Talk:Helmuth von Ruckteschell

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

	This article is within the scope of the Military history WikiProject. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see lists of open tasks and regional and topical task forces. To use this banner, please see the full instructions.
Start	This article has been rated as Start-Class on the quality scale.
Additional information and associated task forces: This article has been checked against the following criteria for B-Class status: Referencing and citation: not checked Coverage and accuracy: not checked Structure: not checked Grammar: not checked Supporting materials: not checked To fill out this checklist, please add the following to the template call: <!-- B-Class-1. It is suitably referenced, and all major points have appropriate inline citations. --> |B-Class-1=yes/no <!-- B-Class-2. It reasonably covers the topic, and does not contain obvious omissions or inaccuracies. --> |B-Class-2=yes/no <!-- B-Class-3. It has a defined structure, including a lead section and one or more sections of content. --> |B-Class-3=yes/no <!-- B-Class-4. It is free from major grammatical errors. --> |B-Class-4=yes/no <!-- B-Class-5. It contains appropriate supporting materials, such as an infobox, images, or diagrams. --> |B-Class-5=yes/no Associated task forces (general topics): Military biography task force Associated task forces (nations and regions): German military history task force

Contents 1 Comment 2 Death 3 POV? 4 NPOV 5 WWI

[edit] Comment

He sometimes even targeted lifeboats while they were being lowered. His trial was in Hamburg and he got 10 years.

• Unsourced, anonymous comment. Citation? POV?.Xyl 54 08:21, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Death

When did he die? V. Joe 06:18, 3 June 2006 (UTC)

• Good question: Muggenthaler gives the date as 24th June, after describing the trial in May 1947; but he neglects to give the year, giving the impression his death was only a few weeks later. But another source gives the date in 1948, which someone has added to the article.Xyl 54 08:24, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] POV?

I've removed the following:-

"Although no official records exist to support the charge, it was rumored that he kicked an enlisted man, which left him very few friends in the command structure of the Kriegsmarine."
Is a rumour really notable enough to be included in an encyclopaedia article? And is the conclusion true? Muggenthaler states he was on good terms with Raeder, though he had a cavalier attitude to higher authority.

"By all accounts, Von Ruckteschell was very moody and introspective. His crew found him very difficulat to get along with. In addition, he suffered from severe migrane headaches."
By all accounts? Muggenthaler states he was respected by his crew, who appreciated that he held their safety and that of their ship to be of paramount importance.

If you've read Muggenthaler, then you know of the "red moon" incident. Which was joked about on the ships newpaper the very next day. It seems pretty obvious the crew thought of him as irasible. And the headaches are not in question.

"Unlike other commerce raider commanders, Von Ruckteschell habitually demonstrated a complete disregard for the lives and well-being of the seamen who became his prisoners. For example, he would think nothing of either not looking for survivors or setting prisoners adrift in small boats in mid-ocean when he felt that he had too many on board. In addition, warning shots were not fired at intended victims: the first shots usually were aimed at the bridge. All of these practices earned him after the war (in May 1947) a seven year sentence for violations of the rules of war: the only commerce raider captain to do so."
This is just POV; I’ve replaced it with a more factual account of the charges and defence; Also some items for perspective.
Xyl 54 08:37, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

He was the only raider captain whose conduct was not exemplary. The raiders were annoying. SOMEONE was going to be tried for SOMETHING over what they did. Ruckteschell was the closest thing to a case they had. If he'd never lived, they probably would have let the Australians lynch Detmers.

[edit] NPOV

The British maintain that von Ruckteschell was a war criminal and that his methods were brutal; on the other hand, the mostly (but not exclusively) German view is that the trial was an act of spite, because they had been unable to do so after the First World War. In the interests of NPOV, I think it behoves the English wiki to consider the German point of view on this, as , presumably, a german website on the subject should try and take in the British position.
Xyl 54 09:33, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] WWI

I've added a bit about his WWI service record; DeutchesMarineArchive has his service record, but lists him as commander of UB-54; uboat.net says this is U-54, which seems more correct. Xyl 54 16:43, 12 September 2007 (UTC)