Talk:John Mayer/Archive 3

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Contents 1 Archive this page. It is very very long. 2 Mayer's "death" 3 GA on hold 3.1 GA hold response 4 GA Passed 5 Japanese translation 6 Why? 7 Archive and page move 8 Requested move 8.1 Survey 8.2 Discussion 9 References 10 John Mayer Two-Rock Signature Amp 11 JM&JS 12 John Mayer's OMJM signature Martin guitar 13 Jimi Hendrix Covers 14 How Mayer got to playing the guitar 15 Seen or heard? 16 Grammy Award-winning 17 Synaesthesia 18 Contradiction 19 Ron Paul 20 Portable John, Inc 21 Benefit concert 22 Biograhpy

Archive this page. It is very very long.

Archive this page. It is very very long. 16:15, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

Mayer's "death"

There has been a recent rash of article editing in an attempt to convey that Mayer has died. This is likely due to what is an apparent hoax group on Facebook:

http://stthomas.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2229180514 Charmston 02:08, 21 January 2007 (UTC)Charmston

GA on hold

I've read the article several times over, as well as the peer reviews. The copywriting has definitely improved since a few months ago, so it passes the first GA criterion. (I quite like the writing in the lead and Early life sections, kudos!) I see no major problems either in the second and fourth criteria (I've described the minor problems below), so my problem lies mainly in criterion 3b—there are just too many details here.

• Career. That first orphaned paragraph needs a subheader.

• Mainstream success.
  • "Bigger Than My Body," was thought by some to be Mayer's attempt to demonstrate that he was not just a one-trick pony - I'm iffy about this sentence. Some critics? Some fans? Some artichokes? It'd be nice if you can come up with a cite for this and make it sound more specific.
  • John Mayer is often referred to as "the best guitarist of our generation." - by whom? Avoid weasel words, or unsupported citations. If you can't come up with a reputable source on that sentence, it should be taken out.

• The next album. This can be taken out, the tone of the section is entirely speculative. Please see Wikipedia is not a crystal ball.

• Touring. Album titles need to be italicized, and that last paragraph needs an update to specify his current tour.

• Personal life. I think his interest in designing/graphic design should also be included. He's mentioned it several times in interviews and in his blog for the past few years now. Just a few sentences will do. Make sure the facts are cited, of course.
  • Also, has his synethesia been verified and diagnosed? I have that very issue of RS, and I'd take his comments with a grain of salt. I'm a fan of his too, and he has a warped sense of humor sometimes, that it's usually misinterpreted and brought out of context in the media. I think it's safe to just remove it, until he comes up with psychiatric verification. I'm just not totally convinced with the little evidence that there is on it.
• Selected events. This section is simply too long, and I think a lot of it can be trimmed down. It even seems longer than the first half of the article about his music. There is no need to go into intense detail here, please see WP:NOT#IINFO. There also seems to be too many dates. Some suggestions of what events can be left out: the prom, the satellite radio shows, even the Oprah, Letterman, and MacExpo appearances. (Unless you can find a source about him being an Apple user—which I know he is—and then link it to the MacExpo appearances. Just a humble suggestion there.) As for the events that remain, a lot of the descriptions can be trimmed down. IMHO, I don't think it's necessary to summarize his skit on Chappelle's Show or his CSI appearance, but it's okay to summarize Mayer's one-off VH1 TV show, as has been already done.
  • Also, I think, once you've trimmed down the Selected events section, the remaining content can be merged into the Other endeavors section. As it stands now: Other endeavors - Personal life - Selected events...the article doesn't flow well at this point. I also think you can come up with a better title than either "other endeavors" or "selected events". And once you have the merged section, I'd also suggest breaking it up with subheaders (TV, writing, or whatever).

• Discography. Since the John Mayer discography article exists, all details, like sales, chart positions, and certifications can be included in that separate discography article. For a biographical article, a simple bulleted or tabulated list will suffice. For the list of albums, you can just list the title and years of release/re-release. It might also be a good idea to segregate his studio albums from his live albums. The singles section can also follow: a bulleted list and the years of release. Some musicians' articles use Wikitables to group together a singles discography by release dates and albums, but that's optional.
  • Album titles in the Selected collaborations section aren't properly formatted either. Stick to a consistent format for all the songs, whatever you'll define it to be. You might also want to remove the soundtrack entries, they're already mentioned in the discog article, and seem out of place in a section that's supposed to be about collaborations.

