Talk:Jar Jar Binks

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Contents

[edit] you're kidding

"Mar Mar Lade"? Marmalade? How unbelievable is that? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 138.163.0.44 (talk) 21:30, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Jar Jar Binks Cookie Jar Jars

I found one of these on ebay...made me laugh like crazy. I think it should be added to the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.147.195.126 (talk) 02:04, 22 April 2008 (UTC)


[edit] I ADMIRE THE PERSISTANCE ON THE PART OF THOSE TRYING TO PUT INCORRECT, UNSUBSTANTIATED, AND ALTOGETHER BIASED INFORMAITON INTO THIS ARTICLE

I have yet again (second time) deleted the incorrect and POV entry from this article describing the performance of Andy Secombe as Watto as resembling a Yiddish "mode of speaking," as I have already stated. This time the editor included some clearly self-deduced and personal opinion of what he or she labeled "Jewish stereotypes" including, "big nose,etc." and "bad teeth?" I've never heard that one myself, but that's enough justification that it's point of view. He/She also referenced Watto's onscreen fondness of money should suggest he was being a parody of a Jewish merchant. It's an interesting theory, but I have found no evidence of a large body of people ever suggesting this, and it remains unsubstantiated. Furthermore, as I have already said, I have found several accounts of Watto having what some people call an "Italian accent." Because of this lack of uniformity on the issue, it should not remain as it was written.

FINALLY - IF YOU MAKE A CHANGE IN THE ARTICLE, DON'T BE SNEAKY - POST YOUR REASON AND YOUR CHANGE ON THE TALK PAGE!!!

I would like to request that you refrain from posting your titles in ALL CAPS, as it comes across very easily as screaming. 207.216.10.130 07:06, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
This tiresome argument has been rendered moot, because the entire section about Watto has been deleted, because this article is about Jar Jar Binks, not every silly little criticism of Episode I. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.239.133.107 (talk) 07:10, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] A SMART-ALECK CHILD DELETES MY EDIT AND TELLS ME TO "USE THE SANDBOX" - KID IF YOU CAN'T READ THE THE VERY CLEAR EXPLANATION I WROTE BELOW, I SUGGEST YOU "USE THE SANDBOX."

I have once again deleted the imcorrect and POV entry from this article as is DETAILED in my DESCRIPTION below. If it is continued to be removed, this page should then be flagged as POV and as containing factually incorrect information. DANIEL - I suggest you read my explanation before deleting things. That's what Scientists do you know - they make observations of natural phenomena before drawing any conclusions. My Apologies if you made a mistake and deleted my edit by accident.

  • Don't type the title in all caps - nobody will take you seriously.
  • CAPS LOCK IS CRUISE-CONTROL TO COOLSVILLE! Jc1033 05:30, 17 March 2007 (UTC)
POINT RENDERED MOOT BY RECENT EDITS. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.239.133.107 (talk) 07:12, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Factual Inaccuracy and/or Opinion REMOVED

In the Article Watto's voice is described as having a "Yiddish accent." Of course this is in and of itself an opinionative statement, as the characterization of accents usually is. Furthermore I have also heard many online claims, as well as first hand accounts which I happen to believe in, that Andy Secombe's (who is a British Actor) protrayal of Watto's voice is highly reminiscent of an Italian accent. In either Case I don't think this is particularly important as I have never seen any evidence of a large group of people protest the possible racial connotations of the voice anyway. It has been removed because it is Point of View and remains Unsubstantiated.

It seems an anonymous user, possibly an angry nerd, has re-inserted that bit about the character Watto being somehow racist, but it has since been removed, not for the reason of being annoying, which it most certainly is, but simply because this article is not about Watto, it's about Jar Jar Binks, and as such, all pseudo-academic accusations of racism must be directly related to Jar Jar Binks.

[edit] Rank

He was called "Representative Binks" but is that the same as a Senator? I mean they didn't fully explain the inner workings of the Senate in full detail, or how a planet with two races inhabiting it would be represented, etc. I assumed he was a full senator... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.199.133.165 (talk • contribs)

  • He was representing Senator Padme Amidala temporarily while she was in hiding. It's unlikely he was given full privileges as a regular Senator, and he would be expected to give up those powers on her return. If there was one.

[edit] Controversy

This sections still needs major rewriting. It if full of extrapolations about fan and viewer motivation 'accident perception' ecetera which are not provable or evidentially based.

