Talk:Katipunan

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/summary -This is a brief summary of the article to be used in initiationg articles in other language versions. Please keep brief but feel free to add to it.--Jondel 07:23, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

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[edit] Full name

I heard from someone that it's supposed to be Kataastaasan, Kagalanggalang na Katipunan and not what is currently on the main page. Can someone confirm/deny, with an explanation? --Evisruc 11:03, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

There was always ng mga Anak ng Bayan appended to the end of that, AFAIK [1] [2]. Although the mga maybe the modern version of manga (the latter not being used widely today). --Quess 19:57, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
ng is short for nang. Kataastaasan, Kagalanggalang na Katipunan ng Anak ng Bayan is the complete official name but among the abbreviated forms are Katipunan, KKK and 'Kataastaasan, Kagalanggalang na Katipunan'. mga is short for manga. You don't pronounce ng or mga as is, but nang and manga , respectively.--Jondel 08:06, 9 June 2006 (UTC)
Take note that ng and nang presently have different functions in Filipino sentences, and according to use ng would be more appropriate. About the Kagalanggalangang Katipunan/Kagalanggalang na Katipunan, either could be used because they both have the same meaning anyway. --Chemicalist 14:14, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Non support of Rizal,

What was the main reason Rizal did not support the Katipunan? Was it because he did not approve of violence or the Philippines was not strong and prepared enough or because he was pro-Spain ? I need this for translations. --Jondel 00:16, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

The Katipunan wanted to fight the Spanish directly, which the Illustrados(middle class people) at the time(Rizal included) didn't want. They wanted reforms so that the Philippines would be on equal standing to Spain like most of the other colonies instead of being completely independent.
(opinion from here on)
The Illustrados were basically afraid to lose the wealth they garnered with the Spanish. --Chemicalist 19:15, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

Take into account that Rizal in his capacity as an educated man with history on his side had the foresight to see that the Revolution would never bear fruit against mighty Spain. All his training, education and deductions points to making the most of what the Filipinos had during the 18th century under a World Power. We may not agree with him today (I know I don't) but try to think like him at a time like that. VodkaDry 11:53, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

Spain was militarily weak after the Napoleonic Wars. That’s why they lost Mexico and South America during the time. They were not like the Reconquista forces in Castille-Aragon, the Conquistadors in Mexico and South America, or the Spanish Armada in the golden age of piracy. That’s why the US military moved in. In Spain they were having their own domestic problems as seen 30 years later. Many able-bodied male Spaniards in Spain were avoiding conscription to fight in the Philippines and Cuba. While at the same time the Katipunan kicked every Spanish Garrisons in all of the cities and town in the Philippines without American help. Most of the firearms were bought in Hong Kong by the wealthy Katipunan leaders, and many average Filipinos were heavily into firearm ownership just like the Americans, Mexicans, and South Americans. The only place remaining in the Philippines was Manila and Dewey negotiated with Aguinaldo not to attack until his US Navy fleet arrived and they will handle the attack to make it appear that the Americans “liberated” the Philippines.
I don’t know about the other the Illustrados, but I read some where in a Philippine history book from the Philippines that Rizal did not support any revolutionary groups because Philippines did have a strong military (and still doesn’t). He traveled all over Europe and lived amongst Europeans. So he knows a little about the West. As soon as the Spanish left, another Western power (with superior military capabilities) would take over like the US. The British Royal Navy also invaded the Philippines during the 7 years war. --James 00:40, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

Rizal was a reformist, who wanted equal rights for Filipinos, and for the Philippines to be recognized as a province of Spain. He understood the implications of any uprising, and even suggested to the Katipunan that they try to get the help of some Western power, like the United States. All of this, however, was advice. Rizal himself did not want to join the Katipunan. More than the wealth, one can probably think that Rizal understood that there were benefits to being a province of a Western power, having seen that the development of society in Europe did have benefits that could be good for the Philippines. If one goes by his writings, Rizal did consider violent uprising, but only as a last resort when all other things failed. Rmcsamson 02:10, 14 August 2006 (UTC)


[edit] dates

One has to read or look a long way down before even one date appears. As it now reads, the article is hard to use for some-one wanting to find out when KKK began and ended. Kdammers 01:17, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Katipunan

Pano nawala ang katipunan?Insert non-formatted text here —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.106.179.78 (talk) 12:36, 19 November 2007 (UTC)