Talk:Jeff Gordon

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Please remember to sign your comments with four tildes (~~~~) -- that way we can keep discussions on point and resolve problems. Iamvered 08:28, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Contents

[edit] Locked

I loaded this up with the {{sprotected}} tag because it is continually being vandalized/fandalized by IP numbered users. At least now they'll have to be registered to make edits. If anybody disagrees with this, remove it. --Iamvered 08:26, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Don't you have to be an admin to semi-protect pages? --Zpb52 08:27, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
Nobody told me I couldn't. And it makes sense, so I did. --Iamvered 08:29, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
You appear to be mistaken, Iamvered. Adding {{protected}} does not affect the article's editing capabilities at all, rather than adding a colored text box to the top of the page. It must actually be locked first, and only administrators have the ability to do that. DomRem | Yeah? 05:37, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Why I included the gay rumors

I want to fend this off before edit wars get started over it.

Gordon's sexuality is immaterial. I have very much tried to keep NPOV as my guide. However, the fact remains that rumors of his homosexuality are rampant to the point that he has himself addressed the question on more than one occasion. The fact that it has gotten so much attention makes it worthy of mention in the article.

I have included source material that remains neutral. Anyone wishing to change this section is asked to keep NPOV about the issue, and not just to remove it to "protect" the subject.

Iamvered 09:19, 2 February 2006 (UTC)

  • How exactly is using Slate and the Globe as a source NPOV? Those are not reputable sources for an encyclopedia. -Jcbarr 13:23, 2 February 2006 (UTC)
  • The Slate.com article does not voice an opinion one way or the other about Gordon's sexuality, it merely takes the sensationalism of the Globe to task. I agree that they are not reliable sources for the veracity of the issue of Gordon's sexuality, but they are perfectly valid as illustrative examples of how much impact the rumors have. The citation stands as being of a NPOV because there is nothing in the quote that denies or embraces the issue of his sexuality. Iamvered 21:06, 3 February 2006 (UTC)

JEFF GORDON IS NOT A HOMO HE IS STRAIGHT I WILL NOT STAND FOR THIS HE IS MY FAV DRIVER AND IS BY FAR NOT A HOMO WHO EVER WROTE THIS IS A COMPLETE IDIOT!!!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.1.20.34 (talk • contribs)

Please see WP:CIVIL. Gordon is my favorite driver too, but it's a Wikipedia article. The gay rumors are and have been there in the past, and IMHO definitely deserve a mention in the article. DomRem | Yeah? 01:16, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
* Thanks. That's all I'm saying. Iamvered 22:10, 25 March 2006 (UTC)

Am I the only one who has realized that popular people eventually become the unfortunate victims of rumors? And if Gordon is gay, well, accept it and move on! People need to learn to respect other people's feelings. But I agree, these rumors have been getting attention, and since some idiot decided to start a rumor that Jeff is gay that was told and believed by so many people that the rumor got so much attention that, well, i guess it had to be included. Well, i think i proved my point, and I need to get on with my research project on Jeff Gordon. Most sincerely, Anonymous Contributor

Thank u anonomus contributor I agree w/evrything u said x-cept in is not "if" it is NO!

I deleted the part of the gay rumors to keep the disputes down to a min.

  • Response to anonymous censor: DO NOT under any circumstances delete information you don't agree with on a discussion page. These "disputes" you're trying to keep to a minimum is the very reason these pages exist, and this is precisely the forum for them. If you disagree with something, say so. But don't obliterate all record of everyone else's point of view just because you don't agree. And sign your flippin' name. --Iamvered 08:04, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Read what I wrote earlier regarding why this section is in here. And then improve that section if you like. Just maintain a NPOV and don't try to turn Wikipedia into fan propaganda (or a smear campaign either, for that matter). Just let the facts be facts. --Iamvered 08:04, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

The simple fact that more editing has been done on this subject than any other in the article is a testament to the need to address the issue. And in as much as all you have done is address the issue, not attempt to prove or disprove,the inclusion is commendable. dennis 18:05, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

The edit war begun it has. yoda

Here's the deal, I'll cite to sources that are as trustworthy as the globe and the slate. I'm not using them to prove the truth of the matter asserted, but merely to show that these rumors exist. These sources will be relevant to Jeff Gordon's life, and please don't delete. Whatever rumors I include are prevalent in the Nascar community, like the gay rumors, and therefore are NPOV for purposes of wikipedia, much like Iamvered asserts above.

Here's the deal. The people that are upset that the gay rumors keep getting deleted are probably upset because they see it as a form of gay bashing. That's not the point! It's not gay bashing to delete reports of rumors when those reports have never been credibly substantiated. Do you understand?? If they said Jeff Gordon was rumored to be a charity lover, I'd delete those as well if they weren't true! If Jeff Gordon were gay, then fine. However, you'd never see rumors like this included in the encyclopedia britannica. For that same reason, they should not be included here. Wikipedia is not a place to spread rumors. If you have proof, then go ahead and state it, but by merely stating the rumors, you're working to verify them in the minds of people that don't understand what NPOV means. Please get rid of the rumors because they add nothing to the article.

