User talk:Horlo

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Contents 1 Welcome! 2 Regarding reversions made on July 24, 2007 to Kiev 3 Kyiv 4 Re:request to move to kyiv 5 PLEASE STOP 6 Responded 7 Tag 8 Your recent edits 9 Request for Mediation 10 Thanks 11 Thanks 12 Kiev/Kyiv 13 Re: Sorry 14 hello 15 A quick question. 16 Thanks 17 request 18 Three revert rule 19 sometimes one hears good news 19.1 Greetings 19.2 Holodomor rename 20 З новим старим роком 21 Move 22 Re: Trolling 23 AfD nomination of Ivan Rohach 24 kiev 25 Ukrainian nationalism edits 26 articles 27 Holodomor Article 28 Genocide 29 a wikipedia award for your valuable work

[edit] Welcome!

Hello, Horlo, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

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I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question and then place {{helpme}} before the question on your talk page. Again, welcome! 

[edit] Regarding reversions made on July 24, 2007 to Kiev

You currently appear to be engaged in an edit war. Note that the three-revert rule prohibits making more than three reversions in a content dispute within a 24 hour period. Additionally, users who perform a large number of reversions in content disputes may be blocked for edit warring, even if they do not technically violate the three-revert rule. If you continue, you may be blocked from editing. Please do not repeatedly revert edits, but use the talk page to work towards wording and content which gains a consensus among editors. Alex Bakharev 23:40, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

You have been blocked for violating the three-revert rule on Kiev. Due to your use of a sockpuppet, your block has been extended to 48 hours. Your userpage has also been marked to indicate that you have abused multiple accounts; do not remove the tag. You may resume editing after your block expires, but continued edit warring and sockpuppetry will result in longer blocks without warning. Kafziel ^Talk 05:21, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

I have to restart your block as you were trying to avoid it editing as User:69.251.192.72 Please wait until the end of your block Alex Bakharev 05:08, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Dude,

It's not me!

But I guess I'm not alone!

Check out all of these other isps!

Regards, Horlo

By the way, I tried talking to Kafziel, but my account has been blocked. Once the block is off, I'll just talk to him.

You can go ahead and talk right here. I'm listening. As long as you don't insult my intelligence by saying you aren't the same person as Hkdd, I'm willing to answer any questions you may have. It's not too late to become a good editor (if you're done with the edit warring and sockpuppetry) and I'd be happy to help. Just be patient, as I'm busy in real life over the next few days. Kafziel ^Talk 13:04, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Kafziel,

How are you? Good luck on the move. Anyways, the reason for hkdd/horlo is that I was working on different computers and didn't remember the passwords. As of the time that this became more than a one-shot deal, you will notice that hkdd stopped.

About the naming of Kyiv, it seems that every time I say something to Alex, he just replies that he wants consensus. As to numbers, I did some checking about media - BBC, CBC, ABC (australia), and ABC (US) - all use Kyiv. Most major newspapers outside the US use Kyiv (for example The Globe And Mail - the only national newspaper in Canada), as does the Christian Science monitor. Every government uses Kyiv.

With respect to google hits, because the name Kiev has been used for so long, and not just for the city (camera, class of aircraft carrier, restaurants, food, etc.) unless somebody is willing to go through the links and manually discount all of the ones that do not refer to the city, I submit that the test should be considered invalid. (on the other hand, I think that it may be reasonable to assume that every link to Kyiv would refer to the city, as most people don't have time to go back and change links made before 1991).

With respect to "the person on the street" - I think that most people really don't care. As an English teacher, I talk to all kinds of people every day, and nobody has put up a fight. However, as most news organizations/governments are changing, people who are looking for more information about Kyiv and are re-directed to Kiev - may be confused. Realistically, there is no objective way of judging this.

For some reason, throughout all of the archives that I saw on this page, the discussion stops at this page, and some editors just go back to naming it Kiev.

And you have my word that I have not changed the page since the block went up.

Horlo

[edit] Kyiv

Wikipedia's naming conventions just don't support moving the article right now. No matter how much energy you put into it, you won't find the consensus for the name change right now, and it can't happen without consensus.

