Talk:Kitesurfing

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Contents

[edit] Reorganization of wiki pages on Kitesurfing, Kiteboarding, Landboarding, Kiteskating, Snowkiting, etc.

Currently, the wiki Kiteboarding page describes Kiteboarding as a land-based sport alternatively named Kite Landboarding. ("Kite Landboarding" is set up as a wiki referral link to the current wiki "Kiteboarding" page). Actually, AFAICT, the sport generally referred to in the real world as "Kiteboarding" is a water-based sport which has Kitesurfing an alternative name, and which has land-based and snow-based offshoots. A number of websites, publications, and organizations exist which support this interpretation of what Kiteboarding is and is not (see http://www.kiteboardingmag.com/index.jsp, http://www.ikointl.com/index1.php, http://www.ikiteboarding.com/, http://www.ikiteboarding.com/kiteboarding/articles/what-is-kiteboarding.aspx, etc.)

Besides water-based and land-based versions of Kiteboarding, a snow-based version exists which is referred to as "Kite Snowboarding" or, as "Snow Kiteboarding", or as "Snowkiting". A wiki Snowkiting page currently exists.

It appears to me that page-naming on this within wiki is out of sync with nomenclature usage in the real world. Barring strong opposition, I intend sometime in the near future to do the following in an attempt to correct this situation:

  • Move the current wiki "Kiteboarding" page to "Kite Landboarding".
  • Make a referral link from "Landboarding" to "Kite Landboarding"
  • Make a referral link from "Kiteskating" to "Kite Landboarding"
  • Make a referral link from "Kiteboarding" to "Kitesurfing"
  • Make a referral link from "Kite Snowboarding" to "Snowkiting"
  • Make a referral link from "Snow Kiteboarding" to "Snowkiting"
  • Do some minor edits on the "Kitesurfing", "Kite Landboarding", and "Snowkiting" pages to provide cross-referrals where needed.

Coomments? Outraged objections? Alternative suggestions? In hopes of having a single-pronged discussion on this, I ask that the discussion take place on the current Talk:Kiteboarding page.

Posted on the Talk:Kiteboarding, Talk:Kitesurfing, and Talk:Snowkiting pages -- Boracay Bill 05:34, 31 July 2006 (UTC)


[edit] History of kitesurfing

History of kitesurfing - perhaps someone could write up a brief history of the sport from Cory Roeseler's original rigid-fram 'KiteSki' (sp?) to the modern foil kites and international sport we know today...

Associations - Also, I'm from Western Australia so I only know about AKSA/WAKSA and the IKO, but perhaps somebody else could link other kitesurfing associations?


splintax 07:34, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Nomenclature: Kitesurfing vs. Kiteboarding

A few days ago, User:Tfmajor revised a Kiteboarding wikilink on the Boracay page to read Kitesurfing instead. Noting that Wiki has sepaprate pages for Kiteboarding and Kitesurfing, I revised that further to mention both names for the sport.

I am not a KiteBoarding/KiteSurfing person, and I find it confusing to have two names for what is apparently the same sport and to have separate wiki pages for each of the two names. Could these two wiki pages be combined, with the page being located at whichever is the most generally-accepted name for the sport and the link for the alternative name made a redirect link?

Note: This section was posted to talk:Tfmajor, talk:Kitesurfing and talk:Kiteboarding -- Boracay Bill 23:59, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

The two major english language magazines, SBC Kiteboard and Kite Boarding made a deliberate decision in the late 90's to refer to the sport as kiteboarding. It was thought at the time that the term kiteboarding better described the various styles of riding and meshed more closely with the naming of the other action sports of Skateboarding, Wakeboarding, and Snowboarding. Kitesurfing is used primarily in the UK to describe the sport, and has it's roots in windsurfing. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.127.244.227 (talk) 12:33, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] External Links

In order to address the cleanup-spam tag, I removed several redundant links and saved one or two of each kind. There is no need to link to three different kitesurfing forums, for instance. --Danaman5 22:23, 23 March 2006 (UTC)