I've said it before: since I'm not sleeping with him, I have no dogs in the sexuality race at all. This is not some kind of gay agenda thing. However, if you look at other Wikipedia articles about pop-culture figures in the public eye, pretty much anything that gets press is valid for inclusion-- Madonna's affairs, Michael Jackson's suspending a baby off a balcony, Kobe Bryant's alleged assault. And talk and rumors abound too, in plenty of other articles: Anne Murray, James Dean, Elvis Presley are three entertainers alone who have similar homosexuality rumors flying about them; the article on Hillary Rodham Clinton includes references that some people think she killed Vince Foster, and that of Adolf Hitler purports that he may have had only one testicle. I guarantee that Britannica wouldn't have included any of these things either. The point is: this article's simply mentioning that rumors of Jeff Gordon's homosexuality exist is valid, because it has received enough attention to become part and parcel of understanding precisely who Jeff Gordon is. Knowledge, particularly encyclopedic knowledge, of a subject means presenting all the gathered data, and letting readers make up their minds for themselves on how to use that knowledge. We pass no judgment one way or another. Whether Gordon is gay or not, dating supermodels or not, or was a child prodigy or not can all be debated-- the fact that such debates exist about him are enough to warrant inclusion. Iamvered 21:56, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

Well put Iamvered. As I said before, since these rumors have been lots of attention, I guess they do have to be added, whether people like it or not. Anyway, all it is is a damn rumor. Why believe in something that nobody even proved? --Anonimous Contributor

The thing is, you people who do include the gay rumors have absolutely no idea why the gay rumors exist. The gay rumors in the Nascar community is old news. If you could cite sources that are currently valid with respect to the origins of the gay rumors then I would be fine with it, but if you rely on tabloids as support for your comments then can you really say that you are adhering to the standards of wikipedia?? I doubt it. It's obvious that you include the gay rumors because you DO HAVE DOGS IN THE RACE. Lamvared, looking at your history, you do have dogs in the race. If you want to keep the gay rumors in the article then please be honest. You're obviously ignorant with respect to NASCAR, so don't try to debate facts that you obviously have a biased interest in. You want to eliminate bias? Then please stop trying to further your own agenda with your edits.

Another thing, if you must include the gay rumors, then please state that the gay rumors have since subsided. As of now the ruminitions of Jeff Gordon amongst his detractors are that he is a favorite child of NASCAR and is immune to any form of punishment. If you want to be truly honest in the article, then please acknowledge that the gay rumors are circa late 1990's, early 2000's, but no longer hold any value within the community that once debated Jeff Gordon's sexuality. You want to be accurate? Then realize that history is fluid and that your agenda may sometimes be compromised by the fickle opinions of the public. I have no agenda with respect to homosexuality. I say detractors because the rumors that were spread with respect to his sexuality were meant to degrade and insult him by people who dislike him. This is well documented. However, Jeff Gordon has handled himself with class with respect to the rumors, I hope that people can treat him with the same sort of class. This is no longer an edit war. This is a war to keep to the standards of wikipedia.

It's clear that gay people want Jeff Gordon to be gay, and people that hate Jeff Gordon want him to be gay (for different reasons). And it's true that Gordon's car colors (rainbowy) are sort of 'gay-vague.' But there's nothing to substantiate that he is gay, and unless he's caught in a gay bar kissing another man on tape, then there's really no documentation at all, and thus no need for these kind of rumors. This is completely different from Anderson Cooper who HAS been photographed in a gay bar with an alleged gay lover.68.211.77.10 08:21, 30 April 2007 (UTC)


Folks, here's what started it all:

"...When Gordon revealed a relationship with future ex-wife and Miss Winston Brooke Sealey, Earnhardt joked, "Whew, I'm glad to see you've got a girlfriend. Some of us were beginning to wonder if you liked girls," unintentionally beginning a rumor about Gordon's sexuality..."4.247.155.142 02:42, 23 August 2007 (UTC)Deej

Link: http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/sptimes/access/1262214011.html?dids=1262214011:1262214011&FMT=FT&FMTS=ABS:FT&date=Apr+29%2C+2007&author=BRANT+JAMES&pub=St.+Petersburg+Times&edition=&startpage=3.C&desc=IN+GORDON%2C+EARNHARDT+SAW+A+STAR+AND+DOLLARS

If you ask me, some attention deprived Gordon-hater decided to say that Jeff was gay all because of the rainbow colors on his car, and some gossipy person listened and told someone else, who told someone else, and so forth until it spread like some kind of disease. And the originator of the rumor is now reading this discussion page with a smirk on his face as he sees how long the section for this ill-educated assumption. And the worst thing is, we are so nosy and meddlesome that this kind of stuff happens all the time to famous people who have a hard enough time shaking off the cameras that are always in their face. And we, I hope we have something better to do than care about the lives of these people. Like, maybe, pay more attention to our own lives, for once? But no, I should just extinguish my hopes, for our society has already wrapped around this barbarism too badly. And to think, some kids think this is a reliable source for information. Sadly wondering what has and will become of the world: ---Anonimous Contributor

[edit] POV problems

1) The description of criticism of Gordon needs to accurately reflect the views of those who are crtical of him rather than what his fans say about his critics. The word "villification" itself is POV and should not be on the page.

