Talk:Intervocalic alveolar flapping

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[ɾ] [ɹ]

Hi. I am thinking of flapping as a type of assimilation in that the [-continuant] feature of /t/ & /d/ is assimilating to the [+cont] feature of the surrounding vowels. So, something like the "openness" of the vowels is influencing the duration of the closure and the strength of the tongue articulatory movement. Perhaps not assimilation in a canonical sense, but still seems rather so to me. Thoughts? — ishwar  (SPEAK) 18:49, 2005 Mar 31 (UTC)

The problem is that |[ɾ]}} is probably still [-cont] (that's the most likely distinction between it and |[ɹ]}}, which is [+cont]). If flapping is caused by spreading a feature, the only possible feature would be [+sonorant], but since that's a major class feature, most theories of feature geometry won't allow it to spread except in total assimilation. I think it's preferable to treat flapping as a kind of lenition in a weak metrical position. --Angr 19:58, 31 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Hmm. That's interesting. Thanks for the note. Cheers! — ishwar  (SPEAK) 23:44, 2005 Mar 31 (UTC)

[edit] Consonant Mutation in Turkish the same

Don't know if this really fits. I'm not a linguist but...

Isn't this known as consonant mutation? This happens alot in Turkish, with which I am very familiar. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 213.139.241.33 (talk) 10:42, 7 May 2007 (UTC).

[edit] Removal of my notes

Angr, I thought it was fair to note the other mergers, so nobody gets confused. Any thoughts anybody?Cameron Nedland 13:33, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

As I said in my edit summary, I thought mentioning those mergers in this context is more likely to confuse people, not less likely. AFAIK all accents that have flapping also have the mergers in question; in fact, very few modern English accents don't. —Angr 14:43, 7 May 2007 (UTC)
Yeah, you're right. I just wanted to help, it wasn't vandalism.Cameron Nedland 13:22, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
I never thought it was vandalism! I hope I didn't give the impression I thought it was! I knew it was a good-faith edit; I just disagreed with its usefulness. —Angr 14:47, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
Oh, my bad! I, just thought it might be confusing to someone who doesn't have the vowel mergers to see those listed as homophones. I remember once reading that broad and rod don't rhyme, (in my accent they do) and I was pretty damn confused because no one clarified what accent they were talking about.Cameron Nedland 18:20, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Flapping after /l/

Do some people really pronounce faculty as [fækəɫɾi]? I'm an American linguist, and it seems to me I've never heard it and can when I try it it sounds totally foreign. Isn't this a mistake?

Hmm... for me (also American), it's more like [fækəɫdi] than [fækəɫɾi], but it's definitely not [fækəɫti] except in careful speech. —Angr 04:55, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
It almost depends on who I'm talking to, idk why though...Cameron Nedland 22:05, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
I think I always pronounce it [fækəɫti] but I might not notice it if someone flaps the /t/. Maybe there's a better, more universal example. Ƶ§œš¹ [aɪm ˈfɻɛ̃ⁿdˡi] 21:17, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
I pronounce it with a t but the flap doesn't sound wrong to me. And [fækəɫdi] sounds off to me but substituting d for t seems pretty common. Maybe voiced consonants are easier to say between vowels or something.--66.153.117.118 (talk) 21:51, 20 April 2008 (UTC)