User:Katr67/Archive2.2

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Peer Review?

I was wondering if you might give me a peer review on Executive Order 9835, I just wrote it. You know, if you have time, I can return the favor, of course. Thanks A mcmurray 05:33, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

9835 and such

Thanks for doing the spell check and such. I would review that article for you if you ever post it. The DYK process is pretty easy. Just nominate an entry, mostly if it adheres to the criteria (inline citations, NPOV, etc) it goes to the Main DYK. The page to nominate entries is here. Sorry my response took so long, been away a few days. A mcmurray 18:23, 21 November 2006 (UTC)

Povey Bros.

I noticed you added Povey Bros. to your to-do list. I have some materials which might be useful in that regard. I've taken photos of all of the windows they installed in The Dalles Evangelical Church (not on the Historic Register), and intend to do the same for other installations in the gorge area (which include a couple other churches here in town and in Hood River, besides Old St. Pete's).

I could e-mail you what I have, or wait for you to get at least a stub up, and post them directly to your article, or perhaps you have another suggestion. -- J-M Jgilhousen 07:33, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

P.S. You might want to take a look at how little I've managed to actually write on Jim Redden. I'm keeping it in draft form in my User space until it's ready for more active collaboration. -- J-M Jgilhousen 07:33, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

My to-do list is a pipe dream, but since you have material, I'll try to get a stub up this weekend. I'm going to try to borrow my friend's digital camera and get some photos this weekend--one of the local historic districts is having an open house, and I'm sure there's some Povey Bros. stuff around here. Jim Redden is looking very good. Very interesting about the AIM controversy--I'll see if he got mentioned in In the Spirit of Crazy Horse by Peter Matthiessen. Katr67 18:40, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
I know too well about pipe dreams. An occasional excursion into the world of the Poveys would provide me a welcome diversion from all the government and politics stuff. I think I'm gonna have to resort to creating some stubs in those categories... the redlinks are really distracting. -- J-M Jgilhousen 21:17, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Music of Oregon

Your comment on Wikipedia talk:Release Version Nominations has been duplicated to the right place : Wikipedia:Release Version Nominations/Set Nominations. Thanks for the help you provide to the V0.7 project. Lincher 20:30, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

John Day (1770-1820)

Hello! I have read your excellent postings, mainly on Oregon cities. For John Day (1770-1820), you changed the identifier from Hunter to Fur Trader. I originally wrote hunter because that was his primary occupation in the old Oregon Country. He was hired to hunt and provide game meat, first for the Pacific Fur Company's Overland Party in 1811-1812, and then at Fort Astoria from 1812-1814. Between 1814 and 1820 he was both hunting and trapping. He never acted in the capacity of "trader" in Oregon. I am going to change the identifier to "hunter and fur trapper." I'm writing a book on the man. Take care, and thanks for all your detailed contributions! --Nick Sheedy —The preceding unsigned comment was added by N.M.Sheedy (talk • contribs) 23:12, 10 December 2006 (UTC).

You're welcome and thanks for checking in. I think "hunter and fur trapper" is a little wordy, the identifier is mainly to help with disambiguation and I chose "fur trapper" for consistency with similar people, but if he wasn't a trapper, there is probably no need to include that part and you could go back to "hunter". I was just thinking it sounded kind of generic, I guess, and fur trader was more distinctive and more of his time and place, if that makes sense (whereas there might well be some guy around today named John Day who happens to be a hunter). Anyway, it might be worth asking at Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (people). It says that you should "try to limit to a single, recognisable and highly applicable word regarding the person at hand", so I'd say go with "hunter" for now, but perhaps something like "Oregon" might make him easier to identify? Or maybe (though it is more than one word) "Pacific Fur Company"? Katr67 05:57, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
I see your point for the identifier for John Day and agree that "fur trader" is probably best, so as to link him with others in that field. I was perhaps splitting hairs with details. John Day was not a "trader"--he was a profesional hunter and later a freelance trapper. At that time, there was a legal distinction between fur traders, trappers and hunters. In the territory included in the Louisiana Purchase, and governed by the United States, it was illegal for any white men to hunt or trap commercially, and traders were allowed to trady with Indians only by license. As such, the industry generally set up trading posts and outfitted the Indians with traps and tools for hunting, and partered for pelts and skins. West of the rocky mountains, these legal restrictins did not apply, and the companies found that the indians were less willing to trap and trade, so they outfitted their own men to trap and hunt. John Day's occupation in the Oregon Country was as one of the lead hunters for the Pacific Fur comapany, and he supplied much of the meat to feed the company's men. He did some trapping after that, but was never a "trader" in the specific or legalsense of the occupation. Nick Sheedy 19:10, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

thanks for your note

Thanks for your edits, especially the wiki help under the Astor Party... I'm still trying to learn all the wiki formating styles. My formatting might be lacking, but the information I want to share is accurate.--Nick —The preceding unsigned comment was added by N.M.Sheedy (talk • contribs) 18:58, 11 December 2006 (UTC).

Boyd, Oregon

I needed a break from government and politics, and noticed there was no article on Boyd, Oregon, so I did one. My great grandfather owned the general store and post office there, and my family still has a wheat ranch nearby. I resisted the temptation to interject personal knowledge and recollections, and relied solely on published sources. Anyway, I thought I remembered your having an interest in defunct towns, and thought you might like to look it over... you're such a great copy editor. Also, I tried to use the "city" infobox template, but it doesn't really work for ghost towns. I could use a generic infobox if you think that would set the map off better. The last several weeks have been rotten for photography -- nothing but overcast, which creates uncharacteristic shots. I'll take some photos to illustrate articles on local and area subjects as soon as we have some decent weather... may have to wait til spring. -- J-M Jgilhousen 23:35, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Great! (And thanks for the compliment!) How cool to have those kind of roots in Oregon. I'm a first generation Oregonian--every generation in my family moved a little more to the west. I'm glad they ended up here though. Boyd has been on my list for ages. In fact, I've got the redlinked names of all the Oregon communities I run across on my watchlist, so I almost always see new community articles the day they get written. I'm doing a data entry project for one of the state agencies involving 55-year-old data, and seeing all the names of the little towns I'd never heard of is what sparked my interest in Wikipedia. I would google the names and every time Wikipedia:U.S. cities without articles would come up and I said "Hmm. I smell a project." There must have been quite a few people from there at one point, because the name comes up a lot. It's funny it doesn't actually link to anything. (I'll go add it to Wasco County.) I don't even bother with infoboxes on the tiny little places because I think it ends up looking silly, but if other people put them on, I leave them be. I just wikignomed a couple things on the article, and when I get home, I'll see if OGN has anything new to add. Great job on the article--it's a lot longer than the ones I usually come up with. BTW, did you check out the article on the Great Southern Railroad someone added recently? Katr67 00:08, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
Yeah, I qualify for "pioneer family" membership in the Old Wasco County Pioneers Association on both sides of my family. My grandfather (son-in-law of the previously mentioned Boyd merchant) homesteaded on Fifteen Mile Creek, moving to town to provide a better education for his daughters. His uncle was a photographer, back when it was a young profession, and taught the trade to several relatives, so our Family Association has an incredible archive of photographs. I'll be uploading some of them. I'm afraid that when I was young, I harbored somewhat of an inferiority complex about my rural background, preventing my appreciation of what, in fact, is a rich heritage.
Regarding infoboxes, I'm fond of them, because I use Wikipedia quite a bit to grab quick bits of data, and I like having the basics summarized in "at a glance" form. You're right that on small articles it does unbalance the page, but I've been placing them anyway, hoping it would provide further incentive for people to expand both the articles and the infobox data. I'll think about that some more given your comment. Perhaps my use of them should be more judicious.
It hadn't occurred to me that someone would have gotten around to doing an article on the Great Southern. I've walked its roadbed often... it runs through our ranch. It was very important to Shaniko during its heyday, too. Thanks for pointing it out to me. I had no idea of the origin of the building to which the article refers, which does appear quite out of place in its current location at the base of Brewery Grade here in town. It now houses a couple of businesses, and I had a friend who lived in an apartment in its second story. I'll grab a snapshot of it for the article. This is great. -- J-M Jgilhousen 02:59, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Joel Palmer

Hi Katr67! Knowing your behavior, you have no doubt read Joel Palmer. As there are no revisions, it's probably the case you haven't got around to making any revisions or suggestions yet. (I have trouble believing there is nothing to find.) Alas, I found his Journal online after several days work resolving the various references. With the discovery of that incredible resource—which I spent hours and hours reading just to get to page 168 of 311—the article can be corrected and expanded greatly. It looks like most biographies condense the information to the point of being misleading. For example, while they were looking for a way over south Mount Hood, there was fairly regular stream of other parties coming and going, bringing provisions from The Dalles. Anyway, I invite you to comment/revise mercilessly to help guide the direction of the next round of revisions. — EncMstr 20:23, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Yes, I saw you wrote it, but believe or not, I haven't read it yet. (Trying to have a life outside Wikipedia, doncha know.) Thanks for the invite--I'll be sure to take a look at it tonight. (Or this afternoon if I come out of my post-office party food coma.) I'm glad my efforts are appreciated by most. I do tend to stick my fingers in all the Oregon pots. :) BTW, I ordered the book that lists all the people whose names are painted in the house and senate chambers at the Capitol--hopefully it will be a good resource. Katr67 21:20, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Mt. Hood

I am most pleased to run across an Oregon maven. :) I got lectured (indirectly) by an editor for writing something about glaciers "softening" in warm weather. I admit I don't know much about glaciers. I wonder if you know: It's clear why December climbing is risky, especially on the north slope. But why is it (or is it?) dangerous to climb during the late spring and summer. Apparently the glaciers don't "soften", so is it simply that the snows on top of the glaciers melt, and crevaces open up? Because the crevace on the hogsback is not visible in the winter, just in the warmer months. Thank you. :) Wahkeenah 02:47, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Hi Wahkeenah. I may be an Oregon maven, but I don't know much about glaciers either. You might want to check in with User:EncMstr, since he's (I'm assuming he's a he, I've never asked) the one who took that part out. Better yet, find a source. I'd go look for one, but I'm busy catching up on a bunch of edits I promised I'd make. Cheers! Katr67 02:56, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
I'm guessing my userID might ring a bell. :) I might have a book on Mt. Hood that goes into that subject more. I think that book also has a list of all the catastrophes on the mountain (as of 1991 or so), which would probably be overkill (pardon the metaphor) for the article. But it might be interesting to list the first fatality on the mountain, and maybe the one where someone got too close to the fumarole of this "dormant" volcano and suffocated. Like many mountains, Hood is both beautiful and sinister. That may be one reason mountains have often been likened to mythological gods. Wahkeenah 03:37, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Otter Rock, Oregon

Hi Katr67; Otter Rock, Oregon could use some work; care to work your magic? Walter Siegmund (talk) 21:44, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Yup, I'm on it right now. :) Katr67 21:50, 16 December 2006 (UTC)
Very nice. Thank you. Walter Siegmund (talk) 23:31, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Naming conventions -- State political offices and government agencies

Confession: The MoS and other policies and guidelines are so voluminous, I have to admit that I had not read the entire section on naming conventions, and have been relying solely on the "most popular name" provision when creating articles.

Recently, I had occasion to delve into it more thoroughly, and it seems that I may be running afoul of Wikipedia:Naming conventions (government departments and ministers) as I go through Oregon government and politics to fill in gaps, de-redlink, etc. In mitigation, I appear to be in good company, as I browsed through the correlary articles for California, Wisconsin, and a few other states before starting to name government-related articles, and they seem to be equally noncompliant with the guideline.


Since I expect to be creating a good number of articles in the next few months, I want to prevent the occasion arising where our noncompliant naming conventions becomes an issue requiring the renaming of a daunting inventory of articles. On the other hand, neither do I want to use a naming system that is so inconsistent with the ones which already exist within the scope of the Government and Politics subgroup.

The logical course would seem to be to rename the existing articles according to the guideline, and then follow it in the naming of future articles. Frankly, I am not keen on interrupting the research and writing I'm doing in order to undetake such a massive "clean up" project. Any thoughts? And should I move this discussion to the project, sub-group, or other talk page? -- "J-M" Jgilhousen 01:20, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

I think it would be good to copy this discussion to the sub-group talk page, with a note on the main project talk page. My professional bias would be to name things according to what the state calls them, with redirects from what people might actually search for. I believe this automatically "pre-disambiguates" them as most of the state agencies have the word "Oregon" in them. Can you give some examples of articles you feel don't fit with the guideline? BTW, a quick rummage through my training materials from the legislature does not reveal an official list of state agencies and divisions but if there are any questions in this regard, I'm pretty qualified to figure them out. (See answer to ORS question, below.) Katr67 22:53, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
Except for this line, done... and thanks. -- "J-M" (Jgilhousen) 22:58, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

Inline citations

It appears that my liberal use of the ref tag to mark what content I have gotten from where is idiosyncratic, but everyone has been too polite to call me out on it. I understand that too many reference tags diminishes easy readability, but I am adding so much content right now, I don't know how else to keep track of what statements of fact I've gotten from where, and have already been bitten with a few Template:fact insertions, and other challenges as to sourcing. Care to provide some guidance? -- "J-M" Jgilhousen 01:20, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

P.S. Sorry to "spam" you by posting twice within minutes, but since they were on entirely different subjects, thought it best to separate them.

No worries. I just got done messing with the Peter French article and need a break, but I'll give both matters some thought and get back to you. Katr67 01:24, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

Hmm. I haven't run into too much trouble in this regard, but my citation style is pretty random. I tend to go with whatever is prevailing on the page, though sometimes I stick embedded refs in as a stopgap, because frankly, using citation templates properly is a real pain during a quick and dirty wikignoming. I think I've also left the inline cites out and simply listed all my sources in a "References/External links" section. As I become more experienced, I tend to add more and more citation tags, though in the past I figured one citation at the end of a paragraph would suffice for the whole paragraph. Like you though, I've started using more than one source and blending the information, which necessitates the use of more tags in order to keep track of what comes from where. My most ridiculous amount of sourcing is in Neighb'rhood Childr'n, but nobody has read it, so no one has complained. :) (And in fact, I mixed templates with embedded refs, 'cos I was lazy.) I think using citation templates is a definite improvement in readability over embedded citations, though they do tend to make the readability in the editing box worse. If we are writing a real encyclopedia, and I think we are, then I think the emphasis should be on properly sourced information over readability (and I think Jimmy Wales would agree), because people naturally get used to ignoring footnotes if they so choose. If a person is not used to reading, say, professional journals or the like, the sourcing will seem annoying, but I doubt we should worry about it too much. I don't think there is going to be a solution that will please everybody--the minute you decide to not cite something that seems really obvious when you've cited everything else in a paragraph, I just bet someone will come along once in a while and slap a {{fact}} tag on it. On the other hand, the most ridiculous assertions sit unreferenced for months and nobody even questions them. Has anyone actually said anything to you about unreadability? I could see it if you cite every word, just like when people overlink things. But I haven't noticed that you overcite things.

Most of my edits have been creating articles from scratch, or doing a major expansion (usually from an existing stub of a paragraph or less). What brought the question up is that I have had people come through and remove all of my cite tags from where I had put them inline, and move them all to the reference section, where they had appeared with the reference/ tag already. I found it annoying, not because of a sense of ownership of the article, but because it effectively erased all track of which facts had been confirmed by which sources. And, no, nobody has mentioned readability to me, but it is mentioned as a consideration in the MoS, and my eyes aren't what they used to be, so I sometimes have trouble tracking lines that are packed with lots of blue superscripted brackets and numbers. And I hate the way line spacing is altered on lines with superscripts, which is as much an aesthetic sensitivity as an ocular problem. Like you, I have already settled into a pattern of holding my inline refs to the end of the paragraph, unless it's to document a source for a fact or quote that I think might be particularly open to challenge. That's about as far out on thin ice as I want to skate at this point, especially since so much of my work is in Government & Politics where cool heads tend not always to prevail. --"J-M" (Jgilhousen) 09:42, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

One final thought: In my college nature-writing class someone complained when I listed the Latin names of various critters in my paper after the common name, and I thought, well, if Barry Lopez can do it, why can't I? Of course, I'm no Barry Lopez, and I was writing for college students, not scientists, so I grumpily revised my draft and took out the offending Latin names. So when thinking about readability, consider your audience. For what level of reader are we writing Wikipedia? Katr67 23:43, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

Well, since I'm enough of a dinosaur that I actually still pray in Latin, I think my obvious bias should prevent my commenting on the particulars of this anecdote, except to say that I appreciated reading it. I have no clue about our audience, and should think that it would vary radically according to content matter, as evidenced by the activity on the talk pages of, say, the Oregon High School articles as opposed to those on biographies of Oregon Pioneers. I would like to think the profile of readers of most of the articles I write would be a closer match to Britannica than World Book, but if I'm wrong, please don't disabuse me of that fantasy. It's a case of ignorance probably being bliss, and anyway, I intend to write as if it's true (or in as close a manner as I am able given my own educational and writing talent limitations). And of course we're contributing to a real encyclopedia, although I am sure there are many who would assert that my credibility with regard to reality is deeply undermined by my Faith... and so it goes. Thanks for acting as sounding board. It is of immense help. You probably noticed that I signed up for the adoption program, and in fact, became an adoptee. I tend to call upon you for precisely the advice I was seeking in that program. Lucky you, eh? -- "J-M" (Jgilhousen) 09:42, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

ORS 401.615 meaning

Hey, Katr, maybe you understand the gibberish the legislature spews out. If you wouldn't mind, would you look at this which seems to say a law was put into effect, and this (especially the note just before 401.610) which doesn't seem to include it, except for recognizing the former. Confusing, eh? What does it mean? — EncMstr 08:13, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

Cool, a question I can answer! Either House Bill 3434 did not become law, or it has since been repealed. I would guess the former--if you look at the bracketed notes at the end of each statute, there are no changes that occurred in 1995. Give me a sec, and I'll see if I can find the tables for the 1995 session where one can figure this out. The note is confusing, but what it means is the legislation that enacted 401.605 to 401.635 did not include a section such as section 1 of HB3434 including those statues in the chapter. So the lawyers at the Legislative Counsel placed the new statutes in the the most logical chapter of ORS, but they are not actually *part* of the chapter. This is to make clear that the action of placing the statues there is editorial, not legislative. Yep, it's weird. Katr67 18:03, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
OK, 1995 legislative history is here. It appears HB3434 passed, but maybe did not get added to the ORS chapter. Now going to look at Oregon Laws. Katr67 18:08, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
Here is the bill as it was actually enrolled. No mention of adding it to ORS Chapter 401, so it resides in Oregon Laws 1995, which unfortunately is not online. The first 7 results of this search will show you all the amendments and such, if you're interested or masochistic. The bill you found was in its initial form, before being meddled with by both houses. It's the enrolled bill that matters, because bills are subject to being completely changed, including by the popular "gut and stuff", in which only the "relating to" clause stays the same. Anyway, for whatever reason, Oregon Laws 1995, Chapter 570 was not added to ORS. Katr67 18:23, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
It's probably just as well. I ran across some interesting materials arguing both sides of the issue—whether sufficiently "stupid" people needing rescue should pay. I've been looking for a place to put that, it seems a stretch in the Mount Hood, current incident article. Thanks for looking into that. At least I correctly got the flavor of it: that it is confusing. — EncMstr 05:57, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Trillium Lake

Is this a naturally-occurring pond? Or isn't that an earthen dam I see in the photo? Wahkeenah 23:00, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

I have no idea and I couldn't find a reference to the fact that it was an artificial lake with a quick google--that's why I tagged it. Judging by the photo is original research. I just searched on "Trillium Lake" with "dam" and see that it is indeed a dam, so I guess it is an artificial lake. It would be good to find a source with some history about it. Katr67 23:54, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

I strongly suspect Trillium is a natural lake, judging by its bottom (snorkel and scuba) and the lakeshores away from the dam. A forest service gravel road was built along the downstream side and that is probably the reason for a dam being built later to compensate for the damage to the lake the road builders inflicted. Gollie! That should be hard to find record for. I bet everyone involved wished it was forgotten. — EncMstr 05:52, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Oregon Railroad & Nav vs Oregon Ry & Nav

Thanks for creating the article and the OR&N one. I had assumed they were two names for the same thing, and since I got more google hits for Railway, I changed some of the references in articles from Railroad to Railway. Since you say you have the reference books, would you consider checking the "what links here" for the Railway article and make sure the references to the Railway are still accurate? Thanks for your help! Katr67 04:48, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Rhallanger"

They are two distinct, yet related, railroads. Oregon Railway & Nav was the first, it started in 1879 and ran until 1896. It built a 643 mile that made up the core of the Oregon Railroad & Nav. Oregon Ry & Nav started out by buying two smaller railroads that ran along the OR side of the Columbia River and then connecting the two small lines with a full routs running adjacent to the river. The railway was a Subsidiary of the UP, at least since 1888 (when ICC started listing) and perhaps before that as well. Why did they change the name to Railroad in 1896. It was sold and reorganized (through still a UP Subs). What changed in 1896 that would bring about a name change. Here's what happened - typically railoads modified their name after a significant change or internal reorgnanization, sometimes it was a result of changing from Narrow-Gauge to Standard Gauge, other times it was due to the line being electrified.