There were too many random links and some wern't in english, so I reorganized them into groups to make it easier to look up more info on kitesurfing. --Denis bda 27 May 2006

I think the following commercial links should go to as they are too close to advertising:

Equipment Makers

--Peter Campbell Talk! 07:46, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

I removed a commercial link recently added, and wound up cleaning up the links section, including the tag. If anyone has a problem with the changes, please discuss it here. I tried to follow the WP policy, but it is not always cut and dried. I looked at all the web sites, and dropped any that were obviously commercial, had significant advertising (other than simple Google ads) or a single product focus. Dhaluza 02:44, 2 January 2007 (UTC)
--

@Dhaluza: i'd suggest a single link to Kiteatlas.com, an international (english language) kitesurf atlas containing detailed infos on kite locations worldwide. It looks good and well-thought, it's open content, non-commercial and contains other web 2.0 community tools (blog, forum, buddies,...). Have a look and eventually consider it for inclusion in the non-commercial links.

It could replace the various single local sites as:

Comments apreciated.
-- sputnikzz 11:55, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Mad Sport

I just saw this sport for the first time down on Sandymount strand two weeks ago. Six guys were doing it and it looked out of this world! 193.1.172.163 22:10, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] kiteboarding/kitesurfing

Hi there,

Looks like there is some confusion about terms for this sport - kiteboarding vs. kitesurfing. Here are my comments:

"Kitesurfing" refers most specifically to riding waves (surfing) on a board and using a kite. This is only a small but growing part of the sport and people don't really differentiate it when they talk about it. "Kiteboarding" refers to riding on a board with a kite, mainly on flat or choppy water. The best reference would be that all the main magazines ("Kiteboarding" by World Publications and "SBC Kiteboard" by SBC Media) use the simple "kiteboarding" terminology. I believe there has actually been editorial written in one of these magazines about this specific topic of the correct name for the sport. Might be worth having someone look into.

[edit] Categories

I've added the categories Extreme sports, as well as water and air sports as all three seem obvious after watching some people doing this in Rio. Pejorative.majeure 22:19, 24 November 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Parasurfing

Parasurfing redirects to Kiteboarding. If individuals are using stylized parachutes and not kites, shouldn't that be included as an alternative name, esp. if the redirect is already there? Nowhere in the article is the word "parasurfing" mentioned, nor is even a parachute included as part of the equipment that can be used. Pejorative.majeure 22:19, 24 November 2006 (UTC)


You might consider the type of kite used because some are similar in construction to a parafoil (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kitesurfing#Foil_kites), other are not. To say they are the same is a horrible over generalisation. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 58.7.141.137 (talk) 09:22, 20 January 2007 (UTC).

[edit] List of kitesurfing locations

The list is getting rather long for the already long main article. I suggest we move it to a stand-alone list article linked from here. Dhaluza 12:24, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

I agree. A separate article would work for this. Peter Campbell 00:29, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

NOTE - The Category:Kitesurfing locations I recently created to catalogue locations has been listed for deletion. You can vote or comment on this here. This means the newly created Kitesurfing locations article may also get deleted, unless editors vote to keep it. Peter Campbell 07:01, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Content requiring reworking

The following content has been removed from the article pending reworking. The content is copied from a website and much of it duplicates what is already in the article. In addition, peacock terms are included. Peter Campbell 22:40, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Reasons for kite surfing

Kite surfing as one of the fastest and most recent growing extreme water sport in the world is becoming safer due to improvements in kite design, safety release systems and training. Kite surfing methods are being constantly enhanced and so with the gear and equipment which are developed continuously seeing that this sport continues to gain popularity. There are a variety of reasons why people go kite surfing. Below is a list why increasing numbers of individual are getting engrossed in this sport[1]:

  • Wind surfing, Wakeboarding, Surfing and Kite flying all rolled into one. It’s like doing various kinds of outdoor activities at one time!
  • Kite Surfing is an exciting outdoor activity. The sky is the limit so to speak!
  • It can be done essentially on available open large bodies of water and dependable steady winds. It can be both practiced along the shores and on large lakes and rivers likewise.
  • Learning how to kitesurf is easier and takes less time than learning the basics of Wind Surfing.
  • Major seaside cities offer courses on Kite Surfing as it continuously attract aspiring participants. There are also clubs for all kite surfers. Likewise, many tropical destinations are following suit.
  • People go Kite Surfing but for strong person with the right dedication this water sport can prove to be a fun and an incredibly exciting sport.

