Talk:Holy anointing oil
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This article was nominated for deletion on 17 February 2008. The result of the discussion was Keep. |
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[edit] Merger with Chrism
Oppose merge. Chrism, as that article explains, is a Greek word representing a specifically Christian concept in current use in various churches, whereas the Hebrew Bible concept of Holy Annointing Oil is shared between Jews and Christians and supports specifically Jewish interpretations not appropriate for the chrism article. Best, --Shirahadasha 17:03, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
- Oppose merge, for the reasons stated above; and also because even within the Christian context Holy anointing oil may or may not be Chrism, depending upon the context. The Orthodox will use Chrism for Baptism, consecrating Antimensia, and anointing kings, but holy anointing oil is used for Unction and on other occasions. Even within baptism there are two anointings, one with blessed oil before the baptism and one with Chrism at the Chrismation. MishaPan 17:18, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
- Oppose merge since neither the reason for use, the process of use and the materials used are compatible to the distinct societies and cultures, at different times in history.--Mrg3105 (talk) 06:41, 21 December 2007 (UTC)
I think we can go ahead and remove it. If anyone still thinks it should be there it can be reconsidered. —Whig (talk) 06:54, 21 December 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Merger with Shemen Afarsimon
- Propose merge. A merger is a no brainer here -- the two articles are on the identical topic, see WP:Content forking. The only question is what to name the article. Note that one will simply redirect to the other. Best, --Shirahadasha (talk) 23:45, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
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- There was a discussion at Talk:Holy anointing oil#Merger with Chrism which resulted in insufficient support for merger. The merge tag was deleted. If you object you might want to mention this in the discussion and restore the merge tag. Best, --Shirahadasha (talk) 23:38, 23 December 2007 (UTC)
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- Actually not. The Afarsemon article needs editing. Afarsemon oil was not a religious artifact, it was a secular product and a major item in Middle-Eastern trade. It was the product that made Ein Gedi a wealthy town. That some of this product may have been used in the Temple doesn't make it inherently religious. -- Zsero (talk) 18:08, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Translations
There are many translations of scriptural texts. Relying upon one translation to the exclusion of others is problematic. Whig (talk) 23:58, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Merge?
The Holy Anointing Oil as described in Exodus 30, is NOT used in Chrism in any Orthodox Church, Roman Catholic Church, nor is it systematically used in any other denomination that believes in the sacrament of "Chrism." Therefore to merge this article with Chrism would make little sense.
The Shemen Afarshimon of Psalm 133 which was used in anointing Kings, Priests, and Prophets is most probably not the Exodus 30 Oil which was to be used on the Aaronic Priesthood only. If the Jones Institute is using the correct name for the oil found it may be the Persimmon Oil or the Balsom Oil used for Kings, Priests and Prophets who were not of the sons of Aaron. Again this question merits this article retain it's separate identity.
Finally, including the translation of the Exodus 30 ingredient called "Calamus" while neglecting translating the other ingredients betrays the authors personal agenda in proving the Holy Anointing Oil was used as an hallucinagenic sacrament. Serious translations do not harbor such a frivolous thought.
In the future, if time permits, I intend to register as a Wikipedia editor and will attempt to add to this article. I simply have no time at present.
Dr. W (talk) 04:03, 28 January 2008 (UTC)
- It should be noted that calamus is a potent hallucinogenic herb in its own right.[1] —Whig (talk) 08:05, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
- Have you any idea just how uncertain the translations of terms in that part of the bible is? There's very little certainty about the correct translation of the ingredients; Calamus is certainly not the usual translation. Clinkophonist (talk) 20:34, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
I would turn this article into a disambiguation page to be honest. Clinkophonist (talk) 20:34, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Editing Needed
This article is parsimonious in content of a subject consisting of great depth. I would like to add some to this article.
I am concerned about the emphasis translating one ingredient over the others. This is a very hotly debated translation and would seem better suited in the existing Cannabis article ( or at least in a separate section at the end of this Holy Anointing Oil article). However I do not want to just charge in editing things disrespectfully. I would prefer to civilly discuss this matter further and attempt a joint edit text that we can then propose on the basis of our mutual agreement.