Reorganization is what led to the name change from Railway to Railroad in 1896. The Railway had two non-operating subsidiary railroads (below). In 1896 the two non-operating subsidiaries and the Railway were sold (reorganized- still UP Subsidiary) as the Railroad. The reorganization brought the railway and the two subsidiaries under one railroad. 69 miles came from the Oregon Railway Extensions Co, a non-operating subsidiary of Oregon Railway & Nav - the railroad ran from Winon, WA - Seltice, WA and from La Grande - Elgin, OR. The other line that made up the "new" railroad was the 154 miles of the Washington & Idaho Railroad that extended the Railway into Idaho. It too was a non-operating subsidiary of the Railway and had two lines. One line ran from Tekoa-Rockford to Spokane (Falls) WA. The other line ran from Tekoa WA to St. Joe, ID and then Wallace ID with branches from there to Burke and Mullan. Rhallanger 05:04, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Oregon Government Stub Tag

Do I really, honest to God, have to go through the bureaucratic approval process before making and using Template:Oregon-gov-stub? I'm not sure there are yet 30 candidate articles, but there soon will be, and I'd rather be doing the researching and writing rather than assembling a list, posting it, and waiting, then going back through to replace the more generic tag, etc. "There are no rules" is seeming more and more like a fantasy by the moment. -- "J-M" (Jgilhousen) 06:11, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Heh. Yeah, I think you really do. I merrily created a stub category after seeing that someone had created an unauthorized stub for Oregon sports venues and found out after seeing it slapped with some sort of deletion tag that that was sort of a bad idea. Discussion here if you're interested. (Speaking strictly for myself, it's a kind of a stub categories for dummies primer.) It turned out OK, I learned some stuff, but yes, the stub sorters keep really good track of things. Though I cleaned up the mess I made, I also chose to ignore the fact that {{Oregon-bio-stub}} is kind of unorthodox because that one wasn't my fault and it seems to be pretty handy. Katr67 06:43, 18 December 2006 (UTC)
I read the primer, which was precisely why I was hoping to avoid having to jump through all of its hoops. One of these days, I'd really kinda like to get back to writing. Once I discovered the MoS I started a downhill slope that is rapidly taking me into full-time administration work with no time left to actually compose anything. Hrrrumph. OK. I'll finish creating thirty stubs, then post the !@#$#@ing proposal. Sheesh. -- "J-M" (Jgilhousen) 09:20, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Re: Tigard

Wow. I didn't know we even had an article on Bull Mountain. (That's why I didn't add the link.) -- llywrch 00:19, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

Yep. That would be EngineerScotty's work. Katr67 00:20, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

Category:Natural history of Oregon

In reference to your statement of: 'this is for the Natural history of Oregon', a US State, of the USA on the North American Continent, in the "American West". I didn't learn what i (sic) learned because i think I am smart. Other people showed me things; however that does not mean they had all the answers. You have removed for a second time a piece of the "Natural history of Oregon", (and of Washington) if i understand where Celilo Falls are. (the American Black Vulture article has a subsection Labelled: "Fossil history, Oregon USA and specifics") So don't claim your way is right by denigrating, or denying that you are removing a Natural history reference. You can pretend you have moral authority. Or that you your (Aarrgh!) has some righteousness. It does not. (I've watched others say they are doing "One Thing", when it is clear they have a different agenda. The Wikipedians not only have stolen the word "Cabal", they are clearly at times creating their Cabals... (I hope somebody from Oregon, or the Pacific Northwest has the gumption to reverse some of your clearly, one minded intentions.)) -From the ArizDesert-SonoranDesert.. --Mmcannis 05:05, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

I was merely replacing the intro, which your edits took out, that all categories should have, defining what the category is for. If an article belongs in a category, then it should be added to the category. I did so with Haystack Rock, but didn't add the other articles because I wasn't sure they quite fit, but I have changed my mind. Category pages aren't the place to add other commentary, however. This edit, with my "Argh" was me being mad at *myself* for messing up the bolding and having to make three edits in row. With this edit, you will see that I added Celilo Falls to the natural history category. This edit adds the vulture to Avifauna of Oregon, a subcat of natural history. That is the proper way to categorize things, If I understand Wikipedia guidelines correctly. There is no cabal. I have no agenda except for following Wikipedia guidelines and making the best encyclopedia possible. You would do well to assume good faith. If you can find a reference to a Wikipedia policy or guideline that says it's OK to add links to articles on the categorization page, rather than simply categorizing them, I'll be happy to read it. Thanks. Katr67 15:09, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks

Hi, Thanks for the welcome message! I've been editing for the last 6 months or so -- this is a new username for me. I should set up my user page!ChartreuseLight 16:34, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

Message to me re: naming conventions

I did not name the "Brisbane Light Plane Crash" article. It was already on Wikipedia as such, I just linked to it and included the name of the man who owned the company. Floracalifornia 15:46, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks, Katr67, you're so helpful and reasonable! Unlike some uh, mods around here.  ;) Floracalifornia 17:28, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Well, some people are just trying to improve the encyclopedia, I wouldn't take it personally, and please assume good faith and try not to fight incivility with incivility. Katr67 19:46, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

AWB

You asked me to let yo know what I think of AWB. As you probably noticed, I finally got approved for its use last week. After staying up almost all night playing in the sandbox with it to get a feel for its features, I haven't actually used it much yet. It does what it is intended to do very well, and remarkably fast: semi-automating repetitive tasks. Today I turned it loose on the List of Governors of Oregon "what links here" list (one of several wiki lists it can read automatically, or it can work from a manually created txt file, or one entered directly into the program). With its "search and replace" function, it made short work of linking to the new Governor of Oregon article instead, stopping at each edit for confirmation (good thing, since some of the links really should point to the list). It would have been invaluable in our Mass tagging project, as it could have done it category by category in much less time than navigating to each article by hand. It will even use Wikisearch, but you know how functional that is. For a Wikignome par excelence like you, I think it is probably something you would want to consider having in your Wiki toolbox. Except, of course, it is another program to learn... I haven't begun to try all its features yet. -- "J-M" (Jgilhousen) 19:20, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks! I saw your flurry of activity, because naturally I have a bunch of those government articles on my watchlist. Actually I went ahead and signed up for it too, after I had to laboriously hand repair the ISBN on several articles in which I had referenced OGN, because Twisted86 accidentally got one number wrong and I was copying his citation. (Hmm, I forgot to give him an extra whomp with my foil last night for that...) I already managed to screw something up using it and had to go through and laboriously hand repair my mistake, but I can see how it will be very handy. I did a quick find and replace for a common spelling error, and it was so easy it warmed my little Wikignome heart. I don't mind doing things the old-fashioned way sometimes, but I'm sure there will many uses for AWB. If I need help figuring out what it does I'll be sure to ask you. I don't quite have the hang of the search parameters--when I searched for Oregon categories, only the top-level categories came up. And there are still many articles that need to be tagged, though I've got almost all the categories tagged except for the county ones and any that don't branch from the main Oregon cat. So if you know how to make it seach for untagged articles within categories, I'd love to know how to do that. Katr67 19:41, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

I don't, and it relies on the internal Wikisearch function, which itself has problems. An inelegant but possible workaround would be to use one of the third-party search tools, convert the result to a text file, and have it work from that. But, there may be some way to do it with advanced search from within AWB. I'll tinker a bit, and see what I can figure out. I am still on the learning curve with it myself. -- "J-M" (Jgilhousen) 09:27, 23 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the Barnstar

It was kind of you to notice, and kinder to bother acting upon it. I set the list aside a few times to do other things for sanity sake, but found that its total disarray haunted me. --"J-M" (Jgilhousen) 07:57, 22 December 2006 (UTC)

In-bloody-credible!

That's all I can say. Volunteer work shouldn't be this frustrating.

-- "J-M" (Jgilhousen) 09:22, 23 December 2006 (UTC)

Requested move

Hi Katr, I'm sort of confused with the current situation with regards to List of sole survivors of aviation accidents or incidents, and Survivors of Air Disasters. Which page should be where, and is the history in the correct place? Thanks. —Mets501 (talk) 18:04, 23 December 2006 (UTC)

plants and animals

Editors pretty much do what they want and not much can be done about any of it. And some editors insist on repeating articles in both categories and their subcategories. Since there are so many WP rules, they can always cite a rule for whatever they want to do. I have not worked on Fauna/Flora for some time. There was much discussion that categories of Fauna/Flora by US State or by international country were not appropriate as animals and plants move/grow anywhere they want, disregarding human political boundaries. Since then, I have seen little work trying to settle what categories should be used instead/in addition to states/countries. Nor have I seen any biological-trained experts join any discussion. Sorry, I really do not know what I can do that would accomplish much. Hmains 19:32, 23 December 2006 (UTC)

wikirest

Hi Katr67! I hope you have a restful break. Please do come back. You are one of the heavy lifters around here and I truly appreciate having you around. Following in your footsteps, I almost always completely agree with your work. (The few differences are trivial matters of preference.) It is so rare—and so nice—to have someone who really knows how to write, as well as possessing a deep understanding of mechanical and spelling; "frosting" for the cake if you will. I looked around for something better than a barnstar, but decided on potentially over-the-top words instead. — EncMstr 01:46, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

No problem!

(It was actually my first block, I'm a new admin.) If after the 48 hours is up he persists and I don't notice, please let me know. I will check though. That was a seriously large amount of spam... Dina 00:24, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

Sisters, Oregon complaint

Trying to recorrect your corrections to the Sisters, OR page. You dumped most of my external links without creating new pages to hold them. Very annoying. It took some effort to track down those links. I am trying to get some of those links back online. bberryhill@gmail.com User:BBerryhill —Preceding unsigned comment added by BBerryhill (talk • contribs) 6:30, December 31, 2006

Mt.Hood

This is User:Furon. I am sorry about Mt. Hood, but I posted rumors, although this is now true. Sorry for the screw-up.

--Furon 02:01, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Image deletion?

Not sure if it was indeed a deleted image or not, but the University of Oregon academic seal is no longer showing on the University of Oregon page, nor any of the pages in its history. I believe it happened after someone updated the image code in the infobox, but I'm not sure. I've tried reverting that section of code back, but the image doesn't show up again.

I'm asking you since you seem to be very knowledgable in Wiki, do you know how to undelete the image or...something? Cluskillz 19:13, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Hey there, just wanted to let you know I got your message. Thanks for the compliment, but I'm not so knowledgable about images, but I'll take a look tomorrow and see what I can do. Sometimes it has to do with the image that is in the commons... Katr67 04:45, 16 January 2007 (UTC)
Hi sorry this took me a while to get back to. It looks like the image was deleted, I checked the deletion log: "Image with unknown copyright status as of 29 December 2006". There's been a lot of this going around lately. *sigh* Seems like the UO seal would be fair-use. I try to steer clear of the copyright issues, so I don't know what using the seal would entail...plenty of other college articles have them, so it shouldn't be too hard to figure out... Katr67 00:54, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

What's wrong with embedded external links?

You seem to have a no-tolerance policy, but I don't see the harm (in the absense of there being a Wikipedia article to link to) in giving readers a shortcut vs. having to copy-and-paste a phrase into a search engine to find more information, so long as what is linked to is appropriate given Wikipedia's policies and the overall effect isn't that of a link directory. (I'm thinking of recent edits you've made to Maplewood, Portland, Oregon and Portland, Oregon.) Could you explain your reasoning?--ScottMainwaring 18:56, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

Hey Scott, I've probably under the influence of WikiProject Spam--they're *really* hardcore. I have a pretty flexible policy, actually. But my rationale is that by wikilinking rather than embedded linking, hopefully someone will see that, for example, the rollerderby team needs an article. I think embedded links discourage this, and that putting the external link after the redlink just clutters the page, though it is a better solution. As for Maplewood, I doubt the church merits an article and I'm not real sure we want to encourage links to every organization that happens to be in a neighborhood. In fact, I'm not even sure a listing of churches is particularly encyclopedic, but I left that section there because I don't want to be accused of any bias. So that's my reasoning--feel free to put the links back if you want. And I'd like to thank you for keeping the Portland article tidy. Sometimes when I'm in a hurry and I see a dubious edit, I think, "Oh I bet ScottMainwaring will take care of it." :) Happy editing! P.S. We talked once about the communities categories--did you see that Hmains has spruced them all up? Katr67 00:42, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
Is there a reason not to use footnotes to address this need? I know they don't work in every situation, but would something like [[Maplewood Church]]<ref>http://www.mwchurchsite.com</ref> work? -Pete 22:37, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
I'd find it hard to quarrel with that. :) Katr67 22:41, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
Hi Katr67, thanks for the kind words, and for the explanation, which certainly makes sense, though I have to say I'm personally not a fan of redlinks (aesthetics) or of footnotes that mean something different than "here's evidence for this claim" or "here's additional editorial commentary that doesn't merit being in the text itself". But I don't have a constructive alternative to propose... --ScottMainwaring 01:14, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

Thank you!

Hi, this is Martin1971 from Vienna, Austria. Thank you for your friendly welcome greetings and your spellcheck of the Sager orphans. Martin1971 17:37, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

List of Yamhill County Post Offices

Actually, the Yamhill County Genealogical Society in McMinnville, Oregon.--Zinc2005 19:04, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

South Tabor

Thanks for the immediate attention to South Tabor! Always nice when a stub gets some love right away. -Pete 22:34, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

You're welcome. I have a lot of redlinks on my watchlist... Helpful or obsessive? You decide. ;) Katr67 22:41, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

Re: Interstate 82

Yeah, that was my mistake. I saw the edit and gave it a quick look, and at first it looked like cleanup to me (and part of it was). It wasn't until I checked a second time after you asked me about it that I saw the inappropriate blanking. I've done a major cleanup to the article, and restored some of the stuff the IP had blanked. Take a look at it now and tell me what you think. -- NORTH talk 23:44, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

likeresume

oooh, I like that tag. Glad to know it! Is there a similar one for "like campaign materials?" -Pete 21:12, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

If there isn't, there should be... Katr67 22:09, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

Sal Esquivel

Hi- I'm confused by your recent edit of Oregon statewide elections, 2006. Are you sure that the 2006 election was the event that moved Esquivel from the Senate to the House, or did that possibly occur earlier? I originally created that page using data from the state's web site, so it seems unlikely that I would have gotten one legislator wrong, as I was working from an authoritative list. Also, Oregon House of Representatives lists Esquivel as a Rep for the 2005 session. Of course, the Elections page was my first major wikipedia project, and I'll be the first to confess that I did a terrible job listing citations... -Pete 21:23, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

I'm confused too. :P I just reverted my changes. Yes, he was the rep for the 2005 session. I was looking through the list and using Google trying to figure out who the freshman senators and reps were. I ran across this page, which seems to indicate that he was neither an incumbent nor a challenger, but I remembered his name from the 2005 session, so I after a little digging (not enough, apparently) I went ahead and assumed that he had made the jump *after* winning the election, not before. I've said it before, but apparently the Oregonian copydesk needs more beatings. :) Katr67 22:08, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
Thanks - I think I just found our answer -Pete 22:22, 22 January 2007 (UTC):
In March of 2003, Sal was chosen to replace Senator Lenn Hannon to represent District 3, which includes the cities of Medford, Ashland, Phoenix, Talent, Jacksonville and part of the Applegate region. Shortly after his appointment, Representative Rob Patridge announced that he would not be running again for his State Representative position. Sal chose to run for the House seat of District 6 because he knows Medford so well after almost eight years on the City Council. He served out the nine months remaining in the Senate, garnering knowledge and experience to take to the House of Representatives.

Inza Wood Middle School

ANNOUNCEMENT:

This page is for a creative writing class, and we would prefer if you would not mess with it.

Thank You,

Ted —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Teddibear4774 (talk • contribs) 22:18, 23 January 2007 (UTC).

Wikipedia is not here for you use for your creative writing. Katr67 22:28, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
Please do not edit Inza Wood Middle School, as it was created for a class project and we will get our teacher to verify this. Email Boonec@wlwv.k12.or.us
We will add a note at the bottom that says that this is for a school project and not to be taken seriously. We will also add the real version under the fake part.
Thank You,
Teddibear4774 22:41, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
Discussion has been moved to the article's talk page. Katr67 22:46, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

User warnings have been updated

Hey there, take a look at WP:UTM. Looks like the old warnings are being deprecated in favour of some new ones. --Brad Beattie (talk) 18:31, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the heads up. I'm using the RC script, which automatically generates the warnings, so that will need to be updated, I guess. Katr67 18:35, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

months off

Clearly, you were having a look around and getting a feel for the place, to prepare for an all-out assault on sub-standard articles! A practice NOT to be discouraged in any way. By the way, I just about spat out my coffee when I saw your "nestled" google link. Priceless. -Pete 19:59, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

Heh. I was actually able to let a "nestled" (a "cozily nestled" no less!) stand in the Salem, Oregon article for several days. I swear someone out there is testing me... And hey look, that Gopher Valley Oregon article even starts with the word. Must go stamp it out... Katr67 20:18, 24 January 2007 (UTC)
Ooops! Seems we collided attempting to remove that pesky nestling. I looked very quickly to see what you changed, but might have undid some of your work. Sorry for any confusion. I'll fix in a few hours if you're not doing anything with the article. —EncMstr 20:24, 24 January 2007 (UTC)
Just saw your note, I'll "wip" away. Thanks! Katr67 20:25, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

Re: "Official website"

I actually don't know of any set guideline on the topic; I've been relying on precedent. I guess my preference for the term is that a number of articles will link to popular fan sites for an individual without the title making it clear it is the official site for that individual. That and the fact it's so widely used already it might be better for consistency. But I really don't know. I've brought the matter up at Wikipedia talk:External links#"Official website"; hopefully it gets some attention. Owen 22:55, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

Creativity

Hey, Katr,

I was wondering if it is possible to create a new template-thingy such as This user is a citizen of the U.S.A., only new. I also have no idea how to create a message box, like this one, so, if you wish, reply on my user discussion page! Thanks!--Furon 20:33, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

Roseburg Senior High School

Hello Katr67, Thank you for showing your concern about the name of Roseburg's high school. The official name of Roseburg's High School is "Roseburg Senior High School." Otherwise it would be a misnomer. You can search the name "Roseburg Senior High School" for schools you will find a search result of "Roseburg Senior High School" such as http://www.schoolmatters.com —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Cheberling (talk • contribs) 21:20, 26 January 2007 (UTC).

Thanks. I don't consider the above a reliable source, but I do see that the school refers to itself as such here. Confusing for it to be RHS and not RSHS though. It's pretty unusual for a high school in Oregon to have "senior" in its name, that's why I was wondering. Happy editing! Katr67 21:24, 26 January 2007 (UTC)
A more authoritative source would be the Oregon Department of Education [1] which is why I moved it there. Alangdon86
OK, I concur. Good thing too because to move it back now I think we will have to involve an admin. Katr67 21:29, 26 January 2007 (UTC)
P.S. Another good source is here. Katr67 21:35, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

Gopher Valley, Oregon

I thank you for your edits to my article on Gopher. A little about me... I'm the Yamhill County Surveyor, a member of the board of directors of the Yamhill County Historical Society, and edit that organizations' newsletter, issued 9 times per year. "Gopher Valley" is the article I wrote for this months article. You are correct in stating the community was called Gopher. This was my first addition to Wikipedia. I submitted some of the information Lewis McArthur used in his latest edition of Oregon Geographic Names, relating to an early county road survey. However, I've not submitted the portion of the 1851 "Sketch of the Willamette Valley" to him, which takes the date of the place name back another 15 years or so. I'd like to insert a couple of neat photos, perhaps a scan of a portion of that sketch showing the name Gopher Hole, but I have no clue how to do the insertion. also, I see the warning to wait until all initial edits have been completed before doing any more to this.

Thanks again... you are light years ahead of me....

Dan Linscheid Sheridan, Oregon 503-843-2625 danl@starband.net

Orphaned fair use image (Image:Long Years in Space.jpg)

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If you have uploaded other unlicensed media, please check whether they're used in any articles or not. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that any fair use images not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. This is an automated message from BJBot 08:52, 27 January 2007 (UTC)

associations

thanks for your kind words. Yes, I noticed that the state associations have no over all category and I plan to work on them soon. Hmains 06:40, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

Please look at Oregon associations now. Comments? Hmains 04:04, 30 January 2007 (UTC)

Perfect. I think the intro ties it all together nicely. I couldn't really figure out how fencing, government and cheese were related. :P Thanks for taking care of it. Katr67 04:46, 30 January 2007 (UTC)

Ghost towns

It took awhile but I did some work on the Ghost towns project. Bring your friends. Also, I think you'll be pleased to see the new project userbox. I'll let you scope it out at the new and improved, albeit somewhat stolen, project page.A mcmurray 07:10, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

Cool. I saw you were busy fixing it up. I'll put a note on the WikiProject Oregon page when I get a chance (I'm trying to keep my wikiaddiction down to a dull roar though.) :) Katr67 14:45, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
And that, that can be hard, so hard. I want to move to Oregon btw. :). And of course, something for your tireless efforts:
The Barnstar of Diligence
You even revert bot edits gone bad. For extraordinary diligence regarding Oregon, National Register of Historic Places and Ghost towns articles, specifically. Also for overall high-quality work on Wikipedia. A mcmurray 20:10, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

PPS

Hi! I'm not ignoring your request to edit the Salem and Corvallis pages - there have just been other things I felt more pressing. I will get to those! Meanwhile...would you mind weighing in on the talk page of Portland Public Schools, Oregon? Do you think that oughtta be linked to the "cleanup" page? I think it should have some opinions expressed by locals before unleashing the world of Wikipedia on it, but I'm curious what you think. -Pete 07:32, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

Hey no worries. I've got a milliion things I have promised to do for people. I did fix up the transportation section in the Albany article. Yes, I'll take a look at the PDX schools page too. I unleashed the schools wikiproject on Roseburg High School and I found the results a lot more...sparse than I would have liked. Katr67 14:43, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

Boasts NPOV?

Can you please explain why to boast how it was used in the Astoria article was NPOV? Boasting in general is definitely NPOV, but this is clearly a case of the second meaning of the verb, i.e., to have. -Yupik 19:31, 30 January 2007 (UTC)

You mean "POV", correct? The word "boasts" is overused, especially in articles about cities, which "boast" about various amenities with abandon. I think it is much simpler and clearer to use words like "has", etc. Through overuse in real estate ads and tourism promotion materials, this word has even been added to a 2007 Banished Words List. A quick Google search on Wiki will show you that far from being used in the context of "has", "boasts" generally is used by inexperienced writers who are proud of their city and seem to be copying their writing style from adverts. Thus when I see it in articles I usually replace it with a more neutral term. In terms of the Scandinavian population of Astoria, I believe that Scandinavian pride (not that there's anything wrong with that) has led someone to use the word "boasts" in terms of the second definition, which is, "To possess or own (a desirable feature)". However:

Some have objected to the use of boast as a transitive verb meaning "to possess or own a desirable feature," as in This network boasts an audience with a greater concentration of professionals and managers than any other network. This usage is by now well established, however, and is acceptable to 62 percent of the Usage Panel.