2) The claim that is widely considered the best active driver has no place on the page. The strongest thing that can be said he is that he is among the best drivers.

3) The claim that he was a child prodegy is not supported on the page. Neither is the claim that he started racing at the age of four.

4) The result section for the 2004-2006 seasons are (or were) full of POV stuff. The old wording of the 2004 season rather than giving the facts presents an excuse for why he should have won the cup even though he didn't. The 2005 result is even worse. He didn't make the cut because he had a bad season. Trying to blame everything that went wrong in the season on the crash that finished him off is POV. The paragraph wording is even worse in that its clearly been added to several times to obscure the important facts. The important fact of the 2006 season is that he is/was in 9th as far as points. Trying to use individual race results to somehow hide or offset that he is in 9th is also POV.

Since attempts to correct the content of the page have been reverted without comment, its expected that those responsible will either explain why the current content is acceptable by Wikipedia standards or make the necessary changes themselves.

I stand by "vilification" as a perfectly acceptable (and better) term, because you can't honestly say Gordon is unpopular. He is very popular. And as many people that love him, hate him and "vilify" him, smearing him with insults, booing him, etc. That's not POV, that's fact. I'm reverting unless you can prove me wrong. I'd be okay with a better word if you can find one, but to imply that Gordon is "unpopular" is just untrue. --Iamvered 08:04, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Who is Howard

The article refers to a potential dispute between Schneider (the maiden name of Gordon) and Howard which could potentially lead to violence. Howard is not otherwise identified in the article nor is a reason given for the dispute. As someone who has very little knowledge of NASCAR, I can't fix the problem. I would be grateful if a knowledgeable person can fix the problem.

Capitalistroadster 07:21, 22 Aug 2004 (UTC)

All of the vandalism which discusses this has been deleted. RickK 07:23, Aug 22, 2004 (UTC)

[edit] E.I. Lyrics

I'm not sure that this is noteworthy, but if it is, it should be quoted correctly.

From the article:

Gordon even became a subject in Nelly's breakout song "E.I." A passage from the rapper's 2000 hit goes:

    I drive fastly, call me Jeff Gordon
    In a black S.S. with the navigation

the lyrics are I drive fastly, not quickly, as a google for E.I. lyrics shows, and the fact that a Google for "I drive quickly call" comes up "did not match any documents."

[edit] Born-Again Christian?

On what site or source is it stated that Jeff is a Born-Again Christian? Can it be stated in the article?Chaz 23:06, 8 February 2006 (UTC)

Update: Yes, it can be verfied on Jeff Gordon's Website.

It doesn't say that he is a Born-Again Christian. It just says that he "Welcomed God into his life a few years ago." Chaz 00:18, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

      • I have heard him talk about it with Darrel Waltrip, and have heard Darrel mention it other times as well. It's been a while since he's been really vocal about it, but I remember him talking about his passion for Jesus and what changed in his life when he became a Christian.

Around 2001, he talked about his faith in a commercial for some form of book. Modor 06:08, 5 June 2006 (UTC)Modor

[edit] "Popularity, lack thereof" in heading

A few weeks ago, lack thereof was removed from the heading by an anonymous IP[1]. It was readded today by Iamvered with the edit summary "remove fan bowdlerization". Now, while I do agree with him on including the gay rumors, I almost find this summary insulting because I was strongly considering removing it too. It sounds POV in the way that the article is against Gordon and is also illogical considering the paragraph before it ends with a sentence stating he finishes second in the Most Popular Driver contest every year!

If he were an unpopular driver, I would think he would be a figure along the lines of Barry Bonds and Terrell Owens, but Gordon is certainly not anywhere near that (and the only driver who is near that in NASCAR is Kurt Busch). Saying he has a lack of popularity because fans of other drivers boo him since he's won four championships is ridiculous, in my opinion. The New York Yankees are often cheered against by fans of other teams since they've won the World Series so many times, but would you call them unpopular? That's why I think this should be removed. DomRem | Yeah? 17:41, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

One only need look at the edit history of this very article on Wikipedia to see that Jeff Gordon is both a very popular driver, and a very unpopular driver. It seems that almost as many people love him as hate him. Personally, I have no opinion on him whatsoever; I don't even follow NASCAR. I'm just trying to make Wikipedia's content about him fair, unbiased and complete. The reason I referred to the "fan bowdlerization" is because the reversions I made not only changed the heading of this section, but also restituted content that was taken out about the whole "gay rumors" thing at the same time (Revision as of 14:58, April 5, 2006 by 69.160.77.209) As far as the heading goes, maybe "Popularity, vilification and personal life" would be better. Edit as you see fit, I just have a problem with calling someone whose public perception is so deeply divided unilaterally "popular." Iamvered 18:23, 29 April 2006 (UTC)
OK, I take back what I said about being offended by that summary; it was my fault for jumping the gun and not bothering to look over the entire edit. I just felt that there could be a better term than "lack thereof" as it almost sounds like Popularity (or lack thereof), rather than the fact people are wildly divided in their opinions about him. And now that you mention it, you are right in that "Popularity" alone would likely be just as bad, if not worse.
I also agree that vilification would probably be better (and less confusing). For now, I'll replace what's currently there with it. Thanks for clearing this up! DomRem | Yeah? 22:57, 29 April 2006 (UTC)
Glad it worked out! Civility rules! Thanks! Iamvered 22:59, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Suggestion

