Template talk:Infobox U.S. Cabinet

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[edit] Foreign Affairs breakage

It seems with the addition of the Foreign Affairs field, the template leaves behind a '}}' upon usage; the George Washington article is an example. The template syntax no longer displays properly here either. Please make whatever corrections are needed. —Adavidb 10:17, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

I reverted the changes and added the sandbox and testcases pages so that changes can be tested before making them live. The sandbox version has the last changes by Therequiembellishere. Please let me know if there are any questions about using the sandbox. --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 12:19, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] vice president

Traditionally, the Vice President was not a member of the cabinet, did not attend cabinet meetings, etc. Each president's VP is listed elsewhere on the page - why should they be listed in this infobox as well? john k (talk) 16:52, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

This has, admittedly, changed somewhat with the VPs from Mondale onwards. But pretty much no earlier VPs were considered to be cabinet members. john k (talk) 16:53, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

From United States Cabinet: "During a meeting of the President's Cabinet, members are seated according to the order of precedence, with higher ranking officers sitting closer to the center of the table. Hence, the President and Vice President sit directly across from each other at the middle of the oval shaped table." --MZMcBride (talk) 16:57, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Since 1977 or so only. Before that the VP never attended cabinet meetings. LBJ was not at Kennedy's cabinet meetings, Hannibal Hamlin did not attend civil war cabinet meetings, John Adams never attended Washington's cabinet. The VP as a member of the cabinet is a very recent phenomenon, and we shouldn't anachronistically read that back into earlier times. john k (talk) 17:22, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Also, please don't quote Wikipedia articles as though they're reliable sources for what other wikipedia articles should say. john k (talk) 17:23, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

This 1974 Atlantic article by Schlesinger discusses the history of the issue. Apparently the first VP to attend cabinet meetings was Wilson's VP, Thomas R. Marshall, but this was only to preside while Wilson was in Paris, and was considered unofficial and somewhat improper. Apparently Coolidge then regularly attended cabinet meetings, but Dawes and Curtis did not, and it only became regular from Roosevelt onwards. So I was in error, the practice began in 1921 or 1933 rather than 1977, but still, the VPs before Garner (other than Coolidge and possibly Marshall) should not be included in the cabinet template. john k (talk) 17:43, 12 April 2008 (UTC)