Count me among the other 38 percent. I believe in most uses the word "boast" is unencyclopedic. In any case, I think reverting the article again would accomplish very little. (See: WP:LAME) The article has worse problems than that. Katr67 20:28, 30 January 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for the links, but I did have a look with google first. I don't know how far back the use of the word "to boast" goes, but it's in the 1911 EB a number of times with the sense of "to possess a feature". It seems rather arbitrary to start claiming it's POV based on a list someone decided to come up with. Furthermore, it's impossible to back up a statement about it being mainly used by "inexperienced writers" ... in talking about desirable features of their towns when Google finds these type of results: "Ironically, this town boasts a large Amish population." In that sense, while you find it lame to keep "boasts" in the article, I find it was lame for it to have been changed in the first place as it was a useless edit, especially as it was not used in the sense of "to possess a desirable feature" as it was used in the sense of "to possess a feature". On that note, you might want to keep an eye on the changes made by the other user in that non-revert-war, as he liberally saturates articles with misspellings, incorrect grammar (singular verbs with plural nouns) and incorrect punctuation (portuguese in lowercase). Be prepared though that he considers any changes made to be personal attacks.
Slightly OT: a large international company I used to write for decided one day to forbid the use of the words "neither", "nor" and any combination thereof. The only reason given was that the company's Asian customers couldn't possibly understand any grammatical constructions using them. :D -Yupik 16:02, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

I'll respond to the rest later, but: Please leave me out of your campaign against that particular user. Thanks. Katr67 17:29, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

This is a weird place for this kind of discussion - what about the article's talk page? But as long as I'm here, I entirely agree that "boasts" is either unencyclopedic or uninformative. If it's considered synonymous with a word like "holds," then what precisely is the objection to using the word "holds?" In other words, while "boasts" may be controversial, surely "holds" is not - so Yupik, may I suggest you simply go with the word that satisfies all concerns? Oh the other hand - Katr, if the editor in question is approaching 3RR, I'd suggest moving the conversation to a more public place, and inviting input…rather than quoting policy (which could be MISinterpreted by an enthusiastic editor as being unnecessarily aggressive.) -Pete 02:48, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
This would probably be a good question to take public so that "boasts" could either be corrected or left alone according to a general consensus on Wikipedia. I apologize for my comments about Ruskeapää; I should have walked away from the situation instead of allowing myself to be annoyed by his edits. And Pete's comment about policyquoting is a good comment as it did seem like it was unnecessarily aggressive.
The reason why I object to "boasts" being changed is that I don't think that the English wikipedia really needs to be generalizing words because someone might have an issue with some word that is not objectional to a majority (in this case some 62%) of people as that's what the Simple English wikipedia can be used for in my opinion. But as Pete said, this would be a good topic to bring up somewhere else, on a page of words to be avoided perhaps? -Yupik 22:13, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

Can someone slowly and clearly explain to me why quoting policy is agressive? I generally quote policy so people can see exactly how the wiki guideline is worded, rather than trust my memory and let them take my word that I "read somewhere" about some policy. If you mean my inclusion of LAME, well, I do think the edits in question were very minor and it would indeed have been lame to continue reverting them. It was not the inclusion of the word "boasts" I was calling LAME, but the revert war caused by it, as you will see by the silly examples on the humorous LAME page. In my opinion, the words were changed from adequate English to very precise English and it would be nonsensical to revert them, especially because I have the impression Yupik was wikistalking the other user. If my post was cranky, well, since your reversion of one user's edits seemed to based more on personal bias or the need to make a point than on an interest in grammar, yeah, that made me cranky. And though I didn't start this discussion here, I chose not to move it to the Astoria page because I didn't want to draw in that other user and start things all over again. (For the record, Yupik reverted twice, the other editor reverted once and I reverted once.) Now. Bringing this up at Wikipedia talk:Words to avoid sounds like it would generate an interesting discussion. Good idea. Though I suspect we would get very little guidance and certainly no firm policy about the use of the word. Unless *not* changing "boasts" to "has" is set down as an official guideline, I for one am certainly going to change the word "boasts" to "has" if I run across it in the articles I take an interest in. On the other hand, it would be LAME of me go around the entire wiki hunting down its usage and stamping it out. Katr67 23:06, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

Yupik has ignored what I think was the most important aspect of my comment: namely, what is the value of continuing this argument, when it appears there is no reason NOT to use the word "holds?" Yupik appears to be taking things very personally, and I share Katr's perplexity about why that is. Remember that we're pretty much all in this together; if we choose to argue about relatively trivial matters, it disrupts the spirit of collaboration that is Wikipedia's greatest strength. So, once again: "boasts" is a word that has generated controversy. The word "holds" has not - it appears that the only reason Yupik objects to "holds" is that he/she has a strong attachment to the word "boasts." Yupik, I would personally be very gratified if you would simply accept the word "holds," and go back to making constructive contributions to Wikipedia - your "talk" page makes it very clear that you have excellent talents to share. -Pete 00:24, 16 February 2007 (UTC)
Mainly because "holds" would not be suitable as far as I can tell in any cases that it's being changed from. To "has" would be ok. And please, I'm not taking it personally and I did get both of your points about it. Please do bring this up at Wikipedia talk:Words to avoid, I would be interested in hearing what other people have to say about this verb. Thanks. -Yupik 06:42, 16 February 2007 (UTC)
I'm happy to see this discussion moving toward resolution. I have no preference between "holds" and "has." Perhaps a complete restructuring of the sentence would be the best bet? At any rate, I think there might be an important lesson here - that in an edit conflict, proceeding as though there are only two options may be a big mistake. I wish you luck in the "words to avoid" discussion; I personally have no interest in participating in a more general discussion of the word "boasts," but I think it's a worthwhile discussion to have. -Pete 22:51, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

Wikia

Hey, Katr. I was just wondering if you know how to create a wikia, as I am wishing to create a wikia, called "Wiikipedia" Thanks.--Furon 20:37, 30 January 2007 (UTC)

I have absolutely no clue. I'm more into the words, not the programming. Did you try Google? Katr67 21:08, 30 January 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the greeting & an Oregon Ghost Town to add

Hi, Katr67! Thanks for the friendly welcome to the neighborhood. I've seen your footprints around some of my favorite pages.

I know you like Ghost Towns, and I've noticed that one of my favorites is missing from the Oregon list: Golden, Oregon. I've been there and it's a real nice one. Here are some links:

[2]

[3] (beware of music!)

[4]

[5]

Why don't you write it up?

--DaKine 05:10, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

White Train

I started a stub on the White Train based on the information I could find quickly (was looking for information for a paper I'm writing and I hate seeing nothing on such subjects). Saw you had a link from your userpage, and seeing the context there thought you might have something to say/do/add/desire to know. CheerioDarker Dreams 03:13, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

Agree with you on the wine list

Sorry it took a while to get back, but I spent much of the weekend sick in bed with a nasty case of the flu.  :)

The "notes" column is, as you said, intended to augment the existing fields. It isn't intended to list wine awards, especially as most such awards are meaningless. I'm not that familiar with the winery in question, but I'm certain that it shouldn't be given praise in Wikipedia in a place where Eyrie, Domaine Drouhin, or some of the other truly-notable wineries aren't praised.

I wouldn't worry about COI, unless it can be shown that a person is acting in an inappropriate manner. If someone did write an article about the winery that met our criteria (and wasn't overly promotional), that would be fine.

You might ask over at WikiProject Wine, to see what they think. I'm certain some of the folks over there will be rather uppity about a minor winery behaving in that fashion.  :)

Talk to you later,

--EngineerScotty 18:01, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

List of Oregon ballot measures

Hi there! Hoping for a comment or two from you on the "talk" page over there, if you got a moment. I'm planning to put a lot of work into that page in the coming weeks, and want to make sure I'm on the right track first! -Pete 02:53, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the suggestions

I'm new to Wikipedia, so I haven't figured quite everything out yet, but your suggestions help and I will put them in to use.—Preceding unsigned comment added by Scoreboard (talk • contribs) 04:18, February 7, 2007

Peter French

Interesting indeed. Shot dead, killed instantly, sounds pretty rough-n-tumble to me. The article was no problem, as I have been on a round barn kick lately. (Maybe I always was). Maybe just a barn kick would be a better description.: )A mcmurray 14:02, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

You deleted my link

Portlandneighborhood.com is a realtor site that has alot of interesting things about some of the portland neighborhoods. They are linked to lots of pages- for example alameda, irvington, etc etc. They are a realtor website. Why are they on it? I have written a neighborhood guide that has taken months and months to do- with all my research on my website about the areas of portland- links, photos, maps etc. It is much more all inclusive than www.Portlandneighborhood.com I tried to put a link on wikipedia just like they did- two different times- and I was kicked off immediately. Why? If I am kicked off, why are they allowed to be on there lots and lots of times all over the portland neighborhoods? I think that if we both have good contributing information about the neighborhoods of portland with links- we should be treated the same. If they can be on there, we should be on there. Does that sound fair? My website is www.TheCreativeRealtor.com and I link each neighborhood directly to the neighborhood page. Another good neighborhood guide is MovingtoPortland.net. She has an awesome neighborhood guide too.

Anyway- please let me know why the rules are different. Thanks Helen HOyt helen.hoyt@comcast.net —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Helenhoyt (talk • contribs) 05:59, 10 February 2007 (UTC).

Did you read this part of the message I put on your page? "Inappropriate links include (but are not limited to) links to personal web sites, links to web sites with which you are affiliated, and links that exist to attract visitors to a web site or promote a product." Your photo is prominently displayed on the top of the page, which seems to be pretty blatantly advertising your product or service. Now, besides that, "His link is there, so mine should be too" is not a valid argument for including your link. "They" didn't necessarily add the link to the articles--often it was an ordinary Wikipedia user. And in fact there is some debate currently happening about whether these links are appropriate at all. Katr67 07:00, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
Also please read WP:COI. You should not be part of any discussion on your own link because you have a conflict of interest. You should not have added it and the arguments on the merits of the site only kicks in if a third party proposes your link and we then discuss it objectively. Cheers --BozMo talk 07:13, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

PortlandNeighborhood.com is not a realtor owned website. The focus of the website is the urban communities (neighborhoods) in Portland. 24.22.1.168 00:30, 20 February 2007 (UTC)Angela Juon, Owner, PortlandNeighborhood.com

This conversation is going on at two places at once. I think these comments should be moved to the Talk:Portland, Oregon page. Couple brief points though: BozMo, please remember that WP:COI is a guideline, not a policy. I think an owner posting their reasoning is a legitimate contribution to the discussion, provided that they recognize their conflict of interest. Angela has been very upfront in disclosing her COI, which is an excellent first step, and should be commended. However, as nobody without a COI has emerged to defend its inclusion, I think the time has come for Angela to drop her campaign. -Pete 00:56, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

Imbrie Farm correction to more recent history

Hi, are you anonymous editor whose name change I reverted? If there is no edit summary, no cited source, and due to a lot of subtle vandalism by anon editors, we can't assume a change like yours was accurate. I'll direct the editor who wrote the bulk of that article to this post, but just so you know, posts like this can never "go away", even if I delete it, it will become part of the page history. When in doubt you can sign up for an account and use the "E-mail this user" feature. Thanks for letting us know. I suppose because of the circumstances you don't have any sources you can cite? Because one of the Wikpedia principles is citation of reliable sources. Not to imply that you're not reliable, but that's the guideline. Thanks! Katr67 18:35, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
Katr, sent Jim an email regarding his request. Aboutmovies 07:41, 11 February 2007 (UTC)
Thanks, I'm deleting his post. Katr67 15:49, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

Your message

Hey. Got your message. If it's something you can talk about here. Please do. - Donteatyellowsnow

I'd rather not, but I'll be in touch. Katr67 19:39, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
Thanks. It's a nasty dogpile. BTW, check out what they are trying to do now. Unbelievable. WP:ANI - Donteatyellowsnow 23:40, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
FYI, that's not exactly what I wanted to talk to you about, but I'm putting the matter on hold for now. Katr67 22:02, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Bull Mountain annexation nonsense

It clearly fails to qualify for Wikipedia, plus it's misleading by omission; thanks for chucking it. 24.22.3.249 00:20, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Umm...I don't think I deserve any thanks. I don't think the addition was completely worthless. FYI, I wasn't supporting any particular point of view, as you can see from the article's talk page, all my concerns were directly related to Wikipedia policy. I'm an equal opportunity deletionist. Thanks. Katr67 01:45, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Chime-in request

Would you mind having a look at the verging-on-lengthy conversation I've had with user:Cnewmark beginning at Talk:Craigslist#proper_etiquette and continuing to the next section, Talk:Craigslist#Article errors. (BTW, I have no reason to doubt he is Craig Newmark.)

Somehow I'm failing to communicate what he needs to be done to add a few facts he has for inclusion in the Craigslist article. I thought I was clear, but what should be swift progress is not happening somehow. Is it me? Am I over the top? Thanks in advance for any help! —EncMstr 18:14, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Well, I just worked too long past my break to reply to the situation on the FOBM talkpage, but if I can squeeze in a few minutes I'll see what I can do. I don't know if I can contribute, but speaking for myself, I know a sanity check is always welcome. :) Katr67 18:28, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
Boy oh boy. I think you did just fine. So it looks like Lumarine missed the point and CM is agreeing with him/her. *sigh* I guess all you can do is repeat the fact that Wikipedia can't be a source for itself. Q: "How do I solve this?" A: "Find some outside sources". Maybe suggest he tell his tale to the press, and after the facts are published, then they can be put in the article. But surely he has mentioned the disputed facts somewhere and he can provide sources? Surely he has talked about developing the list to dozens of people? If you want me to do it, so there are more voices in the debate, let me know. Check out the talk page for Dave Carter for an interesting example of this kind of debate. Jimbo actually did get involved in that one. They really couldn't use Tracy Grammer's word either. BTW, there's a process around here somewhere to get it verified that he is who he says he is. Katr67 19:12, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for the check. That makes me feel a lot better. Jimbo apparently is watching this a little too—at least he reverted the article once or twice. I posted at Wikipedia:Village pump (assistance) for help before, but no takers. (Maybe that was the wrong place?)
I think it would go a long way if someone highly credible—like you are—told him what the standards are. He must think I'm a huffing and puffing squeaky wheel or something. I don't think it matters whether he's Craig or not—if he's not, he can edit the article without WP:COI. Being treated as if it were him just makes the situation more controlled and less loosy goosy. —EncMstr 22:20, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
I've found getting help at the pump totally hit or miss. When DocTropics was watching the pages he was very helpful. At other times I've not heard a peep except that time one user thought my warning to another user was a bit rude. That was the whole Elk Cove thing and I don't really want to go there. :) Am I highly credible? I'm pretty good with the commas and stuff, not so great with the policy, but I can try. Katr67 22:49, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Donteatyellowsnow

Thanks for the message Katr. Yes, actually I was referring to you. Besides the other similarities, DEYS already assumed your familiarity with the issues, saying "they" and "it". So I see that he must have misinterpreted your original contact, as I misinterpreted his. I'm sorry about that. It was a mistake on my part.

As for my message to AM, it was really only incidental, even had it occured. And of course it had nothing to do with your behaviour at all. Sorry again. --JGGardiner 22:33, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, you too. Although I can see from your talk page that it isn't all happy. =) --JGGardiner 22:39, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

see also

Hi Katr, just wanted to inquire about your theory of "see also" sections. You have made a couple edits I don't agree with, and while my disagreement isn't strong in those specific cases, I'd like to share my general thoughts and see what you think. Essentially, I disagree that inclusion in the body should disqualify a subject from the "see also" section. I consider "see also" as a potentially significant part of an article, that allows a reader new to the subject to develop a sense of context. Oregon Ballot Measure 37 (2004), for instance, contained links to the organizations that promoted it and opposed it. You removed the link to OIA, because it had been linked in the body; but the result is a "see also" section that represents only one side of the issue.

None of this is meant to say that bloated "see also" sections aren't a problem. I'm all for keeping them "lean and mean," but I don't think inclusion in the body should automatically disqualify an article from inclusion. -Pete 00:20, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

you deleted my link in 'rafting'

I added an external link a couple weeks ago to the rafting topic, linking to my website, www.whitewatercampsites.com. You deleted that link yesterday, calling it spam. Since I added it, a steady stream of people have used that link. My usage data shows that visitors spend almost 600 seconds at my site, on average. And this month they return 1.69 times each to spend another 600 seconds. It is not simply a picture gallery, it is a unique resource on the web for white water rafting enthusiasts. Yes, it has Adsense and today I made 12 cents, no joke. In the course of a year, my advertising MIGHT pay my hosting costs. I returned yesterday to expand the link text. I suppose that is promoting the site, in someone's definition. But reading the external links qualification for Wikipedia, my site certainly falls in the "should be included" category. My site is a labor of love, and very appreciated by the river rafting community, but apparently not by you. I can only ask that you do a little research and reconsider.


Certainly if someone is looking for river rafting information, they want to find my site. Commerical rafting companies won't link to it; they want to keep their visitors. There are very few places on the web that make sense to link to my site. This is, IMO, certainly one.

However, if I make my case with you and the next editor that comes along is going to delete it again, then don't bother reinstating it. Will Hansen —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Mcguy0 (talk • contribs) 02:52, 14 February 2007 (UTC).

According to your user contributions I only see the link you added to Selway River, which another editor also deleted as linkspam. You must mean this IP: User:67.50.221.226. Please read {{Spam}}. Editors are discouraged from adding links to sites that they own. Though Wikipedia is not here to help you get hits on your website, I can see that your link isn't particularly commercial and that it is a "unique resource". What usually happens is that someone starts spamming Oregon river articles with very commercial rafting links and I quickly discover they have also spammed Rafting, Whitewater, etc. Then I go clean out those external link sections. Those kind of articles are magnets for all sorts of competing outfitters, guides, etc. Hopefully you can see my concern because the external links sections soon become unwieldy with so many links. I'm sorry I did not look at your link more closely--sometimes it's really hard to draw the line about which links "should" be included. The problem with links like yours is that people see it and say: "His link is there, so mine should be too." That said, my area of expertise is not rafting and I don't keep an eye on that article. I think it would be best for you to discuss your link on the Rafting talkpage, where the rafting experts can chime in, bearing in mind there is a conflict of interest in defending the inclusion of a link to your own website. But if there is consensus on the Rafting talk page, and the link gets added back, then it will be harder for the "next editor that comes along" to delete it again. I hope this helps! Katr67 03:19, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for your feedback. I'll take a look at the talk page for rafting and see where things go from there. I didn't intend to become and 'editor' and have said conflict of interest. Is there a way to delete me? I just want to repost my link (at some point) and continue using this wiki as a plain user.

Mt. Bailey in So. Oregon

Katr67,

If I recall correctly, you have a copy of the Oregon Geographic Names book? If so, could you look and see who Mt. Bailey is named after? I'm wondering if it might be William J. Bailey. Thanks. Aboutmovies 22:58, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

Will do. I seem to be in semi-permanent posession of Twisted86's copy of OGN. I'll do it after I get back from fencing tonight and after I take care of the matter EncMstr wanted me to look into. Cheers! Katr67 23:11, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
Thanks I figured I could count on you, and thought you might like some less controversial talk. On a side note I hope you are not fencing the OGN, the project needs that book. :) Aboutmovies 00:49, 16 February 2007 (UTC)
The book doesn't have opposable thumbs--fencing it would not be a challenge and indeed it would end up full of holes. :P And I'm too tired to do anything intelligent about EncMstr's request, but I can tell you Mt. Bailey wasn't named after anybody in particular at first, might even have been a typo. In 1992 the Oregon Geographic Names Board (there's another redlink for us) voted to name the peak in honor of Vernon and Florence Bailey; Vernon was a prominent naturalist and Florence an educator and ornithologist. Everything else named Bailey in the state was named for local settlers. So there ya have it. Katr67 05:38, 16 February 2007 (UTC)
OK, thanks. Interesting though. Aboutmovies 01:27, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Warm Springs Reservation / Confederated Tribes of Warm Springs

Katr67, Do you think there should be two separate pages one for the reservation (ie: more about the land itself) and another for the folks who live there? I noticed that the Umatilla tribe and the Umatilla reservation is set up like that? Just curious, because I put some stuff on the reservation page that is really more about the tribe. --Smartone100 23:35, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Yes, there is a general consensus that the reservations and the tribes who live on them should have separate articles. It's a little confusing since many of the modern Oregon tribal entities (consisting of several individual tribes) have "reservation" in their names. But the people are of the reservation, they are not the reservation itself. There is often some overlap between articles, but effort should be made to differentiate the information as much as possible. When the tribal article gets written, we can move your information there. Unfortunately there is still a lot to do in the area of differentiating the articles. It's been on my to-do list forever. Just to add to the confusion, the Warm Springs (people) is a whole other article that needs to be written. If you are interested, you can see which articles already exist and which are needed at List of Indian reservations in Oregon and List of Native American Tribal Entities in Oregon. Also the category Category:Native American tribes in Oregon. Thanks for all your hard work on the tribal fishing info! Katr67 00:22, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Thank you

Thanks for that very warm greetings! Regarding Oregon I'm just an interested reader right now, but I enjoy fixing grammar and loose ends. Flagman7 16:28, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Ships & More

Yes, the Iredale should go into the cat. I didn't work all the way through the History in Oregon cat as I had to write the Tonquin article. Which was slowed down by our northern neighbor also then editing the article. We'll see if he behaves. Good morning and happy rain! Aboutmovies 16:52, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Speaking of cats, while I was in the History of Oregon cat I came accross Living Enrichment Center. I don't think it should be in there and thought I'd see if you thought it did? Of course I am biased towards older history, but I had never heard of these people. And since there were no deaths like with Jim Jones, Heavan's Gate, etc. I'm not sure they are significant. Aboutmovies 18:50, 18 February 2007 (UTC)
OK, just checking, since the Iredale wasn't originally an "Oregon ship", though of course she has spent many many more years in Oregon than anyplace else. I've seen several references to the LEC, I think it comes up in the Wilsonville article, the Dammasch article and the Pacific Northwest article. I suspect a bit of {{advert}}izing. But I haven't been in the mood to untangle that particular mess. I doubt it should be in that cat. I mean, when it comes right down to it, anything and everything that happens in Oregon is history, right? Why should that particular article be in there an not the 7,000 or so others relating to Oregon? I'll take a quick peek, and leave a note on the talk page. I managed to miss the downpour--hoping for a nice dry ride out to Minto-Brown but that's probably wishful thinking... Katr67 20:57, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Edit request

Hey, How's it goin'? First off thanks everytime you do something on my peer review requests and what not. Anyway I am in the process of improving two articles in hopes of getting GA status (I have tried to rant about it incessantly wherever possible). One, I think you did some work on, Joseph F. Glidden House, which is currently undergoing two peer reviews. The other is one that had a peer review awhile ago but I just got around to improving, this one University of Illinois Astronomical Observatory is a bit long but it's already a "B" class and I have reworked some stuff today and it's a lot better, I think it still needs a bit of work though and I was wondering, if you have the time, could you give it a copy edit and going over for any glaring contradictions or errors? Thank you ahead of time. : )A mcmurray 21:13, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Hey, I think I still owe you a copyedit on Executive Order 9835, but I have the day off tomorrow and had plans to do some intense wiki-ing. BTW, I may let myself get dragged kicking and screaming into seeing about getting the Oregon article up to GA/FA status, would you be willing to lend your expertise to that? Your interest in our fine state confers honorary Oregonian status on you, I think. :) Katr67 22:05, 18 February 2007 (UTC)
Oh most certainly. I would be more than happy to help. Just let me know if there is anything you need me to do. I'll take a look at the Oregon article tomorrow (the main Oregon article, right?). And I am contemplating a move to Oregon, the honorary status is flattering. Thank you. As for now, I must sleep. Good night.A mcmurray 04:56, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
Yep, the main Oregon article. As long as you're not from California, we'll all get along great. ;) Katr67 05:09, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
Now that made me laugh. I'm from the Middle Coast. Hee. Lake Michigan is like a small Illinois ocean, anyway. ; ) A mcmurray 12:37, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

Oregon people

Although I work on lots of categories, I think all types of people categories are the worst. I never know whether both categories or subcategories should include the same articles. It is just a mess; rarely does the category state what is expected; so anything goes. Then people get upset. Then things get worse. I have no insight. Sorry. Hmains 04:30, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

VoA's RC script warnings.