Put your energy into important writing about Ukraine. See my comments at Talk:Kiev#Discussion. Pryvit. —Michael Z. 2007-07-30 05:35 Z

[edit] Re:request to move to kyiv

Tnx for the note but I am not a specialist w/ regards to Ukrainian names. I can only recommend reading WP:NCGN and second Michael that names are not that important. -- _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk}  18:16, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

This is the ENGLISH language version of Wikipedia and we spell it Kiev. We also spell a host of other capitol cities differently to the way the natives of those places spell it (Munich instead of Munchen, Warsaw instead of Warszawa, Vienna instead of Wien). If you wish to set up a Ukrainian (etc) Wikipedia in that language fine, but you should not expect English speakers to change 2000 years of tradition. David Lauder 14:14, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Please don't mass-message people on this (or any other...) issue: it could be construed as internal spam. Looking briefly at the talk page, it appears this has already been heavily discussed: holding polls until one gets "the right result" isn't a useful basis to proceed. BTW, from where do you get the idea that the BBC uses "Kyiv"? That would most definitely not appear to be the case. Alai 03:59, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

FWIW...search at bbc.com shows 4 pages of results for "Kyiv" and 234 pages of results for "Kiev". The common English spelling from a BBC point of view is "Kiev". Case closed. AKRadecki^Speaketh 04:20, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] PLEASE STOP

If you continue spamming talk pages, you will be blocked. ˉˉ^anetode╦╩ 03:57, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for stopping. There are several avenues available to you for the purpose of resolving disputes. You may try WP:MEDCAB, or WP:MEDCOM to resolve an argument with an individual user. Alternately, you could request a third opinion or file a request for comment. Canvassing all administrators is not a viable option. ˉˉ^anetode╦╩ 04:05, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

I second the above suggestions (and injunction). Ultimately, though, you may have wait for usage in the English-speaking world to "catch up" to Ukrainian preference, frustrating though that may be. Alai 04:09, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

As one of the people you spammed, I echo the above sentiment. But I will also address your question: If I were to participate, I would voice a strong oppose. The Ukraine article is not Ukrayina, Germany is not Deutschland. This is the English Wikipedia, and our guidelines clearly state that the common English usage is the preferred title. You have not shown that your version is the preferred English version. I live in the U.S., but as a hobby I've read much about Soviet history, and I have a nice sized library of books on the subject...all in English, most published in the U.S. (though some are from the U.K.). All have it spelled "Kiev". You'd have to provide some pretty compelling evidence that your version is the more common version here. Ultimately, why is it so important to you to change it? Do you realize how much combined editors' time has been wasted on this when there's so many articles that genuinely need improving? AKRadecki^Speaketh 04:10, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Unfortunately it appears that you already have, in effect, solicited a third opinion. I have to agree with Akradecki and Alai on this: while you are free to pursue dispute resolution, none of the above are methods for circumventing consensus. ˉˉ^anetode╦╩ 04:15, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

I think no-one whom you contacted will provide you a different opinion. Naming guidelines are very clear on this. Running poll after poll on the same matter would be classed as disruptive. Agathoclea 07:04, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Responded

I responded on my talk page. Cheers, Daniel 03:14, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

Please list all users who have given substantial input and who would be heavily interested/involved in reaching a consensus resolution as 'parties'. Cheers, Daniel 03:51, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Tag

I noticed that a sockpuppet notice has been placed on your user page. That is very unfortunate but there are ways to deal with it.

• First of all don't try to create new accounts or do something that may give real grounds for this type of accusations, that is counterproductive and will get the situation worse. There are legal ways to deal with it.
• Second, if you are innocent, remove the tag and complain to the admin. Be specific and state your reasons clearly and give examples.
• Third, if you are guilty of what they accuse you, it can be dealt with too. Just admit what you did and promise not to repeat it again and ask for forgiveness. It happened that people were forgiven and their accounts restored.

Also, don't give up, ask for help. I put this page on my watch, leave your comments here, I will try to help. I will also be asking the person who tagged the page for further explanation. Hang on. Good luck. --Hillock65 04:30, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

• • Thanks for the advice.

Really it doesn't annoy me. I was on a different computer and didn't have access to my login & password, and just created a new account instead of doing it anonymously.

