User talk:Jakro64

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[edit] About Royal/National motto

The question here is perhaps what kind of motto people are most likely to identify as the unified motto of the nation. I personally have never heard of "Enige og tro til dovre faller", even though i've served twelve months in the armed forces where we swore an oath to our king and country. But i've heard "Alt for Norge" in many contexts and occasions. And it is written on our currency too. --Heno 17:10, 20 Oct 2004 (UTC)

I agree that "Enige og tro til Dovre faller" is not very well-known, especially among younger people. (This is mostly another good example on the terrible education level in Norway's secondary schools.) But "Alt for Norge" is King Harold's personal motto, not the Norwegian royal family's motto. It is well known that "Alt for Norge" has been used by football-fans, but please let us keep this debate on a historical level! The village of Dovre and "Enige og tro til Dovre faller" is in fact something which is binding the nation together and has done that for almost 200 years. The fact that our younger generation is not so well aware about it, is also telling that Wikipedia is a very good tool for everybody of us. This leaves us with two options: "Enige og tro til Dovre faller" or to leave it blank. Jakro64 10:21, 21 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Why cant you take the time to proper analyze what im saying in response to you? I've served 12-months in the armed services and i never heard any of the officers-in-charge there use that motto. Even when we pledged the oath. Furthermore, i never have heard it meantioned in the media etc. And the school system is terrible becouse they dont know the eidsvoll motto? I can think of many reasons the system is terrible, but that isnt one of them. Thats just trivias compared to many of the other reasons that makes the school system "so terrible".--Heno 14:05, 21 Oct 2004 (UTC)
I read your lines and noticed what you stated. I cannot explain how. If you are a Norwegian and more than 20 years old it is seen in my eyes unbelievable if you until now never have heard this oath. You should've been taught about it already in 3rd-4th grade in the primary/secondary school and repeated this several times before entering high school. Many memorials from World War II has this statement engraved, and I am 100% sure that most Norwegians are not in doubt that if Norway has a national motto, this is the only one! The King's motto would be much better suitable in His Majesty's article. Jakro64 17:16, 21 Oct 2004 (UTC)
"I read your lines and noticed what you stated. I cannot explain how." --Jakro64
I'll try to explain how. Even since the days when the King chose rather to abdicate (but he didnt he managed to escape to London), then to give in for the German aggressors demands he and the slogan "Alt for Norge" became a symbol of a free Norwegian nation. The very reason many norwegians chose to fight on was becouse of the kings zealous attitute towards the occupiers, dissregarding his own safety, gains and profits. The motto "alt for norge" was a bonding slogan, that reminded the norwegian people not only about the sacrifices the king made for his country, but for what sacrifices that was expected out of each and every one to make in those times of need.
Thats the reason i think, the kings motto is used much more frequently as a slogan than the Eidsvoll motto. The movie that celibrates 100 year of Norwegian independence which is scheduled to be realesed in 2005 isnt called "Evige og Tro til Dovre faller" but "Alt for Norge". To give one such example.
I have to stress one more time that the Eidsvoll motto is not an official National motto. And that is for a reason. It woud cast a shadow upon the kings motto which i think is recognized far more as a slogan than the Eidsvoll motto. --Heno 17:14, 22 Oct 2004 (UTC)
Why are you still complaining? Now both mottos are listed, the people's and the king's. Let's end this now, please! Jakro64 05:35, 23 Oct 2004 (UTC)


[edit] Norwegian-language newspapers in USA

Hello Jakro, good to hear from you! In response to your questions, no I don't believe there are any Norwegian-language newspapers left in the USA today. There are a few Norwegian-American publications today, but they are in English; there simply aren't enough people left in the USA who are fluent in Norwegian to make a newspaper economically feasible. Only a few of the oldest people are still fluent. I also don't know of any Norwegian-American groups that have websites in Norwegian, although there probably are some out there. The websites are mostly in English because they are trying to reach the several million Norwegian-Americans, 97% of whom are not fluent in Norwegian today. Sorry I can't be of more help here

In answer to your other question, if a Swedish-American man married a Norwegian-American woman, the child would probably consider himself both Swedish and Norwegian ancestry, or he might consider himself simply 'Scandinavian', as many of the Americans who are a mix of Danish, Swedish, and/or Norwegian do.