Besides, isn't there a guideline against using phrases such as "It is commonly argued..." and "It has been argued...", which this section uses a lot in its extrapolations? Edward Tremel 17:08, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
How about breaking up the Controversy section in two, one for Controversy, and one for Responses to Controversy, or something like that?--65.25.247.53 06:01, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
How about letting it go? Episode I was released more than eight years ago. These highly opinionated accusations of racism aren’t particularly relevant at this point are they? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.239.133.107 (talk) 07:26, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Changes to "Controversy"

Folks, I changed the opening paragraph of the section to remove such weasely POV statements as "Jar Jar seems to be the result of a total miscomprehension of Georges Lucas of the cultural imperatives of our time", and "One can say that he may endanger the credibility of Lucas and of the series". I know my edit is far from perfect, so have at it :-)--RicardoC 23:27, 28 September 2005 (UTC)

"As hardcore fans often seek to identify with movie characters (e.g. cosplay at fan conventions and premiers), many ostensibly object to any portrayal of cuteness in the Star Wars hexalogy. This can be percieved as odd given acceptance of 'cute' elements in the films made between 1977 and 1983." There wasn't a lot of 'cuteness' in Star Wars or The Empire Strikes Back. Fans generally reviled the Ewoks as being excessively cute. Also, this statement is highly POV. It judges the motives of Star Wars fans in objecting to excessive cuteness in Star Wars, claiming that the stated reason to object to excessive cuteness is not their real reason. Furthermore, who has heard of Star Wars fans objecting to any cuteness, as this quite claims? --RLent 22:46, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

Hey, I didn't add that, it was already there. I took out the most blatant POV-pushing and restructured the resulting paragraph, that's all.--RicardoC 17:08, 22 December 2005 (UTC)

Added Citation - XyKyWyKy 16:39, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Parody?

Am I the only one who has had the thought cross their mind that Jar Jar Binks is a depreciative parody of Africans?

No. http://www.cnn.com/SHOWBIZ/Movies/9906/09/jar.jar/ Dze27
No. It's awful. The entire new trilogy is pretty racist, draws too much in racial stereotypes. But this is not different from most shitty American commercial enterntainment, specially TV series.dalegrett 15:53, 19 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Yes. The notion you suggest is rooted in the fact that Jar-Jar was voice performed by an actor who also happens to be African American. I don't see anyone making the suggestion about the character of Boss Nass. If Jar-Jar had been voiced by, say, George Takei, people would be sugesting that he was a depreciative parody of Asians. Let's get real people! -- Jason Palpatine 00:13, 20 Jun 2005 (UTC)
If George Takei had voiced Jar Jar with bad pidgin English, then it would be legitimate to ask if it was a parody of Asians.--66.162.55.2 16:20, 12 January 2006 (UTC)
Yes. -- KFan II
It's just a movie. Any racism you detect is in your own head, not Jar-Jar's vapid ramblings. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.60.99.253 (talk) 06:30, 10 May 2007 (UTC).

"(removed sentence on the "unfortunateness" that the technical achievement of Jar Jar was lost)"

Why? It IS unfortunate that a major special effects breakthrough was ignored because of the row about JJB's character. -- Lee M
That may be so, but this is not writing with a NPOV. Opinion should not enter into a Wikipedia piece. - Ta bu shi da yu 12:31, 1 Jul 2004 (UTC)


"In the light of all the fuss surrounding the character, it has almost been forgotten that he was the first CGI character ever to interact realistically with live actors."

This cannot possibly be true.

Surely not true, and not even well done. dalegrett 15:53, 19 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Indeed. The first all-CG character to interact with live actors in a lead role in a feature-length film was Casper in Casper (movie), a 1995 film.

I think it meant a realistic character. Jar Jar acts cartoonish, but he's still completely photorealistic, and Casper looks like a blown up cartoon character. Of course, even with this definition there's Jabba the Hutt in the special editon, and Casper was still beat by Dino the dinosaur in the The Flintstones (movie).
I don't find it realistic. Too cartoonish. Even Shrek or any Pixar production is more realistic. dalegrett 15:53, 19 Jun 2005 (UTC)

The character of "Bit" in the movie Tron was all CGI and interacted with live actors. This was in 1982, thirteen years before Casper.