I was wondering if it would be possible if someone could get the facts that Jeff's favorite color is red, his favorite animal is the cheetah, and that his favorite street car is the Ferrari Spider in the article? I found this info in a book and I thought I might put it in this article somehow but I don't know how, nor do I know how to add stuff in an article. Also if someone knows his favorite foods I would appreciate it if someone would put that in also. Thanks.

Once again,

Anonymous Contributor

Maybe you should be looking at Tiger Beat instead of Wikipedia. That's the place for that kind of info. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a fan site. It should contain relevant, factual information. --Iamvered 08:06, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] one of the reasons he is unpopular

"In years past, the circuit was nothing but gritty, slimy, bar-fighting guys who lived in the back of a pickup, drank their breakfast and once they got on the track, just wanted to bang into each other." - Jeff Gordon's stepfather John Bickford

Contrary to whats on the page, he is unpopular because he is seen as a rich prettyboy yuppie who owes his career to his stepfather's money. His unpopularity isn't regional, its based on social status. People hate him for the same reason they hate their bosses spoiled kids and their boss. Bickford's well-known hate for white trash has rubbed off on Gordon.

What makes people mad? He makes excuses for himself (Go read the parts of the page that deal with the last three seasons). He comes across as a wuss and a coward. And NASCAR plays up the class differences in its audience as a way of promoting the sport. Nothing generates interest like an equally divided audience each with its own hero and villian. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 152.163.100.6 (talk • contribs)

Acctually he is very popular it just does not show at the track. The reason it seems this way is because Dale Jr. fans are much more rowdier and louder than Jeff Gordon fans, like me. --69.1.20.100 01:32, 10 November 2006 (UTC)

Can't the same argument be made for Dale Jr? Gop 24fan

I think these arguments reflect badly on the crowd, not on Jeff Gordon. Oh, so he's not slimy, grimy, bar-fightin' ugly. Since he's a pretty-boy with a rainbow-colored car, even if he's not 'gay' he's definitely 'metrosexual.' Makes small-minded bigots angry.

That's the truth, and everyone knows it, but no one dare say it on TV or in the newspaper.68.211.77.10 08:08, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Age Five

Be advised it notes in his book that he began racing at the age of five. This is also validated at racingone.com. The preceding unsigned message was left by User:Killakane24.

I cited the website. It is important to cite references, so please cite in the future. The trivia section needs citation too. If you would list the name, author, ISBN #, etc. for the book I would take care of doing the citing for you! Royalbroil 14:41, 18 May 2006 (UTC)
Cool, thanks for that. I'm new at this (just joined today).--Killakane24 18:57, 18 May 2006 (UTC)
Thanks for your contributions. We can always use help at WikiProject NASCAR if you're interested. Royalbroil 19:06, 18 May 2006 (UTC)
The source curently listed isn't good enough. Any claim that he raced at five is going to have to source to something that says *what* kind of racing he was doing at the age of five. If thats his book, fine. But the webpage cited is little more than a PR piece on Gordon which isn't a credible source. This page doesn't need more information on the subject, but some sort of reasonable source has to be found. 152.163.100.6 13:41, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
is his NASCAR.com bio GOOD enough for you?--Killakane24 02:57, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
I found it interesting that User:152.163.100.6 is a well-known vandal and sock puppet according to the user page. All comments should taken in that light. The sources seem good enough to me. STOP BEING DISRUPTIVE. Royalbroil 04:09, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
Ok Sir. First, before you start making accusations like that you might want to check your facts. The IP address in question is a pool address of a certain well-known service provider. That means that it gets randomly assigned and the user of that address is usually not the same person.
After that, go refresh yourself on Wikipedia policy as per personal attacks on discussion boards. In your case, that includes false accusations and name-calling. In your case, its even worse in that you are making those accusations in an attempt to prevent discussion of POV and source problems with this page.
On the main subject, nobody has presented a credible source that describes Jeff Gordon as racing at the age of five. Fansites for Jeff Gordon and the bio at the NASCAR website are not credible sources per Wikipedia. Again, if the claim about racing at the age of five is going to be made, someone is going to have to find a source that says where and what racing he did at the age of five. 152.163.100.6 07:06, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Well since i believe NASCAR.com bio is a credible source, im just going to go ahead and put it back on there. --Killakane24 04:41, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

Definitely add it. An administrator may be needed to come and resolve this problem. How anyone can dispute nascar.com as a credible source is beyond me. Royalbroil 04:55, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Chicagoland Controversy