In fact, most Norwegian-Americans are similiar to this hypothetical child. Only about 2 million of the Norwegian-Americans are solely of Norwegian ancestry. The other 2.5 million are Norwegian ancestry in combination with something else, mostly in combination with other Scandinavians or German-Americans, who settled in the same places as the Norwegians (in fact, German-Americans and Scandinavian-Americans together make up about 80% of the white population in the Upper Midwest). Also, about half of the Norwegian-Americans who are not full Norwegian, about 1.2 million people, consider Norwegian to be their "first ancestry" in the US Census.


(you may ignore the below paragraph if you wish, as it is only an expression of my opinions)

What saddens me is that this convsersation we are having might be totally meaningless in, e.g., 100 years. By that time there are projected to be non-European majorities in many of the countries we are discussing, isn't that correct (Sweden especially, I hear)? So what will it mean to 'be a Norwegian' in the year 2100 AD? Due to immigration, will the concept of "being Norwegian" be totally meaningless by that time, beyond an empty expression of one's citizenship? What's even more troubling for me is that many in Scandinavia (and across Europe) keep quiet about these things because they don't want people to think they are racists. But in my view, there is nothing racist about wishing for the survival of your people and your nation.

Kind Regards, Bert Sveen

My reply is on my talk page. --BSveen 00:05, Dec 6, 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Bernt Balchen article: let's improve it big time!

Heh -- you too watched the NRK 1 TV documentary on Balchen tonight, I see (from Lithuania, or from X-Mas vacation in Norway? Oh well, none of my business, really). :-) I too will work a little on the Balchen article, probably will get more time to do it after new year's. Merry Christmas to you! --Wernher 00:55, 19 Dec 2004 (UTC)

and just a reminder: if answering this comment please do it right here, to keep the thread in one place; I'll check out this page from time to time

Thank you, Wernher! Yes, I did - I am watching NRK1/2 on satelitte. I will try to contribute as much as I can! Jakro64 19:12, 24 Jan 2005 (UTC)


[edit] The answers

from talk: Lithuania

I think it is not a very good idea to spell Lithuanian names with Lithuanian alphabet. Not everybody has them installed, and they will therefore appear on the screen as empty boxes. Remember that in the English alphabet ą, ž and ū etc. do not excist. It is also not very smart to name a page e.g. "Tauragė" without making redirect from "Taurage"... Jakro64 01:01, 11 Oct 2004 (UTC)

I partially agree with you. It isn't good, when one can't read in his computer a name with exotic letters. On other hand, we write an encyclopedia, so full information is necessary, including accurate written form of a name. The only question is proportion between using of true form and simplified for English reader one. When I wrote articles, I hadn't found a clear tradition for this case. But it was impossible to read main headings with Baltic script. So I almost forcedly decided, that main headings would be simplified and writing of a name in other cases would be original. At least it isn't a special question of Wikipedia or of Lithuanian letters, we deal with this problem generally in international communication, don't we?
Sure, but I wanted to focus on the redirect issue. 99% of English Wikipedia's readers don't even know the existence of letter ė :-) Jakro64 19:12, 24 Jan 2005 (UTC)

'Rajonas' is a municipality; like 'savivaldybe', so why to differ between them? A district sounds much bigger and can confuse a foreign reader. Jakro64 01:07, 11 Oct 2004 (UTC)


About the difference. there's surely no status difference between a district and a municipality. Municipalities are those, that were created after 1990. But nobody wanted to keep people at calling municipality what they used to call district, and these two variants remained this way.
About the translation. I could agree with you, that it were more clear to translate both with one word. But we deal with already existing translation. We deal as I've written, even with two variants, so municipality can appear in three variants in a translation from Lithuanian.