Rdmeier (talk) 19:11, 18 January 2008 (UTC)

What, no death scene? Oh, man.
JesseG 23:51, May 21, 2005 (UTC)

RACISM ISSUE: Is our automatically-presumed notion that Racism is bad (as opposed to good), itself considered a violation of NPOV, in Wikipedia? Or...in other words, in a main article should we have "... accused of racism..." as opposed to "... commended for its racism..." (which we rarely see), or rather a neutral "asserted to exhibit racism", etc.? Until about 80 years ago, on Earth, most people including the well-educated were racist, generally opposed to miscegenation, interbreeding, etc., as an obvious matter of course. Even American freedom-lovers like Thomas Jefferson and Abraham Lincoln. Only for a short time in history has general racism been considered widely as incorrect and bad (which I myself consider it, but that's irrelevant to the NPOV issue). I haven't seen racism treated "neutrally" in the Jar-Jar controversy or in many places in Wikipedia. Read the main article and pretend that your view is "racism is actually correct" and ask yourself if the "Jar-Jar controversy" section would make sense. The non-neutrality is clear. Similarly, why should it be that a bumbling (but intendedly adorable) character like Jar-Jar should be assumed to insult any race he's deemed to resemble? If he WERE to seem a bit Jamaican, or Belgian or whatever, who would have a basis for complaining of racism? Who IS a bumbling space alien allowed to resemble?208.70.148.49 06:36, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Daughter?

Simply the greatest Star Wars character ever and that should be mentioned in the article. -Amit

Huh? --mixvio
Eh, he's not that great; better than Jabba by a long shot, though. Anyway, that's POV (point of view), so it wouldn't fly. Oh, yeah, and is your last name "Bandakar" by any chance? Darth Katana X


"The Character was inspired by Lucas´ youngest daughter." Is there any basis for this? It seems a bit out of context, and seems like the kind of thing that could use a source citation. --Overand 03:03, 21 May 2005 (UTC)

Yes, It was written in an article about Jar Jar Binks some time ago in Star Wars Insider. I can't seem to find the article now, but I know it was there at some point. Firestorm 18:37, Jun 21, 2005 (UTC)

That would explain Lucas' insistence in protecting the character. But it's awful.

Has JJB been featured in the Expanded Universe? I foresee a million possible horrible deaths dalegrett 15:55, 19 Jun 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Rastafarian reference?

This was at the end of the article:

"==See also==

I don't see what Jar Jar has to do with Rastafarians outside of the minor similarities in sound (Jah/Jar). The quote was also not attributed to anyone, so I've removed it for now. Fernando Rizo 23:07, 20 Jun 2005 (UTC)

That needs to be re-worded, but it's a good point. That's what they call him. I'm not sure why, but P.O.D. calls Jesus "Jah Jah" and use it as a word for "god" (not capitalized because I'm not referring to the God). Darth Katana X 23:26, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

It's not a good point, actually.

[edit] Binks in ROTJ

I hate to be pedantic about it, but we shouldn't state that Binks is in ROTJ. I know the shot in question, and there's about a million Gungans in it. The viewer has no reason at all to believe that Jar Jar is somewhere in that shot, much less to believe that he is the one with the "Weesa free!' line. --Staecker 4 July 2005 04:33 (UTC)

I agree with you Staecker. The issue has been batted back and forth on this page, so I think we need to come up with a consensus. I'm for removing the reference due to lack of evidence. Fernando Rizo 4 July 2005 04:36 (UTC)

Agreed. Reverse when Lucas says "we put jar jar in the scene". Tempshill 7 July 2005 16:38 (UTC)
Didn't Lucas say he was on Alderaan when it got destroyed? Shingen 06:07, September 1, 2005 (UTC)
That is fanon. - Gilgamesh 08:23, 1 September 2005 (UTC)

It can't be JarJar. Look closely at the Gungan that says "Weesa Free!" See how old he looks? Now on JJB's article, it says he was born in circa 50 BBY, so that makes him ~54 years old by ROTJ. He would look a lot more like Captain Tarpals by now.

Just to play Devil's Advocate here, as I agree there is no proof that it is Jar-Jar, but the assumption of incorrect age also assumes that Gungans age at the same rate as humans.Aericanwizard 21:19, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

Hence, that had to have been a different, younger Gungan. JarJar's progeny? Unlikely, but possible. --Shultz 08:30, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

On the official site, the character databank lists which films each character is in. Jar Jar is not listed as being Return of the Jedi, Gungans however ARE listed. Therefore it has come straight from the horses mouth, Jar Jar was not in Jedi. I will add this information in a moment. The Filmaker 17:42, 25 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Jar Jar Merchandise

Jar Jar merchandise was simply not popular, this can be clearly seen by the amount of Jar Jar merchandise which filled the shelves of dollar stores. Darth Vader merchandise has retained its popularity and sold well. As a marketing tool, Jar Jar was a flop. Whatever appeal Jar Jar held with children, it did not lead to the sales of Jar Jar merchandise that had been expected. Even if Jar Jar did appeal to children, it was hardly a new market for Star Wars. A New Hope and The Empire Strikes Back appealed to children without alienating older audiences.--66.162.55.2 16:31, 12 January 2006 (UTC)

Right. And how is this conjecture relevant to the article about the character? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.239.133.107 (talk) 08:08, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Neutrality?

