Talk:Holy War (Boston College vs. Notre Dame)

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Holy War (Boston College vs. Notre Dame) is part of WikiProject College football, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to college football on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.
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[edit] Suggestion to merge from Boston College Eagles football section

There is currently a long, ranbling section about the same topic in the Boston College Eagles football article. I suggest cleaning it up for npov and neutral tone and then moving it here. 24.91.215.57 (talk) 20:25, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Use

JMM13, I realize Wake is a fine school, but your edits to this article make it clear that you need to learn more about the distiction between fact and opinion. You also have removed portions of the article that are factually accurate. You stated that you removed opinion, but then re-inserted the line "many students who dont get into ND end up at BC". Is it possible for a statement to be any more opinion than that, given that the admission stats don't back it up?

Not sure who the annoying ND fan is who keeps re editing this page, but if ND as strong a school as he argues, perhaps he might be capable of using correct grammar, and start referring to graduates of his beloved institution as "alumni" not "alums".

I removed the passage "For Boston College fans, the game is an annual chance to show that Boston College is a worthy spoiler in Division I-A college football. For Notre Dame, the game is their 11th most important historical rivalry, just behind USC, Michigan, Michigan State University, Navy, Army, Purdue, the University of Miami (Florida), Pittsburgh, Penn State, and the annual intrasquad Blue and Gold game." This is an opinion that is perjorative toward BC appears to be a perpetuation of an ND fan's belief that BC exists only to defeat ND. A search on ND published newspapers and websites indicates a great deal more attention to this game than Miami, Pitt, Army or Penn State, which indicates a factual flaw in this statement.

Disagree with the merge with the Ireland Trophy and Leahy Bowl. These are two seperate awards, started at different times, by different organizations. AriGold 12:05, 28 September 2005 (UTC)

I incorporated most of the info from these two articles into the section called "Trophies." --Mulenberg 17:20, 28 September 2005 (UTC)

Page is temporarily protected until vandals find something else to do. --DanielCD 16:52, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

This term is not used or recognized by any Notre Dame fans. Don't know where you are finding proof of this. --MrCalifornia 03:18, 15 November 2005 (UTC)

A quick survey of major media outlets shows that this term has currency by parties neutral to the rivalry. Some examples: CBS (http://cbs.sportsline.com/login?xurl=/nfl/story/7825520), CNN/Sports Illustrated (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/college/news/1998/11/03/week11_previews/), USA Today (http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/USAToday/access/56239298.html?FMT=FT&FMTS=FT&date=Nov+9%2C+1992&author=Michael+Hiestand&pub=USA+TODAY+(pre-1997+Fulltext)&desc=Trumpy%2C+Enberg+make+game+worth+watching), New York Daily News (http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/story/120451p-108484c.html) --18.95.1.44 02:48, 16 November 2005 (UTC)

The term isn't really used by BC fans either, who are more likely to nickname it the Vatican Bowl. In fact, there were hats with that term made unofficially in the 1990s. Holy War seems to be a media term, as noted by the citations above.

  • The article itself was lacking references, so I cited the ones above in addition to some others. When/if I have the time I'll try to do the same for these other nicknames, though they are more colloquial. 24.91.215.57 (talk) 00:41, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] ESPN Rivalry rankings - BYU vs. U of U is the Holy War?

ESPN's Ranking college football's best rivalries lists BYU vs. U of U as the "Holy War". It fails to list BC at all, and ND's rivalry is with USC. As a Utah resident I have noticed that the "Holy War" term is consistently used for the BYU-U of U rivalry. I actually was considering creating a page on the rivalry (especially with its rivalry extending back to 1942 or earlier) until I discovered this page. Any ideas on what should happen?


I think the term Holy War arose because both schools are Catholic. While anyone can use any term they want in sportswriting, I am not clear how the BYU vs U of U game should be called this since Utah is not a religiously-founded institution. If another Mormon school were playing BYU it could make sense. Anyway, I think Vatican Bowl is a funnier name for the ND-BC thing, but I guess it was too politically incorrect to catch on.

My guess is that the use of "Holy War" in Utah is, to a degree, ironic. BYU is, of course, owned and operated by the LDS Church. Utah, on the other hand, is not only public, but is from my understanding ferociously secular. — Dale Arnett 07:10, 23 November 2005 (UTC)

I live in Utah, and I have heard it referred to as the Holy War before. Never made much sense to me either, but whatever. bob rulz 08:05, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] i'm new to this, so bear with me please

this article should not be wasting space on the internet. the rivalry was fun enough while it lasted, which was incredibly short, but it's over. somebody who knows how to should just delete the whole damn thing. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mitnibobo (talk • contribs) 07:21, November 30 2005(UTC)

Hi there, if you feel the article should be deleted, the deletion critieria is shown here and the nomination process for deleting articles is outlined here. - Akamad 07:25, 30 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] The recent hockey edits

I reverted all the hockey stuff. While the use of the word "rival" is debatable even for football as the two schools are not in the same conference and don't regularly play; it is clearly not appropriate to expand this to hockey, where the teams only play sporadically. Please remember to follow consensus. -- KelleyCook (talk) 14:27, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

  • You reverted more than the hockey stuff. You also deleted the cited references of the term as it relates to the football game. 24.91.215.57 (talk) 06:18, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
  • But your point is well taken, and you're right to distinguish between the "rivalry" (real or imagined) and the use of the term "Holy War." Whether or not a rivalry exists, the term clearly does and is well documented in the mainstream media. That said, the fact that the term "holy war" was also used by the media in the context of the recent hockey championship strikes me as entirely appropriate for an article on this term. Based on that, I've restored the previous edits that deal with the use of the term "Holy War" while omitting those that dealt with the "rivalry" in general. 24.91.215.57 (talk) 06:18, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Ireland Trophy

Recent edits have gone back and for on whether this trophy was created by the student government at Notre Dame or by both school's student governments. I cannot find anything to suggest the BC student government's involvement in its creation. Please cite a source before re-attributing it. 24.91.215.57 (talk) 06:18, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Image copyright problem with Image:BostonCollegeEagles.png

The image Image:BostonCollegeEagles.png is used in this article under a claim of fair use, but it does not have an adequate explanation for why it meets the requirements for such images when used here. In particular, for each page the image is used on, it must have an explanation linking to that page which explains why it needs to be used on that page. Please check

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This is an automated notice by FairuseBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. --22:17, 16 May 2008 (UTC)