• External links. There are just too many that this article is bordering on being a fan site. IMHO, all the links under the "General" and "Interviews" subheaders can be taken out, but only the link to guitar tabs can be kept. I'd keep the RS site link to the Hendrix article, but take out the Dennen one, as it links to a fan site.

• Other issues (won't have to be fulfilled just yet to be granted GA status, but just a few ideas for further improvement)
  • There are some footnotes that don't follow the correct citation format. Doesn't have to be done now, but there's one task for the future, especially if you're ultimately aiming for this to be FA.
  • Also one section that I'm surprised is not included in this article is a list of awards and nominations (e.g. Christina Aguilera). It's just a suggestion, but isn't really imperative. Some of the stuff mentioned in the "Selected events" section can be moved to a subtopic on a list of awards.

The article has some good copywriting and important, stable facts and at least one willing and hard-working editor around, which is why I don't think the GA nom should fail just yet. There's still significant improvement to be made, especially in whittling down all the detail that can be otherwise left out. Please address these issues within a week, or else the nom fails. I hope it's a reasonable amount of time. I also might be checking in every now and then to see if everything's on the right track. Anyone else with suggestions to improve this article, please comment, or better yet, pitch in and edit! Thanks! - NicolaM 06:11, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

GA hold response

• Career. - FIXED
• Mainstream success. - FIXED
• The next album. - FIXED
• Touring. - FIXED
• Personal life. - FIXED (individual issues addressed below)
  • Also, has his synethesia been verified and diagnosed? I have that very issue of RS, and I'd take his comments with a grain of salt. I'm a fan of his too, and he has a warped sense of humor sometimes, that it's usually misinterpreted and brought out of context in the media. I think it's safe to just remove it, until he comes up with psychiatric verification. I'm just not totally convinced with the little evidence that there is on it.
    • - Kept it, shortened it, reffed it, and mentioned that he has not received a formal diagnosis. I thought it should stay, as it often comes up in interviews, reviews, analyses, etc... and is said to influence his music (eg - "Bold as Love") and so is a relevant, though admittedly minor, fact in a well-rounded article about him. I tried to phrase it to reflect the somewhat dubious nature of the fact.
• Selected events. - FIXED (IMHO) - did a lot of trimming, cut the talk shows, took out Chapelle descrips. etc... Kept MacWorld, b/c he has gone literally every year for the last few years, and is literally a fixture now. But I trimmed it.
  • Also, I think, once you've trimmed down the Selected events section, the remaining content can be merged into the Other endeavors section. As it stands now: Other endeavors - Personal life - Selected events...the article doesn't flow well at this point. I also think you can come up with a better title than either "other endeavors" or "selected events". And once you have the merged section, I'd also suggest breaking it up with subheaders (TV, writing, or whatever).
    • — Definitely saw your points about flow issues. Changed name of "other endeavors" to "other projects." Didn't see how all of them could be coherently merged, though (OP are his deliberate side projects, SE are incidental occurrences of note, and "personal life" definitely didn't fit in those other two cats), but I did move "other projects" under the umbrella heading of "Career."
• Discography.— FIXED
• External links.— FIXED

• Other issues (won't have to be fulfilled just yet to be granted GA status, but just a few ideas for further improvement)— not fixed, but great suggestions that I (or, I don't know, another editor) should address soon.--Esprit15d (talk ¤ contribs) 16:12, 30 January 2007 (UTC)

GA Passed

The work done since the nomination looks great. I am able to understand the rationale with Other projects vs. Selected events. All the details remaining in the article seem significant enough to merit inclusion, and nice touch with the music samples there.

Keep up the good work. I hope contributors can maintain this article's quality. Refer to WP:WIAGA when in doubt, especially on criteria 2, 3b, and 4. - NicolaM 03:13, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

I'm euphoric. Thanks again.--Esprit15d (talk ¤ contribs) 13:45, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

Japanese translation

Japanese speakers: What do you make of John's red carpet comment? ジェシカはとてもすてきな女性で、一緒にいられて最高です。I really fail to see how "you're the last to know" comes into it. Totemo sutekina josei, very beautiful woman, pretty straightforward. I know Saikou = the best and isshoni = together, irarete = potential form of "to be", so "it's the best to be together with her" is what it's looking like to me. Any natives want to drop a word in? M.C. Brown Shoes 03:27, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Why?