Sorry for late answers.
 :Linas 12:44, 2005 Jan 24 (UTC)

[edit] Asking for support

Hello, since you are interested in Lithuania I thought hat you might support our letter to Centre for Cartography, Vilnius University. We are asking to release their maps found at www.balticdata.info under GFDL licence so they could be used in articles about Lithuania. So far we got 14 people to "sign" it. The draft in very very rough English is available at user:Renata3/letter. If you decide to support it, I'll need just your first and last names together with your user name. You can leave it on my talk page or send it via email: just attact @gmail.com to my user name. Renata3 22:04, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Re: Milett

Hi Jan, I'm afraid I can't help you much with the etymology of the name. In Hungarian, the sentence you quoted is ortographically incorrect, although the typo is common and sometimes (especially online) even intentional. With the correct ortography, it reads "El tudom képzelni, mi lett volna még kátyú esetén", in which case it means approximately "I can imagine what would have happened if it had been muddy too". Or, more literally, "what would have been" – "mi" corresponds roughly to "what", "volna" to "would", and "lett" to "have been". As one word however, "milett" doesn't exist in Hungarian. Regards, KissL 14:55, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] re:me

Jan, just an off-subject thank you for the work you and your compatriots over at Borderpoint; I regularly read these, and have used discussion points and facts gleaned from there or links on Wikipedia. I hope to join when I eventually get a PC. A list of my edits (including work on exclaves/enclaves and territorial dispute articles) may be worth looking at; if you can help me with suggestions for additions to these articles, please do. Keep up the good work. RAYMI.

Thanks Raymi for your nice comment. ~Best regards, Jakro64 10:05, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Thanks, again, and info.

I have used some info from Tornio/Haparanda on geosite.jankrogh.com for use on 'List of Divided Islands' on Wikipedia. Have credited you (check edits). Incidentally there are TONS of enclaves in Traditional English county history (now pretty much irrelevant), and also a vast number of practical enclaves between modern 'counties'. I have added a few practical English/Scottish enclaves and English/Welsh enclaves in Wikipedia. England also has a disputed county quadripoint. Two other thoughts for you. Both Argentine and Chilean Antarctic Province (not officially recognized, of course), are, to their home nations, exactly that, PROVINCES. In their eyes, a continuation of the National territory, NOT an 'overseas territory'. Which would make them exclaves????? Secondly, if you do visit England at any point, and wish to visit any areas, let me know, and I will point you in the direction of a few areas of potential interest for Border Pointers. Maybe, as an island nation, the UK will not be as interesting as most European nations, but still has a few moments of border madness. RAYMI.80.68.39.212 13:48, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Solveig Gunbjörg Jacobsen vs. Solveig Gunbjørg Jacobsen

Dear Jan, I don't think that your 'correction' of Solveig's name is justified without citing any relevant source. The quoted Headland's book gives the name as 'Gunbjörg', and he is careful enough to distinguish between 'ö' and 'ø' in other Scandinavian names. Names are not 'corrected', they are spelled as they are and not modernized post factum. Therefore, it is my opinion that you ought to either cite a source demonstrating that the name was actually spelled with 'ø' or revert to the original name of the article. Apcbg (talk) 15:05, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

In the Nordic countries the letter Ö is used in Iceland, Sweden and Finland while Ø is used in Denmark, Faroe Isl. and Norway. If Gunbjørg was or is a Norwegian citizen her name should be spelled with an Ø, no matter if she or her parents themselves spelled it otherwise, where or when she was born. Jakro64 (talk) 22:51, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
Your reasoning is OR I'm afraid, and unconvincing at that as you haven't even sourced your statement that Gunbjörg was a Norwegian citizen. Apcbg (talk) 06:43, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
I am sorry, but I am not following you. I did not write the Solveig Gunbjørg Jacobsen article where her father and mother are mentioned and which is categorized as a 'Norwegian people stub'. Grytviken was Norwegian run and Mr Jacobsen is in this article mentioned as one of its managers. He appears therefore as a Norwegian citizen and any daughter of a Norwegian father would therefore also become a Norwegian citizen by birth. This is no "research", simply a conclusion. Jakro64 (talk) 07:37, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Hello

I found this source but i can't read Lithuanian and i noticed that you can. I was wondering if you would please translate it into English please? [1] Ijanderson977 (talk) 16:43, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

In short: The parliament of Lithuania taking in consideration Kovovo's independance declaration of 17th Feb, statement from the President of Lithuania of 18 Feb and statements from the European Union of 18 Feb declares: 1. to recognize Kosovo as an independent republic and 2. that it reccomends the Government of Lithuania to exchange diplomatic relations with Kosovo. Jakro64 (talk) 11:05, 24 April 2008 (UTC)