Talk:Karl Hess

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[edit] Anarcho-capitalist or anarchist without adjectives?

Hess was clearly a slippery figure in politics, but I've just watched the AK Press DVD "Anarchism in Amercia" (a documentary from 1981) in which Hess details how he discovered anarchism. He very specifically cites Emma Goldman as the person who wrote the ideas he adheres to. Thus, is it appropriate to call him an anarcho-capitalist or is he an anarchist (possibly without objectives)? Donnacha 16:24, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

BTW, if you want some fascinating insights into Hess's politics, read "Dear America" if you can find it.George415 23:04, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

I'm not familiar with the multimedia source that you cite... but I think the evidence of Hess' anarchocapitalism is pretty strong, although like many others he probably changed his positions over time. According to this source, Hess said a lot of pretty darn A-C things, including,

  • In a laissez-faire society, there could exist no public institution with the power to forcefully protect people from themselves. From other people (criminals), yes. From one's own self, no.
  • The libertarian, laissez-faire movement...builds diversified power to be protected against government, even to dispense with government to a major degree, rather than seeking power to protect government or to perform any special social purpose.
  • Liberty [is]...simply being human to the hilt; being absolutely responsible for your own choices in life, questioning authority, being honest in all dealing with others, and never initiating force to get your way or condoning it for someone else to get their way.

This last quote in particular smacks of Rothbardian Libertarianism/Anarchocapitalism, with its reference to the non-aggression principle. Hess also edited the Libertarian Forum with Murray Rothbard for a while... DickClarkMises 18:54, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

I would also note that Hess wrote the introduction to at least one edition of The Market for Liberty by Linda and Morris Tannehill, which is, so far as I know, consistently defined as an A-C work. DickClarkMises 19:01, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
From that introduction:
...The importance of reissuing the Tannehills' book at this time, it seems to me, is in the probability that it will inspire and enlarge the horizons of young entrepreneurs who may enormously enjoy what they are doing but may not fully appreciate the larger implications of a free market world. Some will appreciate, from reading the Tannehills, that not only can them make money but that they can help make a new world as they do it. (From the 1984 Fox & Wilkes edition of The Market For Liberty) DickClarkMises 19:07, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
He was co-editor of The Libertarian Forum with Rothbard. He called himself a libertarian. I'm not sure if he called himself an anarcho-capitalist. Not all anarcho-capitalists call themselves by that term. Some call themselves "libertarians," some call themselves "market anarchists," and some call themselves "individualist anarchists."Anarcho-capitalism 01:43, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
This is from the Libertian Forum: "The next meeting was on April 11, when Karl Hess, our most recent and our best-known convert, spoke on the need to avoid letting a sectarian emphasis on economics block our alliance with the other, New Left, groups which are overall libertarian in thrust without being sophisticated in economics...An important anarcho-capitalist group has also rapidly emerged at Wesleyan College..." [1] Anarcho-capitalism 01:56, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
Ok here is he is explicitly advocating "anarcho-capitalism": "Laissez-faire capitalism, or anarchocapitalism, is simply the economic form of the libertarian ethic. Laissez-faire capitalism encompasses the notion that men should exchange goods and services, without regulation, solely on the basis of value for value. It recognizes charity and communal enterprises as voluntary versions of this same ethic. Such a system would be straight barter, except for the widely felt need for a division of labor in which men, voluntarily, accept value tokens such as cash and credit. Economically, this system is anarchy, and proudly so." The Death of Politics Anarcho-capitalism 01:59, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] extremism/liberty Goldwater line

This article currently says:

[Hess] is widely credited with writing the famous line "Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice; moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue" but he revealed it was originally Lincoln's line.

However our article on Barry Goldwater says of the line:

This paraphrase of Cicero was included at the suggestion of Harry V. Jaffa, though the speech was primarily written by Karl Hess.

In this interview Jaffa claims he wrote the lines himself, and that they were not from Cicero (though he's flattered by the confusion). I haven't been able to find any of: 1) a source attributing it to Hess; 2) a source attributing it to some specific work of Cicero; or 3) any reliable third-party source having investigated the matter at all.

--Delirium 10:16, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

The problem is that when you insert remarkable claims they require clear sourcing, preferably including both the name of the source and publication information. I've ordered a copy of MOtE so I can assist with the sourcing. DickClarkMises 18:47, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

The article should say that Hess is credited with writing the "infamous" Goldwater line about "extremism," etc., so I've made the necessary change. Many Wiki contributors have had some difficulty with this matter (and with tampering with the article despite having only a superficial knowledge of Hess and his politics). It is generally accepted that the line may have cost Goldwater the election. Whoever wants to edit this article should read up on the man first. George415 01:56, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia is the free encyclopedia that anyone can edit. You don't own this article. And no matter how well read you are, you cannot insert POV statements in the encyclopedic voice. If you want that description of the Goldwater speech in the article, find sources that you can specifically cite to back it up. DickClarkMises 04:57, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Improving references, etc.

This article needs a great many more references, but, what it really needs is a lot more content, and a better organization. The section entitled "back-to-the-lander," for just one example, mostly talks about Hess's experiences in the Adams-Morgan neighborhood in Washington, D.C., and the book Community Technology which was based on those experiences. Very little is actually said about his years as a back-to-the-lander. The first section is entitled "biography," as if the whole article were not a biography. So, yeah... better organization, more content, and more references. Tout de suite! ---RepublicanJacobiteThe'FortyFive' 22:39, 27 January 2008 (UTC)