"This raises the question of whether George Lucas himself understands the market for his own work."

Is this statement neutral? Gildir 22:10, 9 February 2006 (UTC)

I don't think it is. There are several other sentences in the "controversy" section of the article, such as "...another issue is whether anything was gained by alienating the adolescent and adult market in an attempt to gain a market they already had," that don't seem to have quite a neutral point of view either. That section could use revising. Edward Tremel 17:03, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Brutal anti-Jar Jar images

The really bad ones of Jar Jar Binks?

Pece Kocovski 06:27, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

Agreeing it's too much I am. One really bad one sufficient will be. Zanaq 19:38, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

thanks.

Pece Kocovski 23:21, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] speech accent

could we remove the phrase 'speech accent'? At least one of those words is redundant. I'll attempt a second edit. - Richardcavell 14:33, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

I agree more with that second edit, but I see no redundancy. Speech accent differs from, say, Speech pattern. Zanaq 14:38, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
The phrase 'speech accent' may not be redundant, but it doesn't make a lot of sense. Speech is, after all, the only thing that can *have* an accent, to the best of my awareness, so saying 'speech accent' is a lot like saying 'toe foot'. 207.216.10.130 07:02, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Titles?

I find the ever-changing titles in front of Jar Jar's name to be a bit silly. Of course the text should say that he was a senator (or representative or whatever), but can't we just call him Jar Jar Binks? I see some inconsistency with using titles or not using titles in Star Wars articles. Padme Amidala has none, even though she is constantly refered to in the films with titles, Princess Leia has one (clearly, she should, since she is usually refered to in pop culture as "princess"), Bail Organa has an absolutely ridiculous one (he is never refered to as such in the films). But Binks's name is Jar Jar. And since we can't seem to agree on the appropriate title, can't we just leave it at that? Staecker 18:12, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

I did not know Jar Jar Binks had any titles. I just call him Jar Jar. I don't think he has an official title. But I only have seen Episode 1. Cheers. --Starionwolf 05:29, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] External Links

Yeah, hi, I'm not gonna bother wading through all this "you're wrong," "no, you're wrong." I simply would like to request that a disclaimer be added to the External Links section in reference to some of the more... unsavory links. Maybe even yank them. Jar Jar's a kids character, kids are gonna come here. Eh, perhaps Controversy warrants its own article. I'm not gonna fool around with it and tick someone off, I just wanted to say that. --64.148.56.23 20:47, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

And because you've said something that actually makes some kind of sense, it will go mostly ignored. Sad but true. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.239.133.107 (talk) 08:10, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Pre-Episode I

I know that there are many Extended Universe books dealing with Jar Jar and his exploits pre-Episode I, including one in which we find out that he was banished for ruining a dinner party thrown by Boss Nass. I think these instances warrent mention in the article and will go ahead with adding them if there are no objections. Iodyne 06:56, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

Certainly include them if you can.

Yoda921 06:21, 29 January 2007 (UTC)Yoda

[edit] Gunga Din?

I believe I'm pretty familiar with the poem "Gunga Din", and there's no mention of any horn-blowing or (direct) battle-saving. I think someone's trying to put one over on wikipedia. Either that or I've been reading the wrong poem. Andrew Rodland 04:11, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

They're talking about a scene from Gunga Din (film), not the original poem. --138.88.84.36 18:58, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Race in the media

I want to link this article in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_intelligence_(Media_portrayal) since this is an example of racism about how smart black people are in the media... how do I do that? JJJamal 18:09, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

I don't know. But I do know that Jar Jar Binks isn't a black person. He's not a person at all. He's not even meant to be a representation of a person. He's a fictional character in a science fiction fantasy film, and in this film, he's a Gungan, an Amphibian, clothes-wearing biped that bears little resemblance to any known animal in the real world. So... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.239.133.107 (talk) 06:33, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Trivia section

The trivia section has become large and cumbersome, and a cleanup is sorely needed. I started the cleanup today, but more work is needed.