Hello! I saw you commented after my comment on Voice of All's talk page and I've yet to recieve any reply from him but I found this and I added the section under "For a collection of user warning templates, add:..." and this has changed my tabs to the new warnings and also given me the option to select the type of warning (blanking, vandalism etc) and an easy way to input the name of the page targeted. Just a suggestion for you if you hadn't found an alternative solution. Regards, --Farosdaughter 16:38, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

UO & Bach Festival

Regarding your comment about the University of Oregon trivia about the Oregon Bach festival - the festival was originally an outgrowth of the UO school of music. See [6]. But, that association isn't apparent the UO page, so the trivia seems irrelevant. The UO page is kind of a beast, isn't it.  ;-) --tess 22:42, 22 February 2007 (UTC)tess 22:38, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. I looked at the Bach Festival article but didn't see the connection. Yes, the UO page strikes fear into the heart of a wikignome like me. I prefer taking on projects that don't involve such a time committment! Oh well, I'm sure it will get cleaned up eventually... Katr67 22:46, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

Big Brother is watching you!

Hi sis,

I've finally gotten around to creating an account and plunging into the editing game. Nothing major, mainly just some gnomish cleanup on some random pages so far. Talk at ya later. Finngall 18:46, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

Help please

Hello. I am at a loss. I am trying to defend the Wiki against a spammer who wants to insert non notable information into the DeKalb, Illinois article, I attempted to get help at AIV, they were none. It seems the system is tilted heavily in favor of this person. The user is User:JazzButcher I don't know what to do to get this person to stop. Can you help me?A mcmurray 02:56, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

Nevermind. I figured out where to report it at.A mcmurray 03:12, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

FYI: I have created tools to simply your Where I have been section of your user page

I see you have a list of nations and/or states/provinces on your user page. I would like to offer you some templates for this task I created for my own list. One pair of templates will create entries identical to the one I use. (I suggest you copy my legend if you use them.) Other templates will provide just a flag or name (nation or province/state).

Will (Talk - contribs) 07:03, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

Mount Hood incident bullets

Hi Katr67! As a perfesshunal ed it torr (I laughed for three days after you wrote something like that), I wonder what you think of the removed bullets from Mount Hood#Incident history. I'm mixed, but also a bit biased having written most of it. The editor who removed them merged several paragraphs in the last two incidents to make it hang together correctly. Now those megaparagraphs seem a bit intense. Should they be bulleted? Or is the way it is now more correct (but maybe stripped down a bit more)? —EncMstr 08:04, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Heh. Hmm. I'm torn. Without the bullets, the single-sentence paragraphs look choppy, yet since this is an encyclopedia, it's preferable that things be written like prose and not a list. And it's alarming that the Oregon Episcopal School incident only merits one sentence (potential bias--I know someone who was touched by this, and I know it was a huge news story at the time), while the recent incident with the folks and their dog gets a huge paragraph. This is perhaps one of the problems with an encyclopedia "anyone can edit"! Speaking of the thing with the dog, most of the other incidents listed ended in fatalities, which unfortunately makes them notable. I'm sure before the advent of an instantly updateable encyclopedia, there have been dozens if not hundreds of people who have gotten lost in the mountain, but haven't died. Do they merit mention? Anyway, back to the point, I like the list format with the bullets, but I think that's probably not how it should look--would it make sense to split off the incidents into a separate article? If you called it List of climbing incidents on Mount Hood, then you could bullet it to your heart's content. Katr67 16:58, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
The national press thought the last incident notable: there were five or six ENG vans parked (mostly in the way) for days during the busy President's Day weekend. Personally I felt they significantly overblew it, but what do I know? I don't think a death is required for an item to qualify as a notable incident though. Perhaps the January incident where a woman was injured by falling ice was air-evacuated should be included to help balance the statistics.
There is more coming on the OES incident, perhaps enough for a full article. If and when the rest of the 1980s accidents are added, the section will indeed be too weighty. Right now it seems on the edge. Thanks for chiming in.
By the way, did you see my answer here? —EncMstr 17:14, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
Wow, that's crazy, but in the light of the recent fatal incident, and the on-going debate about who should pay to rescue "idiots", I guess it makes a kind of sense. I just bet in a couple years nobody will remember anything about it except that it involved a dog. :) Yup, saw your reply, sorry. I had already linked to one of the policies, but nobody has come back to debate the issue. Still, though it seems really obvious, I still swear that somewhere it literally says that a Wikipedia article cannot be used as a reference for another article. Oh well, "they" are always changing the guidelines at meta... Katr67 18:39, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Oregon Volcanoes

Hi Katr67, I noticed that you've been systematically removing the "see also" sections from a number of Oregon volcano articles I created. Why? They are there to provide quick links to other nearby volcanoes. If anything, the sections need to be expanded, not deleted. I made all those articles in a single concerted push, so I haven't had time to go back and fine-tune the list for each volcano. I will do so as time permits.

Please don't delete those sections entirely, but instead correct and expand them with other nearby volcanoes (obviously the "Cascade Range" link can be deleted, since it is redundant with other parts of the article). Maybe the sections should just be renamed "Nearby volcanoes" instead, since that's their primary purpose right now. But "see also" is certainly an appropriate name, too. Thanks, Seattle Skier 02:15, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Hi, thanks for all your hard work on those articles. Yes, according to Wikipedia:Guide to layout#See also, it's best not to add see alsos that are already linked in the article. As far as the others, all I could see was an arbitrary collection of other volcanoes, which seemed to me would become unwieldy if all volcanoes were included. The Category:Volcanoes of Oregon and the like serve the same purpose. I suppose if someone is new to navigating wiki categories, adding a hardlink to the category would be helpful to them, and yes, a heading "Nearby volcanoes" might work, but again it seems like it would be arbitrary (who determines what "nearby" is?). Another solution would be to add a brief explanation as suggested in the layout guide, such as *Mount Hood, next closest Cascade volcano to the south. The wording is a little clunky, but you get the idea. So if it's clear why things are in a see also section, I don't have a problem with it, but you have to think about what a user might want. Is s/he thinking "Hmm. I wonder what other volcanoes are around here?" and they don't know how to use categories, then maybe a hardlink to the category would be good. But for example, at Hoodoo Butte, I saw Mount Hood and Crater Lake... What do they have to do with Hoodoo Butte? Someone might click on Mount Hood thinking s/he would get more info on Hoodoo Butte and be confused. You say you need to fine tune the lists and that's fine, but at first glance it looked (and apparently was) completely random. (Maybe leave a <!--note--> about what your plan is next time?)
BTW, I didn't remove all the see also sections because I didn't start to notice them until halfway through fixing the sort order (leaving a space after the pipe causes the article to not sort alphabetically), and I'm lazy and not a complete ogre :), but "See also" should go above "References" and "External links." I hope I explained where I was coming from clearly. Thanks for checking in. Katr67 03:54, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Discussion continues at Template talk:Volcanoes of Oregon

Talk:New Carissa

I noticed you added the peer review template to the New Carissa talk page; however, the peer review is already linked at the top of the page in the "Article Milestones" section of the FA template - it's just hidden by default. Not a big deal either way, just wanted to point that out. -Big Smooth 17:48, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Oh rats. I didn't see that, I tend to ignore templates. I did link the peer review to the archived version of the automated suggestions, so at least that was helpful. :-\ I wanted to make the NC review handy because we are thinking about FAing Oregon. Thanks and happy editing! Katr67 18:22, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

New NRHP Collaboration Division

(Message generated via copy and paste, sorry to be impersonal but I am hitting up everyone in the project. But hello. : ) Hey, saw you were a participant in the National Register of Historic Places WikiProject. I thought I would let you know that there is a new Collaboration Division up for the project. The goal of the division is to select an article or articles for improvement to Good article standard or higher. There is a simple nomination process, which you can check out on the division subpage, to make sure each candidate for collaboration has enough interested editors. This is a good way to get a lot of articles to a quality status quickly. Please consider participating. More details can be seen at the division subpage. IvoShandor 11:09, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

I-5

I think it's "Afterbirth" by From First to Last, which was in there, haha. I didn't get it either, but with so little info on it, it doesn't need to be there. Good call. Cheers! --MPD T / C 05:47, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

Ohhhhh.... I get it. I'm out of the loop as far as Nu-metal is concerned. It sure sounded like they were describing the tracks on some album. :) Katr67 05:52, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

Location of project banner

Re: your change to Lewis and Clark State Recreation Site. Thanks for the tip, I'm already using it on my next stub. And, BTW, your welcoming messages are very nice and appreciated. Cheers! Werewombat 15:18, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Christmas Valley Airport

Thanks for catching that. I wonder what I thought I was doing? CambridgeBayWeather (Talk) 16:59, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

re. Stubsensor Cleanup Project

Your opinion makes sense, I've replaced the stub tag on both Oregon's 1st congressional district and Oregon's 3rd congressional district - thanks for the input! (also copied to project page) PGWG 17:25, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks, it was finally a good day to take pics. If the clouds stay away tomorrow I might be able to get a good outside shot of the capitol, if the big ugly yellow school buses stay away. Aboutmovies 06:16, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

Made minor changes to Chemult, Oregon entry

I made some minor formatting changes, added a little more info on elevation/lat/long, and mentioned the post office and forest service since they are government. Feel free to get rid of it if you think I did it wrong. jimransier@hotmail.com —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.107.78.245 (talk) 20:13, 18 March 2007 (UTC).

Thanks. It's not like I own that article, though so you can usually put discussions like this on the article's talk page where other people can see them. The lat/long was actually already there in the form of the mapit links at the bottom, which places the coords in the upper right corner of the page, so I took that part out as redundant. Happy editing! Katr67 15:31, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

More movies made in Oregon

Hi, KATR! I saw your page of movies, realized some movies (such as "One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest")were missing and set out to find you a better search phrase for IMDB. Check this one out and I think your list will get longer:

http://www.imdb.com/LocationTree?Oregon,+USA

I hope this helps. Did I ask you to check out the lovely Southern Oregon ghost towns of Golden (Douglas county) and Buncom (Jackson County) ?

Keep up the good work,

DaKine 22:15, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the location tree link. But actually, it's a work in progress and certainly not ready to "go live". (P.S. some people are a little touchy about other people editing their user pages, even if there are glaring typos...) I was mostly keeping track of the less-obvious ones, especially the ones filmed in and around Eugene (personal bias). You did suggest Golden, and somebody else suggested Buncom. Now that two people have suggested it, maybe I had better do it, huh? Of course, I'm mostly going to use material from the Internet, and maybe a line or two from Oregon Geographic Names so if you want to create the articles yourself with cited sources, feel free! Be BOLD. They're on my watchlist so if they get created I will see them, and I can't help but edit them after that! ;) Happy editing! Katr67 15:25, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

grammah

I was kicking myself for not going all-in on the stub-for-deletion debate, like "how dare you people offend Oregon's treasured and Most Excellent Grognard." Bet that woulda made you blush!

Yeah, Mom is pretty hip in her own way - now I'll get to figure out if she gets "yo' mama" humor. Dig that ND joke. -Pete 16:00, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Grammah indeed. IvoShandor 16:45, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Heh. BTW, I am so stealing that plainlinks thing for my WPOR userbox... Katr67 18:07, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

nestled

The funniest thing about that "nestled" search is that the first thing after all those cities is "Fecal sac."

tyler skarz 04:01, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

Uh...thanks for sharing! Katr67 04:02, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

Yaquina River

Hello, Katr67. I noticed that you edited Yaquina River to fix an image that I had inserted. For some reason the image was not displaying at thumb size, but you changed it to 250px and now it displays. I have run across this problem previously, where an image will not display at all at a particular resolution, but change it, even slightly, and then it displays. I had the same problem with the image Petroglyphs in the Columbia River Gorge.jpg that I added to Columbia River Gorge. It was not displaying at 300px, so I changed it to 298px and now it shows just fine. Any idea why this happens? Have you run across this problem before? ●DanMS • Talk 04:39, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Hey Dan. Images aren't really my thing, so I have no idea what is going wrong. I just saw that someone (probably you) had used the same solution with a problem image, so I tried messing with the Yaquina one and it worked. I had a suspicion that if I changed it back, the problem would resolve itself (on the age-old principle of taking something apart and putting it back together again). I just tried that on Yaquina River and it seems to have worked. Strange. Maybe ask at Wikipedia:Village Pump (technical) and see if anyone there knows what's going on. Katr67 04:59, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

HFMA

I see you removed the Yahoo! Top Ten part, which is fine. But I had to re-add the ref since it also covered the third largest museum part too. Odd thing. When I wrote the article it was just a top ten thing, then when the DYK person nominated the article it was #9, last night it was #14. Aboutmovies 17:46, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

I wondered about removing the ref alltogether, but I figured that fact wasn't too disputable. I assume the Portland Art Museum and Jordan Schnitzer Museum of Art are the top two? Anyway, as you can see, I found what I consider a better reference--I hope you don't mind--I just don't like that Yahoo page at all. One of the top ten is now a winery I've never heard of...advert city. I quickly tried to find a source not connected with UW that has a list of the biggest museums in the state, I bet there's one out there somewhere. Happy trails! Katr67 17:51, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
Sorry, I just noticed that all this relates to your DYK, oops. Katr67 17:59, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
No problem, I didn't nominate it. But I looked all over and can't find any sort of museum rankings site, though I found just as good of a source as the Yahoo one for the UO museum, which is now #2! Aboutmovies 19:14, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

Wetlands

That was fast. I was going back in to populate the category after finishing Jackson Bottom, but you beat me to it. Thanks. Aboutmovies 18:28, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

You're welcome. All in a day's...*ahem*...work. I loves me some categories, and was dying to put that plains thing somewhere, since it wasn't a grassland, so thank *you* for creating the cat. Now I had better go do what I get paid for... Katr67 18:32, 27 March 2007 (UTC)
Oh, you'll be back. You will start getting the shakes and feel the need to feed your addiction. *huuumwaa aah aaaah* Aboutmovies 18:37, 27 March 2007 (UTC)
I can quit anytime. Katr67 18:56, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

DYK

Hey- as far as I can tell, the *mp template (could it be a weirder name??!) is a substitute for a "*", that overcomes some Firefox-specific problem where bullet lists crash into images.

As for DYK items, I misunderstood your list, but I think it would be cool to keep track of nominations, as well - and build up a list of interesting facts about Oregon. Sounds like a separate list, though.

Just heard back from the Gov, they're on it. They didn't have much clue what I meant by "license," which seems weird for a former attorney gen/scj who champions open source but…whatever, they're willing to play along. -Pete 23:58, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

Open solicitation for input/advice

Hello! There's been some recent activity getting the ball rolling at WikiProject Journalism, and if you'd like to join us, I'm sure your input would be valued. In particular, User:Wiki Wistah has proposed a guideline for editing articles about newspapers, and although I've responded with comments of my own, WW rightly suggested that it should be more than just a two-way conversation. I've noticed some of your own edits on related matters and thought you might be interested. Any suggestions would certainly be appreciated. Otherwise, if this is not of interest to you, or if you've already got a plateful of editing, feel free to ignore this message! -Tobogganoggin talk 02:02, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

my cat removal

Thanks - it was hiding in plain sight, which is I guess why I didn't see it; I was looking in bodies of text where I knew I'd been naming various categories, but they all had the second colon in them; I guess what happened here is I copied the contents of a template, trimming them in the box, but didn't notice I'd also selected the category attached to the template......how's the weather in Oregon? It's actually warm here for the first time in months; don't know if your rain was as bad as ours, but ours was epic (60-year records all over the place, with predictions of a 100-year flood on the Fraser in the next month or two......); gonna go outside and play ;-). Thanks for finding that again; I keep on coming up with bits of Oregon history in BC sources I've got, y'know, I just don't have time to add them; mostly fur trade stuff but also cross-border stuff to do with the Similkameen, Boundary and Kootenay areas and washington in the Oregon Country days; it's always intriguing to me what I find about BC-side history in American histories and about American-side history in BC accounts; there's tons of material affecting various existin articles and suggesting others; I just don't ahve time, but Oregon/WA/ID/MT even UT/WY historians/writers/wikipedians should be aware that they may find things in BC history about their own areas that they haven't heard before, or told from a different perspective. This also includes more recent events like the Salmon War of 1996, although that didn't affect Oregon it's certainly as much an Alaska or WA story as it is a BC one; ditto the mining history of eastern WA, ID and MT with BC's Southern Interior districts/valleys, whose histories are often more involved with Spokane's etc (and even Denver) than they are with New West/Vancouver/Victoria. Oregon's a bit more removed but there's still threads that go back and forth; the reason I'm rambling about this is if there's any particular historical topic area that's of interest to you, I'll keep my eyes open for bits and send 'em along if found.Skookum1 00:26, 7 April 2007 (UTC)

Tsunami hazard zone

Hi Katr67. I am too lazy to add the tsunami hazard sticker anywhere else. In my view it makes sense to have such a warning on pages about coastal touristic resorts at risk. Feel free to revert my addition if you don't think it is useful.--Unconcerned 20:27, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

Airport Geolinks

Good day, recently you added Geolinks to the Alkali Lake State Airport article. I'm not sure if you know this but if you click on the coords in the airport info box it brings up tons of links to maps & such. In fact I believe all of the geolinks added are covered there. Let me know what you think as it may be redundant to add geolinks to the bottom of airport articles. Thanks! -Trashbag 01:59, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

I kinda prefer the geolinks because it saves a step, what with the map links right on the article page. It's probably redundant, but for that one article, I wanted to make it abundantly clear that the airport is in the middle of nowhere. ;) Feel free to take it out if you want, I promise I won't plague the rest of the airport articles with it. BTW, I think the closest actual town is Wagontire, Oregon. Katr67 02:30, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

OSU Radiation Center Tags

Hey! I removed the quality tag you placed on OSU Radiation Center because I think it was there due to the spelling errors, and it's evolved quite a bit since then. If you could look at the article again and comment with what parts are difficult to understand or make no sense it would be greatly appreciated. I want to get all of the parts that need attention addressed b/c I just despise articles that have tags that never go away. Thanks! theanphibian 06:31, 7 April 2007 (UTC)

It looks much better, thanks. If you don't mind I'll just go ahead and take care of the {{context}} issues, which apply especially to the lead paragraph, which should state clearly what and where the thing is. I think perhaps the article should be moved as well, as I saw suggested somewhere, and there might be some more things that could be wikified. If I see anything else that's unclear, I'll be sure to let you know. Thanks to you too. Katr67 23:19, 7 April 2007 (UTC)

Oregon related articles

I have completed some list of descendants of Category:Oregon than are not marked as Project Oregon. The list is not complete, as the bot crashed, but the list User:AlexNewArtBot/OregonList should keep you busy for a while Alex Bakharev 14:22, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

Awesome, thanks! Katr67 15:07, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
Can I delete (or perhaps strike out) the ones that we've looked at? If you finish the list will you start it on a new page? I don't want to mess up your system or duplicate our efforts. Katr67 15:12, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
I went through 1850 and added WPOR tags to those I thought should be in our web. I left out those that had little or nothing to do with the state. For instance if they only played college sports, went to college, or played briefly professionally in Oregon I left them out. Happy bunny day. Aboutmovies 21:31, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
Cool, thanks for helping out. I have little interest in athletes but somebody likes them so I have been tagging them. I don't care one way or the other so I see no need to make that consistent. Somebody else can do it if s/he wants. I also tagged some satanist author who used to live in Portland. <shrug>. I'm going to leave out things like "Milk" though because though it's Oregon's official state beverage (gotta love the milk lobby) our connection to the article ends there. I don't know if you're checking out the categories some of these things are in, but I found a few that were flying under our radar: "Television shows based in Oregon", "Bus stations in Oregon"...useful? I dunno but I tagged 'em. So what happened to it being a sunny bunny day? Katr67 21:41, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
Some weren't atheletes, they just went to college here and never came back. Didn't see any interesting cats, but wasn't looking that closely either. As to the sun, well I think we didn't sacrifice enough bunnies to the satanic author. Well, maybe next year. Aboutmovies 21:48, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

Christianity/Oregon overlap assessment

Hi, saw your message on my talkpage about assessing the Project: Oregon articles that are also within the scope of the Christianity project. Basically, I was just being bold, and have overlapped my assessment on a handful of articles. If that's a problem, I'll be glad to stop. Just trying to be a friendly neighbor. Did you disagree with my assessment, or is it mainly just inappropriate for me to be assessing articles for projects I'm not a part of? Just let me know. No offense taken on my part. Nswinton 18:08, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

RE on my talk page. Have a great day! Nswinton 18:29, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Your edit to Sometimes a Great Notion (novel)

I noticed you added a "sic" following the title Never Give A Inch in this article. I dont think it is really appropriate in a title. Of course inline inside of a quote this would be normal practice, but following a title, not a quote, I dont think it is appropriate and it looks odd and out of place. Russeasby 16:40, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

Power

Could you take a look at Katherine Ann Power and copy edit it to make sure things make sense and items are linked, etc. Thanks. Aboutmovies 21:52, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

Katherine Ann Power

Thank you for improving the article Katherine Ann Power. But I'd just like to inquire that when and where was she born, and if she is still alive? WooyiTalk, Editor review 05:22, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

Actually User:Aboutmovies did most of the work improving the article. I'm not sure any of the available sources say what her exact place or date of birth was. The article states that she grew up in Denver, so I'd assume she was born there, and by doing the math, it looks like she was born in 1949 or 1950. As far as I know, she's still alive. Katr67 05:34, 13 April 2007 (UTC)
I found an image of her wanted poster on eBay. Yes, she was born in Denver, and she was born in 1949. Though I'm not sure we can use the image of the poster as a source to cite in the article, I saved a copy of the image, just in case. That info is probably available somewhere, however. Katr67 13:59, 13 April 2007 (UTC)
Thanks a lot for searching. Heh, the FBI looked for her for decades trying to hunt her down, just for an act she did that many people find to be heroic. One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter, indeed! WooyiTalk, Editor review 03:02, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for looking at Chinook Salmon

Thanks for lookin at Chinook Salmon and reverting the garbage edit about fry and bathtubs. I thought I'd gotten that one too, but obviously had missed it. -Fenevad 13:11, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

You're welcome. Salmon have a tough enough time as it is without people vandalizing their article too. :) Katr67 14:00, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

Oregon State Library Entry is Looking Good

Just wanted to say thanks for all the improvements you have made to the page. And to point out one quibble. The photo of the "card catalog" is not really our card catalog in the sense of being our book catalog. Like most libraries we have an online book catalog and have had one for a long time. The card file at the State Library is what we call the Oregon Index. It is a manual card index to local newspapers that we began in the early 20th century. It also indexes other historical resources. We quit indexing in the 70's, so the scope is limited, but it is still a very valuable resource for researchers. -- Jim Scheppke —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Jscheppke (talk • contribs) 04:18, 15 April 2007 (UTC).