What annoys me is that they think that everybody who agrees with me is a sockpuppet.

Anyways, about Kyiv, I put in a request for Mediation. Some of the arguments now are quite, well, interesting. We'll see what happens with the mediation. Hopefully that will bring the discussion back to the topic, and progress can be made.

Bud'mo Horlo 06:02, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

• • Whatever you do, please take good care of yourself and don't get yourself blocked. As you probablly know there are enough people here, who want Ukrainian editors blocked and forced out of Wikipedia. Don't give them the satisfaction. Take one step at a time and be careful. Good luck.--Hillock65 12:37, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Your recent edits

Hi, there. In case you didn't know, when you add content to talk pages and Wikipedia pages that have open discussion, you should sign your posts by typing four tildes ( ~~~~ ) at the end of your comment. On many keyboards, the tilde is entered by holding the Shift key, and pressing the key with the tilde pictured. You may also click on the signature button located above the edit window. This will automatically insert a signature with your name and the time you posted the comment. This information is useful because other editors will be able to tell who said what, and when. Thank you! --SineBot 06:31, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Request for Mediation

A Request for Mediation to which you were are a party was not accepted and has been delisted. You can find more information on the case subpage, Wikipedia:Requests for mediation/Kiev. For the Mediation Committee, Daniel 08:18, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

This message delivered by MediationBot, an automated bot account operated by the Mediation Committee to perform case management.
If you have questions about this bot, please contact the Mediation Committee directly.

[edit] Thanks

Thanks for the help with Kyiv. Too bad that some people just don't want to keep an open mind.

Horlo 16:14, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

By the way, do you still think that the name should be changed to Kyiv? Thanks, Horlo 02:59, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Well, seeing that a lot of people still use Kiev, I think we should wait, maybe a year or two. I have my own opinion about the situation; however, I don't think it will help the case at all for now. What we need to focus on is writing the articles themselves, and not fighting over the names they have. So for now, the case should rest, no matter how stronly we feel about the issue and how frustrating it will be accepting it. — Alex^(U|C|E) 06:42, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Alex,

What is your opinion? I think that more people use Kyiv, so the name should change now.

I am just the kind of person who likes to do one thing at a time. I have learned the hard way that if I try too many things, none of them get done well. That's why I want to do this article, and then move to others.

Thanks, Horlo 06:51, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

I think we should wait, there's just not enough support for the name at this point. By the way, from what I can tell, you're not focusing on the article itself, just the name. Just focus on the content, okay? Leave the names alone for now, as they're the source of conflicts on Wikipedia. After all, we're all here for one reason: to write articles. And neutral ones, at that. Don't feel that I'm targeting any of the users here, but people shouldn't use Wikipedia to push across a certain point of view. We might both not agree about the name for Kiev. And we might have good facts to back us up. However, that's not enough at this point. What we want to do is for people to start accepting the new name. So here's my advice: leave the naming issue alone, for now. We'll come back to it in a year. Work on articles right now instead: name changing is easy to do, it only takes a minute. However, great articles take days, weeks, to write. — Alex^(U|C|E) 07:46, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Thanks

Hello,

Thank you for the welcome.

Please let me explain the sockpuppet situation:

I was doing research for a course that I teach, and came across the Kyiv article. However, I was working on a different computer at the time, one which did not have my password saved. I made the changes from that computer, under a different username.

However, since I started using this computer, I did not create any other sockpuppets. A few times I added comments before signing in, so I went back and signed them after I signed in - I wanted to assume responsibility for my words.

I think some people do not realize how emotional this issue is for many people.

I hope you get it unblocked - I was actually thinking of making a request for comment, but somebody made a request for move first. I tried emailing administrators, but that didn't work. I tried mediation, but that didn't work. I'm just happy that there are other people taking an interest in this article.

Thanks, Horlo 05:40, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

I didn't state it outright, so please let me do it now. After the HKDD account, I have not created any sockpuppets. I will not create any more sockpuppets.

By the way, at the beginning of this discussion, I wanted simply to hold a straw poll, a RfC. An administrator suggested that I also add a Request to Move at the same time. That's why I kind of barged in, but I hope that you can see from my discussion on the page that I prefer to discuss rather than force.