  • I removed all points of trivia that were simply references to Jar Jar in another otherwisely unrelated work. (e.g. someone mentioning his name in a Simpsons episode once).
  • While it could be argued that holds a slight claim to noteability since it included George Lucas, I also removed the Greenscreen Challenge reference. "Lucas immitated Jar-Jar on a TV show". I feel this is non-notable.
  • I also removed various examples of how Jar-Jar has been parodied or insulted in different media. That Jar-Jar was ridiculed is mentioned in the Controversy section of the article. I think a list of random examples is redundant.
  • The information on how Ahmed Best was cast as Jar-Jar, I moved to the Ahmed Best page.
  • Regarding the Ronaldinho reference: Firstly, it is not sourced. Secondly, if this were to be included anywhere, it should be in the article on Ronaldinho, since he is the main topic of this little piece of information. If there was a mention in his article about his different nicknames, this could go there, if a source could be found. For now, I removed it.
  • The remaining two pieces of information, about the origin of Jar Jar's catchphrase, and the role of Lucas' daughter in the creation of the chatacter, I left untouched. This is not to indicate that they should remain where they are. Proper sources should be found, and the information be worked into the main article. If said sources cannot be found, or the information cannot be included in the main article in a good way, then these two last points should also be removed.

Please read Wikipedia:trivia before adding or re-adding to the trivia section. Dr bab 10:24, 3 April 2007 (UTC).

Thanks. Your edits were purposeful and beneficial to the article, and in accordance with Wikipedia policy. Of course, this means they've been reverted, but they can easily be restored, as all good edits should be. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.239.133.107 (talk) 06:37, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Jar Jar Binks Rocks!

Jar Jar is awesome! Someone tell me why they don't like him. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 70.91.220.98 (talk) 11:16, 14 April 2007 (UTC).

Well, because
a)He is the most ridiculous, stupid, annoying character in Star Wars
b)He practically GAVE Palpatine the galaxy
c)"Oooh!! Icky-icky goo!" Need I say more? --C Teng (talk) 01:56, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Controversy NPOV

Since the controversy section still deals more with opinions on the character, I've been forced to tag it for now. There needs to be citations included for the bolder statements, and the sillier ones need to go. Come on, I know it's Jar Jar, but we can rise above it. Rebochan 14:21, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

What opinions? Most things look like they were cited from Lucas, or celebrities who referenced the controversy, or other sources. So what's the big deal? I think the section is fine.Rglong 00:50, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
What about the new 'homosexual' accusations up? Not too sure. Lordio 01:29, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
It took someone more than eight years to craft that ridiculous paragraph. I mean, it's embarrassingly irrelevant at this point, but it took some amateur sociologist so long to come up with it, that we may as well keep it for a little while. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.239.133.107 (talk) 08:15, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
I like most of it, I mean, people do think Jar Jar is annoying. It's a fact. C Teng (talk) 01:58, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] WikiProject Films

Twice, User:71.239.133.107 has tried to remove "{{Film|class=Start}}" from this talk page because "Article has been sufficiently developed". I think that doing so is a bad move (causing this article to no longer be considered by WikiProject Films), and that instead it is up to the members of WikiProject Films to upgrade the class of this article from "Start" to some other class (hopefully better), and I invite those members to re-analyze this article.   — Jeff G. (talk|contribs) 21:43, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

Firstly, I have not tried to remove the "{{Film|class=Start}}", I have actually done it. Secondly, I did it because I sincerely believe that this article has been developed beyond the state of a rough draft, and should no longer be considered a Start Class article. Of course, it still needs quite a bit of work, but it has been considerably improved; because it's not a very popular subject, though, I thought it would be a while before someone else came along and made this change. When I made this change, I didn't know that such a change had to be discussed in a committee. My mistake. Thirdly, you seem particularly interested in me and my edits, to the extent that it seems as though you're following behind me, criticising everything I do. Whether or not you (or others) like the tone of my edit summaries, they're not in violation of policy, and my edits are constructive.71.239.133.107 (talk) 22:24, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
The template is not supposed to be removed. You can update the class attribute to B or promote the template for the GAC process. Hope this resolves matters. —Erik (talk • contrib) - 22:49, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
Yes it does, thanks. 71.239.133.107 (talk) 23:51, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
Sorry, "tried to" was a poor choice of wording; I meant that your removals had not eventually had the desired effect of the template remaining gone from this page. I have not criticized everything you did, in fact I appreciated your edits to this article.   — Jeff G. (talk|contribs) 18:37, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for saying so. I think this article has come a long way. Sometimes it seems that good edits attract more good edits. Maybe. 71.239.133.107 19:57, 30 November 2007 (UTC)