Trask Mountain

Hey could you take a look with the good book? Aboutmovies 20:36, 22 April 2007 (UTC)

Strangely enough, there's no mention of the mountain, just the river, which is named after Elbridge Trask as it states in that article. I'd assume the mountain is named after the river but OGN won't help us this time. I did fiddle with your flora... Katr67 21:52, 22 April 2007 (UTC)

Companies

Thanks for the heads up on OSI, they were not on my watchlist. That same person also tagged Shari's. If all the articles in the Based in Oregon cat that don't show notability were tagged, then it would take a couple days to add the needed info as rarely are there any sources. I'm all for people starting articles, but take a minute to add a source. Enough ranting. No maybe I can work on what I planned on working on today. Aboutmovies 22:42, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

You're welcome. Ditto on the rant. I was talking to my brother about this the other day. His hobby is speedying seemingly non-notable new articles. And he gets a lot of "Wah. You deleted my article!" And I was saying gosh, ya know, how hard is it? I mean, I've written a few dozen articles on barely notable localites, and not one has been deleted because I properly format them, categorize them and source them as fully as possible. Katr67 22:54, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

KY/Bluegrass

I saw that a little bit ago and thought "how many people outside of KY are going to recognize the outline of the state?" I thought about commenting, something along the lines of "maybe something more recognizable outside of the state, like a bust of Tubby Smith, oh wait he left..." But I thought that might be considered rude. Aboutmovies 17:01, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

Roffle. Katr67 17:06, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

Another dubious milestone...

A vandal created an attack page in my honor. The guy couldn't even get my name right. Sigh.  :-/ --Finngall talk 23:28, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

Congratulations! Katr67 23:30, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

Thomas J. Hubbard

Can you check the OGN and see if Hubbard, Oregon is named for this Hubbard? Thanks. Aboutmovies 01:04, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

Sure, ask me just when I was about to go out into the big blue room...Just a sec, I'll see what I can find out. Katr67 01:06, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

Nope it was named for one Charles Hubbard, who took over a donation land claim from a guy named Hunt who disappeared after he joined the California Gold Rush... None of the other things named Hubbard match Thomas either. Cheers. Katr67 01:10, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

OK, thanks for checking. What's the big blue room? Aboutmovies 01:15, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

You know, outside. :) Though maybe right now it's the big gray room... Katr67 01:16, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

who made you the wikipolice?

What is so wrong with me posting a link to a Portland area news service? I noticed PortlandWiki is there, why is that okay?

Maybe I should leave you a message like you did to me that says "please don't delete my contribution to wiki pages."

Actions like your undermine the entire wiki philosophy. My contribution is entirely within the scope of the page and adds to users experience. What is your problem with it?

Get a life...—Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.117.164.28 (talk • contribs) 01:21, April 26, 2007

WTF?

Why are you threatening to block me just because I do practical jokes? You should tell me that 'NO JOKES ARE ACCEPTED ON WIKIPEDIA BECAUSE WE SUCK AT THEM' on my user talk.

♫Deathgleaner 01:12, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

U an admin?

Wow - if you consider meaningless typoing of Wikilinks and removal of references sections "practical jokes," then not only are you vandalizing, you need to work on your sense of humor, too. Adminship has nothing to do with enforcing policy - not at this level, anyway. You're vandalizing. Stop it. -Pete 01:32, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
Deathgleaner. Katr does not need to tell you, you should read the OFFICIAL POLICY titled Wikipedia:Vandalism, where very near the top so it is hard not to miss:
The most common types of vandalism include the addition of obscenities to pages, page blanking, or the insertion of bad (or good) jokes or other nonsense.
So please read, and comprehend. Then stop vandalising and you will not have any problems. You may also want to read WP:WWIN as well so you can figure out what not to do in general. Aboutmovies 04:26, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

dante's

You are not the wikipolice and your behavior is beginning to border upon that of a self-appointed dilettante.

I was going to refrain from commenting to you, but your over-editing of the page forces my hand. Frank first informed me of your harassment months ago. The hoax tag can stay. The "media" articles did need to go. However, deleting the accolades section when there are legitimate links to AOL went too far. This is not spam. It is proof of an award. Any search of the Willamette Week archives will confirm our awards in the previous years. Or, you could just get up from behind your computer, come down to the bar and see the awards for yourself.

You might also want to take a little trip down to the Oregon Historical Society to confirm my research on the building, that way we can remove the original research tag.

That being said, if you continue to make condescending comments in the talk section, remove valid information, or otherwise engage in behavior that is contrary to wikipedia's policies, I will report you.

Focus your efforts on other Oregon-related topics, since you are the self-appointed "expert" in these matters. I'm sure there are bigger fish to fry.

Good day. I consider the matter closed and am happy with the entry as it now stands.

PP —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Pspark (talk • contribs) 03:19, 29 April 2007 (UTC).

Hi Paul~
Wow. Frank must be pretty thin-skinned if he considers these edits: here, here, and here, and here (the sum total of my interaction with him), besides this cryptic entry on my talk page and subsequent conversation: on my and his talk page as "harassment".
It happens that I *am* a dilettante. Aren't you? And aren't all dilettantes self-appointed?
I felt the "accolades" section was unencyclopedic. I never said it was spam, and I never said they weren't real awards. But a section like that does begin to make the article about your bar look like an advertisement, and wikipedia isn't here to provide free advertising space. I didn't place the original research tag, but before you provided your detailed and apparently well-researched history section, the article really was mostly nonsense, and you apparently agree since you say the {{hoax}} tag can stay.
Can you please point out which wikipedia policies I have violated? And I'm confused--I never made *any* comments in the talk section. You must mean the edit summaries? Feel free to mention my actions at the administrator's noticeboard. Or else check out these other ways to work out article disputes: request for comment, mediation, or arbitration.
You seem pretty condescending yourself. I never said I was an "expert" about anything. I think this can be worked out. Usually these things are done on the article's talk page. In the meantime, you really need to read about ownership of articles (it doesn't really matter if *you* are pleased with how the article is now, because it's not *your* article--like I told Frank, you need to be prepared to have your work mercilessly edited), what wikipedia is not (including an advertising medium for your club) and conflict of interest. Another thing we like around here is civility. Try it :) Some people prefer the essay entitled Don't Be a Dick. Katr67 05:32, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
Civility is definitely the main problem here. I think you both need to focus on the quality of the article, and Wikipedia policies and guidelines, rather than each other's approach to the matter. And by the way, threats of administrative action are pretty weak. If you want to involve an administrator, PP, by all means, just do it...it will likely help improve the quality of the article, to everyone's benefit. But the threats just raise the tension, without serving any productive purpose. -Pete 21:47, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

re: non-obvious vandal

Hi, I respect your assessment that my recent nomination for blocking may have been in error, and agree that this user's behavior is different from most vandals. But I feel it's essential that something be done. Can you suggest an alternative? I don't want to violate WP:CANVASS, and I'm not sure what remedies are available between that and a block. -Pete 19:39, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

I did a little digging about Interstate 2, and it looks like it might exist. Or at least some major road(s) named #2 exist. See Talk:Interstate 2. If he's acting in good faith, then I'm not going to block him. He did have a string of vandalism on the 27th, but if he's stopped vandalizing there's no need to block him now. Has he vandalized since his last warning (not counting Interstate 2)? --Fang Aili talk 19:49, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
I see Pete beat me here. Thanks for being a good Wikipedian and assuming good faith about Deathgleaner--I'm afraid I'm a bit more cynical about his I-2 article. He's done some almost-but-not quite vandalism, mostly useless edits and unexplained changes, which I have reverted. I know you can't block him for that, but like Pete, I'd like to know what to do short of waiting for him to get bored and go away. Katr67 19:56, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
I just gave him a "final warning". [7] Does this suffice? Please contact me if you need a block performed. --Fang Aili talk 20:00, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

Not a female body part

I award this Barnstar to Katr67 for their great efforts improving WP Oregon. Over 2000 edits again this month, and every single one of them in Oregon ;) Aboutmovies 23:39, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
I award this Barnstar to Katr67 for their great efforts improving WP Oregon. Over 2000 edits again this month, and every single one of them in Oregon ;) Aboutmovies 23:39, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
Hey- I wanted to second your Barnstar award...but (as usual) you beat me to the punch :) Congrats, well-deserved and long overdue and all that. Keep up the kickass gnomerific Oregon improvmentism! -Pete 17:16, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Nez Perce

The accent markj and associated pronounciation are inaccurate with respect to the Nez Perce. As a teacher of Pacific Northwest history, I grow weary of this common error. At least let Wikipedia get it right.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.185.74.220 (talk • contribs) 20:29, February 27, 2007

Welcome to Wikipedia! I suggest you sign up for an account, we can always use more well-informed editors. Unfortunately when an anonymous editor removes content from an article, does not provide sources or discuss the changes on the talk page, or use an edit summary, it's hard for us to tell whether or not the change is vandalism or personal opinion. The use of accents may be wrong, but rather than completely remove the information from the article, it might be best to include it and explain why it is wrong, citing your sources of course, because it is still pretty common to see the accent used. Without a solid explanation in the article, the information may just get added back again by someone else. I hope that helps. Katr67 20:52, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. I created an account right after posting the message to you. Now, can you explain why I get messages intended for Oriel College?

Mission Mill

I think you mentioned that you used to give tours at the museum. If so, do you think the history they are giving is particularly accurate? I ask because their webiste says the Indian School became the Oregon Institute, then Willamette U. I know OI became WU, but according to G. Hines this is not what happened. And from what I've seen elsewhere I think Hines is correct, plus since Hines was there I give his opinion a bit more weight. Aboutmovies 20:15, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Actually, I haven't started volunteering yet (I'm a slacker), but I have a big packet of information from them.(still wondering if I can cite it as a source, I need to ask) There are definitely some inaccuracies I saw, some minor and silly, but it could be MM isn't right. The way I know the story, the Indian School was kind of a bust, due to lack of Indians and the pressing need to worry more about basic survival. However, there was definitely a need to educate the children of the missionaries and others who showed up, so the Indian School sort of morphed into the Oregon Institute because there were teachers around and people who needed teaching, but I don't know if there was direct lineage. I'll have to check the packet when I get home. The website mentions the lineage in two places, but only one establishes a direct connection between the two. (Egads that site is hard to navigate...) Katr67 21:28, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
Very confusing. I re-looked at the Hines stuff and it isn't clear either. Then the End of the Trail people have on their site it was two different locations. Guess I'll have to check out some books. Thanks. Aboutmovies 21:46, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
Isn't Chemawa mixed up in there as well? Katr67 21:48, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
I think Chemawa is the problem. People are confusing the two and think J. Lee's Indian Manual Training School is the precursor to Chemawa. That's rare, white folk lumping the natives together. Aboutmovies 23:41, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Ghost Towns

I noticed "Ghost Towns" as a project on your other page. There is one in southern Oregon, called Buncom. You can find a little on the web. Anyhow, I'm fairly lame at making Wikipedia catergories - I barely know how to post images right. But if you ever feel like adding Buncom under Oregon, I'd be glad to send you a photo to use in it. Its just 3 buildings. I think I have one or two images now, but its only a few miles down the road, if I can't locate one and need to take another.Mdvaden 05:54, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the suggestion. Somewhere in the chaos on my desk I've got a list of ghost town articles I want to get around to writing and I'm sure Buncom is on it. Judging by the pictures on the 'net, it looks a little like Jawbone Flats up at Opal Creek Wilderness Area. I seem to get easily distracted around here, but when I write the article I'll be sure to drop you a note. P.S. Sorry I meant to touch base with you about your Bigfoot trap image before it got deleted, but it indeed looks like you got the copyright tag correct this time. Thanks for uploading it--it really adds to the article. Talk to you later, Katr67 06:43, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Tricia Leines

Hi! I remember ages ago you querying my adding Patricia Leines as a notable resident of Medford as she did not have a page (see User talk:PageantUpdater/Archive 4#Patricia Leines if you wish to refresh your memory). Anyway I just noticed that someone else created the article and when I was expanding the article I remembered our discussion so thought I'd pop you a note :) -- PageantUpdater • talk | contribs | esperanza 09:13, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Glencoe High School

Hey there, I notice you had done a little bit of editing on the Glencoe High School page. I cleaned it up a little bit, please let me know what you think of my edits and what you think needs to be done. I went to Glencoe, so I'd like to see its page improve. Pablothegreat85 21:54, 25 March 2007 (UTC)

Champoeg cat

Since I know a lot of the folks I changed today are on your watchlist, I mainly left those that were important outside of the participation at the meetings in the main cat. But if their main notablity was just from the meetings, then I put them only in the sub cat. Let me know if you think this makes sense. Aboutmovies 20:00, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

WP:MOS

As I see you keep changing around the sections with a reference to the MOS, I thought I would let you know section order is not covered there, it is in Wikipedia:Guide to layout. And it says the order doesn't matter which is why I normally put the ref section last. It is a personal preference I have since I always put footnotes at the bottom since most people don't bother to check them (even my professors joke with us that nobody reads them), and I think people are more likely to use the external links. But that's my preference, I'm not trying to get you to agree but somepeople (as I think you have expierenced) might not like others changing articles for no reason. Aboutmovies 20:23, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

Well, technically the GTL is part of the MOS so I'm not wrong about that part. It says it's "okay to change the sequence" of the sections, which I take to mean the order they have listed is the preferred way. I bet there's a huge talkpage argument about this archived somewhere. I dunno, most of the articles I see have the external links at the bottom, which seems like a consensus, and I really think it looks better that way and that people are used to looking at the bottom of the page for the external links so it's faster for them to find them that way. This is the kind of thing professional editors get paid to make consistent. Since I can't achieve consistency across the whole of Wikipedia, I figured I'd try for it on our end. If Wikipedia were a real encyclopedia, the guideline wouldn't be so vague and I could have my way, Bwahaha. Anyway, I hope I've only changed the order when I'm also editing other things, 'cos doing stuff like that and nothing else (I'm thinking of people who do nothing but change the spacing around the == Headings == vs. ==Headings==) *is* truly annoying, though luckily so far I think I've managed to annoy only you :). I'll try to look the other way on your articles, but that's how I see it, YMMV. Katr67, Hobgoblin, 21:09, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

Oregon Airport locations

Good day Katr67, I've noticed that you've been working on critiquing cities that have been called out in airport articles. Be advised that the cities selected as references where selected for a reason. These "cities" - whether a local or a cross road in the middle of no where - are called out in two FAA related documents. The first is FAA A/FD or Airport/Facility Directory. This directory is used by every airman for gathering information on an airport or other facility (such as a helipad).

The second is the FAA Form 5010 - Airport Master Record. When an airport is built and every three years there after it will be inspected and all pertinent information is recorded here. The inspection is performed by the FAA or a designee. (Trivia) In the State of Oregon, this is performed by State Airport Inspector with the Oregon Department of Aviation.

I would advise in keeping with standard in calling out the city addressed by the FAA. By all means feel free to indicate whether that local is incorporated, and if it is not incorporated then what the next closest city is.

Just for an example of this data here is the 5010 data for Lake State Airport. Note how Alkali Lake is called out as the associated city. I hope this help explain the method to my madness. Happy Wiking -Trashbag 02:02, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Well, I find this baffling because I checked the USGS database, the Portland State University Geographic Names Database, and Oregon Geographic Names, and the places I changed are neither "populated places" nor "locales" (defined as a "battlefield, crossroad, camp, farm, ghost town, landing, railroad siding, ranch, ruins, site, station, windmill") [8] in any of those references. This is why I changed them to reflect the Wikipedia naming convention of Settlement Name, Oregon and put the nearest actual populated place. (Apparently even Wagontire has a population of 2.) These places are instead natural features and should be named simply Foobar Lake or Foobar (Oregon). I see how you'd want the List of Oregon Airports to reflect what the FAA says, so feel free to revert my changes. However, though I'd hate to say the FAA is "wrong" (have they talked to the USGS lately?), for the purposes of Wikipedia, I'd prefer these places didn't have wikilinks that made it seem as if they were settlements. (I was really doubtful about Beaver Marsh too, but that place even had its own post office for a time.) Perhaps, for example, the Alkali Lake (Oregon) article could include a sentence something like "for the purposes of the FAA, a location eight miles north of the lake, referred to as 'Alkali Lake, Oregon' is considered the nearest 'city' to Alkali Lake Airport". Similar to the blurb some of us put on Census-Designated Places--see Neskowin, Oregon. Katr67 06:43, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

category-mistress guidance sought

I'm working on adding divisions to the {{WikiProject Oregon}} template, but am in doubt about the proper category arrangement. As you seem to more fully embrace categories than I do, perhaps you could suggest the category names and relationships that these WP:ORE divisions should fall into:

  • government
  • education / schools
  • biography / people
  • history
  • sports & athletes biographies
  • flora
  • business / companies
  • geography / physical
  • culture / arts
  • transport / roads / airports

I expect these would be named rooted at category:WikiProject Oregon or similar names would be subcategories of it, but not sure how to proceed. For example, should government project articles be under category:WikiProject Oregon government, category:WikiProject Oregon/government, category:WPORE government, or what? Maybe this should go to the project talk page? —EncMstr 18:48, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Oooh fancy. Well, as for government, we've already got Category:WikiProject Oregon Government & Politics, so why don't we follow the lead of that one but maybe lowercase like your first example because history, culture etc. are not really subprojects but subdivisions? We can key them to the existing subdivisions. I'll see if there's any examples of how other WikiProjects do it. Katr67 18:59, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
So I tend to to see how WPMinnesota does things, as they seem to have their act together/have more obsessives than we do ;). This is how they break it down: Category:WikiProject Minnesota. I like their format Category:WikiProject Oregon/Education, etc. I'd skip the "general" subcategory that they have, and I see their "nature and geography" seemingly overlaps "places". We have a cities subproject, but that can in turn fall under our geography category. I'd take the one you call "flora" and make it natural history (there used to be an Oregon fauna category that got axed but there's still a bit of fauna relating to our project). That's the only one I can see that doesn't match up with a subproject, but that's probably OK. They have a parks category, do we need one? We do have a lot of parks. It could be a subcatgory of geography. They don't have a history subcat but we'll need one of course. Katr67 14:30, 10 April 2007 (UTC)
Okay, I'll propose something based on that at WP:ORE. Thanks. —EncMstr 23:29, 10 April 2007 (UTC)


Take a look?

Hey there-

Just got back from the Maryhill Museum of Art (which has an awesome exhibit on Celilo Falls, btw) and I'm trying to wikify my newfound nuggets of knowledge. Could you take a look at Maryhill, Washington - I tried to make it grasp more coherently the dual roles of "modern" maryhill (pop. 98) and the original planned community. It's a weird combo, and one I know you've dealt with before…mind letting me know what you think? I've also been plugging away at Samuel Hill, Celilo Falls, The Dalles Dam, etc… -Pete 09:09, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Cool, I need to get over there one of these days. I didn't just take a look, I was BOLD and did that thing that I do. I even happen to have a book on Washington sitting here so I threw in a little more info. See what you think--I added the blurb I stole from Bkonrad for just such purposes, slapped a bunch cats on it, etc. Judging by the info I found online, Columbia/Columbus had an identity of its own before it became Maryhill. There's a tiny bit more I can add from the book I have, but I'm sleep-deprived so I'll see if I can get to it later... Katr67 03:52, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
Thanks! Good stuff. My original conundrum, however, remains. In this particular case, it seems to me that the historical status of the place is more significant – or at least, equally significant – to its present status as a hamlet of 98 people. I think a summary of its history belongs in the "intro" paragraph. Do you disagree? -Pete 00:54, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

LPO

The funny thing is, that removal came from the same IP address as the one that originally added it…also without explanation. -Pete 20:01, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Heh. Well, s/he's stuck with it now. Bwahaha. P.S. I'll get back to you on the Maryhill thing. I had some ideas but I got sidetracked... Katr67 20:03, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

The line under Libertarian Party of Oregon History concerning Wes Wagner lawsuit is false and misleading: "Instead of complying and producing accurate financial documents, the party leadership spent over $6000 in attorney's fees to not disclose this financial information." It is my understanding and direct experience that the LPO Treasurer made available all books and records to Mr. Wagner and any other member of the LPO State Committee at their request. If the LPO would have answered Mr. Wagner's "Alternative Writ of Mandamus" in the venue of the Washington County Court, it would have subjected the LPO to paying his attorney's fees as if it were an admission of some sort of guilt not to mention a recognition of the courts jurisdiction in the matter which was disputed by the LPO, affirmed by Judge Hernandez and the suit summarily dismissed in favor of the LPO. Please remove the line in question from the Wikipedia entry. --Jerrydefoe 08:02, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

Hi, welcome to Wikipedia. I don't own the article so you are free to edit it yourself. Sorry if my above comment sounded snarky, but we don't like it when anonymous editors delete things without any discussion on the talk page and without using an edit summary--this usually comes across as either vandalism or POV-pushing. I don't really have much interest in the article itself, except to remove what looks to me like vandalism. I'd suggest making the changes, adding cited sources and using an edit summary, or, if you are not comfortable with that, posting your suggested changes to the article's talk page where other editors can get involved. (User Pete is a great resource for the political stuff.) Hope this helps. Katr67 16:39, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

P.S. If you are involved with the party, I'd also suggest reading about conflict of interest. This doesn't preclude you from editing the article, but there are good suggestions about how to write from a neutral point-of-view. Katr67 16:43, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

You didn't sound "snarky" and I am not the anonymous editor and I have no idea who is (was). Also, I am aware and agree with the conflict of interest which is why I wrote in rather than edit myself. I'm not sure why I ended up writing here if you are not the owner. Sorry. Thanks for the advice and I will take your advice and write to the talk page. --Jerrydefoe 07:13, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, sympathy, connections, and misc.

