Talk:Human Y-chromosome DNA haplogroup

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[edit] Ancestry of Haplogroup F

The template nor the explanations of this page make it very clear; From the template, it seems as if Haplogroup F descends directly from the MCRA, and it doesn't come from A, B, C or DE. However, it could be meant that F comes from B which comes from A but is a different branch than C? Does anybody know which is the case? This needs to be more clearly explained in the article Nagelfar 22:01, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

I think the template and the indentation and the text are all fairly consistent. I read them all to say that F is a sibling branch to C and DE -- ie F and C and DE all share a common ancestor, characterised by the M168 and M294 mutations. According to the Hg F article, F became differentiated from this common ancestor about 45,000 years ago.

This common ancestor of CDEF (properly called CR) is in turn sibling to Haplogroup B; and their common ancestor BCDEF (properly called BR) is sibling to Haplogroup A.

That seemed fairly clear to me from the article; but if you think you can make it plainer, then go for it. Jheald 22:51, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

Haplogroups C, DE, and F are all descended from an extremely ancient haplogroup called Haplogroup CR, which was a "brother haplogroup" of Haplogroup B. At present, Haplogroup B is most frequently found among the Hadzabe and various ethnic groups classified as "pygmies," such as the Biaka and Mbuti. The haplogroups derived from Haplogroup CR are, of course, the only Y-chromosome haplogroups that are commonly found among populations outside of Africa, while haplogroups E, J, K2, and R1, which are derived from Haplogroup CR, are also common among modern African populations. I have heard that some Y-chromosomes classified as Haplogroup CR*, i.e. parallel to Haplogroup C, Haplogroup DE, and Haplogroup F as descendants of Haplogroup CR (the brother of Haplogroup B and founder of all modern extra-African populations), have been found among populations of the Nile River Valley.

It's interesting how in the article it further states Haplogroup "F" as "(GR)" & Haplogroup "K" as "(LR)". However, GR & LR are absent from the template. Is this because they are more clearly identified with modern F & K but BR, CR & CF are not as identified with their modern equivalents? I mean, I can clearly see how those latter ones could be placed upon a "tree" but not GR & LR in relation to those two F & K Haplogroups. Nagelfar (talk) 11:14, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Multi-mutations on the Y- chromosome

What are the frequencies of multi-mutations on the Y-chromosome? Will that give us some indication of male human population dynamics in the recent past? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.155.100.190 (talk) 22:28, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Proposal to create a WikiProject: Genetic History

I have put up a suggestion at Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Proposals to create a new WikiProject, WikiProject: Genetic History.

To quote from what I've written there:

Description

A wikiproject for articles on DNA research into genetic genealogy and genealogical DNA tests; the history and spread of human populations as revealed by eg human Y-chromosome and mitochondrial DNA haplogroups; and similar. Many such articles can be found in Category:Genetic genealogy and its subcategories, notably the subcategories on human haplogroups.

Rationale

• My direct motivation for seeking this Wikiproject was a recent run-in at Y-chromosomal Aaron, where I desperately missed the lack of a relevant WikiProject talk page to go to, to attract the input, advice and views of knowledgeable editors in this area.

There's a lot of general public interest in the proposed subject area -- eg the Y-chromosomal Aaron page is apparently getting well over 100 hits a day, and over the last 18 months or so there's been a lot of material added, by a fair number of different editors, mostly editing different pages which are particularly relevant to them. IMO, a central wikiproject would be useful, and also a good place to be able to bring WP:OR, WP:V, and WP:general cluelessness issues for wider informed input.

Wikipedia:WikiProject Molecular and Cellular Biology and Wikipedia:WikiProject Evolutionary biology do already exist, but their focus is much much broader. With regard to those project's charters, I believe the subject would be seen as a rather specialist niche topic area, rather out of the mainstream of those project's normal focus. On the other hand, I believe that there are a number of wikipedia editors (and readers) who are specifically interested in the subject, who would find advantage if there were a specific wikiproject for it. Jheald (talk) 12:56, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

If people think this would be a good idea, it's a target for WikiProjects to have at least five "interested" signatures to show there's some support, before they get going.

Alternatively, if people think it would be a bad idea, please leave a comment in the comments section.

Either way, please show what you think, at Wikipedia:WikiProject_Council/Proposals#Genetic_History

Thanks, Jheald (talk) 13:09, 22 February 2008 (UTC)