Talk:James the Just
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[edit] NPOV
I'm removing the POV tag from the main part of the article because I didn't see anything particularly POV about the main body and there was no rationale givin on the talk page for the tag in the first place. I did, however, move the tag down to the section on the James Ossuary because there seems to be some sort of dispute running about that section. If anyone thinks that the article as a whole has problems, please feel free to reinstate the tag and justify your actions on the talk page. -- jackturner3 15:04, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
- I'm confused about what exactly in the Ossuary section is POV. Reading the section as it stands now, it seems to be rather straightforward. I looked in Archive 1, linked at the top of this page, and found only one reference to the section. Has the dispute about this section been archived somewhere else? Perhaps the section has been edited since the POV tag was placed on it (16 October 2007). At any rate, unless anyone has some objections, I recommend the tag be removed from this section. If anyone does have objections, perhaps they could post them here. Thanks very much. MishaPan (talk) 22:31, 20 January 2008 (UTC)
- I see no basis for objecting to the removal based on the existing text, but I'm far from being an expert on the subject. Let's hope someone more knowledgable chimes in soon. John Carter (talk) 00:20, 21 January 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Citations needed
The "Influence" section is woefully lacking in citations. Also, I believe any statements attributed to a writer, such as Robert Eisenman and Ben Witherington, would have to be supported by specific page numbers and exact quotations in which the statements which they are claimed to have made are clearly and explicitly sourced. John Carter 15:59, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
[edit] James' Names
- "James son of Alphaeus" is "James the Less" and
- "James the Just" is "James the Brother of the Lord"
- It is the identification of these two with each other that is disputable and needs an independent sentence with citation.
- My rewrite was to make this clear. If you disagree please indicate why and discuss.--Carlaude (talk) 15:50, 7 March 2008 (UTC)
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- Let's not start making simple "is" claims. It seems that the confusion is that you have misunderstood what "adelphotheos" means. It has nothing to do with Alphaeus. It does not mean "son of Alphaeus". What it means is "brother of God"; that is, it is the epithet for James the Brother of the Lord. Tb (talk) 18:16, 7 March 2008 (UTC)
Historical Jesus was a son of soldier named Panthera (or Pandera)(greek). Yehoshua-ben-Pandera. also called Jeshu ha-Notzri. The stem of this word means 'to keep oneself separate' -- an indication of the ascetic nature of sect. The expression 'Jesus of Nazareth' is therefore a mistranslation of 'Jeshu ha-Notzri'. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.50.198.215 (talk) 08:04, 23 March 2008 (UTC)
- Such opinions, whether true or false, are not particularly relevant to this page. Tb (talk) 17:46, 23 March 2008 (UTC)
[edit] james/jacob
The statement that Jacob and James come from the same Hebrew root is not true. The letters are not the same, and there is no "J" at all in Hebrew. Jacob is pronounced Yaakov. Can anyone shed light on this?--Gilabrand (talk) 20:13, 7 June 2008 (UTC)
- Its found in the Greek I know - Iakobos is Greek for James, Iakob or Iakobos is Jacob (pardon my bad transliterations). Pastordavid (talk) 20:18, 7 June 2008 (UTC)
James is an English invention, probably to make it sound less Jewish. The German is Jakobus, the Latin is Iacobus, the Greek is Iakobos, the Hebrew is Yaakov — the obvious English is Jacob. 75.14.211.158 (talk) 01:12, 10 June 2008 (UTC)
Um, let's not assume racist or otherwise unpleasant motives. "James" comes from Old French; it's cognate to "Jaime" in Spanish. It comes from "Iacomus", a variant of "Iacobus" in Latin. The reason the yod became a J is the result of a longer process. Hebrew yod generally became iota in Greek, which became I in Latin. That's what happened here. Then consonantal I in Latin (originally like an English Y) became more roughly pronounced, to give the "zh" sound of a French J and then the English "J" sound. Tb (talk) 05:23, 10 June 2008 (UTC)