Thanks for alphabetizing Medford notables I should have done that myself.

Sorry your getting flamed so much lately just for making following official Wikipedia policies and guidelines. It would help a lot if users would learn more about these and throttle back their egos. I copied your talk page's discussion to Deathgleaner's talk page, where he can read it.

I've been trying to find out about a world champion lumberjack of the 1960s and 1970s named Melvin "Mel" Lentz. It's a little hard to find stuff here in Jackson County, what with #@*&!~ closed libraries and all. I'm sure he lived in Creswell, Oregon in his competitive years. Since he and Fircrest chicken are Creswell's 2 best known exports, I think we should put an artcle up about Mel and a link to Creswell. Can you help? I would also like to put in more about Larry Mahan, one of the greatest rodeo cowboys of all time, who competed out of either Salem or Brooks, Oregon. Same research handicap.

I see you are a fencer. Do you know our fellow Oregon Wikipedian Brady User:Bradybd ? I do volunteer work with him. He studied with Gay Jacobsen D'Asaro. Also do you know my other buddy, John McDougall [9], who also knows which end of the epee to hold?

I see you are a UU. I have always identified as one, and used to teach Sunday school at the Ashland fellowship.

Keep up the good work and keep being BOLD.DaKine 17:48, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

Re: Fencing. Cool! My friend and fencing instructor, Twisted 86 has done some training under Maestro McDougall. I've met one other fencer from the Ashland area, Joel, but I've only been fencing for a few months, so I don't have the guts to compete in tournaments and possibly meet more of those folks. More later, I'm supposed to be working. Cheers! Katr67 18:41, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

Hey man, sympathy back atcha about your libraries... :( Katr67 17:21, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Glad you're a Crumpacker Backer now

And I'm really looking forward to your Spruce Production Division article which will make everything clear! --Sprkee 04:37, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

I updated the Crumpacker saga, thanks to a pointer from Aboutmovies. One thread I started following had to do with his wife's legacy that I thought might be in your area of expertise or interest. She was the daughter of an Oregon Trail pioneer, James W. Cook. He seems to have some interesting pioneer history, documented in the "History of the Columbia River Valley From The Dalles to the Sea", which I started reading here. So in case you are looking for something else to suck you in.... --Sprkee 17:58, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Content from Bend Living

Hi Katr67 ... I understand the SPAM policy. I believe the changes I made regarding Central Oregon add value to readers in that each article showcases our beautiful state. We are not asking people to buy anything. We simply want them to have access to content that will help them plan a vacation and what to do when they're here.

For instance:

"Paradise Found" talks about "The roots of Central Oregon’s backcountry scene date to the early 1900s when Swedish and Norwegian loggers brought skiing to Bend from the Midwest and Scandinavia."

"Cathedral of Climbing" has some of the most spectacular photography of climbers at Smith Rock State Park. It also includes resources for climbers who visit Central Oregon.

"Rollin' (and Rockin') on The River" features the Bend Paddle Alliance and their work for a safer Deschutes. Again, the photography is beautiful.

"Central Oregon's 10 Best Places to Fly-Fish" lists the best places to cast your line in Central Oregon. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Chebert512 (talk • contribs) 20:06, 1 May 2007 (UTC).

Hi Carrie, I suggest you read What Wikipedia is Not. One of the things Wikipedia is not is a place for helping people plan their vacations or even to showcase the state. You might want to check out Wikitravel, where the kind of content you want to add to the article is quite welcome. If you are truly interested in contributing to Wikipedia, I'd suggest adding content, not links. If you have further questions about the content you wish to add to the Bend, Oregon article, be sure to mention them on the article's talk page. Thanks and happy editing. Katr67 20:32, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
P.S. Also please read this about external links--it is strongly discouraged that you add links to sites with which you are closely affiliated. Thanks. See also conflict of interest. Katr67 20:41, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Plunderathon

Thanks for re-wikifiing the Plunderathon article. We ran into an editorial conflict when two of us were editing it at once, and I believe the solution that was used was "cut n paste," which didn't work out so well. --Davethehorrible 01:02, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Still Pending revision

I noticed that you reverted an edit to the Still Pending article that appeared to be vandalism. Would you mind putting a warning on the user's talk page User_talk:KEVRAYRecords so that they understand the policy? You are quite the prolific editor about all things Oregon! Thank you for all of your contributions. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Stampsations (talk • contribs) 20:25, 2 May 2007 (UTC).

Hi there. I warn users all the time when I'm at home where my vandal script works. When I'm supposed to be working, at work where I can't use Firefox, I often don't take the time to warn vandals because I have to type out the templates by hand. That's just the way it's gonna be. But thanks for the reminder. And you're welcome! Cheers. Katr67 20:29, 2 May 2007 (UTC)
P.S. It's been too long since the vandalism for a warning to that user to be effective, I think. If s/he is still vandalizing, of course s/he should be warned again. Katr67 20:31, 2 May 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for the response. Stampsations 02:20, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Cookie

Thanks for the cookie. I can use one...I gotta go reboot a system at 1am. --Finngall talk 00:14, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

Gak. What a weekend--heavy housecleaning, light home improvement, multiple parental units, and the door to the game room started falling off its hinges and needs replacing. Bibble. Bibble. B-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-b..... --Finngall talk 19:01, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Thank you

Katr67 -

Thank you for reviewing my first article. I will work on proper categorization very soon.

GOSCON is not a pure acronym, it roughly stands for "Government Open Source Conference" and I am worried that as an entry title that would be a little generic. Let me know what you think based on the Wikipedia naming conventions.

Thank you!

Chess —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Chessicle (talk • contribs) 01:51, 4 May 2007 (UTC).

Cascade passes

I am almost afraid to touch anything about the Cascades. There is one editor who thinks there is a distinction to be made between the 'Cascades' and the 'Casade Mountains', claiming some mountains are in the Cascades, some in the Cascade Mountains and some in both. I hate to think what would happen to passes as well. Hmains 04:43, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

Governor of Oregon

I was on this page today and the navigation template with all the past govs is having issues, but I wanted to make sure it wasn't just my computer. Could you see if the v d e and edit are behind the title? Thanks. Aboutmovies 15:32, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

It seems to be working fine in Explorer... Katr67 16:10, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for checking, I have explorer too and both the Gov template and the curretn govs templates are not displaying properly for me. Time for a re-boot. Aboutmovies 16:31, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

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NHRP tidbit

This page looks like it could use a little gnomification from a NHRP geek: Grays River (Washington) (see the bit about the covered bridge...) Enjoy! -Pete 09:31, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Gnoming accomplished, including on a couple related articles. I'll try to get around to writing an article on the bridge. First I have to help my friend get her master's degree by editing a couple of her final papers... Katr67 14:43, 7 May 2007 (UTC)
Northerly! LOL! Good luck with the "real life" editing... -Pete 19:02, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Yeah. Heh. But for some reason I left "southwesterly" in the other article. At least they aren't statistics papers this time... Katr67 20:15, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Official Appointment

I hereby appoint Katr WikiCop.
I hereby appoint Katr WikiCop.

Now nobody can claim nobody ever appointed you the police of Wikipedia. Hopefully the mellow is now somewhat unharshed. -Pete 06:19, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

Jeff the Great weighs in again

Thanks for all the traffic to my http://jeffthegreat.blogspot.com blog, Katr67! Too bad I haven't made your User page as someone you hate :( —Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.117.164.28 (talk • contribs) 16:16, May 8, 2007

No problem. But I'm confused. I don't keep a list of people I hate. Am I supposed to? Hate lists are uncivil. Besides, I don't hate you, but I wish you would read up on wikipolicy. Katr67 16:24, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

Oregon politician stubs

There are a lot of politician stubs, including those not tagged as such, that need to be expanded. I see you made a place to list them under Wikipedia:WikiProject_Oregon/People but from the description on the main project page, I would almost expect them to be under the Government subproject. So could we either expand the description of the People subproject to specifically call out politicians, or decide to have politician bios be a part of the Government project? I think people who are into the government stuff tend to be into the politicians themselves as well. --Sprkee 17:01, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

Hey Sprkee, I'm not attached to where they go, I just wanted a place to keep track of 'em. For sure feel free to rewrite or cross-reference the two sub-projects so it's clearer. My bias is that I'm more interested in people than politicians. :) I figure most everybody who's actually working on this stuff is already aware of both lists, but yes, if we want new people to get involved we should definitely make the redlinks easier to find. Katr67 17:12, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for the invite - I'm also starting on a category and related pages for Category:University of Oregon buildings. I plan on taking pictures (myself, of course) of at least the appealing buildings on campus and incorporating them into new articles about campus history (I'm a bit of a UO history buff =P). Nice to meet a fellow duck on here! akendall(talk) 19:54, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

You're welcome. Glad to have you aboard. Good idea on the buildings--quite a bit of work needs to be done there. I took a few pics last time I was in Eugene, but the weather was gloomy so the light wasn't so good. I did add a couple images to the Knight Library, bookstore and museum articles but better pics are always welcome. I've got a few more I need to upload... Be sure to check the commons--there's quite a bit of UO stuff on there. Cheers! Katr67 20:01, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
You sure are quick with those Wikiproject Oregon tags. =P akendall(talk) 04:40, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

LOL. Some people tell me I need to get a life. :) Katr67 04:44, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

Capitol

Thank you for the correction.

Live and learn.

(capitol, not capital)—Preceding unsigned comment added by Beaver1believer (talk • contribs) 17:08, May 11, 2007

You're welcome. It's a common mistake. Katr67 17:19, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

Three Rivers, Oregon

Three Rivers is an interesting example of wikipedia's laws limitations. The problem is, there is basically no published information on the subject, so almost anything added is going to be considered original and thus wrong. In this way, we can't learn about Three Rivers simply because no one has published it.

I've lived in Three Rivers and my information is verifiable -- but "verify" here would mean calling the people and asking them if what i write is accurate.

So what's the solution to this?—Preceding unsigned comment added by Rayjackson30 (talk • contribs) 11:33, May 11, 2007

Thanks very much for bringing this up for discussion. First of all, please read about originial research. Unfortunately, personal experience does not count as a reliable source on Wikipedia. If there isn't anything published about the situation in a secondary source, I'm afraid it will need to stay out of the article, because as you correctly guessed, calling up people to verify the info doesn't count. I do find the "lawlessness" situation interesting, and I didn't know that Three Rivers was a gated community. Can you at least find a reliable source for that information? I see your revisions have become increasingly less POV, so thanks for working on that. If you want to go ahead and add a few sentences on the legal status of the community that are NPOV, I would be OK with adding a {{fact}} tag to that part and seeing if we can find more information. BTW, I believe "photographic evidence" doesn't work as a reliable source either. I'll take a closer look when I'm not supposed to be working. I hope that helps. Katr67 18:48, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

Springbrook, List of Yamhill County Post Offices

I will gladly cite my sources. Can I get info on book and pamphlet citing format? --Zinc2005 15:57, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

I find using citation templates is the easiest, maybe modify the books one to use for a pamphlet. According to the Chicago Manual of Style (one of the style guides Wikipedia suggests when the Wikipedia MOS doesn't address something), the format for pamphlets is here. If you're using OGN, you can just copy and paste this template:

<ref name="OGN">{{cite book |last = McArthur |first = Lewis A. |authorlink = Lewis A. McArthur |coauthors = [[Lewis L. McArthur]] |title = [[Oregon Geographic Names]] |origyear = 1928 |edition = Seventh Edition |year = 2003 |publisher = [[Oregon Historical Society]] Press |location = [[Portland, Oregon|Portland]], [[Oregon]] |id = ISBN 0-87595-277-1 |pages = }}</ref>

and add the page number. Since I use it all the time that's what I do. I keep a copy of it on my user page and just open the edit screen to copy and paste it when I need to. (I'd link to it, but since my user page doesn't have a TOC, I guess I can't--it's a little more than halfway down the page.) Hope that helps. Katr67 16:23, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

P.S. Here is the page on footnotes. To simplify, most of the time on the Oregon articles we are trying to use the <ref></ref> tags around the citations, and then a References section with the {{reflist}} template. Other methods are OK, but that's what a bunch of us are trying to do. Katr67 16:28, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Oh, sorry, I didn't notice you'd replied. Okay, I tried it on my own, I'll revise them. By the way, where did you get the info on the Springbrook post office closing date? OGN? --Zinc2005 19:33, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

I must have got it from OGN, not sure why I didn't cite it. I'll go ahead and add the cite now. Katr67 19:39, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

With or without a TOC, you can still link to the section header...though your superscripted "ref" tag makes for an ugly URL: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Katr67#My_favorite_citation.07UNIQ5127530c4bf7191e-nowiki-00000008-QINU1.07UNIQ5127530c4bf7191e-nowiki-00000009-QINU
=) -Pete 19:47, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, I tried that and I couldn't seem to get it to jump to the right section. You're right that it's ugly. I thought about fixing it but I'd rather work on articles. :) Katr67 19:51, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

How do you cite a section of a book? (or informational map, in this case?) --Zinc2005 20:00, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Hmm. There's a way to cite the chapter of a book with multiple authors (example from Chicago Manual: Repgen, K. 1987. What is a 'Religious War'? In Politics and society in Reformation Europe, edited by E. I. Kouri and T. Scott, 311-328. London: Macmillan.), but I'm not sure about a map section. Can you give an example? Katr67 20:45, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, reference 2 on Springbrook. "Rural schools" is the section (it's included in the title right now.)--Zinc2005 22:10, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

I think it's fine the way it is now. If it were me, I'd probably do it something like this: "Historical Map of Yamhill County, Oregon [map]: Rural Schools.", or not even bother to mention the section at all--as long as it makes it easy for someone else to find the info if they wanted to, that's the most important thing. Katr67 05:04, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

George Washington (Washington pioneer)

Hi, thanks for the help on editing this one. I tried to clean it up a bit. Bearian 00:56, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

You're welcome, and Wow, great job on the cleanup. I wouldn't have noticed this at all if you hadn't put the oregon stub tag on it. Interesting how something that looks like total garbage can turn out to be a quite notable subject. Happy editing! Katr67 01:00, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Des Griffin

Hello Katr67, "This article may require cleanup to meet Wikipedia's quality standards". Ok, but you do not explain why... I would be interested to know your arguments about that. Don't you think this model is a little "agressive" for a new article that has already 2 references (which is a lot more than about 50 % of the articles on WP) ? To you, g'day, Eristik 03:14, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

I took the tags off. I'm getting tired of arguing with people. But some of the syntax is a little off in places, and just because other articles aren't up to Wikistandards doesn't mean you can compare them. Ideally, each fact in an article should be backed with a citation. That makes it easier when other editors add new info. Tags shouldn't be construed as "agressive"--we're all just here to improve articles. Happy editing. Katr67 03:24, 15 May 2007 (UTC)
Ok for syntax, on my user page you will notice that ma langue maternelle est le français. I still believe, in general, that clean up is often done by users who do not know enough about the subject of the articles they're cleaning. Just a constructive comment. Merci et je vous souhaite une très belle journée , Eristik 17:12, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

See my comments on the article's talk page. Merci. Katr67 04:52, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

treasurers

Looking for a copy editor...anyone seen a copy editor around here? Can you weigh in at Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2007_May_13#State_treasurers_of_the_United_States, about how the capitalization should be? (And otherwise, if you so desire.) I am usually good with that stuff, but can't seem to wrap my head around whether the official title "State Treasurer" means that "State treasurers of Oregon" should have a capital T...and I have no style manuals laying around! -Pete 20:33, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

My brain hurts--I've been in the data entry zone all day. I'll take a message for the copy editor. I'll see if I can get my brain to wake up and take a look at it this evening. TTYL Katr67 22:14, 15 May 2007 (UTC)
I took a look and as soon as I can consult my copy of the Chicago Manual of Style, (and heck, the MLA and AP too) I think I'm going to go with the rename. Generally what I've been taught is that when referring to positions and titles generically, they aren't capitalized. Thus, even without the rename, "Oregon state treasurers" wouldn't be capitalized, because they can't all be the Oregon State Treasurer at the same time. Which reminds me, I should see about Oregon Coast, in which we discussed a similar issue long ago... Katr67 23:24, 15 May 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for thinking it over. I think you're right…mostly, but have another thought. Supporting your notion is this: I think if someone wrote about "the governors of western states," for instance, it would be lower case; multiple people holding offices with similar names. However, if the title does not dictate the article title, I think it goes further than just capitalization: it should be "Treasurers of Oregon" or "Oregon treasurers." Everyone knows Oregon is a state, and it's plenty obvious that the treasurer of the bridge club somewhere in Oregon would not belong in this category. Hm. Still thinking. -Pete 23:33, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

You're absolutely right. So where were we? Oh yeah... My brain hurts. Katr67 05:15, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Rawr

Yeah. So I just got back from taking pictures of some of the buildings on the UO campus. I plugged my camera into the computer and realized that there was as smudge on the lens. Bah! I guess I know what I'll be doing *tomorrow* afternoon. akendall(talk) 00:10, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Ha! I beat that nasty little smudge. I had some time, so I went back to campus and snapped some shots of the buildings. Check them out on Commons here or on the first of my many articles on UO buildings at Lillis Business Complex. Yay! akendall(talk) 06:58, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Rock on! These are great. Please replace my crappy museum and library pics with some of yours! Katr67 07:54, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Lake Creek, Oregon

I have started a page on Lake Creek, Oregon, noting that I have not forgotten about the official spelling. However, I spent lots of gas money and door knocking time to find out that the locals have no clue how the name got in the system as one word. I have sent an email to GNIS for correction. The page itself is still stubby for now, but please view the comment I left at Talk:Lake Creek, Oregon. Thanks. Zab 17:40, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Legislative initiative

Hi- I started a list of people who've helped and may be interested in helping at the page about getting works of the Oregon government into the public domain. Added your name - hope you're still willing to help! -Pete 20:20, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Hello and WP:OR stuff

Hey there,

I did snag the flag from you, I thought it was kinda cool. Being from Oregon I had to keep the Jefferson and Cascadia flags on there as well. I am interested in the evaluation stuff, so I'm trying to figure out how to get it to work. It looks like there are not to many articles that are even tagged as actually part of the project; either that or the wiki server is slow in processing the info. Once I get it all figured out I'll post it on the talk page and add an assessment page as well. I haven't yet joined the project officially, I briefly looked, but it didn't jump out at me. I'll look around a little more and see if I can find it. Theophilus75 18:51, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Actually, there are several thousand tagged articles, and we are adding more all the time. See Category:WikiProject Oregon and User:AlexNewArtBot/OregonList. This is WP:OR jumping out at you: Wikipedia:WikiProject Oregon<-Join me! Join me! :) Katr67 18:57, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
It's showing more now, it just took a while for the system to populate the page...and I'll get joined up on the project after I get back from lunch (leaving right now). Theophilus75 19:34, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Fern Ridge Reservoir

Thats the plan! My parents live out there, so I have a couple of photo projects now because of Wikipedia ;) - Mazakar 17:46, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, I am done working on it now, I am at work, so i don't have a lot of time to edit or look up stuff... i was just tired of that being a dead link everywhere! :) I haven't really gone bird watching out there... I personally have never seen a pelican out there... but i will probably grab my mom and get her to walk around with me... She's usually down for watching birds! Mazakar 18:11, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks!

Looks good.

The long project at work is finally winding down... hopefully I'll be able to resume a higher level of contribution to Wikipedia in the near future. I hadn't written a new article for months it seems :(.

Anyway, TTYL.

--EngineerScotty 17:59, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Thank you for your editing

Thank you for your editing. My kids are excited to see this new content about Portland area railroading up on Wikipedia.

Information about Samtrak seems to be not easily accessible on the web. I'll look into books and newspaper articles that discuss it next. Is there a time limit for citing material that I need to be careful about?

PerlDreamer 05:25, 19 May 2007 (UTC)

Hi, glad I could help. I wikified it this morning too. There's not really a time limit. Sometimes if an article seems to be about something that isn't notable and it sits there for a long time (or a short time depending on who runs across it), an editor may decide to propose the article's deletion, which process it's too early for me to explain without coffee. :) I wouldn't worry about it too much--I've got the article on my watchlist and I can see that its a notable piece of local history, so I would contest any deletion efforts. Getting good citations up as soon as you can would be helpful though. OK, gotta go get that coffee. Happy editing! Katr67 13:19, 19 May 2007 (UTC)

Go for it

Feel free to jump in, I got through about M or N on the cities, so maybe you could hit the non-city communities (I don't know how many they are). Make sure to thourgouhly read through every last bit of info and compare to the official grading scale and don't go too fast, and don't trust your judgment! ;) Aboutmovies 18:13, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

They're all stubs, and none of them are at all important. I know, 'cos I wrote most of 'em. :P Advice heeded. Talk to ya later, Katr67 18:17, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
OK, I finished the following categories from Category:Settlements in Oregon: Cities in Oregon, Defunct Cities in Oregon, Ghost towns, Metro areas, company towns, and all neighboorhoods except Portland's. That's all for me tonight, off to my anniversery dinner. Aboutmovies 00:17, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Yay. Sorry, yesterday I had to catch up on my sleep. Happy anniversary! Katr67 14:53, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Nelscot Reef Oregon

Hey there, could you do me a favor and check this one out? I put a WP:ORE tag on it when it was created. Someone else speddy tagged it, and they're probably right since it's completely unsourced, but do you think there's anything there worth saving? Thanks. --Finngall talk 21:32, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Oh, really? What's her ID? Thanks again. --Finngall talk 22:19, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Ha!