Does the recent controversy surrounding his recent win at Chicago really belong? I know we're all fired up about that, but it probably won't be that memorable a few years down the line. --D-Day I'm all ears How can I improve? 22:16, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Might as well add his run-in with tony last year, the kenseth incident at bristol earlier this year, the rusty incident at bristol a few years back. The chicago "incident" may be newsworthy but it hardly belongs in a npov article about a race car driver. It more properly belongs in a newspaper article which I don't think Wikipedia holds itself out as. Please delete. James Brown

Why delete the bristol race if you're going to include the chicago race? You reference bristol, might as well include what happened so that readers have a npov as to the both incidents. Don't delete the bristol incident, and if you do, state your reasons why. mick jagger

[edit] Correct spelling of Jeff Gordon's full first name

...is "Jeffery," not "Jeffrey," according to the Palm Beach County (FL) property appraiser's website. Here's the record for one of his homes, as of 9/16/06: http://www.co.palm-beach.fl.us/papa/aspx/web/detail_info.aspx?p_entity=12434621080050050&geonav=Y&styp=general&owner=gordon%20jeffery&city=-1&zip=&method=owner&cidx=-1&sdiv=&sdivnam=&stno=&pdir=&st=&strnm=&sufx=&ptdir=&cty=&rng=&twp=&sct=&blk=&lot=&book=&page=&tangid=&condo=&condoname=&use=&usnam=&sloc=&prd=&pedir=&podir=&famt=&tamt=&fsqft=&tsqft=&srt1=&srt2=&srt3=&stpage=0&adlfilter=

And the official records website of Palm Beach County (FL) lists numerous other transactions--some including ex-wife (Jennifer) Brooke--again, with the same "Jeffery" spelling. Just click here and enter "Gordon Jeffery" (no commas): http://oris.co.palm-beach.fl.us/or_web1/or_sch_1.asp 4.247.143.48 06:10, 17 September 2006 (UTC)Deej

Of course, proper identification is always required when negotiating these kinds of transactions.4.247.155.142 01:53, 23 August 2007 (UTC)Deej



--69.1.20.100 00:46, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] defending jeff gordon

for those who say that jeff gordons a fag or homosexual, you need to lay off. I dont see gordon fans calling junior fans cry babies for throwing beer bottles and other stuff down on the track, you earnhardt fans need to GROW UP!!!!!!!!!!

Gordon actually has a wife, unlike Earnhardt, whos with his mama all the time —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Northwest lions (talk • contribs) 04:00, 7 January 2007 (UTC).

Look, people just hate Gordon. Its personal. Jeff Gordon reminds too many people of their bosses spoiled wuss of a son. The other reason people hate him is that his daddy hates NASCAR and most of them. To quote "Mister" Bickford: "In years past, the circuit was nothing but gritty, slimy, bar-fighting guys who lived in the back of a pickup, drank their breakfast and once they got on the track, just wanted to bang into each other." What Bickford wants is a new NASCAR where people who don't make enough money are kept behind barbed wire while he and his freinds enjoy a spa experience in pink slik robes at the track where they can watch "bad drivers" bang into poor Jeff's front bumper. People just hate Yuppy scum and there is nobody in NASCAR than comes closer to it than Gordon and his father.
Another reason people hate Gordon is because he whines and makes excuses every time something doesn't go his way. Gordon never bumps anyone. Bad redneck drivers just get in the way of his front bumper. He is also the kind of guy whose idea of picking a fight would be throwing a punch from behind and then running away. Its not an Earnhardt thing anymore or a southern thing. Its more a rich vs. not rich thing now. To many people, he represents all the changes to NASCAR that they hate. i mean its not like he is a top driver anymore. He has fallen behind Johnson even on his own team and its been years since he really contended. But people still hate him.
And even if Gordon has a wife, its his Dad that wears the pants in the family. The price of being the bosses' son is that you live your whole life under daddy's thumb. You can take it out on other people, but at the end of the day you do what your told and you know in your gut what you are. 63.3.5.129 02:31, 19 February 2007 (UTC)


