, and holds to no fringe sectarian doctrine. I've also changed the "Fundamentalist" statement to read correctly "Evangelical". If someone wants to brand it as fundamentalist, I think it's up to them to prove it according to the definition of what fundamentalism is, and not just throw statements around.
Sparkie 09:40, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
I've removed the allegation that KwaSizabantu members must adhere to "The Standard", as the citation is still lacking, and it has been pointed out by current preachers at the mission (like Rev K Olsen in his discussion) that there is no such thing, but KwaSizabantu Mission is adhering to the Bible for its authority and not some "standard".
Sparkie 09:06, 3 November 2006 (UTC) I have removed the statement which slanders the mission of having worked together with the Apartheid Government, as the point has been standing to be proved since it was posted in Feb and no proof has been forthcoming. It is simply slander and inaccurate as the mission had never been involved in such activity; but simply to preach the Gospel to every creature - whether the old or the new government. Sparkie 19:00, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
