Talk:Kos
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[edit] Turkish name?
Foreign and historical placenames are explicitly encouraged by Wikipedia guidelines. Please see here: Wikipedia:Naming conventions (geographic_names). Specifically:
- "The title can be followed in the first line by a list of alternative names in parenthesis: {name1, name2, name3, etc.}. Any archaic names in the list (including names used before the standardization of English orthography) should be clearly marked as such, i.e.: (name1 arch.). Foreign language names are permitted and should be listed in alphabetic order of their respective languages, i.e.: (Armenian: name1, Belarusian: name2, Czech: name3). Alternatively, all alternative names can be moved to and explained in a names section immediately following the lead. In this case, the redundant list of the names in the article's first line should be replaced with the following text: (known also by several alternative names). Once such a section or paragraph is created, the alternative English or foreign names should not be moved back to the first line."
Quite simple, really. Lukas (T.|@) 12:46, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
The fact that foreign language names are permitted doesnt mean that it is correct. I have never read a serious Encyclopedia that states other possible names besides the official name of the place at the start of an article. Besides that, it is stupid as well. A place can be called with a 1000 different names by 1000 different foreign countries. Of course someone can say that because of historical reasons one should add the names that a place was called by various civilizations that had an effect on that place. But again if you look carefully for a strange reason, that we all know, only in the islands of the Eastern Aegean is the Turkish name added and nobody has seen Turkish names in Athens or Corfu or Arachova or Thessaloniki etc etc etc. Last but not least, various parts of Europe Asia and Africa used to belong to the Ottoman Empire and I dont see Turkish names there not to mention other Empires before the Ottoman. Should we add how every single place is called in every single foreign language of every single civilization that used to belong that place to??? Of course not..pure and simple. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.171.226.246 (talk • contribs) 14 March 2006, 22:09
- (a) If you have a problem with the guideline, take it to the guideline's discussion page.
- (b) Nobody wants to add all names of all places. But this is a pretty clear case where because of geographical and historical proximity the name is appropriate and interesting. For the same reasons that Greek editors have (rightfully) been insisting on "Monastiri" for Bitola and other instances. The purpose of that guideline is to spare us all the predictable stupid nationalist blather that you get in each and every such case, time and again. I'm really sick and tired of it. Lukas (T.|@) 22:19, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
(a) I have a problem cause it is stupid and I will do that. (b) Of course nobody doesnt do it, thats why it doesnt happen. Only guys like you want to add Turkish names to Eastern Aegean Islands. It is not clear either from a geographical or historical proximity why the name is appropriate at the start of an article. I can tell you many examples for other countries that this doesnt occur. And if it occurs it occurs at the appropriate History section. You can add if you want Turkish, Vietmanese, Korean, Thai or whichever language you wish but at the HISTORY SECTION and not the START of an article. It is simply wrong and doesnt happen in any serious Encyclopedia. Why do you want to turn Wikipedia into a non-serious Encyclopedia? Not adding the Turkish name at the start of an article about a Greek island is as nationalistic as not adding the Monastiri name for Bitola. Not at all. We are practical and correct here not nationalists...personally I dont care if you name an island even yourself but its WRONG to put that name at the start of an article... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.171.226.246 (talk • contribs) 14 March 2006, 22:44
- Before you start shouting in your ever so rightful indignation, you might try actually looking into other encyclopedias. The first one I opened, just now, did exactly what the guideline proposes. But please do bring the issue to the central discussion page, people there will problably teach you what "consensus" means in Wikipedia. You might also want to learn to sign your contributions properly. Lukas (T.|@) 22:55, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
Lukas, the guideline you're linking to is merely a proposed guideline. It has absolutely no force. I also think that the proposed guideline cited above is unsatisfactory, as it could indeed lead to an endless list of alternative names. Fortunately there's a much more satisfactory option, which is to link to Wiktionary - e.g. Wiktionary:Kos. -- ChrisO 23:48, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
A dictionary and an encyclopedia are very different things. A dictionary is strictly about language and legitimately and usefully tells us, for example, the Japanese, Urdu, and Hausa names for Iraklion (Crete) and for hamburgers because these words or expressions exist in those languages (thank you, McDonald's), even though they have nothing special to do with those cultures. In the WP framework, this information can also be found in the interwiki links.