Wow! bigger lies were never spoken...let's take a look at a few of the ridiculous things you said....
First of all, Jeff Gordon is not his dad, and I doubt he actually said that quote, why don't you cite your sources? Even if he did, Jeff Gordon himself has never said anything to badmouth other drivers or say that he is better as a person than them, that's ridiculous, since when did courtesy become something to hate? Personally I've always considered courtesy to be a good thing, you're the one who is the little bitch if you want a driver that's an asshole to everyone all the time. "Be my fan and hate jeff gordon or else" "yes driver whatever you say." Also, just because you say Jeff Gordon's idea of picking a fight is throwing a punch from behind and running away, doesn't make it true. Luckily, Gordon keeps his temper in check most of the time, but as I recall a certain incident with Kenseth last season, he walked right up to him and gave him a good shove and people had to pull him back so he wouldn't continue to advance. So try again smart guy. Secondly, I don't hate Jr., but I will say this. THE ONLY REASON HE IS THE MOST POPULAR DRIVER IN NASCAR IS BECAUSE OF HIS DAD. Time to face that facts Jr. fans, Jr.'s record isn't anywhere close to that of Jeff Gordon or Tony Stewarts, or even Jimmie Johnson's, he's never even won a championship, yet he's more popular than a guy that's won four championships, yeah, I'm sure his popularity has nothing to do with his dad. Anyways, moving on. How can you say he's not a top driver anymore? Not competitive? Yeah, making it into the chase and finishing 6th last season isn't a top driver? What is your idea of a top driver then? Let's compare Gordon's record from last year to Jr.'s, Gordon's W's: 2 / Jr.'s W's: 1 // Gordon's Top 5's: 14 / Jr's Top 5's: 10 // Gordon's Top 10's: 18 / Jr.'s Top 10's: 17 // Gordon's Poles: 2 / Jr.'s Poles: 0. So I guess if Gordon's not a top driver anymore, then Jr. definately isn't a top driver anymore. Do you agree with that statement? If not then you are either a hipocrite or a liar. Pick your poison. It's been YEARS since he's contended? Once again I'll point out the 6th place finish last year, and only 2 years ago he finished 3rd, a mere 16 points behind the leader. It came down to the last race of the season if I recall correctly. But yeah, he definately wasn't contending for the title then huh? Also your rich vs. not rich thing....here's a news flash for ya, just in case you missed it. ALL THE NEXTEL CUP DRIVERS ARE RICH!!! Hello, have you seen how much they make just in race earnings? They earn more in a couple races then most people do the whole year. Not to mention all the money from royalties. So it doesn't matter what athlete you support, they are rich. So no, its not a rich vs. not rich thing. If you want to be bitter because he was successful at such a young age and because he was able to bring in loads of new spectators to the sport, then that's your problem. But change and adaptation is always going to happen within organizations if they want to stay alive. Can you imagine if NASCAR had made absolutely no changes in it's policies since the day of it's inception? It wouldn't have grown to what it is today. Change is needed to survive, it's true in life and it's true in NASCAR, if you haven't figured that out yet, than your either very young or very ignorant. I'd like to see if you can defend what you are saying in an intelligent manner, but I doubt I'll hear from you again, because your type runs away from logical arguments. I understand it's hard to win a logical argument with complete nonsense, so please stop spreading your bullshit. War wizard90 15:03, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Though I have a different username ( I cant remember my password and I visit my sisters house only once every two months) Im gonna tell ya you don't want to doubt me. With what you said, I basically agree with, Gordon is a bit spoiled from his dad, and the only reason Earnhardt Jr's popular is because of his dad. Ill give you that, but for the attitude part where he goes after Kenseth, DO NOT TELL ME YOU HAVE NEVER SEEN TONY STEWART, KEVIN HARVICK, OR JIMMY SPENCER GO JUST AS INSANE. That incident at Bristol happens with just about everyone these days. Did I not see Ward Burton chuck a race helmet only a few years ago. But my point with that is, are you telling me that nobody likes Stewart, Harvick or Spencer either, ( I don't like those three just so you know) As for the whining part, yeah i do agree, Gordon does sort of bitch about any thing that doesn't goes his way. But what my main point was though I kindof specified it wrong going after only one driver, was that you don't chuck shit out on the race trak just because the driver you don't like doesn't win, thats like what a driver said in an issue of Nascar Illustrated chucking popcorn at the movie screen because you get a bad ending or to what I would like to say... well I dont anything but anyways to end this off, whoever posted the in between "Part Nonsence but some truth" is the little Bitch and not me, I dont run away like a little Umjik ( Thats the turkish word for it with incorrect spelling) I fight my batttles until im the last one standing. Besides if you dont like Gordon what the hell are you even doin here. Yeah and Im 16, Im more intellegent than you think I am.

For the people who think he whines look at Jr. He wanted 50% ownership of DEI and left because his "mommy wouldn't let him have his toy." Plus gordon may have whined earlier in his career but he's grown up and just brushes it off.--69.1.20.100 00:46, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

I haven't ever heard of any NASCAR driver that has never whined or complained about something if they didn't finish well in a race or got wrecked. Fact is, adrenaline can make anybody act contrary to how he/she would normally act. So, all you ABG (Anybody But Gordon) fans need to remember that the drivers you like are human beings as well, and are just as prone to whine or lose their temper as Jeff Gordon is. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.69.214.104 (talk) 23:31, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Main Picture

A picture of a fan with a cardboard standie of Jeff Gordon is the best you can do? Please. How 'bout a real picture.

Is it just me or shouldn't the main picture in the infobox be a picture of Jeff Gordon and not a picture of his car? This article is about Gordon, not about the number 24 DuPont Chevy Monte Carlo. War wizard90 15:05, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

I found a picture of Jeff here: http://ll.scenedaily.com/drivers/jeff_gordon.jpg Since I don't know how to, I'm leaving the URL here instead of doing it myself. There's also a picture of his car here, if anyone wants to post it: http://www.speedtv.com/_assets/library/img/large/96086_jeff.gordon.duel.jpg Anonymous Contributor


The main picture needs to be changed from the current of a cardboard cutout with a goofy looking fan.

