Talk:Joseph Nicolosi

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Contents 1 Cleanup 2 Suggested deletion 3 Suggestion: expand on theories 4 Female homosexuality? 5 NPOV concerns 6 Cleanup 6.1 Removed unsourced sections 7 Bias and misinformation

[edit] Cleanup

Originally I stumbled across this article and thought it was a non-notable vanity entry. I was going to propose a Article for Deletion but Googling showed otherwise. He's actually infamous, try Googling his name with quack and you'll get 150 entries. So, I cleaned up some POV and added an external link. And the reverts go back and forward... Ifnord 15:16, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Suggested deletion

Delete this articleGLGerman 15:35, 25 August 2006 (UTC)GLGerman

Can you explain your reasons for why you think this article should be deleted? 70.59.196.16 02:32, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Suggestion: expand on theories

Can we add some of Nicolosi's theories about homosexuality in here, such as that he has written that fathers can "prevent" their sons from becoming gay by showering with them? Or that homosexuals don't truly exist? Proponents of Nicolosi's theories would no doubt claim the article would be biased against him then, because his theories would inherently come off as ridiculous. But then again, theyu are. If that's what he believes, then why can't we mention some of them? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.241.225.181 (talk • contribs) 19:26, September 9, 2006 (UTC).

This article can and should be expanded. Nicolosi is indeed infamous, he is a central figure in the so-called "ex-gay" religious/pseudo-scientific movement, and his work is cited by many who oppose gay civil rights and homosexuality in general, including Focus on the Family's James Dobson. Gay activist Wayne Besen might be a good source of information on this guy, since he's done a lot of research into his theories and written a book on "ex-gays". —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.241.225.181 (talk • contribs) 19:28, September 9, 2006 (UTC).

[edit] Female homosexuality?

Does Nicolosi, or any other reparative therapist for that matter, ever talk about female homosexuality? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Rglong (talk • contribs) 20:08, September 9, 2006 (UTC).

Yes, reparative therapists do address the issue of female same-sex behavior. Contact NARTH for more information.

I'm glad this article is here. However it lacks depth and intellectual honesty, as it presents Nicolosi and his work solely from the viewpoint of the critic and ignores the viewpoint of the proponent. It should be expanded to offer a more fair and balanced perspective. Perhaps one could begin by stating his theories in their proper context. Another would be to cite statistics comparing the number of individuals somehow "harmed" by reparative therapy to the number of individuals who've realized their own therapeutic goals (keeping in mind that reparative therapy, by definition, is self-directed and voluntary).

If one is secure in their position, they will not be threatened with any and all evidence in support of the opposition.WarriorLeo 05:27, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] NPOV concerns

Wow. Good job guys. Your "controversy" and "quotes" are 2x what the information about the person is. The selective quoting to make him seem like a sexual pervert is just magnificent. One would think an encyclopedia wasn't done to put all effort to make someone seem like quack. All I came here for was information on the guy's career. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 69.181.228.88 (talk • contribs) 17:47, March 11, 2007 (UTC).

[edit] Cleanup

• I placed fact tags on content that Joshuajohanson added (and attributed without sources) to Nicolosi.
• I created a Bibliography section for the books N has written
• There was a statement that N had been associated with reparative therapy "for 15 years". Per WP:MOS, I converted this to a statement that will not become dated (i.e. "Since 1992"), but this statement needs a citation.
• I reinstated the blanked Quotations section.

-- Joie de Vivre 18:06, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Removed unsourced sections

The following content (added by Joshuajohanson) is here, until it can be sourced:

This, it is argued, leads to a quest for bonding and fulfilment, oftentimes in what is perceived to be inappropriate and dysfunctional manners such as compulsive sexual gratification. It describes homosexuality as the need to possess the perceived manhood or womanhood of the object of desire:

It is worth noting that reparative therapists hold that a propensity for an emotional bisexuality would seem to exist in all men, for example, as is evidenced by the male need for camaraderie and bonding.^{[citation needed]} It is in the fulfilment of these unfulfilled needs that they believe the cure for homosexual attraction is to be found. Hence, it is not the innate emotional need for same-sex bonding that reparative therapy tries to correct, but what reparative therapists see as its dysfunctional expressions.

In general reparative therapists hold that homosexuality is caused by environmental factors, and reparative therapies focus on discovery of historical factors that could have influenced the development of their homoerotic emotions in a subject.^{[citation needed]}

I left what Joshuajohanson claimed was said by Nicolosi (adding fact tags where appropriate). I moved this more generalized (unsourced) information here. Joie de Vivre 18:06, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Bias and misinformation

This article needs to be changed so that it reflects a neutral point of view. I have made a step in that direction by removing the claim that all mainstream organizations claim that sexual orientation is unchangeable. The source given ('Just the Facts about Sexual Orientation and Youth') does not say this. It does quote the American Academy of Pediatrics saying that reparative therapy offers 'little or no potential for achieving changes in orientation', but this is not the same claim; to say that there is 'little or no potential' is not the same thing as saying that change simply cannot occur. In any case, I note that 'Just the Facts' claims that 'Sexual orientation conversion therapies assume that homosexual orientation is both pathological and freely chosen', which is false. Conversion therapies do not generally assume that homosexual orientation is freely chosen. One must ask, why is a document that contains a false claim of this nature treated as authoritative?Skoojal (talk) 05:22, 5 February 2008 (UTC)