An encyclopedia, on the other hand, is about (among other things) cultural history, which is often closely tied to language. In an English-language encyclopedia, there is no interest in the Japanese name for Iraklion, because it has no special cultural relevance. On the other hand, Iraklion has had several names over the centuries, all closely tied to its history, literature, and culture and its inhabitants, conquerers, and rulers in interesting ways. The various Greek, Arabic, Ottoman Turkish, and Venetian names for Iraklion are important parts of its cultural history., and are also found in English-language sources for various stages of its history. It is an anachronism, for example, to say that El Greco was from Iraklion: he was from (Venetian) Candia. Without endorsing any political position such as nativism or irredentism, we can also say in an NPOV way that Istanbul and Constantinople are two names for the same place, with very different historical and political implications.
Therefore, it seems to me highly appropriate that articles on places which are closely linked culturally, politically, or historically to more than one language community should include all the relevant names. Thessaloniki (for example) was ruled by the Ottoman Empire, had a majority Ladino-speaking community for centuries, had a minority South Slavic-speaking community (and more in the hinterland), and of course is today a completely Greek city, so should rightly have its Greek, Ottoman Turkish, South Slavic, Ladino, etc. names included in the article (as it does, unless someone has recently changed it). --Macrakis 15:03, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
- Actually, the vaunted 'guideline' says "If English usually calls a place by a given name, use it." In fact, it rather deliberately states that it not be named what it "should be" which seems to be the point of the Turkish language inserts. BTW, I have the same trouble in reverse with former Greek places in Turkey. I'm not just being pro-Greek! Anyway, my change just got reverted. Student7 (talk) 13:42, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
- That is what is says for the title. If you look at the next section, it says "The title can be followed in the first line by a list of alternative names in parentheses" and then describes the reasons: historical, minorities, etc. I don't see any evidence that anyone is proposing that the name "should be" Istankoy today. There are lots of historical names on Wikipedia, and in fact Greek ones in Asia Minor and Greater Syria are very common. --Macrakis (talk) 14:46, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Geography issue
I would aprreciate if the external reference to kosisland.info is not deleted again considering that a substantial amount of info has been taken from that site. (word for word)
- What info, specifically? —Khoikhoi 19:09, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
- The specific information is:
The island is part of a chain of mountains from which it became separated after earthquakes and subsidence that occurred in ancient times. These mountains include Kalymnos and Kappari which are separated by an underwater chasm 40 fathoms deep, as well as the volcano of Nisyros and the surrounding islands.
There is a wide variety of rocks in Kos which is related to its geographical formation. Prominent among these are the Quaternary layers in which the fossil remains of mammals such as horses, hippopotami and elephants have been found. The fossil molar of an elephant of gigantic proportions was presented to the Paleontology Museum of the University of Athens.
The shores of Kos Island are washed by the waters of the Karpathian Sea. Its geographical location is between latitude 36 degrees and 50 minutes north and longitude 27 degrees and 10 minutes east. Its coastline is 112 km long and is caressed by long immaculate beaches of golden sand
The main religion practiced is Orthodoxy and as such, Kos has one of the four Cathedrals in the entire Dodecanese. There is also a Roman Catholic Church on the island as well as a Mosque catering to the Muslim community of Kos. The Synagogue is no longer used for religious ceremonies as the Jewish community of Kos was practically wiped out by the Nazis in World War Two. It has however been restored and is maintained with all religious symbols intact and is now used by the Municipality of Kos for various events, mainly cultural.
The above info is taken from here I do not mind at all that this is the case but if you take a look at kosisland.info, it is not merely another commercial site. There is a wealth of information on history, mythology, Hippocrates of Kos, the surrounding islands, a virtual tour which includes details on the capital, the villages, photographs, port excavations, central, eastern and western excavations, Medieval monuments and the castle, the Asklepieion and the Hippocratic foundation as well as other useful information. In fact the entire site is dedicated to the island of Kos by two people from Kos. To help cover hosting costs there are google ads. I agree with you completely that wikipedia is not a place to simply add your link and to promote commercial sites, but I sincerely do not think that this is the case here. -- AmethyStos 06:56, 5 August 2006 (UTC)
- Thanks, how does this look now? You know, if you had just said that in the first place, this page would never have to have been protected! Oh well (let me know what you think of the article now). —Khoikhoi 18:40, 5 August 2006 (UTC)
- Thank You! That is perfect. -- AmethyStos 11:10, 7 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Remove spam links
This page is currently protected, but there are a few spam links... could some one remove them?
These links are : inkos.gr, and katras.gr
Thanks, Fmanos
[edit] Tourism
Kos is a favorite destination for Iranians.
[edit] Municipality of Kos (Δήμος Κω)
The island of Kos is comprised of three municipalities: Kos, Dikaio, and Irakleides. We do not have an article for Kos municipality, the biggest of the three. Backspace 22:19, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
- Please feel free to start one! We look forward to reading it! Student7 00:02, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