ARossetti 13:09, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

hahahahha, that dude does look real goofy.

i really love the current picture

[edit] A few comments

All right, here goes:

  • First of all the assertion on the main page that Gordon may be the most popular driver is false. Earnhardt Jr. wins that award every year. It needs to be removed as POV.
  • This is not a forum for discussion on whether or not Gordon is liked or disliked. It is not a forum to discuss whether or not he is gay. This is not the place for that. This discussion page is here to allow users to provide ideas to make the article better. Edit warring back and forth over these subjects is pointless. If you cannot contribute to the article constructively with a neutral point of view, you should not be here.
  • The main picture needs to be changed. A cadboard cutout with a fan standing next to it is completely ludicrous. It would be better off with nothing than this picture. --Cyrus Andiron t/c 12:46, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] 2007 Information

As this is an encyclopedia I don't believe that under the current year as it is written now that there should be a synopsis every week of the weeks race. Only things that are of important events should be listed ie. milestons, wins, poles etc. What does everyone think?

I agree. I just trimmed it down but i believe it still has some sort of reference to every race. But since he has been off to a great start this year, and because of his performance in the new COT, I kind of had a hard time removing some content from the section. Caster23 21:08, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] "Modern-era" Record

To all, I think its WRONG to ascribe a 'modern-era' record of 84 wins to Darrell Waltrip. Mind you, the main difference is that pre-1972, NASCAR ran 41-56 races/season. Yet stop and do the numbers: if we divide Richard Petty's pre-1972 victories (140) by 56 and times by 33 (today's races are 36, but in the 1980's/1990's it was about 30), that's still 82 victories. Then add the 60 'modern era' victories and you get 142 victories for Petty. Not only that, since the number for the early years was often about 49 and as low as 41, a better comparison would be 140 divided by 49 and timed by 33, to get '94' victories...then add 60, and you get 154--twice as many as Gordon. The bottom line: even accounting for differences of schedule, Richard Petty's victory count is still more than 50% better than anyone else's (David Pearson's '105' would be reduced to 80-something), given the same formula. Not to mention Petty raced against Pearson (2nd best unadjusted and among the top five ever, adjusted totals), so he had stiff competition.68.211.77.10 08:15, 30 April 2007 (UTC)


The reason it is ascribed as "Modern-era" Record is because NASCAR ascribes it this way. If the sanctioning body i.e. NASCAR uses this terminology and accounts data this way then we should follow suit.Jhighfield 00:38, 5 May 2007 (UTC)

What also needs to be considered is that a lot of pre-1972 races were very short(200 miles), making it easier to win from the pole, as well as making the better races more dominant. In other words, it was similar to formula 1. In modern NASCAR it's much more competitive. User:WallyRankin 2:23, 10 June 2007

[edit] Please enjoy your fan-cruft

I'm done trying to be encyclopedic in this article. For all you Gordon fans out there who don't care about recognizing basic facts about the driver's life, you win. This is now one of the most slanted, fan-crufty articles in all of Wikipedia. Congratulations. Evidently one of the rules of Wikipedia needs to be that you can't recognize that controversy exists about a person. The gay rumors are clearly such a part of Jeff Gordon's persona that they have sparked this much discussion about them in our little forum. And yet the fan-base of Mr. Gordon, and the homo-haters out there don't see that it's fit to include THAT THE RUMORS EXIST TO THE POINT THAT HE HAS ADDRESSED THEM HIMSELF IN HIS OWN AUTOBIOGRAPHY to be relevant to the man's life. I will no longer try to press this point. But know that you have indeed done a disservice to anyone trying to get a true, complete, accurate and ENCYCLOPEDIC account of this very important figure's life. For the record, I don't give a damn whether he's gay or not. I have never once made any attempt to say "Jeff Gordon is gay" or "Jeff Gordon is not gay." All I have said is that there is enough debate about whether Jeff Gordon might be gay that he has himself addressed them, they have been on numerous talk shows and, if you look at the ongoing vandalism of this page from those who don't seem to appreciate Mr. Gordon, you will find that it is his sexuality that seems to most often be the target of their scorn. But never mind. It's not important.

69.247.134.2 08:17, 1 May 2007 (UTC) (Iamvered)

I just wanted to point out that the Jeff Foxworthy joke about Jeff Gordon enunciating is over 10 years old. The way the article shows now it makes it look like Jeff Foxworthy just came up with that joke in 2007, when in fact it was on one of his cds that also covered the 1996 Atlanta Olympic games.

I don't believe David Pearson, Richard Petty or Dale Sr. would have the wins they have now if they had to race thru all the competition Jeff Gordon has had too. When he first started there was Dale Sr., Darrell Waltrip, Bobby and Terry Labonte, Dale Jarrett, Mark Martin and a few more. Now he has competition such as Tony Stewart, Jr., Johnson, Kenseth, Harvick, Burton, Kahne, Newman, Kurt Busch and the newcomers Kyle Busch and Hamlin. Richard Petty only really had Cal Yarborough and David Pearson. Plus they drove so many more races. Sr. had some pretty good company but Jeff has already passed him. I think it is always going to be hard to compare the drivers but Gordon better make everyone's top 4.

ah I was going to say it's atleast as old as the first Blue Collar Comedy Tour, were he said the exact same thing.