I saw you at Henry Alley - we were both trying to link the Clark Honors College, but the database was really lagging, so that just left me confused. =P akendall 17:58, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Hey, speaking of which, do you think Robert D. Clark Honors College is still a stub? How would I know? akendall 18:01, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Oops. Hey I'm still in the middle of cleaning up the Henry Alley article, just so ya know. No the Clark Honors college article looks good. I think there's something somewhere about word count, but I haven't been able to find an exact criterion. I usually go by common sense. You might want to slap an {{expand}} on it instead if you think there is more to be added. Happy editing! Katr67 18:04, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Oops, wrong section on Thomas Condon. I picked up Sheldon's History of University of Oregon at the library yesterday, and now I'm all anxious to add info to some of the relevant articles. =) akendall 21:17, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

No worries. I started it by being sloppy about my refs. Please do add to Condon, I started a stub because I was surprised he started life as a redirect, but there's a lot more to be said about him. Cheers! Katr67 21:20, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

I like the picture too - he looks sufficiently crazy. =) akendall 21:24, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
Hey! I have another question that you might be able to answer...can I (and if so how) cite a thesis from a student at the UO that's about UO history? It was published in 1904 and is in the UO Library's Special Collections and Archives. I was going to go check it out, but I was wondering what info I needed to cite it on here. This is a link to the item's entry in the UO Library catalog. Thanks! akendall 21:22, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

He does look a little like Rasputin, doesn't he? Check out WP:CITET. There's a {{cite paper}} template for citing theses, so they must be fair game. Katr67 21:35, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

Re: Robert W. Lundeen

Good job salvaging the article. Yes, he needs to be added to the list of (Oregon State, not UO! :P) alumni. I recently went through every name on "what links here" to the OSU page and added an alumni/faculty category if appropriate, resulting in there being tons more that I need to add to the lists that I just haven't gotten around to doing yet. One question I had about this guy is if he should be in Category:Oregon State University faculty. It says he "serves on the advisory board for the OSU College of Engineering" but I'm not sure if that is faculty or not. Any idea? VegaDark (talk) 22:20, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

Script

Yes, I did miss the other. No permission needed, just copy the script per the instructions and you are good to go. Once you get it running let me know if you have any questions. The application will appear when you are on the article's page at the top, select the importance rating and WPOR if it isn't the default, then press the stub/start/B/GA/A/FA. It will then take you to the talk page in preview mode with the values entered and an auto edit summary. Aboutmovies 22:42, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

Lost Creek Bridge

I was surprised you hadn't already gone through it, but feel free to poke fun at Lost Creek Bridge. I got the article started yesterday. Zab 17:51, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I just noticed it this morning and added it to my watchlist. :) I think I'm going to whip up a list of Oregon covered bridges this weekend. I'm trying really had to get some real work done today though. :P Katr67 17:56, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Use of your cool links

You shot me a warning several months back, which I missed, as I've been moving to a new life in Christmas Valley, Oregon from Southern California. I had just clipped and not had a chance to tweak before I was offline for several months. I found your comment today, which jogged my memory of having not finished that edit, and made several adjustments on my user page, to personalize what I borrowed from you. Hopefully what remains is acceptable to you. If no, or there's anything else you prefer I not use, or lay out differently, please let me know and I will refine further. I apologize for the misunderstanding and trust that all is well with you. Duff 06:08, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

don't need tildes on edit summaries

Thanks - I didn't know that.

Paul—Preceding unsigned comment added by Paulburnett (talk • contribs) 16:14, May 29, 2007}

You're welcome. You still need to sign talk pages though. :) Katr67 17:22, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

Lists

See User talk:Sprkee, then lets move the discussion to the assessment talk page. Aboutmovies 19:03, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

Capitol

I'm finished adding text to the Oregon State Capitol, so if you could take look and do some copyediting/wikifying that would be great. Plus the opening paragraph needs to be expanded to be a better summary than what it is now. I have a sketch of the first building that I'm going to see about the copyright status of, then see about adding it to that section. Thanks. Aboutmovies 02:55, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

I worked on the intro and did some wikignoming. I'll be back to do more soon. I can think of some more info to add as well. Katr67 05:09, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
Good job changing the photo--I was dubious about the copyright tag on the other one as well. Katr67 19:40, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

RE: your comments

Heya, I have been here before I recognize your user-page, though rudely I'm afraid I can't remember under what circumstances! See you about SGGH speak! 19:20, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

I have re-written the passages other than the "services" one which a) seems to duplicate info from the above sections and b) seems to have been written free hand so is probably not a copyvio problem. I don't want to change it anyway because all this interference must be disheartening Tiptoety greatly as a new user, and I don't want to scare him off. The copyright issues have been removed so I suggest we can allow him to bump his way along without us watching over him, which as I've mentioned must be disheartening and annoying. What 'ya think? SGGH speak! 19:32, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
No worries, I might observe from afar but as I said, don't want to crowd him. Wikipedia users need a near perfect start these days to get off to becoming good editors don't you think? A DYK on my first article got me going. SGGH speak! 19:53, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Willson

Oh sure, make me look stupid. ;-) --Sprkee 23:13, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Nah, what's stupid is that we don't have an article on him yet! :P Katr67 23:15, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
Well get goin'! See, the fact that I didn't go to 4th grade in Oregon shows itself in embarrassing ways... --Sprkee 23:20, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Heck, I never heard of him either until I moved to Salem. I seem to recall 4th grade was all about the bicentennial and Lewis and Clark... Katr67 23:33, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

That was funny, I must have been writing my Hines comment just as you were fixing the article. BTW, I had a trip to the American Freedom Train in 5th grade. We're clearly too old to be wikiing.--Sprkee 20:04, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
Too weird, I just read that the engine that pulled the FT, the Southern Pacific 4449 is now in Portland. Who knew. Could be an actual train-related WPOR article, though... --Sprkee 20:08, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

(edit conflict of course) LOL That was funny. I have fond memories of the Freedom Train as well. (And yeah, I was going to mention the 4449 but I figured since you read the article you already knew that!) PS: Don't worry, old age and treachery will overcome youth and skill... Katr67 20:11, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Hines and the tale of the Rambot

So yeah, Pete, it turns out Hines is really interesting--a company-built town as you can read in the links I added. Alas, I didn't have time to add that info to the article. The naming pattern seems to be Eastern Oregon: things are named after railroad, timber and cattle company execs, and Western Oregon: pioneers. Which brings us to User:Rambot. Back in the mists of time, Rambot used the 2000 census data to produce articles on all the settlements that had a census presence, which is why the demog and geog sections are all pretty much the same. The geog section seems to be where people stick additional info for some reason. If they don't make a line break between the new info and the old, it can go unnoticed for years... Katr67 20:43, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

So very good to know, thanks for following up on that. This might be a good thing to explain at WP:ORE at some point, it makes it clear what kind of editing tasks might be needed on underloved geographic locations.
Now, if I could only find me a RAMBOT to autofill Portland neighborhood infoboxen… -Pete 02:57, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

This means?

not a stub, rm parent category......what category did u rm MCSO SAR from? -T Van Wormer 00:46, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

Do you know how to check the "diffs" on a page? For example: on the MCSOSAR page, after you've clicked on the history tab, click on "(last)" to the left of my name to see what I changed. "Not a stub" means that the article is longer than a stub, so it doesn't need a stub tag. Stub tags are a way of keeping track of articles that need to be expanded. "Rm parent category" means that I took the article out of Category:Oregon because that category is too general and it is already in a subcategory of Category:Oregon. Hope that helps! Katr67 00:52, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

Cone cow

Have you seen what has been going on at cone cow lately? Zab 06:12, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

Ohhhhhnooooo! Poor cone cow! 14:57, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

Monte Ne

Hello, I'm needing some info or support for an article about a place listed on the National Register of Historic Places that I've been working on. It's a place called Monte Ne which was a health resort of sorts run by an eccentric bimetallisms named William Coin Harvey in the early twentieth century. I've put a lot of time into the article and now I'm trying to get it featured, so if you wouldn't mind looking it over and giving me some criticism or support I would really appreciate. Also I've asked a few other users for there help and placed this exact same message on their discussion page. This was just so I wouldn't have to type it again, I'm not trying to spam your talk page. If you have any questions please feel free to leave me a message or email me. Thanks so much! --The_stuart 21:47, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

Hewlett-Packard

I have raised some concern about the controversy section of the Hewlett-Packard article, and having noted that you have shown interest in previous talk page discussions on this topic would invite you to input at [[10]]. thanks Keylay31hablame 23:39, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for thinking of me, but I was really only interested in the discussion about the WikiProject Oregon tag. Katr67 23:55, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
No problem. Have a great day. Keylay31hablame 00:04, 5 June 2007 (UTC)


Lake Creek, again

The saga continues! GNIS manager told me in an email that basically my facts were useless (and all those pictures I took) because the information is available on wikipedia!!! I guess he thinks that I downloaded the pictures from wikipedia to show to him, and we all know the unfortunate rap WP has going for it.

Instead of responding, I drafted a letter to one of our county commissioners. This one is is a bit better written and armed with much more solid information, facts, and figures. Plus, I took the time to add up the cost of changing all those signs and give him sources on that. I will present the letter in class tomorrow to get some proofing before mailing it.

What I am stuck on is the post office problem... It seems that a rumor is going around that Lake Creek is thinking about another post office out there (property is getting divided and snatched up more often lately), but I can't find anything to confirm it. Also, I can't find the year the post office closed before.

Field research is planned, but who would keep such records? The historical societies are difficult for me to accept as reference not because of potential mis-information, but because I can only seem to verify the source by driving to said town and seeing the stuff for myself. I can't help but thinking that a decent earthquake or brush fire will institute a form of linkrot for hard citations. /me laments about something more accessible... Zab 12:26, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Oh, that is too funny about the pictures being on Wikipedia. Is its reputation really that bad out there? You should set the record straight with the GNIS guy, if not for results, at least to clear your name. Do you have a human interest or history type columnist in the paper down there? Maybe you could interest someone in doing a story on it. Not as exciting as Nimrod, but you never know... Good luck! Katr67 14:11, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
Good idea with the reporter. I was toying with the idea of writing to the editorial, but I am not all that great of a writer. I'll poke through a few articles in the local paper and see who is into such things. As for WP reputation: the general consensus around here is "avoid wikipedia" because anybody can edit the articles, and therefore what you read may be false. To those types, I resort to this argument, as it basically sums up how I feel. When I say consensus, I mean from these people, which because of relative superiority concerns, I don't argue too heavily anyway.
Also, I may have spoke too soon on GNIS. I received a second email tonight that was a bit more satisfying, as it said that it was still under investigation, and it was courtesy-copied to like 3 other people. I will carefully respond tomorrow. Zab 03:30, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

That sounds promising, I'll be interested to hear what they have to say. Katr67 03:36, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Timesbold

Hey there, I understand why you nominated the article for speedy deletion, although I was working on it. Before I could add {{hangon}} it had already been deleted! Can it be undeleted or would it be wise(r) to create a new, better, more informative article? :) Cheers --> 7+1 15:06, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

  • Yeah I agree, to be honest the article was a bit rubbish and was did in about 10 minutes! I'll take your advise and create a new article from scratch, once I feel I've done enough here. I'll start cleaning up Whip (folk band) as well. Thanks for the advice! --> 7+1 22:35, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
Cool. And BTW, I love the expression, "a bit rubbish". Americans should say that more. Katr67 22:51, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Romary

After reading her obit in today's O (which is not readable on their website, grr...) I expanded the Janice Romary article and added a WPOR tag. It's a edge case since she didn't grow up here, but from the obits, she has lots of family here and seems to have been in OR a while. Anyway, since she was a famous fencer, I thought you might want to take a peek. --Sprkee 18:45, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the heads up. I get the daily Zero now too, so I'll check it out there. Darned Internets just aren't good for everything, unfortunately. Now that Twisted86 is done with school, bicycle rides and fencing tournaments, maybe I can use this article to lure him back to the wiki...Mwahaha! Katr67 18:50, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Cyclecide page

Thanks for cleaning up the Cyclecide page! That was educational for me, as that was the first page I every made from scratch. Your illustrating wiki technique with an article I am familiar with really helped. Rururudy 03:45, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

You're very welcome. Hey and FYI be sure to read about conflict of interest since you are involved with the group. There are a few more things that need to be done, and I was hoping to find some links to go with "converted school bus" and "carnival ride" and stuff like that. Also the link I made to SF Weekly needs to be fixed. Cheers, Katr67 04:07, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
I'd be happy to let the article go and have other people edit it. There were some links to it, so I thought I put up an outline -- but that would lead to a page being deleted if there was not enough content, etc.... I'm focusing on C.h.u.n.k. 666 and some other groups now. Rururudy 00:40, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

Mark Rothko

I was going to do M on the User:AlexNewArtBot/OregonList list before you nabbed it, and I happened to notice earlier for the first time that Mark Rothko had a Portland connection...it took me a long time to notice it in that dense article, so I just wondered if you missed it since you didn't add him to WPOR. We need more famous artists...and fencers, of course... --Sprkee 04:00, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

I wasn't convinced that Rothko had enough Oregon cred to be included. Do you think he does? Katr67 04:07, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
Besides, we get Ginger Rogers--she's loaded with Oregon cred. Katr67 04:17, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
Emigrated to Portland, graduated from Lincoln, first art show at the Portland Museum...I dunno, I was swayed, but perhaps because I had no idea of any connection before. C'mon, he kicks Ginger's butt backwards, in high heels! But YMMV. --Sprkee 04:29, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Ah, first art show at PAM, I didn't see that. It *is* a dense article. OK, I'm convinced. He's got more cred than yer average Trail Blazer, anyway. Katr67 04:35, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Cool. Weird, I could have sworn *I* wikilinked Portland Art Museum in that article, but the history shows you did it. Bizarre edit collision perhaps... --Sprkee 05:19, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

State of Oregon

The State of Oregon is the official and legal name of state, not just the government of Oregon. The other 49 official state names all redirect to the main article about the state. --Buaidh 04:49, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

Well, they redirect there because you made it that way... Katr67 05:52, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

Negative. They were redirected before I got here. --Buaidh 13:09, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

"The City of Beaverton is located in the State of Oregon." --Buaidh 19:18, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Sorry I assumed you were the one who made the initial redirects, but I'm not sure what point you are trying to make by posting this single sentence here? Personally I would rewrite this to say "Beaverton is a city in the U.S. state of Oregon", which is consistent with most of the U.S. city articles. Like many people, I disagree with your "State of" edits. Since you seem bent on having your way, however, go ahead and revert my redirect, but I request that you also take care of everything that is linked to State of Oregon, which generally, when referred to in an article, is referring to the Government of Oregon, and not the literal physical state of Oregon. Please direct any further inquiries about this issue to the WikiProject Oregon talk page, or better yet, the appropriate national WikiProject or other public Wikipedia policy talk page. I'd prefer not to discuss the matter on this page any further, as I find the whole matter irritating, and would rather not tempt incivility. I also think it would be better if other people had a chance to weigh in, lest it look like I am speaking for the entire state and/or WikiProject. Thanks. Katr67 20:06, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

This isn't a big deal for me, but I do a lot of historical and legislative research and I encounter this issue repeatedly. You understand the nuances, but most people do not. I won't do anything significant unless I run it past WikiProject Oregon. Thanks for your indulgence. --Buaidh 23:53, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Oregon and whatnot

Actually, I just spent a few days in Oregon on my way down the coast, so just had time to take a few pics of places I was. I just put a cute one in McCloud River Railroad, and I'm gonna throw one in Illinois River (Oregon) here in a second. I've never gone to the fair, but I definitely have friends that go. Cheers! Murderbike 17:57, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

Edit collisions

From what I've experienced multiple times when placing speedy tags, here's what happens: If two editors make the exact same edit to the same page, the first one to save the change get the "credit" for the edit, but the second one gets no notice of edit conflict or any error message. The redundant edit is not noted in the history, but the page goes into the second user's watchlist just as if s/he made a normal, successful edit. Hope this helps. Take care. --Finngall talk 18:20, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

Re: Romantic compatibility

post moved from unused talk page User talk:Katr67/About me

What the hell! - you deleted one of my pages yesterday calling it "blatant advertising". Umm - just because something has a commercial component does not make any reference to it a damn commercial. In fact - it was based on substantial psychological research and also represents a contribution to that field. I think you need to take a serious chill pill!!!—Preceding unsigned comment added by Cabbagehead310 (talk • contribs) 07:39, June 8, 2007

User:ForestH2/Userpage/Stanford Sierra Camp

{{helpme}}

I simply want to put <nowiki></nowiki> around the stub and category on the above page (to get them out of the accompanying categories), but is fully protected (for sockpuppetry?) and the user is also blocked, so I cannot request the user take care of it. If you could direct me to the proper venue for such requests I would be grateful. In taking care of a similar issue I have also noticed that User:Onceuponastar pretty much has an article posted on his/her userpage. Doesn't this need to be userfied? Katr67 17:56, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

The above user is a indef. blocked sockpuppet. Also, due to Wikipedia:Sandbox, they can use their page as a sandbox in order to correct typos/grammar, etc. Miranda 18:08, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

So are you saying that the categories on the blocked user's page cannot be removed. The categorization rules do say to get the cats out of the sandbox... Katr67 18:17, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Taken care of... :) — Scientizzle 21:45, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
Awesome, thank you! Katr67 21:46, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
FYI, I was busy dealing with a sockpuppet, and couldn't respond to you quickly. I have requested the page to be deleted on IRC, and it has been taken care of. Miranda 22:35, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Find-a-grave pics

In my exhuming of the old dead guys, I've found that the Find-a-Grave folks tend to have some pretty cool pics of some of the old Reps that I haven't been able to find anywhere else. For example: here, here, and here. Clearly these are all old enough pictures to meet the copyright expiration deadline, but they don't have any source attribution. Do you have any ideas or thoughts on whether I should use them, and if so, how to source them? Is Find-A-Grave a reputable source? --Sprkee 19:31, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

I don't think you should use them. It looks like Find-A-Grave is kind of like a wiki, but without the concern about copyright (?) so any ol' person can upload an unattibuted image. As you have seen by the recent spate of bot-driven image removal, I doubt "looks old enough" is a good enough rationale? Though I have uploaded a few images from the Oregon Historical Society of photographs of people who died before 1923, with a link to the OHS page I found them, that's still pretty iffy and I expect at some point a zealous bot will do away with those images too... This stuff gives me a headache, frankly, so I usually don't bother with images. Katr67 19:40, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
Yeah, I was erring on the side of caution as well. Oh well, the original source must exist somewhere, so maybe I'll find them eventually. There is a startup company I heard about that developing what is essentially a Google for pictures--you search for images that look like a target image you give it. Pretty cool. Too bad I can't remember the name of the co. so I can get rich off the IPO. --Sprkee 19:47, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

William D. Hare

Small request when you have time with the book. If you check the family sectionof the above you will find a Joseph C. who if I recall is the namesake for Hare's Canyon at Stub Stewart. I'm trying to expand out the Hare's as one son served for quite some time in the legislature (1915-1925ish) and I'm guessing grandson served in the 1950s. Plus there is a Hare Field in Hillsboro. Again, no rush. Thanks. Aboutmovies 00:06, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

Hey Am, I'll be away from the computer starting about an hour from now until Monday morning, but if I get a couple minutes before I leave I'll check it out. Keep an eye on the wiki for me! Katr67 00:10, 9 June 2007 (UTC)
I'll try my best. Aboutmovies 01:08, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

Briefly, yes, there were a couple RR stations named "Hare" or "Hares" and Hares Canyon (ostensibly--it doesn't come right out and say so) named for Joseph C., I imagine the airfield is too...also a p.o. in Curry Co. for a Joseph Hare, not sure if he's the same guy, and then there's a p.o. in Clatsop Co. named for James W. Katr67 01:11, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

Response to issues raised in article page/discussion page placement of sort tags and Categories

To retain the thread, I responded on my talk page regarding the issues involved in categorizing and alphabetizing the myriad entries on discussion pages. Please feel free, if you would find it of any use, to transfer the thread to your own talk page. —Roman Spinner (talk) 00:30, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

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refactor

Hey- never got a sense if you're OK with the refactoring. I'd like to reinstate my edits, if only the distant Wengi opposes them…but if that's not a good idea, please let me know! (Wouldn't it be nice to have archives we could easily scan through, as we work toward FA?) -Pete 08:33, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

deputization

Wail shucks, sheriff, you just let me know which varmints you need me to head off at the pass. Meantime, let's rustle up some vittles and git some shut-eye. --Sprkee 23:59, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Second opinion requested

I responded to a {{helpme}} request regarding what to do about a spammy-looking external link in Leadership. The requestor deleted it and was reverted. I agreed that it didn't look kosher and removed it with an explanation in the edit summary, and now it's been returned along with a lengthy justification for inclusion. Since it's a little out of my area of expertise, I'd like both your impression about the link itself, and about how far I should push the issue. Thanks. --Finngall talk 15:31, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Hey, for now I just took care of the glaring formatting issues...the link looks dubious, I'd whack 'em. WP:SPAM would certainly delete it again. I bet that article is a magnet for such things, I'm trying to find out how to link to dmoz instead... BRB Katr67 15:38, 15 June 2007 (UTC)
OK I linked to dmoz. That should be plenty of Leadership links for everyone. Any replacement of the other link is the action of a linkspammer. Katr67 15:51, 15 June 2007 (UTC)
Thanks again. I'll continue to keep an eye on it. --Finngall talk 15:55, 15 June 2007 (UTC)
P.S. I gave the anon a {{spam}} warning. I've really got to work on my essay about "Wah you deleted my link". See also the "spammity spam" section on my user page for the guidelines I use most often in response. Katr67 15:59, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Natural history of Oregon

Yes, it will stay. Anything that fits in the Natural history article content would stay in/be added to Natural history categories. Thanks Hmains 18:26, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Cap

Yes, I'm done I think I've added as much as I can. So yes, please wikiedit and I'm thinking straight to FA nom since GA isn't needed, what do you think? As to asher, I didn't know what it meant either, but I figured someone would eventually figure it out. Aboutmovies 21:07, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Since you said you started with working-in the Salem Online History source I'll let you finish. Did you figure out your other items in question? With the two new redlinks, do you think they will have articles? I'm planning on putting together the Ter Leg article this week to remove that one, but wasn't sure about those two as the FA people might complain.
As to the article about the names, feel to get more opinions. That was sort of what I was getting at since I have a low opinion of lists to begin with. But I did look it over (linked one article) and it looks good. Can't say I agree with some of the inclusions the person in charge of the project came up with, and dang that is still quite a few articles to be written. I would suggest adding the bit about the names spelling out something (I think it was the artist's intials) along with the name of the person in charge of the project. Now back to old dead guys. Aboutmovies 05:16, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
Hey, just got back from a weekend away from the computer (darn summertime fun sure eats into the editing time). Yeah those two redlinked guys merit articles, I think, I was planning to write articles on them. One was the editor of the Bend Bulletin and one was...I forget, but of decent local notability. Of course I'll probably also have to write an article on the Bulletin, *sigh*. More later after I catch up. I hope the vandals were all at the beach... Latr, Katr 14:49, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
One thing I noticed and keep forgetting to mention, should we change the subsections to First capitol, Second capitol, Third capitol since the First state capitol was the territorial capitol? Aboutmovies 19:20, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
I'm sure you noticed my new changes, let me know if the 3 stories thing works better. Also, with you addition about the columns in the creek, was that supposed to be footnote only? It just looks odd to have a footnote with a{{cn}} on it. Aboutmovies 00:29, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
I'll check it out, gotta run now. Yes, footnote only, since it's kind of a tangent from the main topic of what's on the capitol grounds, though if you can find a way to work it into the article, please do. The {{cn}} is because it's original research--I can tell they're the same columns but haven't found a source to back this up. Maybe at the historical society... You can take it out if you want, it's sort of COI on my part, but I couldn't help it. Go back behind the Safeway some time and see for yourself! :) Latr, Katr 02:38, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Apostrophe protection

Hey there, Katr67, (fellow idealist!),

I am glad that you appreciate my misplaced apostrophe-related travail! Thanks for the comment!

