Talk:Josei Toda
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Good Job! - KenV
this article is somewhat biased. it doesn't take seriously the charges that were levelled against toda and makiguchi by the japanese government. i'm not the one to do it, but someone should write a paragraph about the anti-government activities that these men participated in during world war ii and the specific crimes for which they were convicted. (in all likelihood JUSTIFIABLY convicted.) toda and makiguchi could be seen as "heroic" men of "peace" and "integrity." or they could be seen as boorish troublemakers who engaged in near-treasonous activies at a time when their nation was at war. (an analogy with joe wilson and valerie plane might not be inappropriate.) or a position could be taken somewhere between these two extremes. in any case, the article as it stands needs balance. toda and makiguchi were flawed human beings. they were not saints or martyrs, and the article should make this clear. one of the reasons that i left the gakkai was because i found the behavior of these two men to be questionable. they were being lauded for activities which were problematic at best. these men continue to serve as POOR role models for the members of the organization. jonathan becker former member of the soka gakkai
"near-treasonous activies at a time when their nation was at war" - Openly practicing the religion of their choice is "near-treasonous" - hmm I respectfully disagree. -- Ken V
i assume, mr ken v, that you are a member of the soka gakkai. which hardly makes you an unbiased observer. i attempted to arrange to give back my gohonzon and butsudan tonight (the butsudan had been a gift from a senior member of the organization). but no one in the sgi was anxious to relieve me of these unwanted ritual objects and arrange for my name to be taken off the gakkai's books. apparently, the soka gakkai is like the mafia. once you are in, you are in it for life. and if one does manage to break one's ties with the organization, it is only after a long and arduous struggle. jonathan becker, (almost) former member of the soka gakkai p.s.--toda and makiguchi did more than "openly practice their religion" during world war ii. they criticized their government in a way that, due to the fact that their country was at war, might be seen as "near-treasonous." they didn't merely make their comments in private. they used their positions as well-connected members of the media in order to disseminate their views to the public at large. the analogy would be to american muslims using the press in order to criticize the government's efforts with regard to the war on terror and (implicitly) supporting al quaeda. the activies of muslims such as these might be described as "near-treasonous" not because these individuals are "openly practicing their religion" but rather because they could be seen as (implicityly) giving aid and comfort to our enemies. there is something to be said for standing up for one's beliefs. but there is also a LOT to be said for compromise and flexibility. toda and makiguchi displayed a kind of stubborn, boorish petulance that makes them unacceptable as role models. they would have been more sympathetic had they been more flexible and generally more "nuanced" with respect to the stands that they took. makiguchi and toda pale when compared with culture heroes such as camus and teilhard de chardin, men who embodied compromise and moderation. (what is more, the first two presidents of the soka gakkai were intellectual lightweights when compared with the likes of john dewey. or shakyamuni himself, for that matter.) p.p.s.--there is something "problematic" about discussing "peace" or calling oneself a "pacifist" at a time when one's country is at war. one might APPEAR to be disloyal, even if in fact one isn't. during world war ii, hl mencken opposed the united states' participation in the war against germany. but he didn't mention this in any of the newspaper columns that he wrote at that time. he was smart. he kept his mouth SHUT. from what i gather, makiguchi and toda were much less DISCRETE about their views.
i was wrong. toda and makiguchi aren't intellectual lightweights when compared with john dewey. they are mental midgets in comparison to dewey.
[edit] criminal
josei toda is listed under the category of "buddhist." he should also be listed under the category "criminal." i don't know how to make this addition, but it should be made.
jonathan becker
Japan in the 1940’s - A militaristic regime that tortured many of the people who where occupied by their conquerers and deeply mistreated captured troops and brought death and destruction to millions including my own great grandfather and several of my uncles. Anyone who had the uncommon sense to resist such folly is in my mind heroic. - Just my two cents - Ken V
two aphorisms come to mind. "treason is treason no matter whom one betrays" and "discretion is the better part of valor." if you are on the side of "uncommon sense," then i am on the side of common sense. if you are on the side of "heroes," then i am on the side of ordinary people attempting to make it through the day. the actions of makiguchi and toda may appear to be "heroic" to you. but at the time i am sure that many people in japan thought of these men as churlish, boorish, or worse. by "resisting" the "folly" of their government, these two men brought shame and disgrace to their families. i am sure that the members of the extended families of toda and makiguchi lost face as a due to the actions of these two men and suffered mortification as a result. to give a more contemporary example: if i had had children who were alive during the vietnam war, i would not have wanted then to protest america's involvement in this armed conflict. and i would have taken steps to PREVENT them from engaging in such protests. being opposed to the "militaristic" actions of one's government is one thing. actually EXPRESSING that opposition is another. sincerely, jonathan becker
i am not the only person who feels this way. my therapist feels that toda and makiguchi acted in a "boorish" way as well. j.b.
Boorish!!!- during the Japanese occupation of the Philippines my great grandfather was forced my rifle-point to pick coconuts by some sadistic Japanese troops -- my uncle armed with a machete took them on in the jungle and my dad had to hide due to the fact that the Japanese army was killing teenage sons of resisting townships. If Toda acted any less then his convictions there is no way Nichiren Buddhism would have spread beyond Japan - I am extremely grateful that he was boorish - the more ticked off the Japanese establishment is to his legacy the better I feel. Ken V
