Talk:Jaco Pastorius

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Jazz, set up to organize and expand entries on jazz and related subgenres, as well as other related subjects. If you would like to participate, you can choose to edit the article attached to this page (see Wikipedia:Contributing FAQ for more information).
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography. For more information, visit the project page.
Biography Portal
B This article has been rated as B-Class on the project's quality scale. [FAQ]
This article is supported by WikiProject Musicians, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed biographical guide to musicians and musical groups on Wikipedia.


Contents

[edit] Fact check, please:

In the "Early Life section," paragraph 1 calls Jaco the first of his parents' 3 children. 2 'graphs down we hear about his older brother Gregory.66.157.32.82 19:51, 10 September 2007 (UTC)


[edit] Bassists in the Down Beat Hall of Fame

The text said that Jaco is one of only three bassist in the Down Beat Hall of Fame. I find at least one more that was not mentioned, Charlie Mingus. That makes four... I'll change the text. /Sven 83.233.152.90 11:39, 19 April 2007 (UTC)


[edit] Biréli Lagrène

Why isn't there any mention of the time Jaco met up with Biréli Lagrène around 1984? The recordings with those two were mind-blowing.

[edit] What the fuck?

This article is abysmal. Sources barely quoted, complete arse wank article. Nothing but fanboy writing. "Jaco excelled at all sports he tried... He waa injured by a jealous quarterback." How is any of that relevant? its relevant cuz jaco wanted to be a drummer like his father but cuz he ingured his wrist he couldnt play right nd switched to bass

It's a lot better now.--h i s s p a c e r e s e a r c h 10:09, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Live in Italy

There's no reference to the "Live in italy" Recordings (Jazzpoint, 1986). I Believe it shuld be included, since it says "discography", not "selected discography", as well as any other records he could have made. Plus, the "live in Italy" is a great record.

[edit] Removed misattributation

"Another technique that Jaco supposedly used was to coat his fingertips in chicken grease or coating the strings in Vaseline, but close friends and musicians that worked with Jaco dispute this."

That one's been bugging me for a while now while I've been waiting for somebody else to fix it. This is a popular story that is told of Motown bass legend James Jamerson (he would eat fried check before playing never washing his hands in between) and somewhere along the lines it got attributed to Jaco. The only definitive source that hints that this is remotely true comes from his 2nd wife who says "every now and then he wouldn't wash [his fingers]", but this hardly classifies it as a 'technique'. If there is any source that can verify this as a technique that Jaco used then please cite.

Jaco says, in the "Modern Electric Bass" video, that he took the frets out of his bass himself, then filled the gaps with wood putty.

I've heard both stories too.

[edit] POV on Jaco's high regard

Guy's a legend in my book but this is exremely POV.

Almost every serious electric bass player considers Jaco a legend, to say the least-- is that so POV?

That's no POV--that's fact. He's a legend. You don't completely change the harmonic, rhythmic, and melodic language of an instrument (and don't forget the new standard for technical prowess on the bass), all while being an incredible composer and arranger, sensitive accompanist, constantly grooving bassist, and not become a legend. I'd sat you're right on in calling him a legend.

"He is considered by many to be the greatest electric bassist to have lived." That's borderline POV. At the very least, it is downright weasel language. Personally, I'm not willing to put him in my Top 5, but if that got put in the article, it would be deleted immediately. I'd be willing to let this stay if you could show me some well-researched/credible lists or polls that put him at the top, but for now, I'm going to remove it. Fishyfred 03:27, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

There's no question he belongs in the top 5 and I personally can’t think of anyone who’s better. Can someone name a contender? Whether or nor he was actually the first person to remove the frets from an electric bass is hardly the point: he was the first person to play the electric bass in a style that completely utilised the possibilities that a fretless instrument allows. And surely his greatness is evinced by whom he played with in his short career: Pat Metheny <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pat_Metheny>, Weather Report <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weather_Report>, Joni Mitchell <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joni_Mitchell>, Mike Stern <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Stern> - they all wanted this crazy cat in their bands because he was completely unique and prodigiously gifted.

Personal POV puts John Entwistle at Numero Uno and Jaco a solid Dos....of course.... I've only been playing bass for thirty years , what the hell do I know.......

Personal POV about the subject shouldn't enter into a discussion on what to put into an encyclopedia. I don't particularly care for the Rolling Stones, but I'd be an idiot to doubt their status as rock legends. Anyone who doesn't know about a particular subject turns to an encyclopedia to find out accurate information about that subject. It is generally accepted in the music world that Jaco was a legendary bassist who truly revolutionized the role of his instrument. Anybody turning to Wikipedia to read up on Jaco should have that information available to them. Jaco66 04:11, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] what happened??

Extremely poorly written and wrought with blatant inaccuracies and hearsay..terrible injustice to an incredible musician.

Part about being buried with his bass is untrue.

[edit] Marcus Miller

I deleted the part in which it was said that some consider MM to be a mere imitator of JP. There might be some people who think this, but i think it should be noted who these people are before reference is made to it. The fact that MM is primarily known for his slapping and that JP never used this technique harms the validity of this opinion. It has to stem from someone with a lot of proven knowledge about bassplaying to make this opinion a valuable one i'd say. Sure JP influenced MM, but influence doesn't make one an imitator. --Vunzmstr 15:59, 7 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] A discography...

...would be helpful

  • I just added a discography, as complete as I could.

I didn't add the "Live in Italy" and "Live at NYC", since I consider those to be bootlegs...

I have a doubt anyway, should I (we) consider his work with Joni Mitchell as a collaboration, or as a member of the band like he was in Weather Report?

