Talk:John Elefante
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 |
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography. For more information, visit the project page. | ||
| B | This article has been rated as B-Class on the project's quality scale. [FAQ] | ||
 |
This article is supported by WikiProject Musicians, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed biographical guide to musicians and musical groups on Wikipedia. | ||
 |
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Christianity, an attempt to build a comprehensive guide to Christianity on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, you can edit this article, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion. If you are new to editing Wikipedia visit the welcome page to become familiar with the guidelines. | ||
| B | This article has been rated as B-class on the quality scale. | ||
| Low | This article has been rated as Low-importance on the importance scale. | ||
|
Assessment comments
|
|||
 |
This article is supported by the Christian music WikiProject, an attempt to better organize information in articles related to Christian music. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion. | |
| B | This article has been rated as B-Class on the Project's quality scale. (If you rated the article please give a short summary at comments to explain the ratings and/or to identify the strengths and weaknesses.) |
|
 |
This article is supported by the Contemporary Christian Task Force. | |
Contents |
[edit] Notability?
I'm removing the notability tag. Here are just two of the Wikipedia criteria for notability, and John Elefante qualifies on both counts:
* Has had a Top 100 hit on any national music chart, in a large or medium-sized country
Vocals on "Play the Game Tonight" by Kansas, 1982 and "Fight Fire With Fire" by Kansas, 1983; both of them top 100 hits. I believe "Play the Game Tonight" was even top 10.
* Has released two or more albums on a major label or one of the more important indie labels (i.e. an independent label with a history of more than a few years and a roster of performers, many of which are notable)
Vocals on Vinyl Confessions (1982) and Drastic Measures (1983) by Kansas. Produced several albums by Petra.
He's notable enough for Wikipedia. Kaibabsquirrel 2 July 2005 04:25 (UTC)
[edit] Organize
Ouch! It hurts my eyes. Organize the article into sections, with a clear lead. -- PEPSI2786talk 08:10, 8 May 2008 (UTC)
Great idea - will do. I'm new at Wikipedia; the number and scope of guidelines is a taking some time to digest. I'm impressed with the rigor of the system. -- Bill G. Evanstalk 016:43, 8 May 2008 (UTC)
I'm glad you have added sections, but the titles are a little too long. Make them more concise. You may want to organize like this- Early Years and Musical Career and separate the Musical Career section into smaller mini-sections.And ADD IN TEXT CITATIONS so readers will know where you get your info from. Also the last section needs to be rearranged or taken out because it sounds like you are encouarging people to buy his new album; it just doesn't sound like what should be in an encyclopedia article. Other than that it looks like a good article.Ltwin (talk) 20:45, 8 May 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Veracity
Thanks for your work, especially the grammar corrections. I hear you on the section titles; I'll change that. I will certainly add citations…it's just a lot of work and I'm getting to it. Please don't delete them until I at least have a change. My information comes from these primary sources: The All Music Guide, Soundscan, John, Kerry Livgren, Bill Hammell (who runs the Elefante fan site), and myself. (I represent John and Kerry professionally.) There's a lot I don't know about citations, though, and I've been reading the guidelines. For example, can I cite other Wikipedia articles? That sounds redundant. Can I cite John and Kerry? Can I cite myself as their representative? For example, the item about being the highest grossing band that year comes from the band itself, and proprietary documents from CBS that I cannot cite. Soundscan isn't a good source for the number of copies sold because it's under (sometimes way under) the actual number. Some aspects of someone's career are impossible to disambiguate. I would like to cite the All Music Guide, but you need an account to see the information. Can that be cited? I hear you on the editorial stuff. I absolutely do not want to encourage people to buy anything from John based on the Wiki page. You can see I said nothing editorial about any of the albums he has worked on; I didn't even consider doing so. In terms of the new albums, I could not encourage people to buy them because they won't be out for a long time. (In the case of the full album, a very long time.) There's nothing even approaching release dates. The reason I talk about the later album as being aenigmatic is because I am bound by confidentiality to not discuss the genre of the album, or anything about it. What I wrote is actually an accurate description. I will make the changes that people feel is appropriate, though. When the albums approach release, I will change the language to being neutral; for one thing, I'll be able to say exactly what's on the albums. I would ask, though (not that I can) that people refrain from editing the last paragraph, because there is no public knowledge regarding those albums. I do have sources for them, though; namely John and myself (assuming I can use them). As I said, though, I will certainly follow people's recommendations regarding it. I'm not trying to control anything - just keep it accurate.-- Bill G. Evanstalk 014:03, 9 May 2008 (UTC)
Well I don't know if it's acceptable to cite another wikipage, you might want to ask someone else about that. However, I hear you say that you represent John and that some of the information is from personal knowledge. Wikipedia has a policy against posting personal research, but not knowing exactly how you got the info or what it is I myself cannot make a judgement on what is or what is acceptable. Just try to get the most important facts in the article with verafiable sources that readers can check for themselves so the article can have the best credibility. I think that's why personal research is discouraged, as it doesn't give the average reader the chance to see the source for themselves. But I wouldn't worry about people taking too much uncited material out if they know the editor is trying to cite his sources.Ltwin (talk) 20:05, 9 May 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Discography
Ltwin, I changed the discography work you did simply to make the whole section shorter, and uniform with his larger discography.-- Bill G. Evanstalk 019:13, 10 May 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Verification
There's a large banner above the article, titled "This article needs additional citations for verification." I've added citations for all the references that were flagged. Who decides if that banner should go? Bill G. Evans (talk) 18:25, 10 May 2008 (UTC)Bill G. Evans
OK, I see where that is. I'm removing because (as above) I've added citations for all the references that have been flagged. One thing I'm not sure about is how to indicate that many facts are referenced by the same source (e.g. Billboard charts). Also, please note that I'm not linking to specific documents in the Billboard charts, NARAS, etc. In some instances, there is no specific document that exists any more. If anyone would like to work on this, please do. Bill G. Evans (talk) 18:29, 10 May 2008 (UTC)Bill G. Evans
[edit] Messages
Wikipedia is telling me I have messages. I have no idea how to check them. I've you've sent them, I'm not ignoring you. One thing I noticed is that Wikipedia had an old, non-functioning email address for me. That's been fixed. Bill G. Evans (talk) 18:41, 10 May 2008 (UTC)Bill G. Evans