Best wishes,

--It's-is-not-a-genitive 22:15, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Colton, Oregon

Thank you for your editing on my additions to the Colton, Oregon page. You are teaching me more about content standards for the wikipedia project. Yes, I live in Colton so I did put what is apparently termed "original research" in the page, so it is correctly flagged. Colton does not seem to be very well documented though, so I'm in a similar quandary as the one described in your Three Rivers talk comment. -- Cheers! James opalmirror 16:39, 17 June 2007 (UTC)

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Blossoming Lotus

Aloha. I don't know if you have ever visited the Blossoming Lotus in Portland, but if you are able, do you think there is any chance you can take a few photos and upload them to the site? Thanks for your help! —Viriditas | Talk 02:29, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Thank you

For helping spruce up an article on a mostly unsung pioneer. (Florence Augusta Merriam Bailey) Shyamal 15:21, 23 June 2007 (UTC)

Is there any item on that article that specifically needs verification? If so please place a {{cn}} or {{fact}} inpreference to the request for sources. The external links and refs currently appears to me to corroborate all the facts mentioned. Shyamal 15:26, 23 June 2007 (UTC)

Keizertimes

You are right, it is all one word. I worked for the Keizertimes for three years and every week I would see someone refer to the paper as Keizer Times or KeizerTimes. Thanks for the correction! I'm thinking about how to expand the Keizertimes site from a stub but I haven't been there since 03 so I don't know how much I can help.

cat in my sandbox!

Thanks! I didn't even think about it. Murderbike 21:36, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

You're welcome. Just one of those little things I notice. (And it yields just about the best edit summary ever.) There's a rule about it somewhere... The article looks good, but I don't know anything about the Yavapai (except maybe they were mentioned in passing in a Tony Hillerman mystery?) That Captain Brown was a nasty piece of work, to say the least. As far as language pitfalls, could "mouthy" and "rejected" (as in fish) be construed negatively? Latr, Katr 21:49, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

You think Captain Brown was bad, check out George Crook, his commanding officer. ugh. as to "mouthy" and "rejected", mouth was the translation I got for that word, but i'm not one to say that books are always right, or polite. "Rejected" seems appropriate, because it was a definite conscious rejection. I read a story about members of another tribe they were trading with putting ground fish meal in with corn meal as a prank, making the victims sick. But if you can think of better wording, shoot it my way! Murderbike 23:42, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

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boo-boos

Don't worry, I knew it wasn't you. I'm still upset over the TA who marked up an incorrect usage of "it's" in a college paper. She wrote a whole long condescending diatribe about it. I swear, it wasn't that way when I typed it on my IBM Selectric! --Sprkee 16:20, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

Lighthouse

You are right! It is indeed Umpqua River lighthouse. On the back of my photo (which was taken in 1991), I had simply written "Pacific Seacoast lighthouse near Florence, OR". A closer examination (including using a magnifying glass to read a small sign cropped out of the Wikipedia image), positively identifies it as the Umpqua lighthouse. Many thanks for pointing this out. Regards, Jim JGHowes talk - 18:22, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

Idaho Stubs etc.

I've been copy and pasting Idaho History related stuff & starting working on a stub, which you edited. My questions are many: 1) I checked the IdahoProjects and didn't see you listed there, but saw you listed on the Oregon WP. How did you see it added so quickly? Were you looking at the "Recently Added" page? 2) You changed our to its, which I understand, but I added the vision of an organization. The mission isn't its, the mision is our. Should I just put that in quotes? 3) You removed a link to an email, should that go under external links instead? 4) Did this pop up on WikiSpam project? 5) If you're going to look over every last Idaho entry, as well as every last Oregon entry, wouldn't that be something you might add on your user interface?

I know mine isn't very well developed, and it's just wikipedia, but I'd like things to be accurate. I also feel that there maybe is someone in Idaho that might be better suited to concentrate on every single Idaho article.

Either way, I respect you and your mission. Thanks for templating the stub that I started.—Preceding unsigned comment added by Avecchione (talk • contribs) 19:01, June 27, 2007

Hi Avecchione
1) I noticed you added a link to Oregon Trail, which I monitor because every time a school in the Northwest does its unit on that, the article gets vandalized heavily. (See Help:Watchlist) I saw you were new, so I welcomed you. Then I checked your edit history to see what else you were working on and it looked good so I did some copyediting on the history society article to bring it up to our style standards. This might seem kind of nosy, but since Wikipedia is a community, that's standard procedure around here. Is there a concern I shouldn't be working on Idaho-related subjects?
2) Encyclopedia articles need to be written in the third person. I checked the change I made and I don't understand why it needs to be "our". "Its" refers to the state's cultural heritage not to the mission.
3) Since Wikipedia isn't here to help provide an interface for the ISHS, links to e-mail contacts aren't appropriate in any part of the article. Linking to the page that discusses the archives in the external links section may be appropriate. See WP:EL for more details.
4) No, why should it? See answer to 1, above. Things like Idaho State Historical Society don't really "pop up" on the Spam Wikiproject, at least not in an automated way, but users will bring things they think are spam to the attention of the project. People adding links will sometimes arouse the suspicion of various editors, however. I didn't think the link you added at Oregon Trail was spam, but another user did. So now there is a thread at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Spam#Idaho State Historical Society discussing some of the additions you and some other editors have made. 20:32, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
5) I'm not sure what you are asking? Are you asking how to add things to your watchlist or are you questioning my right to edit articles about Idaho? I'll clarify my answer once you give me more information. What do you mean by "every last Idaho entry"?
Since your further text seems to indicate (and I hope I'm not assuming bad faith here) that you feel I shouldn't be editing articles about Idaho, let me be clear that anybody on Wikipedia can edit any article he or she feels like. We have a policy about ownership of articles, basically meaning that once one saves a page, anybody else can edit it. I happen to focus on Oregon, because that's my "thing", but my edits range far and wide.
One more point--since you seem heavily invested in the ISHS article, I'm thinking you might be connected with the organization in some capacity? If so, you might want to take a look at our conflict of interest guidelines, which certainly don't preclude a person from editing an article about something in which s/he is involved, but do point out the potential pitfalls of such edits.
If you'd like to contact editors who are better versed in Idaho subjects, be sure to look at WikiProject Idaho. Though I'm not a member, I do tag articles for them from time to time, as a regional favor since there is often overlap between our articles.
I hope this helps answer some of your questions. I know there is a lot of policy to get familiar with here, but I hope that doesn't deter you from contributing!
P.S. I hope you're not literally copying and pasting things from the Internet, because that may be a violation of our copyright guidelines.
Latr, Katr 19:33, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

List of high schools in Oregon

I disagree. There are some high schools of course that are notable through the Wikipedia:Notability (organizations and companies) guidelines, but a couple "unique" things about a school does not meet those guidelines. I'm sending the List of high schools in Oregon to the Articles for Deletion section. If a school is truly notable, create a page for each one that comes along.—Preceding unsigned comment added by Tatonka79 (talk • contribs) 23:09, June 27, 2007

Fair enough. See you there. Latr, Katr 23:17, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

OWT

Left a note on the talk page. I still think Low and Start, though close to a B. But remain Low. What do you think? Aboutmovies 21:54, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Yep, thanks! Latr, Katr 23:13, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

QBP

Holy cow, how did Quarterback Princess go so long without a WP:ORE tag?? I'm so ashamed. My Helen Hunt fan club membership should be revoked. --Sprkee 23:48, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Jim Torrey

Since apparently a mayor of a slightly larger city is "obviously" notable, based on my aforementioned smackdown, I'd say Boss Hogg is notable enough. --Finngall talk 01:14, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. I'll make a note of that on the talk page. Latr, Katr 01:21, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

Weird

A little wiki news from beyond the wiki ESPN. Aboutmovies 04:39, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

That is VERY weird. Still, time zones can do funny things to WP entries…I've been fooled before. This will be an interesting one to watch. -Pete 05:05, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
Wow. That makes my wikistress look like a tropical vacation... Latr, Katr 05:12, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
A more local suicice person Ralph Wilcox. Aboutmovies 15:59, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

Hudson Bros. change

Katr67,

Help me a little, I'm still new here. I feel that your edit of the Hudson Bros. page...well, let's say it makes everything more difficult. If you look at the editing I did, you will see that there were huge sections of both the Mark Hudson and the Hudson Bros. article that were the same, verbatim. I eliminated that. Yet, my edit accepted the basic fact that Mark Hudson has a personal history of "more interest" which people might like to read about. Thus, I left in what I left in — or I guess you could say I wrote what I wrote. You have erased half of that.

If accepting the fact that Mark Hudson has a personal history that is more interesting is okay, why can't one leave in the open reference to "more details" and to the article itself? It would seem to follow the logic that a small mention is acceptable, but major duplication isn't "encyclopedic". And it would seem to also support the theory that you are reading here, this paragraph, specifically about Mark Hudson — because he interests you — but about whom more ("the dirt") can be found elsewhere.

If on the other hand you eliminate the "More details can be found at" sentence and link, "because there is another link above" somewhere in the general text, wouldn't it be more logical to just eliminate the entire paragraph on Mark Hudson — "because if you want to read about him, you can hit his wikilink above, that's all that's needed?"

Sorry if this sounds provocative, I am not trying to be obnoxious. But to me, to be honest, the edit you made was not really logical or productive, so I need to know from an experienced Wikiperson: Why?

Thanks in advance for your help.

Jtnet 15:26, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

WP:EL

As you can see, I've started what will be a rather long reply. My linkfighting has been to keep particular articles, such as ebooks, clean, mostly from commercial spammers. They go away if you warn them & come back a month later under another name. The only thing I can do as an admin that's relevant is block people, but I almost never do.

What I can do for the project is work with journal publishers, & I can sometimes get commercial PR people to cooperate & post the right stuff; my feeling is we want them & other commercial people to add stuff, but properly. COI is handled by editing. (I could also go further up for most of them, but I haven't done this for WP yet.) I'll be making some suggestions.
As for becoming a librarian are you thinking of UWa, or Emporia? My daughter did a BSSW at UWa & loved the place. DGG 15:45, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

NRHP Oregon Updates

I can certainly leave the latest revision date, no problem. I've noticed that about a handful of the states lists are maintained on a regular basis. Einbierbitte 16:56, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Columns

This might work for a cite. Aboutmovies 05:44, 4 July 2007 (UTC) Nevermind, already there. Aboutmovies 05:58, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

town request

Thanks for the Alfalfa article, hometown of notorious former rep Wes Cooley! There is now only one Oregon town listed as an Oregon congressman's home town that is a redlink: Winchester. Looks like it got sucked into Roseburg at some point. Witnesseth my hand as I herewith formally request that you, O keeper of the great book of McArthur, create such an article forthwith. --Sprkee 18:56, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the article! Is it really Heman ("I have the power!") and not Herman? I found some hits for Herman with the same bio information. Somebody's got a typo somewhere... --Sprkee 17:58, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
That Lewis, he anticipated everybody's future muck-ups. --Sprkee 18:26, 9 July 2007 (UTC)

User:PeterKraushaar

Given that we're not talking about a high level of abuse (so far), I wouldn't sic the dogs on him for sockpuppetry at this point, but he should be watched. As far as proving they're the same, even if the edits aren't identical, I think the duck test applies quite well. --Finngall talk 22:56, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

William G. T'Vault

Looks good, and clears up a few redlinks! I'll add some categories, and any info I come accross. Thanks. Aboutmovies 17:46, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

re: Apiary, Oregon and VanNatta Forestry

I am VanNatta Forestry. <grin> and am based in Apiary. Rvannatta 17:56, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

Hudson Bros.

Hi Katr,

I am really beginning to appreciate your comments about good writing style and taking Wikipedia seriously. That Hudson Bros. article is a weird one. The person doing most of the writing is obviously not a style freak, and it's difficult to make some of that stuff even semi-readable. I'm trying. I actually think all that recording information would be easier to digest if it were in tabular form.

As for Mark Hudson, I assume that that bit was a "personal agenda" thing by the original author. There's no other evident reason why one would report the gory details of that episode in extensive detail in both articles. Sorry about the section title link, by the way -- but you (or I, actually) learn something new every day.

Anyway, I thought I would continue to look for a solution that takes the middle ground. I decided that if Bill Hudson can stay in with a tidbit and a wikilink, I would do the same for Mark. Thus he -- like Bill -- is linked twice in the article, but that seems to be quite common. However, his name is not heading a separate section any more. The tidbit says something about him that is extraordinary and may warrant further reading. I think this is an appropriate solution to the problem.

Although I can understand the arguments for eliminating the bit about Mark entirely (which would of course also apply to Bill), I feel that that might be being "päpstlicher als der Papst" (holier than the Pope), because it reflects more "letter" than "spirit" of the rule. Small bits of information can be expressed in two articles, it's just important that they shouldn't be expressed twice in incredible depth/length. Jtnet 14:27, 17 July 2007 (UTC)

adding a local dialect pronounciation guide for the word Apiary.

Thanks for the comments. I figured out HTML on my own enoughh to write my own web site from scratch, but one thing I haven't figured out is how to put a pronuniciation guide in. ---- One of the unique things about Apiary, Oregon is that it is not pronounced like the place you keep bees.

instead it is universally locally pronounced A'-pree but I have no clue how to add this to the page.

Also there must be a way to generate one of thosd 'dot on' maps, but I'm uncertain if they are 'used' for unincorporated communities.

One of my near term goals is to round up a good group of highquality representative photos of the local communities.Rvannatta

Leatherman

Thanks for the heads-up. I think the editor didn't read the article and notice the Leatherman Tool Group in bold in the lead and the "Company Infobox" and realize both are covered in the same article. Aboutmovies 16:54, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Question...

Hey, have you ever considered an RfA? Your contribs rock (from our modest interactions and a brief skim of your history) so I bet you'd fly pretty readily. It'd allow you to do those pesky page deletions & moves as well (not to mention everything else) but continue your gnome- and ungnome-like activites. Lemme know if you're interested. (I see that you're not entirely sure...) Anyways, if you're willing ('cause you're certainly capable), drop on by. — Scientizzle 19:01, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Fair enough. It's true that if one picks up too much of the sysop load, other contributions dip. I'm trying to pull away from that myself & get back to all the science articles that have gone neglected...The RfA process is stressful (though passing is quite validating). It's kind of like getting your driver's license: it's a bit nerve-wracking, but passing it means your mom won't have to drive you around any more in that ugly minivan. :) (To make the analogy more complete...driver's ed is your contributions; the written test is your answers to the standard questions; the driving test is the answers to the questions that pop up over the course of the RfA's week; and driving by yourself means no more speedy deletion tags or WP:AIV/WP:RM/WP:RFPP requests. Yeah, that's a decent analogy.)
If you feel like going for it, I'll be happy to write up a (co-?)nomination (and offer help on your answers to the standard questions). Feel free to contact me here or via email if you want to discuss any of your concerns. And I'll be happy to participate in any future editor review. — Scientizzle 19:53, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

spelling

Check out that page's "what links here" entry...I guess I've been neglectful on pages I create thinking of any and all possible misspellings or mistypings... --Sprkee 20:53, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Opinion out.

Are you from Jackson County, and if so, how long have you lived here?

Don't make representations like that and present them as fact. That is without doubt your opinion. You are entitled to it, but don't try to make a historical fact from it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 167.80.246.204 (talk • contribs) 23:30, July 19, 2007

Vandal count

oops, my bad. I meant to just put 1. I have corrected it, thanks for pointing that out! Tiptoety 03:32, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

Boones Landing

Welcome back from your break. I hope you are feeling all shiny and new.  :-)

I uncovered mention of one time existence of Boones Landing, Oregon and linked to it in Boones Ferry and Wilsonville, Oregon. I looked for a place to put a redlink (to Boones Landing) in the proper index article, but couldn't figure out which would be appropriate: List of ghost towns in the United_States#Oregon or List of cities and unincorporated communities in Oregon. Thoughts? —EncMstr 07:16, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

I looked it up in good 'ol OGN and it's not mentioned there (meaning there was never a post office by that name, making the community "official") so I think I'd list it under ghost towns... I hope that helps! Katr67 14:10, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

Re: WikiProject Oregon/Portland

Thanks for thinking about me in regards to this project. It's true, I'm not much of a joiner -- mostly because I find it hard to carry thru with my committments on Wikipedia, despite my best intent (there's just something about Real Life that's always getting in the way...), but also because to cope with WikiStress I try to dial down my emotional investment in Wikipedia. I only mention the last since it appears you had to cope with a bout yourself. -- llywrch 16:23, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

it's not so bad

40 that is...you'll be fine. Now you're XL!

Hey, I added an article for a sportsguy who is from Eightmile, Oregon, which doesn't appear in the List of cities and unincorporated communities in Oregon, though it shows up in Google Maps and apparently is in That Book (Google Books lets me see excerpts but not enough to cite or write an article). So...hint hint?? --Sprkee 17:17, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

OSC FA

I think the FA is going to fail since nobody wants to comment on the article. I was hoping some people from all the projects it is technically from would comment, but I guess the CapCities and NRHP folks don't care. I made some changes based on the feedback, let me know how it looks. Aboutmovies 18:26, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

nested categories

If someone is in a category that is a subcategory of another, you should remove the parent category right? For example, as you've probably seen, I started removing people from Category:People from Oregon if they are already in Category:People from Medford, Oregon, but then I started seeing it in other places. Do you know if there is a policy on this I could cite? --Sprkee 17:22, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Generally, yes, though it's not writ in stone: WP:CAT#Some general guidelines. (I think in the example to which you're referring, the person probably just forgot.) On the other hand, as I state on the talk page, I like having members of Category:Cities in Oregon in both the cat and in any city subcat, and so far no one seems to mind. The only reason I can think of to do this for a person is, and I admit this is a bit of a stretch, they happened to be born in some part of Oregon that doesn't have a subcategory, then s/he lived in say, Medford, or wherever, and it seemed really important to make sure s/he was in both cats... Katr67 17:33, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
No, that's a good distinction. I never really liked the "people from" categories for that reason. It's pretty common for someone to be born in someplace quite different than they were from just due to their parents' situation, for example, Erik Sten. I'm not suggesting adding a "people born in" set of categories. Just noting it's a sticky issue. (Hey, I know: let's just add one category: "People born in a different place than you would normally associate them with"). --17:45, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
I was just thinking, if I ran into the situation above, I'd just say the person was from Oregon and leave it at that. I just thought to look up Ken Kesey as an example, and he's not even in a "from Oregon" cat, just Oregon writers and UO alumni. You could say he was from Colorado, or California, or Springfield (where he grew up), or Eugene (with which he is closely associated and where he taught and went to school), or Pleasant Hill, where he lived since the 1960s... Katr67 18:10, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Binger Hermann

C'mon, I know you saw it. I'm not sure what to do there. Looks like good info but...so much of it, and so uncited... --Sprkee 17:01, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

It's one of the two dozen windows I have open to have a look at, but right now I'm in the middle of Oregon Shakespeare Festival... patience... Katr67 17:03, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
Oh, I wasn't hinting for you to hurry up, I was just wondering what the approach should be. But I look forward to your wise solution. --Sprkee 17:15, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
Two words: Oy vey. *sigh* And what do you think of the changes ot OSF? I'm tempted to do a full revert... Katr67 17:34, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
Wow, I didn't see the extent of that. Yeah, a full replacement of an established article with no regard for the previous article seems way out of bounds to me. Looks like a PR job. This kind of thing will eventually be the death of WP. --Sprkee 17:43, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
Check this out: http://www.rootsweb.com/~mdcbalti/BaltimoreColony.htm Maybe we could pull out the genealogical info and excess detail on the Baltimore Colony, and put it on the talk page for now. It could be a separate article, but I don't know how notable it is. --Sprkee 18:05, 26 July 2007 (UTC)