Talk:Harvest Crusade

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[edit] CDThieme's Link

• Linking the Catholic Crusades where people were killed isn't appropriate. They have nothing to do with these Protestant events. I'm removing the controversial link until you can explain why it should be included and how it is relevant. --Jason Gastrich 19:29, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

The article linked to has a whole section on the usage of the term "crusade". Linking there lets the reader know the history and controversy surrounding the term. CDThieme 21:05, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

How is this pertinent to the entry? It is like using the word extermination, when talking about cockroaches, and having a link to the extermination of the Jews. There is no relation, so link should be removed. --Jason Gastrich 21:09, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

By the way, I asked you on your talk page why you have removed "Christ" from several entries that contained Jesus Christ. Please reply here. --Jason Gastrich 21:11, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

Because the article is at "Jesus" and adding "Christ" asserts a POV. Wikipedia has a NPOV policy. CDThieme 21:14, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

Christ was his title. It distinguishes him from other people named Jesus. --Jason Gastrich 21:15, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

Jesus goes directly to the article about the person meant, who is obviously the most famous person with that name. Yes, "Christ" is a title, a highly POV title. CDThieme 21:17, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for your POV. We'll see how that plays out. --Jason Gastrich 21:20, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

CDThieme's proposal is more impartial that yours Jason, isn't it? Jesus is not Christ to everyone. In fact he is not Christ to 3/4 of the earth's population. Izehar (talk) 21:23, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

Izehar, for now, I'll concede the point about Christ. I'm interested in the input of others, though. This discussion was started to discuss the issue of the crusades link; which hasn't been done, yet. --Jason Gastrich 21:31, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

However, CDThieme, it is clearly NPOV that among Christians this Jesus is known by the title "Christ". It doesn't seem to me to be POV to refer to Jesus Christ using that title in an article about an explicitly Christian topic. BTW I agree that the Crusade link was inappropriate.--Srleffler 06:56, 11 December 2005 (UTC)

I removed the crusade link. It is in fact not relevant here, given the context. You wouldn't say "so and so was a vile person", and then link vile to a "vile" article that covered "a small, narrow glass to hold liquid". Granted this example is a bit more extreme, but I believe it's applicable. Granted, there is some relevant info there at the end of the section, but I think the emphasis on the wars overshadows it to the point that it will cause more confusion than help.

Besides, the word is part of the article title and as such shouldn't be linked anyway. Technically this article is the definition of these types of crusades.

Also, Jason you might gain some ground with the Christ debate by using a direct quote that adds to the article. "According to Pastor Som Christianguy, who opened the Harvest Crusade in Bermuta, people '...come to these meetings because this music helps us feel closer to Jesus Christ.'" This statement is a complete fabrication, but just to give you a general idea. Of course, any direct quote is required to have a reference. Just consider it, a little savy can get some things where brute force fails. Of course it needs to be relevant and appropriate, etc.

Finally, I'm going to put a context tag on the article because I think it needs more definition in the introduction. I had to read quite a bit before I got the general idea, but a general definition in the intro will definitely improve the article. --DanielCD 20:06, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for your input and contributions, Daniel! --Jason Gastrich 23:01, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

Jesus IS the Christ whether others choose to believe it or not. I might believe the Earth is flat but that hardly changes the fact that it is indeed a spheroid. There is plenty of factual information to prove that Jesus Christ is Lord of all but I don't think this is the article to address that. If I don't believe Muhammed was a prophet, should I go to the Islam page and start badgering Muslims? Look up "Jesus Christ" in other encyclopedias...you will find an article there. Is Wikipedia going to become another revisionist text in order to appease those who choose to separate "fly shit from pepper"? Jesus Christ WAS and IS his title, if you choose not to believe it, fine. Just seems like phishing to me