Thanks, Horlo 05:50, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Kiev/Kyiv

Here is a simple request. I am going to ask that Kiev be unprotected, but before I do that I need to ask you to promise not to make any attempt to change Kiev to Kyiv anywhere in the article or as the name of the article. There is a process that needs to be gone through before that happens, and I have re-opened that process. I need to ask you to respect the process no matter what happens, but by unprotecting the article everyone can contribute to the article, and I am hoping that you might have something to contribute. However, on the English language Wikipedia there are about 2,000,000 articles right now, and I would encourage you to use the same username for all of your edits. I trust that you have read the articles on sockpuppets? While there is nothing wrong with using different names for different purposes, it is more respected in the Wikipedia community if only one username is used. 199.125.109.78 05:32, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Hello,

Thank you for the welcome.

Please let me explain the sockpuppet situation:

I was doing research for a course that I teach, and came across the Kyiv article. However, I was working on a different computer at the time, one which did not have my password saved. I made the changes from that computer, under a different username.

However, since I started using this computer, I did not create any other sockpuppets. A few times I added comments before signing in, so I went back and signed them after I signed in - I wanted to assume responsibility for my words.

I think some people do not realize how emotional this issue is for many people.

I hope you get it unblocked - I was actually thinking of making a request for comment, but somebody made a request for move first. I tried emailing administrators, but that didn't work. I tried mediation, but that didn't work. I'm just happy that there are other people taking an interest in this article.

Thanks, Horlo 05:40, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

No problem. Wikipedia gets vandalized a lot and a lot of people try to do favorable edits as well. The Wikipedia community has developed established procedures to deal with each situation. I need a more definite promise from you that you will not make any naming edits until after the issue has been resolved. Please keep discussion here. It is difficult for me to find if you reply on IP talk page. 199.125.109.78 06:08, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Hello,

I promise not to change anything on the Kyiv/Kiev page until this situation is resolved.

One of the issues that I put forth at the beginning of this debate was that I find the name "Kiev" pejorative. I still do, as it represents either colonialism or institutionalized slaughter. I will not do anything the page until it is called Kyiv. Then, I want to add a lot, and not just there, but on many pages about Ukraine - pictures, descriptions, lots.

Please understand, however, that I am not the only person taking part in this discussion. I'm not sure if you noticed, but you are now considered my sockpuppet on the Kyiv/Kiev discussion, also. I promise not to do anything, however.

Thanks, Horlo 06:38, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Any suggestion that I am anyones sockpuppet or meatpuppet is laughable and will be deleted on sight from the discussion. 199.125.109.35 22:40, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Absolutely, That's what annoys me about this issue. Everybody has a right to an opinion, and I don't expect everybody to agree with me.

However, it has many times been suggested that anybody who supports the move to Kyiv is my sockpuppet or meatpuppet.

Thanks, Horlo 23:26, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Re: Sorry

Heh! It's okay! Erring is human... and besides, some good came out of it (like the upcoming malformed RFC detector). Mind telling me which page you may have mistyped on? (That is, if I can't find it in your contribution listing.) MessedRocker (talk) 02:34, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] hello

Your efforts to have wikipedia refer to Kyiv by its correct name are laudable. Sadly, there are some who are not as concerned with accuracy as we are. Thanks for your efforts. I wish you the best, Ostap 22:51, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

Horlo, you have to get that sockpuppet nonsense off your userpage. Cheers. Eduvalko 03:53, 16 September 2007 (UTC)

I will remove it myself. Horlo is annoying still annoyinh but since socking stopped there is no need to keep the tag for old sins. --Irpen 04:52, 16 September 2007 (UTC)

Horlo, may I send you an email (using the link at the left) about the Kyiv contoversy? Ostap 00:10, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

Ostape,

Please feel free to email me anytime. Thanks, Horlo 05:33, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

Sorry about the delay. Ostap 15:51, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] A quick question.