-- It shoud have not deleted in the first place... You should have at least edited it, if in conformance to your judgement is true. It seems that you know what is opt to do then. You should have edited for further expansion and edition... The information listed is not really bad. It only needs revision. We both know for a fact that the information was placed because of a purpose? And not to be just judged and removed.... Reader contributor 07:01, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

The content in question should not have been added as it is a direct copy from a website, which is not allowed, and was not referenced either. Some is also opinion and quite a lot duplicates content already in the article. Please refer to WP:NOR, WP:CITE and WP:COPYVIO policies/guidelines on article content. Regarding external links, please review WP:EL. WP:Attribution and WP:What Wikipedia is not are also relevant. --Peter Campbell 09:14, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] How-to and 2nd person

The article contains a lot of how-to content, which is not permitted on Wikipedia. Also, there are a lot of 2nd person "you" references, which are also inappropriate. Recent edits have made this problem worse, instead of better. Dhaluza 04:53, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

Someone needs to bite the bullet and shift the "howto" content to Wikibooks. The current form of section of the article will encourage more of the same. Peter Campbell 11:41, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

I have made a start on removing the "you" references in the article. When this has been done, will look into moving the how-to sections out and clearing up the tag. Richard Thompson (Talk! | Contribs) 08:46, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Dangers and safety

Hallo Peter, with my contribution I would like to enlarge the area of the 2-linekites (beginnerkites) and point out to a security breach not considered by the supplier of a 2-linekites: A 2-linekite which can modify into a 4-linekite, has 3 attachment points on each kitetip. The attachment points are not visually different. Own tests have shown that the kite, if the attachment is different on each kitetip, cannot be controlled as expected. Because the range of the kitetips, which can be changed any time, a warning sign should be added at the kite or in the instructions to avoid accidents. The pilot will check the attachment before kiting and can be sure that the kite flies well. I like to add even further details to the flight behaviour of a dejusted kite. My question now, do I have to start a new report or may I add my experiences into the above one? Anja —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Kiteroulette (talk • contribs) 12 February 2007.

Anja/Kiteroulette, what you may be valid, but Wikipedia has a policy of no original research WP:NOR so including the type of content you mention is not appropriate in this article or elsewhere. All content added should include and external reference and/or citation to ensure it is worthy of inclusion. You could try posting your content on a kiteboarding community forum. Peter Campbell 00:41, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

Better yet post it on my "how-to" Wiki over at http://www.how2kitesurf.homeip.net - Its looking for content!

Hallo Peter, may I write following: A 2-linekite, which is convertible into a 4-linekite, has 3 attachment points in the range of the kite tips. The attachment points are not visually different. A different combination of the attachment causes a uncontrollable flightbehaviour.

'cause I have made the experience, I do have the copyright. Till now, the bad flightbehaviours of a dejusted kite were not published. With my contribution I would like to make use of my right and publish these now.

Kiteroulette, content added to Wikipedia requires an appropriate citation. Original research is not permitted. Please check your content meets this criteria. If it does, it can be added. Peter Campbell 09:47, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

When will you publish my article? Do I have to publish first the technical report of an engineering office? Do I have to send it via e-mail. The technical report states the problem with a 2-linekite. Maybe I have to create a homepage which show this technical report? I really don't know. Please give me some advice. Anja —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kiteroulette (talk • contribs) 16:30, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Snowkiting image

I have shifted the snowkiting image recently added to this artile to the snowkiting article Peter Campbell 01:17, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] External link - xKiting.com, please comment on inclusion

The following external link has been added (by IP address edits and User: SurfboYbe and removed several times from the article:

xkiting.com - Kiteboarding Tools!

