Talk:Kaliakra

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[edit] Historical name

The Romanian name of "Caliacra" is just a historical name and IMHO doesn't have any irredentist or nationalist connotations. The argument "one would think that it used to be in Romania most of the time" sounds a bit paranoid to me. I guess an open-minded individual would read first about the history of the place before jumping to conclusions after only reading the historical name. If one applied the same pattern to other articles (e.g. New York and New Amsterdam), according to your logic, Gligan, one would think that New York used to be Dutch most of the time. Or Sofia were Greek, since the name is of Greek origin. Just my 2 cents. Mentatus 15:31, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

Nah... I personally don't have any problem with it (or any other foreign names) really, but you may like to discuss that with Gligan. When there are alternatives (although it's usually only spelling/transliteration differences most of the time), I don't mind including all which are available. It doesn't matter how long someone ruled over something. Todor→Bozhinov 18:14, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

I think that all the official historical names of a place should be included in its respective article (see for example the names of cities in Transylvania or Constanţa County). As for Gligan, I hope he'll leave the Ataka-style hate-ridden ultra-nationalist rhetoric aside (see his first edits: [1] or [2]). And he seems to listen more to you anyway, Todor. Mentatus 11:35, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

The fact is that I do not supprot Ataka : ) Since my first edits I am trying to change my attitute towards the neighbouring countries and to respect them more. Perhaps it would sound strange to you but history is my passion and the way our neighbours tricked Bulgaria in the Second Balkan War simply makes me mad every time I think about it. I know that the Romanian, serbian or Greek peoples were not quity, not to mention the fact that it was almost 100 years ago, but... sometimes I still get angry, but believe me, I am tring to change and to think more positive things for Romania or Greece. Still it is difficult- when I see a romanian or serb to write insulting things for Bulgaria, all positive attitute vanishes again; but I am trying and already respect our neighbours.

It is good to hear that, because I don't think Wikipedia is meant to be a platform for extremist and nationalistic views. History is my passion too, but this doesn't mean I disrespect or hate the peoples Romanians fought throughout history or anybody only because he was born in a certain place. Second of all, ethnicity or nationality is irrelevant to me; I think we're individuals first and foremost, and one should be treated according to his character and deeds, not according to the country he was born in, his native language or who his parents are. Third of all, I know that Second Balkan War and the First World War were ugly episodes in the history of Bulgarian-Romanian relations; IMHO, the annexation of Southern Dobruja by Romania was a big mistake, since the population there was only 2.3% Romanian (according to the 1910 census). From what I read, it was more or less Carol's idea to indirectly slap in the face Austria-Hungary, whose ally Bulgaria was (anyway, the relations were tense since the professor Ştefan Mihăileanu, advocate of the rights of the Aromanians in Macedonia, was killed in Bucharest by VMRO agents on July 22/23, 1900) On the other hand, the then Bulgarian leaders (and I name especially Ferdinand I of Bulgaria here) forgot too quickly that Romania was a safe haven and provided support and training bases for the Bulgarian revolutionaries in the 1870s and that the Romanian Army spilled its blood also for the independence of Bulgaria in the Russo-Turkish War (1877–1878). Most of wars start because of the leaders, not because the peoples wish so; and even if they wished so, what does have to do with me, you or anybody else? Do you think, Gligan, that we are responsible for the mistakes of our grandparents, grand-grand-parents or for anyone's mistakes other than our own? Sorry for the digression. I think (and I hope) the times of tribal wars (as those of the 20th century) are long gone - and, along with them, the ignorance, hatred and arrogance that caused them. Mentatus 12:28, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I realise that the men responsible for those sad days are not among us anymore, and that we are not quilty for what happenned. I agree that 21th century should not be one of confrontation and war. I have read positive thing for the Romanians, for example, after the Treaty of Berlin in 1879 when Bulgaria was spit into parts, many Romanians were not willing to accept the tiny land between Constantsa and the present day border which was ceded to them with this treaty, because they did not want to have any possible chance for conflict with the Bulgarians. I know that the Romanian people respected Bulgaria, supported its struggle for liberation and even participated in the war 1877-1878. : ) --Gligan 12:42, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

For Kaliakra I removed the Romanian name also for another reason: it is simply the same, but with the other "k". Its pronunciation is the same, then what is the point of being there? Now I will accept this because I see the same in Arad. Still one day I will remove it somewhere below as the greeks do, if you see the articles for Solun, Lerin, Kostur- The other names are written below. --Gligan 09:45, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

Answered on your talk page. Mentatus 12:28, 10 February 2007 (UTC)