Why in blue fu*k do the fan sites keep being removed from external links? they are valid links.

I've allready had three complaints from people asking why I removed them. I didn't. The jerk sitting on his magical wiki-admin horse did.

So I ask this question, and I expect an answer, I don't care who from. WHAT IS WRONG WITH HAVING LINKS TO FANSITES? at the very least have the toolbar link (the best John Mayer resource for daily updates on the web)

You can forward any replies, complaints, hatemail ect to: renee@musicianslovejohnmayer.com

- Renee May (Is one pissed off Panda)

Wiki admin horse? I removed them, once at least. I'm hardly even a very active Wikipedian, far be it an admin. Wikipedia isn't a list of fan cites. I cited the policy when I removed them. Please follow policy, and also please avoid profanity/personal attacks. Thank you. Cheeser1 21:14, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Then how come the Dave Matthews Band entry, for instance, has fansites? Max Mismetti 15:01, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

That is not a good reason. Those fansite links are also not supposed to be there. You can't justify one policy violation with another. Cheeser1 21:39, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

Archive and page move

This page probably belongs at John Mayer, seeing that the two other John Mayer articles are stubs and appear not nearly as notable. In addition, would anyone object to archiving this talk page? Thoughts? Cheers. --MZMcBride 22:06, 22 April 2007 (UTC)

Requested move

This article has been renamed from John Mayer (musician) to John Mayer as the result of a move request. --Stemonitis 08:40, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

References

A lot of information has recently been added to this article without referencing. I will be making efforts to reference this information, and invited any other editors to do so as well.--Esprit15d (talk ¤ contribs) 13:50, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

John Mayer Two-Rock Signature Amp

Need to update article to include recent John Mayer Two-Rock Signature Amplifier (see www.two-rock.com). —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Andrewjoseph70 (talk • contribs) 05:05, 5 May 2007 (UTC).

Done.--Esprit15d (talk ¤ contribs) 17:49, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

JM&JS

Celebrity gossip sites almost all reported that Mayer and Jessica Simpson have ended their relationship as of 5/18/2007. Someone may want to keep their eyes open for verification of this. Oh and since they are always off and on, someone should definitely watch his personal life section then. 70.233.138.169 02:59, 19 May 2007 (UTC)hbick

Celebrity gossip sties are not acceptable as references for Wikipedia. If a valid source comes up, it's fine, but the fact is, no valid (i.e. reliable) sources have published that they're together, especially since Mayer's been nonchalant and has not confirmed anything about their relationship. --linca^linca 13:01, 19 May 2007 (UTC)

John Mayer's OMJM signature Martin guitar

[1]

In 2006, Martin announced the OMJM, John Mayer's second signature Martin Guitar. Unlike the OM-28 John Mayer, the OMJM is not a limited edition model. I think it would be good to have this in the article, but I don't know how to edit it without disrupting the flow of that section. Daniel 226 13:37, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

Jimi Hendrix Covers

Somewhere in the article, it should be mentioned that Wait Until Tomorrow and Bold As Love are both Jimi Hendrix covers. These songs are on Try! and Continuum respectively. I'll look for a logical place for this information and post again if I update the page.

Swsnow 15:10, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

Probably the most logical place would be on the pages of the album articles. In fact, I would guess it is already mentioned there.--Esprit15d (talk ¤ contribs) 14:26, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

How Mayer got to playing the guitar

his dad was the principle of the high school and he once took a walkman from a dude that ws listening to it in class... thats when mayer took it to listen to the stuff that was playing on the walkman that was lying in the principles office and it was a stevie ray vaughan record on the tape, which he fell in love with

Seen or heard?

"The blues influence can also be seen on his album Continuum, released in September 2006."

Shouldn't this be "heard on his album...", it being a music album? 195.95.172.250 10:55, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Alright, so no-one has adressed this. I'm changing it to "heard", cause it's illogical that you can "see" a musical influence on a music album. I don't suppose anyone can see blues influence in the liner notes of Continuum?