It appears to be semi-commercial to me - at least as a directory of sellers.

Opinions on whether this is worthy of inclusion please (e.g. support, oppose):

  • The site does seem commercial, although includes information on kites. I would oppose the inclusion of this link - Richard Thompson 09:30, 6 March 2007 (UTC)
  • Commercial sites are sites different from xkiting.com. Do you see any money-making involved in xkiting.com? Nobody is earning money or making money with it. The site is made for information about kiteboarding products. Does return some news, video's,... and many more tools in the future. Commerce comprises the trading of something of economic value, this is not the case with xkiting. Xkiting gives information. Support..
  • Oppose. The content is very light, and there is a commercial directory as part of the site. I think some relevant policy links are WP:NOT#DIRECTORY and WP:NOT#SOAP (advertising). Peter Campbell 22:30, 6 March 2007 (UTC)
  • The information on the site is limited, seems to me to be a start up website looking to push visitors their way. Although the site may not be directly commercial, the link inclusion would seem to be a soapbox. If the content of the site improves there may be good reason for it to be included in the article, but at this time my opinion of inclusion is still the same. - Richard Thompson 10:49, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
  • Here is another revelant policy reference: WP:EL External link guidelines --Peter Campbell 03:49, 9 March 2007 (UTC)
  • Exclude I had the same reservations that this was a semi-commercial site primarily aimed at product info, not kiteboarding info. Dhaluza 10:55, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
  • You should really take a look at what commerial sites are. Dhaluza here above says it's product info, well what is commercial at that? Do you see a 'buy here' button? Do you see (google) advertising on the site? So I'll repeat, there's no money making involved in this site. It's made for information only (and other tools). People here are working hard in their free time to make a site like this for the kiteboarders, and you all just support it like this, very nice. Commercial says business, xkiting is not a business. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by SurfboYbe (talk • contribs) March 7, 2007.
  • Wikipedia is not about support for your site. As your site stands, with little content, there is no usefulness for it to be included as a link. If the site improves its content then there may be good reason to include it. If you want to increase awearness and get more content, from users, for your site I would suggest using kitesurfing forums to create interest. You will need to prove to people that your site has enough useful information on the topic if you want them to vote to keep your link. Peter makes mention of WP:NOT#SOAP which is more where your site falls at this time. - Richard Thompson 11:37, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
  • From Xkiting.com - For Companies - "We are the searchengine for kiteboarding companies! Register your company and choose what information you want to be published of your company. After your registration you will be able to login and manage your account using our advanced admin area. It's made perfectly for your company to promote products. Add and edit kites, boards and accessoires. If there's something you would like more to have in our admin area, you just have to ask us and we will add it as soon as possible!". This is clearly a promotional and marketing service site, which I think makes it unsuitable for Wikipedia. Not detracting from your good efforts in creating this, it is just not encyclopaedic. Peter Campbell 11:53, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

ok —The preceding unsigned comment was added by SurfboYbe (talk • contribs) March 8, 2007.

[edit] 'Wikipedian kitesurfers' category created

I have just created the Category:Wikipedian kitesurfers for Wikipedians to add to their userpages. You can use by adding [[Category:Wikipedian kitesurfers|{{PAGENAME}}]] to the bottom of your user page, or add {{User:Peter_Campbell/Userboxes/Kitesurfer}} to your user page to display the userbox and add the category. --Peter Campbell 13:50, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Board Grabs

Diagram showing board grabs
Diagram showing board grabs

I have created a diagram showing board grabs and the different names for each grab, shown above. The image is SVG and I release it for anyone to make use of/change to make it better/informative. How do people feel about inclusion in the article? Richard Thompson (Talk! | Contribs) 17:40, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

--I see no harm once this image is used... I have personally reviewed and tried as what is shown on your diagram. Reader contributor 06:56, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