Hello Horlo. Ever since the vote on Київ's talk page I've been pretty much ignoring the whole Kyiv/Kiev issue, and to be completely honest I don't really care much one way or the other. You on the other hand seem to be very obsessed with the controversy. So a little while ago I decided to look you up in the edit-counter and this, really amazed me. You have 357 edits on WikiPedia, ALL Kyiv/Kiev related. Where is this passion coming from; and why do you such concern on this topic and no interest what so ever in anything else Ukraine-related? (we could really use some help). Just wondering, best regards, Bogdan 03:44, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Thanks

Thanks for turning your attention at last to expanding Ukraine related articles. We can use any help we can get as there are too few editors in this sector of Wikipedia.

If you are generaaly interested in Ukraine-related themes, you may want to check out the Ukraine Portal, particularly the Portal:Ukraine/New article announcements and Portal:Ukraine/Ukraine-related Wikipedia notice board. The New article announcements board is probably the most important and the most attended one. Please don't forget to announce there the new articles you create. Adding both boards to your watchlist is probably a good idea.

Finally, in case you are interested, similar boards exist at Russia portal as many editors contribute to topics related to both countries. The respective boards there are: Portal:Russia/New article announcements and Portal:Russia/Russia-related Wikipedia notice board. Of course there are also many other portals at Wikipedia or you may just get right into editing.

Again, welcome! --Irpen 02:33, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] request

Hello, I know that this statement you added to the slur term "Little Russian" is true, but someone reverted it because it is unsourced and in violation of another annoying wikipedia policy: WP:OR.

"This is possibly due to the fact that because of the Valuev Circular of 1863 and the Emz Ukaz of 1876, the Ukrainian language was banned in the Russian empire. According to the official Russian government, the name was "Little Russia", even though the name Ukraine was locally used.

Do you think you could find an authorative reference that says this? Then it could be put back in. Thanks, Ostap 02:05, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Three revert rule

Horlo, I am watching the revert war on the Kyiv discussion page. Don't get sucked into this because it may trigger the three reverts and your blocked rule. Don't have a quick link for this but its a big Wiki thing. Otherwise keep up the struggle. Ciao Eduvalko 03:02, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

I looked up the Wiki page for the 3R rule and its pretty staightforward to report if you know how to link Wiki pages. My guess is that these "reverter" will claim that they are fighting vandalism and then it goes tit for tat. It would be good if we bring an administrator in for this. RegardsEduvalko 12:52, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

I asked administrator Mzajac to look at it, and he removed the line about consensus. Ostap 00:57, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

• Thanks for telling me. I only added some links, it is a very good article. This is an article User:Bandurist would be very interested in. Thanks, Ostap 01:56, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

Here is a little advice. If the personal attacks are bothering you, you can always report them here. Ostap 00:21, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] sometimes one hears good news

Check out http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special%3AIpblocklist&ip=reginmund Cheers Eduvalko (talk) 04:43, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

Join us at Zaporozhian Cossacks Bandurist (talk) 16:01, 29 December 2007 (UTC)

If you want, come help with Ukrainian embroidery. It still needs help being developed, and there is no arguing with propagandists yet. But who knows what can happen here... Ostap 08:48, 30 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Greetings

• Сійся, родися, жито, пшениця,

Горох, чечевиця,i всяка пашниця,

Внизу корениста,зверху колосиста,

Щоб на майбутній рік було більше, ніж торік.

Щоб всього було доволі i в коморі, і на полі.

Сію, сію, посіваю, з Новим роком Поздоровляю!

• Щастя, радості, краси, бочку меду вам в труси.

Щоб не злиплись яйця голі,молодичок Вам доволі.

А щоб сало було в хаті, кабани хай волохаті

Запетрушать свиноматок, отоді буде достаток.

З Старим новим роком!

Bandurist (talk) 01:54, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

Thanks very much for the wishes. And Happy New Year to you, too! Turgidson (talk) 07:24, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

Sorry for the delay also. Thank you very much and I wish you the best in the coming year. And by the way, did you see the deletion discussion here? Not a single delete, nothing but keep votes. Ostap 07:36, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

The article has really turned out well. Hopefully many people will read it. Ostap 07:45, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Holodomor rename

Just to let you know there appears to be consensus from both *sides* to rename "Holodomor denial" to "Denial of the Holodomor" to avoid ambiguity or accidental association with denial of the Holodomor as genocide (and move us toward eventual tag removal). Hope you also agree so we can take care of that issue and move on to deal with the article contents. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Vecrumba (talk • contribs) 02:47, 5 January 2008 (UTC)

Denial of the Holodomor A lot of "interesting" activity there recently. Bandurist 19:28, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] З новим старим роком

Сію, вію, посіваю, з Новим роком поздоровляю!