Hmmmm...interesting question! Even though he didn't really "write" the songs with Joni, he had free reign to play what he felt, and his playing was a huge part of the distinct flavor that Hejira, Don Juan, and Mingus have. One might say he collaborated with her on those three records. But he was also part of that band at that time, since he did appear live on stage with her. However he played on only one song, "Mood Swings," on Mike Stern's album, so we would call that an appearance rather than a collaboration. Thoughts? Jaco66 03:49, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fretless bass guitar

Jaco Pastorius was not the first fretless bass player? Most of music magazines that I read from 1984 to 1994, reported that Pastorius invented the fretless bass guitar. I am asking because Wikipedia says that David Gilmour played fretless bass in several Pink Floyd's tracks in early 1970s.

Any Americans out there?? or this is just a brit crap and trap?Brian Wilson 15:11, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

What I've heard is that he wanted to play double bass, but his bass split all the time because of Philadelphia weather, so one day he came home drunk and took out his frets with a screwdriver. I don't know how real this is though. It's still a great story. Gnome

  • Heh, nice story. Jaco told Guitar Player in 1984 that his fretless bass had the frets removed by its previous owner ... and also that he had to use wood filler and boat varnish to fix up the fretboard as a result. Renaissongsman 18:50, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
  • I heard many years ago that Bill Wyman was the first, and in the following interview he claims he made a fretless c. 1959: [1]. His Wikipedia page also carries this claim. I have seen really old Stones footage where he was on fretless, though he was not playing in the post-Jaco flashy fretless style, of course!
  • I'm looking at a Jaco Pastorius article in "The Bass Player Book" 1999 (edited by Karl Coryat) and in an interview with Charlie Brent of the C.C. Riders, he says "I remember when [Jaco] started playing fretless. We were somewhere in the Midwest, and Jaco said 'Man, I wanna try one of those fretless basses.'" He goes on to say that Jaco went out to a hardware store, picked up some pliers and wood compound, and proceeded to tear the frets out of the only bass he had on the road. That was 5 years after he started playing bass, thus he wasn't playing fretless from the beginning. Also, that quote by Jaco shows that he wasn't the first one to play the fretless bass.198.145.75.176 10:25, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
  • The Ampeg AUB-1 (scroll bass) was a factory fretless available as early as 1967. Rick Danko is playing one on the Band's "Rock of Ages" recording. 66.157.32.82 19:45, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Influences

I added Rocco Prestia. While they can be considered contemporaries, Rocco had the jump on Jaco by a few years, with a style and approach to the instrument that are probably among the most unique. When you listen to Jaco, you hear far more Rocco than you do Bob Marley, Frank Sinatra or Tony Bennett. Thedukeofno 08:56, 7 June 2006 (UTC)


Speaking of influences, i was surprised not to see such names as: Jack Bruce, John Entwhistle, and John Paul Jones on the list.

[edit] His Death.

This article on Jaco Pastorious's death is false. Jaco was said to be pushed of a balcony of a club by the owner and was killed.

Jaco66 03:32, 24 February 2007 (UTC) I don't agree with this, and indeed have never heard this story before. It is quite well-documented that Luc Havan beat Jaco outside the club. He served jail time for it, which ought to lay to rest the balcony account.

--- —Preceding unsigned comment added by Vashkan (talk • contribs) 05:30, 19 May 2008 (UTC)

After re-reading the events of Jaco's death, of which I have some familiarity, I find a rather remarkable synchronicity virtually twenty one years after his murder. I couldn't help but feel an impulse to share it with those who cared so much about this man and his music.

The last piece on the Heavy Weather album is Jaco's piece "Havona". The man who murdered Jaco was named Luc "Havan". While this particular coincidence is intriguing, what is even more amazing is what "Havona" means. This is my assumption, but Jaco was an extraordinarily brilliant man who was known to read Nietzsche and other philosophers. Clearly he was also reading The Book of Urantia, in which "Havona" is the central and main universe where "Heaven" is located and where the God of the known universe's home dwells. To me this is fascinating, and implies that Jaco's death, while tragic, has significance and deep meaning if we look deeper at the underlying order to the cosmos. I think Jaco would have agreed, in his more sober moments, that the all existence has a mysterious order that is larger than our limited perspective. His spirit is extant and can never be extinguished. Vashkan (talk) 05:28, 19 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Cite request re "genius" claim

In response to the request for a citation supporting the claim that Pastorius was regarded as a genius, here is one such cite: Chris Jisi The Legacy Of The 'World's Greatest Bass Player' Deepens With A New Edition Of The Essential Biography Bass Player 1 March 2006 p 41.Robma 22:18, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

Herbie Hancock regards Jaco as a "genius" on Portrait of Jaco (Holiday Park Records, 2002). This is the quote from the interview, which is on CD# 2, track# 17: "Jaco was a genius. Jaco was really a genius...I don't know anybody who would question that." Jaco66 03:15, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Ninja

Was Luc Havan a ninja? I don't know much about Pastorius's life or death, but something tells me that he wasn't a ninja....71.175.17.13 10:26, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Diagnosis not correct

Jaco was diagnosed as BiPolar II. Most common type. Manic Depressive IS Bipolar II and so needs to be corrected as redundant.

71.239.180.89 02:56, 13 September 2007 (UTC)UMGrad86

[edit] What Video???

"By this point, Jaco had been in the throes of mental illness, drug and alcohol abuse and had been homeless for a stretch. He appears shaky, his playing is uneven and he admits he can't play some of his old licks. The video is not structured and tends to jump around from one subject to the next."

What video? The preceding text has nothing to do with any video... Overlook1977 (talk) 01:47, 28 January 2008 (UTC)

NOTE: I believe the preceding text is a reference to the DCI Instructional Video (1985 video?). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 140.220.3.174 (talk) 18:37, 22 February 2008 (UTC)