  • With no further disagreement I will include this in the article at some point to day. I am going to create a new section under techniques called Board Grabs. Although in the future it may be advisable to create a subcategory tricks and then include information on board grabs, kite loops and unhooked tricks etc. Richard Thompson (Talk! | Contribs) 09:14, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Information has now been added to the main article, any problems please discus/let me know - Richard Thompson (Talk! | Contribs) 15:15, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Links - Other non Commercial

The other non commercial links needs to be addressed, I feel. There are now a lot of links that I feel would be better suited on the Kitesurfing locations article rather than the main article. Any comments? Richard Thompson (Talk! | Contribs) 07:55, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

I have now moved the links to the Kitesurfing locations article. Richard Thompson (Talk! | Contribs) 08:33, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

HangGliderHistory has just been added to the article - it doesn't have much content on kitesurfing at all so I think it should go. Any other thoughts on this? Peter Campbell 23:49, 18 January 2008 (UTC)

Lots of .com links in this section, as at March 16 2008 the .com and.co sites, with my suggestions, are:

  • sbckiteboard.com - Buyers' Guide, gear tests, travel, instruction and breaking news.
  • kitesurf-varna.com - Links Directory 1000s Photos and Video
REMOVED: already in Kitesurfing locations article
  • Kite-stuff.org - Home building kite stuff site.
REMOVED, not notable
  • iKiteboarding.com - Kiteboarding articles, pictures and news.
Remove; some commercial content (travel, lessons etc)
  • Document on KiteSurf (in French)
REMOVED; not much content and limited value to english wiki
  • KiteSpot.gr - Greek kitesurfing locations, news, gallery and forum.
Shift Kitesurfing locations as is country specific
  • www.kitesurfers.co.nz - Wellington, New Zealand, gallery, locations.
Shift to Kitesurfing locations as is location specific
  • www.seabreeze.com.au - Australian kitesurfing news, weather and gallery.
Shift to Kitesurfing locations as is location specific
  • Outer Banks Kiteboarding - Information on Kiteboarding on the Outer Banks.
Shift to Kitesurfing locations as is location specific blog
  • Extreme-sports - Lithuanian kitesurfing, windsurfing, snowboarding news, weather, forum, locations and gallery.
REMOVED; not specific to kitesurfing
  • SurferToday.com - Kitesurfing news provider.
REMOVED; commercial and not specific to kiteboarding
  • HangGliderHistory -Kitesurfing, Kiteboarding, KiteJumping timeline inclusion as kitesurfing includes large sectors of hang gliding.
REMOVED: nothing about kitesurfing (could be cited in text, but not a general resource
  • kitesurfing.com.au Sydney, Australia area daily kitesurfing weather forecasts, kitesurfing news, photo galleries and and other kitesurfing related information.
Shift to Kitesurfing locations as is country specific
  • KiteboardingReview.com - Online kite reviews and discussions.
REMOVED; very light on for content and numerous links to commercial sites

Peter Campbell 07:15, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] External link to www.kiteboardingreview.com

A link to http://www.kiteboardingreview.com/ has recently been re-added twice. While this site is notionally non-commercial I note that one manufacturer has provided a prize for a competition on the site and reviews for their kites figure prominently. I don't think there is much significant content on the site, and there are numerous commercial links on it. Can editors please indicate whether they support or oppose inclusion of this external link? Peter Campbell 23:38, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

  • I support the inclusion of the site http://www.kiteboardingreview.com/. Firstly, content within the site is meaningful and relevant to kitesurfing, however, not suitable for inclusion in the article, such as reviews and interviews. Therefore it should be included, as recommended by the Wikipedia External Links reference. I have been searching the internet for kite reviews for months and this site is the best at this point in time. I do not believe this site is commercial in nature. The fact that 'featured kite' positions have been offered in exchange for prizes should not be viewed as 'commercial' since no profits are made by the website. Mick auf (talk) 00:00, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
    Note that the link to this site has now been re-added again by Mick auf. I am waiting for other opinions on whether it should be included. Peter Campbell 13:22, 12 April 2008 (UTC)