[edit] Semi-protected until 29 June; hopefully this will quell some schoolkid vandalism

I have semi-protected the main article until 29 June 2007, for the following reasons:

  • this article gets vandalized more than any other article I watch closely — several times a day when unprotected
  • that vandalism comes almost entirely from unregistered users on IPs issued to school districts in the rural Midwestern and Southern US
  • thanks to summer holidays, those school IPs will be mostly quiet when the protection expires

Our policy on biographies of living persons also comes into play here.

This semi-protection is mostly experimental, but please discuss any change in protection with me first. Thanks! - jredmond 19:28, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Meeting his current wife

In the section about how he met his current wife, Ingrid Vandebosch, it states they met on the set of Taxi. In fact, they did not. According to an article at Nascar.com, Gordon is quoted as saying, "We didn't meet on the set of the movie Taxi as I read somewhere".

http://www.nascar.com/2006/news/headlines/cup/07/13/jgordon.engagement/index.html

ALso, if you click on the footnote link for that fact, it even states there that they knew each other before Taxi.


Kbnha goddess 07:29, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] 76.178.68.210

Jeff Gordon has 81 career wins it states on www.nascar.com that Johnson failed inspection at Vegas and that Gordon won the race. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.178.68.210 (talk) 23:41, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

  • No it doesnt. And until you can go back in time and change that fact, STOP vandalizing pages. Caster23 talk contribs 23:57, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The meeting of Brooke Sealey

He could have not met her in victory lane of a Busch Series race, because he hasn't won one. Plus, she was a Miss Winston, so I assume it was after a Winston Cup win, his Co-cola 600 win maybe? Either way, something isn't right. —Preceding unsigned comment added by TextileWolf (talk • contribs) 19:34, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

  • Gordon has won 5 Busch Series races. He completed all the races in the 1992 Busch Series Season (the year they met), winning three of those: it could be that he met her after one of those wins. Also, Gordon only competed in one race of the 1992 Winston Cup season. Caster23 talk contribs 20:33, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Heterosexuality

I'm not a vandal unlike these types of edits but the gay rumors definitely need to be mentioned just as they are Ryan Seacrest if only to dispel them, considering he's stated several times he's not gay. Cheechie Chung 00:40, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

  • There are whole sections about this topic above. "considering he's stated several times he's not gay." Source? Caster23 talk contribs 00:46, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
  • Well, citing a non-online source will probably not be supported, but it is stated here that "In his memoir, "Jeff Gordon: Racing Back to the Front", the driver actually addresses the rumor, which he denies. Part of the rumor was fueled by a comment by Dale Earnhardt, Sr. intended as a joke. At the time Gordon had been dating Miss Winston, Brooke Sealy, but because Sealey worked for Winston the couple was required to keep the relationship a secret." etc. Cheechie Chung 00:53, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
  • That link you gave is one of many sites that actually use content from Wikipedia. So what you read on there was actually once on this page, but was removed for some reason. I know the part about how the rumor came about is mentioned on the talk page, but there is nothing about it in the main article. Maybe re-instating what was once on the main article page (the quote you mentioned right above) might be a good idea. But I'm not sure. This has always been a touchy subject. Caster23 talk contribs 01:04, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
  • Sorry, I'm not very good with this stuff so I didn't know. I was looking for a "verifiable" source that cited the source in question. But yeah, I'm not a Gordon basher, I just know how prevalent Wikipedia is (it's second only to Jeffgordon.com on google...) and decided to come here when I heard someone talking about the latest win and how he was surprised that there was a gay NASCAR driver and a good one at that. Sources like this should address crap that gets so widespread and isn't true although to the editors credit it doesn't go "LOL FLAMING HOMO" either. Cheechie Chung 01:26, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Milestone Data

Jeff Gordon's page shouldn't be used just for milestones. It should be used for bad performances as well. If you don't add his bad times it makes it look like he has never made a mistake in NASCAR which everyone should know isn't true. Right now the page makes him look like the greatest driver ever which obviously he is a close 2nd behind Richard Petty.(Planecrash111 (talk) 21:47, 7 June 2008 (UTC))

[edit] Vote

I have a vote up here to keep the current info in the 2008 section up. Vote yes for yes and no if you don't want the info and make sure you sign with the four tildes so i can tally the votes.(Planecrash111 (talk) 06:39, 8 June 2008 (UTC))

No For reason that have already been stated on here. If we give a race by race recap of every race the page will be to long and unreadable. Mile stone data such as polls wins bad crashes, making the chase etc. are what need to be written about, all the other data can be found in simple tables which keeps the page much cleaner and easier to read. --Vertigo315 (talk) 13:42, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

You are the one that suggested the vote.(Planecrash111 (talk) 14:34, 8 June 2008 (UTC))

No per Vertigo. This is an encyclopedia article, not a fanpage. --D-Day (talk) 15:31, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

Agreed being that Vertigo315 is a Jeff Gordon fan.(Planecrash111 (talk) 20:20, 8 June 2008 (UTC))

That's quite enough of the sniping. Please keep the focus on the edits and not the editor. Bad things happen to folk who cannot play nicely. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 03:55, 13 June 2008 (UTC)