Talk:John Amaechi

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[edit] Biography assessment rating comment

WikiProject Biography Assessment

Upgraded to B.

The article may be improved by following the WikiProject Biography 11 easy steps to producing at least a B article. -- Yamara 18:03, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Penn State Career

Need more info about his Penn State career, as he was one of the best basketball players in recent history at PSU. He played from 1992 to 1995 and was a two-year team captain, in 1993-94 and 1994-95, under head coach Bruce Parkhill. He finished as Penn State's No. 10 all-time scorer, with 1,310 points and 15.6 points per game, and ranks fourth in rebounds.

During his senior season, Amaechi and his teammates went 21-11 and advanced to the National Invitational Tournament's (NIT) semifinal round.

[edit] NBA Hall of Fame?

A number of websites state Amaechi is in the NBA hall of fame, and in an interview with the BBC (Hard Talk, on News 24) both he and the interviewer seem to claim the same. But hoophall.com doesn't list him: is there some other hall of fame, or different categories therein? Alai 03:36, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

I dont see how its possible since there is no "NBA Hall of Fame." Nick81aku 05:57, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
Perhaps the quotes in the above might usefully be moved around, since if I knew the Precise, Official Title of whatever "hall of fame" might be being referred to (in for example these pages [1], [2], [3], [4]), I wouldn't have had to ask the question in such an open-ended fashion. Does anyone know what's being referred to, or are these all wildly inaccurate? Alai 07:21, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
No, I didnt mean to be a Smart Alec about it (sorry) - It's actually a good question since about all of those sources refer to him being in the NBA Hall of Fame. Anyway, what the articles are referring to is the Basketball Hall of Fame. And no, he wasnt inducted into the basketball hall of fame as a exceptionally skilled player either (as those articles lead one to believe). Instead, he has a sort of "unofficial" spot (like many other people do for various one-time accomplishments) simply for being the player to score the first NBA points of the millennium. [5] (your first reference) Nick81aku 18:25, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
That's what I wasn't clear about: whether it was the BHoF (which doesn't seem to list him), some other HoF listing, or as you say, some sort of annex/honourable mention. Doesn't seem like he should be in the category or the list article, certainly, and I'm not quite sure how to word any mention of this in the text. If you or anyone else has any ideas on that... Alai 00:00, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
There is something in the Hall of Fame involving him since he was the player who scored the first points in the year 2000 which is for one reason or another considered by the Basketball Hall of Fame to be the first points of the Millennium (2001 would be the first year of the new Millennium since they didn't start counting at 0). That's what's being reffered to. It's deceptive since he is not a hall of fame player, there is just a mention of him scoring the first points of the 2000s just as someone else mentioned. I think it's kind of a shady way to draw attention to his announcement and his book since casual fans might not know the difference. I also just noticed Nick81aku answered the question as well. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by MysteriousMystery (talk • contribs) 05:14, 8 February 2007 (UTC).
MysteriousMystery is right. He was by all accounts a mediocre journeyman player who only averaged more than 10 points a game once. He's not close to being in any Hall of Fame. He was just a subpar player who is getting recognition now for coming out of the closet. Nothing wrong with him getting publicity as he is the first former NBA player to come out of the closet but if you go by the objective statistics he was average at best:[6] Quadzilla99 09:21, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Gay Rumors?

I don't know this to be true, but supposedly he's going to annouce that he's gay on Valentines day on an ESPN show. This is a huge story for sports and the first of it's kind for the NBA. I was reported on Outsports.com and Perezhilton.com. Just a thought that someone might want to add. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.232.119.132 (talk) 04:07, 7 February 2007 (UTC).

It is true but I fail to see why it is huge? There are gay people in sports such as Mauresmo in tennis.

Are you serious? An NBA star talking about his homosexuality is a very big deal indeed. A lesbian woman playing professional tennis is, happily, nothing special these days! Sah10406 21:20, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

He did announce it - http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/basketball/nba/02/07/amaechi.ap/index.html?cnn=yes

Let me say this quickly, John Amaechi was never a "Star". He was a serviceable man in the NBA for 5 years. Hardly worth calling him a star. Oh, and Mr. Unsigned, there is also a lesbian Tennis player, Navartalova, just to give you validation. FoxSportsRadio 12:42, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

--Some people consider anyone who has reached the NBA to be a "star"-- and someone who ranks as the 10th highest scorer in Penn State history, then going on to the NBA, is a high-caliber basketball player. I've heard sports enthusiasts argue about the stats of some pretty little-known players who would not be considered stars at all but are important to different people for different reasons. Amaechi's latest news and book will actually probably make him very famous. And anyone who merits a Wikipedia article is notable in the first place, correct? ;)71.65.202.41 22:45, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Do you make a habit of getting your facts wrong FoxSportsRadio? It wasn't Mr. unsigned that commented on the lesbian player, it was actually Sah10406, and you further misread his / her comment where they said it is "happily nothing special..." he / she didn't say that there is no such person! As my lecturers say... "READ READ READ!"