195.95.172.250 11:42, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

I believe either is appropriate. "See" can indicate sight, or it can indicate sensory perception in general. From the Oxford English Dictionary entry for "see" : 3. a. (fig.) trans. To perceive mentally (an immaterial object, a quality, etc.); to apprehend by thought (a truth, the answer to a question)... Sounds like "see" is fine, if not more appropriate. I'm reverting the unnecessary change. --Cheeser1 14:40, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

i thought that his dad was a policeman and his mom was a teacher??? If i remembered that correctly from when he was on Oprah.... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.226.122.167 (talk) 22:42, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

Grammy Award-winning

I've removed "Grammy Award-winning". The subject of the article is John Mayer, not his Grammy Awards. The lead sentence is supposed to identify the subject of the article. Mentioning Grammys there doesn't really identify him much (since his Grammys are not a fundamental topic of the article) and it casts him in a positive light. ShadowHalo 02:47, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

Apparently someone added it again, and it has since been removed. Adjectives of praise or critism should not be in the opening statement (eg. DUI-convicted Nicole Richie, or Grammy-award winning actor Zach Braff, or accused-child-molester Michael Jackson, etc...).--Esprit15d • talk • contribs 18:28, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

Synaesthesia

The wikipedia-article on the neuropsychological condition of Synaesthesia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synaesthesia) names John Mayer as an example of a famous Synaesthete.

In the seperate article with the actual list of famous synaesthetes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_with_synesthesia), he is only named in the 'proposed but still under review' section.

Does anyone has any reference to proof John Mayer does or does not have synaesthesia? This would be an important thing to mention in the article, and is of particular interest to me since I'm currently writing an article on synaesthesia in which I wish to name John Mayer as an example of a contemporary famous synaesthete, but cannot find any reference to this on the web.

212.204.155.128 14:01, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Contradiction

Near the beginning of the article, it says John Mayer first got a guitar at age 13 when his father rented one. Then later in "Career", it states "Mayer played the guitar for half a year before enrolling in the Berklee College of Music in Boston, Massachusetts, at the age of nineteen." I don't know what the correct age is, but there's a significant difference between 13 and 18/19. Sourgum 04:19, 17 October 2007 (UTC) sourgum October 16, 2007

You're right. I checked out the sources cited for each claim, and the source for the "half a year" claim actually confirmed the "age 13" claim and said nothing about Mayer only playing for a half a year before Berklee. Not sure when that got added in. I've removed it. —bbatsell ¿? ✍ 04:26, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

Yesterday, the vandals had a field day. I'm going to go through today and route out some of the insanity.--Esprit15d 12:46, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

Ron Paul

John Mayer has not officially endorse anybody. He alway pulls gag conversations when he is in front of the papparazzi, and the night before his 30th birthday, he made a scene comparing Ron Paul to RuPaul. I feel he was drunk. Go here for the footage.--Esprit15d 13:05, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

I have reverted the readdition of this content. Regardless of whether he was drunk, acting, playing around, a YouTube video does not satisfy Wikipedia's requirement of verifiability from reliable secondary sources. Until it is reported (or possibly if he blogs about it), it has to remain out of an encyclopedic article. Secondly, the assertions that Mayer is playing a concert in support of Ron Paul do not appear to be true. No mention is made of such a show at either johnmayer.com or ronpaul2008.com. The only source cited appears to unequivocally make such a claim, but when "More event details" is clicked, one can find this wonderful tidbit:

If John Mayer is as big of a Ron Paul supporter as he claims (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrPCkMSTH9A) then we know he will be in Philadelphia to meet Dr. Paul and play for his supporters on November 10th. Whether you are a Ron or a John fan, I think we can all agree that America has lost its way. Let's bring these two influential people together for a day of fun and freedom in America's first great city, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania.

That page is, in effect, an attempt to recruit Mayer to play a free concert. As such, it must stay out of the article for the same reasons as the first. —bbatsell ¿? ✍ 06:38, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Portable John, Inc

John Mayer incorporated in the state of Georgia under the name Portable John, Inc. Here's the link to the filing with the state of Georgia. Not really sure how this fact could be worked in but it's kind of funny.

http://corp.sos.state.ga.us/corp/soskb/Corp.asp?75064 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Andrewjoseph70 (talk • contribs) 17:57, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

Benefit concert

I removed teh paragraph about the December 8 show. The article is very long, John has probably done (just to my knowledge) probably 20 benefit concerts, and the individual ones are not very notable. The notablity of any specific concert would be the only reason I would think it would merit inclusion in the article.--Esprit15d(۝ • ۞ • ▲) 13:24, 19 November 2007 (UTC)

Biograhpy

John Mayer born a female, can someone please explain.--Penelopekp (talk) 01:56, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

That's what's called vandalism. The false information was removed. --Cheeser1 (talk) 02:11, 7 December 2007 (UTC)