User talk:IceGunner

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[edit] This is me

I've only been a Wikipedian a very short while (since November 2004), so I'm still getting the hang of this.

Going to just be adding and updating stuff here and there...

Thanks to zoney for the welcome!

--Icegunner 16:16, Nov 13, 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Welcome Message from Zoney

Hi there! I noticed your edits to Republic of Ireland. I hope you enjoy your time here and decide to regularly contribute. I've some useful links listed below. If you're interested in Irish topics, you may be interested in the notice board for Irish wikipedians.

First off, welcome to Wikipedia. If you made any edits before you got an account, you might be interested in assigning those to your username. You can sign your name using three tildes, like this: ~~~. If you use four, you can add a datestamp too. You can introduce yourself on the new users page.

You might find these links helpful in creating new pages or contributing: How to edit a page, How to write a great article, Naming conventions, Manual of Style. You should read our policies at some point too. If you ever think a page or image should be deleted, please list it at the votes for deletion page. There is also a votes for undeletion page if you want to retrieve something that you think should not have been deleted.

If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump, or ask me on my talk page. I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian!


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Here are some tasks you can do:

zoney ♣ talk 22:17, 27 Oct 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Wikimedia UK/Wikimania 2006

Hi, this is a circular to Wikipedians in Ireland to draw your attention to Wikimedia UK, where the establishment of a local Wikimedia chapter for the United Kingdom (and possibly for the Republic of Ireland) is being discussed. See the talk page, as well as the mailing list; a meetup will take place to discuss matters in London in September, for anyone who can get there. On another topic, plans are being drawn up for a UK bid for Wikimania 2006, which would be conveniently close to Ireland. On the other hand, Dublin's bid was one of the final three last year - might we bid again? --Kwekubo 04:01, 31 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] A Reply from the Republic of Ireland talk page.

Paul, the Celts never occupied Ireland! You are confuseing a culture with a people and/or ethnic group.

The peoples (notice the plural) who called themselves Celts as we know them principly lived in what is now central, southern and eastern France, parts of western Germany, Switzerland, the far north of Italy, and one or two other places such as Spain and Galatia.

In what's now France, they were bounded in the north and east by the Belgae and Germanic peoples, and in the south by the Vascones. There are the names of maybe half-a-dozen peoples or nations, known to inhabit Britain and Ireland either side of the first century A.D. (Menapii, Atrebates, Belgae/Fir Bolg) who did come from the Celtic/Belgae/Germanic borders, but only in very small numbers. Certainly there is no trace whatsoever in the archaeological record that such an occupation of Ireland by anyone took place at that time, let alone the Celts.

" England (later completely Saxonised by the Viking ethnic cleansing)." That's one humdinger you are going to have to explain! How could the British be Saxonised by Vikings???

"Our culture, our language and our descent are Celtic. Like all things Celtic, it has been enhanced by the interaction and assimilation of Viking, Norman, Roman, Greek and Arabic concepts, culture and genes." Paul, frankly this sounds disturbingly racist.

"Your comparison to language is also misleading. A majority of Irish speak English fluently yet the specified quote does not sugest that they are of English ethnicity." Exactly.

"I would point out that the English are a mix of Viking and Norman" - actually the English were, up to c.1066, mainly of British and Anglo-Saxon descent, with the culture and language of the latter being dominant.

"there is little evidence for Welsh-Irish interbreeding" Actually there is. Check out the Attacotti, the Desi, Irish kingdoms in Dark Age Wales, not to mention them returning the favor from 1169 onwards - hence surnames like Bhreanach, Brannagh, Walsh and Welsh.

"the Scots are descendents of Irish colonists known as the Picts from before the submergence of the landbridge between Scotland and Ulster" Sorry, no cigar. The Picts were in what we now call Scotland long before the Scotti turned up in force from c.498 onwards.

All the best in 2006! Fergananim 21:36, 29 December 2005 (UTC)


"Paul, the Celts never occupied Ireland!"
Huh? No Celts in Ireland? No archaeological evidence? Are you mad? Look at the culture, google "Celtic Ireland", look at all the Celtic crosses around the place, look at the wiki entry for Celt!
"How could the British be Saxonised by Vikings???"
I quote the wiki article on Anglo-Saxons: "Prior to King Alfred there had been the Hiberno-Saxon culture (the fusion of Anglo-Saxon and Celtic techniques and motifs) which had ceased with the Vikings." The Saxon culture quickly became dominant among the 'natives' as a result of the Viking raids.
"Paul, frankly this sounds disturbingly racist." Re-read the statement. It is not even remotely racist. In fact, it is even politically correct.
"the English were, up to c.1066, mainly of British and Anglo-Saxon descent" I am talking about present-day English, not those from 1066. There was no "British" people in 1066. You are correct in mentioning Anglo-Saxon. Indeed I said as much earlier in the post.
"Actually there is. Check out...." I concede that point.
"The Picts were in what we now call Scotland long before the Scotti turned up in force from c.498 onwards." That isn't what I argued. I argued that the Scotish people are descended from Picts and that the Picts may well have had Irish roots.
Icegunner 21:01, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] List_of_IRA_Chiefs_of_Staff

I removed most of your contribution as this page is a list and is not the place for such debates. Feel free of course to state your points on the respective IRA pages.

I'd also like to point out that when the IRA murdered two policemen at Soloheadbeg in 1919, they did not enjoy an iota of legitimate support. I'd also remind you that while the deputies who assembled in the Mansion House may have represented the largest bloc of seats, they enjoyed less than half of votes of the Irish electorate. Was that sufficient to santify and justify outright murder?

I detest revisionism - no matter which quarter it emanates. --Damac 20:38, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

I think I did make the point on the IRA pages as well. I felt that the point deserved to be made on the list as well. I will not restore the contribution however.
In the General Election of 1918, the Irish people by an overwhelming majority voted for the Sinn Féin who had campaigned with the platform of an Irish Republic. After the 1916 Rising, no one could doubt by what means Sinn Fein would pursue a Republic. Note this: a Republic. Not a Democracy. In a Republic, it is the majority of the representatives that matters, not the majority of the voters. As a result the action at Soloheadbeg, was legitimate if distasteful.
--Icegunner 21:12, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Europeanist

Hallo IceGunner, your article about Europeanism is very interesting. What me make thinking is the discribed fact, that Europeanist´s wants to have 1 Seat intead of the two for Britan and France. Im Europeanist in some things (I think its "our" part to regard the American War politics ) but I want to have 1 Additional Seat for Germany as wantet from the G4 nations idea. This means 3 stable Seats for these three Eu-States + the rotating thing for the other EU-States. I reverted this in your Artikel.++Scooterman 17:54, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

I've removed your change as it is not logically in accordance with Europeanist thinking. Europeanism calls for a common position in international bodies. This is impossible when individual member states hold the EU's seat(s) in the UN Security Council. A good compromise between the two positions was reached in the negotiations for the EU Constitution underwhich the EU Foreign Minister would speak in the Security Council whenever Britain & France had agreed a common EU position with the rest of the EU foreign ministers and the EU Commission.
The German grab for a seat was, in my view, a misguided power-grap by Shroeder and I doubt Merkel will continue the policy.