Anyone who knows basketball at all knows he was a medicore player at best, see his career stats:[7] It's so funny now that he has come out of the closet people who know nothing about baskeball are saying he was a real good player which makes even casual fans laugh when they look at his stats. Then they call those people a homophobe, all this for a guy who averaged more than 10 points a game once and never averaged more than 3.3 rebounds a game which is awful for a center. He was a journeyman NBA player who is significant solely because he was the first NBA player who came out of the closet. Which is definitely important but the facts are he wasn't a very good player. Quadzilla99 09:48, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] First NBA player to discuss his sexuality?

I know what they are trying to say, but other players (Wilt Chamberlain, for example) have discussed their sexuality. Maybe that sentence could be reworded. -dc

[edit] Height and weight?

His web site has him listed at 6' 9" and 280 lb., does anyone have a problem changing that?—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 74.141.130.97 (talk) 19:36, 7 February 2007 (UTC).

"Ziegler said he has read an advance copy of Amaechi's book and spoken with him on the telephone. He gave some insight to Amaechi's upbringing in England, where he was raised by his mother and felt isolated because of his size and black race."

Is this really critical information? Or is it just some sort of allusion to why someone wants to suggest he is gay. It reeks of NPOV violation, and should be edited out imo.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.67.217.125 (talk • contribs)

[edit] Good sources for more material:

Here's the ESPN article that was written about his recent coming out (pre-Hardaway comments): ESPN The Magazine: Free to be himself; also an ESPN article on his initial coming out: Amaechi becomes first NBA player to come out. ESPN's part of the group publishing his book, so it's no surprise they're a ready source of information. --Bobak 19:43, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] "Best known" for $17 million offer from Lakers

Can somebody provide a source for the recent addition that, before coming out, Amaechi was "best known" for turning down a $17 Million offer from the Lakers? Or even a source that he was offered $17 and turned it down? Thanks! — Malik Shabazz | Talk 23:11, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

The the ESPN artical "Free to be himself" as linked earlier makes such a claim as to the money. As to the claim that he is best known for it, I don't know if that was ever true but I think it will be safe to say that it will no longer be true Leftus 23:08, 27 February 2007 (UTC)
Thanks! I'll add the reference in the article. (By the way, the "best known" sentence begins "before coming out, Amaechi was best known ...") — Malik Shabazz | Talk 23:14, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Reference to Sexuality

It is definitely important to the article, but why not move it out of the first paragraph and expand on it later after the initial stub paragraph? I'd hate to see people infer that that is all there is to John Amaechi. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.152.239.216 (talk) 12:26, March 7, 2007

The first paragraph of a biography is intended to be a brief summary of the article, with an emphasis on who Amaechi is and why he is important. Amaechi's sexuality certainly isn't the most important thing about him, but his "coming out" is one of the unique things that makes him more notable than many other basketball players. The first sentence describes his career (former NBA player who works as a broadcaster). If you think there are other important facts about Amaechi that should be mentioned in the first paragraph, go ahead and add them. — Malik Shabazz | Talk 17:57, 7 March 2007 (UTC)


[edit] Reaction from Other Players

I think this section is very poorly constructed. I quote from the text:

Steven Hunter said that he would accept an openly gay teammate "as long as he [didn't] make any advances toward me. As long as he came to play basketball like a man and conducted himself like a good person, I'd be fine with it." That sentiment was echoed by Shavlik Randolph, who said that "as long as you don't bring your gayness on me I'm fine. As far as business-wise, I'm sure I could play with him. But I think it would create a little awkwardness in the locker room."

These two comments are included as being supportive statements on Amaechi's homosexuality from other players. I would argue that they are hardly such... Both these comments are laced with an inherent homophobia, in Hunter's case he only says he would be fine with it if he 'came to play basketball like a man,' this is hardly supportive of Amaechi's well documented aim(check any interview with him on youtube) to challenge the prevailing sexual and gender roles in sport. In the much clearer case of Randolph his comments are plainly homophobic ('as long as you don't bring your gayness on me') and again qualifying his tolerance by insisting that gay players would still be problematic in the locker room and insinuating that he would only play with him for business. I assert that both these quotes have no place in a paragraph headed by 'supportive reactions.'

To be honest I think the whole section regarding Amaechi's coming out and the subsequent reactions could do with a major rewrite and expansion. Whatever your feelings on homosexuality this was a major unprecedented event and it deserves it's place within the article. User:seanagreat August 17th 2007