Talk:Kontsevich system

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[edit] ㅚ

Transcription of "ㅚ" as "ВЕ" seems really strange, I would expect "ой" or something similar. The link to Kontsevich article has indeed "ВЕ", but I strongly suspect this is an error (moreover, "ВЕ" is already a transcription of "ㅞ"). rado 20:38, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

I'm guessing it's a case of them being distinguished by funny diacritics that people can't or couldn't be bothered to type, kinda like what happens to McCune-Reischauer. There's the same problem of distinguishing ㅗ and ㅓ, both got transcribed by О according to ruwiki and that external link. Would be nice to have a printed reference --- there'd be a table in the back matter of a Russian-published Korean dictionary or textbook, probably. cab 21:54, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

No, the Kontsevich system is very unlikely to contain any diacritics - this would be very unusual for a Russian cyrillic based system. I did some research and I am puzzled. The World's Writing Systems by Peter T. Daniels (rather respectable book) gives the pronunciation of "ㅚ" as [we], which corresponds with Russian transcription as "ве". However, every other online source I have been able to find gives the pronunciation as [ø] or (historical) [oi̯]. rado 09:29, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

The pronunciation of "ㅚ" may be either [ø] or [we] according to the standard rules in South Korea, and [we] dominates in the younger generation especially. I'm not sure what the tendency is in North Korea, but in both Koreas there is an ongoing simplification of the vowel system. As Russian lacks a simple way to represent [ø], it makes sense to write both "ㅚ" and "ㅞ" as "ве" to reflect the ongoing "ㅚ"-"ㅞ" merger. I can come back with some references if needed. 124.111.53.68 09:03, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Bae Juchae 배주채 (Hangugeo-eui Bareum 한국어의 발음, 2003) describes the different varieties of Korean as having between 6 and 10 vowels according to region and generation. He lists 6 different vowel systems. Of these, only one—the 10-vowel system used by the older generation in Central and Jeolla regions—retains [ø] as a simple vowel. In all the rest (all of which have fewer than 10 vowels), including that of both older and younger generations in North Korea, "ㅚ" is pronounced [we]. --124.111.53.217 16:21, 8 June 2007 (UTC)