На щастя, на здоров'я та на Новий рік,

Щоб уродило краще, ніж торік, -

Жито, пшениця і всяка пашниця,

Коноплі під стелю на велику куделю.

Будьте здорові з Новим роком та з Василем!

Дай, Боже!

Bandurist (talk) 01:01, 14 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Move

I added Kiev to the official move request page at WP:RM. It clearly says to use the talk page of the article. If anyone removes it, they need to let us know how to get the request move discussion started. If not, I guess you should just move it. Regards, Ostap 01:07, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Re: Trolling

Horlo darling, those accurate comments were from a year ago. Please don't troll on my talk page. Deacon of Pndapetzim (Talk) 11:43, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

Horlo, just ignore the above trolling. This user now accuses me of being your sockpuppet. Disruption is not fun to deal with, but it is sadly something that happens on wikipedia. There is good information about what to do here. Ostap 21:02, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

I did no such thing Ostap! Deacon of Pndapetzim (Talk) 21:27, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

In the edit summary. But that's okay. I'll just keep editing quietly. Ostap 21:33, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

Hard luck Horlo ... absolutely no chance of me "please refrain"ing from that. Gave me a good laugh though. Deacon of Pndapetzim (Talk) 12:20, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

So, you refuse to refrain from making personal attacks? How petty. Remeber Horlo, ignore the trolls. Ostap 17:46, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

No more than I refuse flying to-and-fro on my pig. If you actually think I am a WP:Troll, rather than this being an actual personal attack, you should be setting an example and taking your own advice! Deacon of Pndapetzim (Talk) 18:08, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] AfD nomination of Ivan Rohach

Please make a comment Bandurist (talk) 03:07, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

An editor has nominated Ivan Rohach, an article on which you have worked or that you created, for deletion. We appreciate your contributions, but the nominator doesn't believe that the article satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion and has explained why in his/her nomination (see also "What Wikipedia is not").

Your opinions on whether the article meets inclusion criteria and what should be done with the article are welcome; please participate in the discussion by adding your comments at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ivan Rohach and please be sure to sign your comments with four tildes (~~~~).

[edit] kiev

Earlier I was at the university library and found a copy of Ukraine: Birth of a Modern Nation (New York: Oxford University Press, 2007) by Dr. Serhy Yekelchyk. I was amazed to find he used the improper "Kyiv" spelling. What an error! The poor nationalist probably doesn't know that a handful of anonymous wikipedia editors have already decided that this is incorrect! I am thinking of writing to him and to Oxford University to express my disappointment. What do you think?Ostap 06:21, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Ukrainian nationalism edits

Horlo, no-one questions that the centre of Kievan Rus lay at Kiev, but the article Ukrainian nationalism is about a modern political ideology. As such it is a modern phenomenon, and general history is really for other places, and certainly medieval history is. Discussing how history has been used in Ukrainian nationalism is acceptable, but that isn't what you're doing. Regards, Deacon of Pndapetzim (Talk) 09:53, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] articles

Hey Horlo, when you write new articles about dissidents, could you post them at the Portal:Ukraine/New article announcements page? That way others can find them and expand them. And good luck at the Denial of Holodomor page, it looks like that tag-adding circus won't end anytime soon. I would help, but I don't know what more can be said... Ostap 04:45, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Holodomor Article

Take a look at the Portuguese Holodomor article at http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor It identifies with references all the countries that recognize the genocide aspect of the Holodomor.Bobanni (talk) 19:46, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Genocide

Don't know if you have heard already, but on Sat. April 12 there will be a conference at Columbia University: The Ukraine Famine, 1932-1933: Was It a Genocide?. If you happen to be in that area for some reason, it looks pretty interesting (skip to page 52). Ostap 00:06, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

A while back, you brought up renaming Petro Mohyla. The discussion has started again, and seeing as you commented before I thought I would tell you. Ostap 19:44, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] a wikipedia award for your valuable work