Talk:Hamburg

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The Barbarossa charta was forged 1265 together with pertaining letters and other documents. They blew because they used the wrong seal. Frank A

Contents

[edit] Culture

What's wrong with the culture paragraph? "Landon. Landon. Lanon. Landon. Project. School. German. Laptop." Can somebody revert this. I don't know how to. You can delete my post after you've done that. Thanks! --125.237.6.196 (talk) 04:56, 20 January 2008 (UTC)


[edit] "Hamburgers"

"An international trade city, Hamburg is the commercial and cultural centre of Northern Germany. Its citizens are known as Hamburgers."

---> Uhm, sorry. but we are not known as "Hamburgers". Someone living in Hamburg is a Hamburger without the "s". But you cant eat us. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.177.204.244 (talk) 09:08, 28 January 2008 (UTC)

In German, one may write "Viele Hamburger sind..." and the form of the adjective and that of the verb make it clear that it's plural whereas the noun is still "Hamburger"; certainly NOT "Hamburgers". But this article is written in English. In German the plural of "Songwriter", a borrowed English word, is "Songwritern" with a final "n". If Germans can do that to an English word, how is the present case different? (Well, OK, they don't sell "Songwritern" at MacDonald's....) Michael Hardy (talk) 02:39, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
Correction "Songwritern" is dative singular; it's not the plural. Michael Hardy (talk) 04:18, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
Correction No, it's not. It's dative plural. You don't really have a clue, do you? Btw, are you really sure of that plural form for Hamburger? 82.82.71.127 (talk) 03:33, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Plural of "Autobahn"

Webster mentions both "Autobahns" and "Autobahnen" as (English) plural forms of "Autobahn" (while of course in German only "Autobahnen" is correct). I think that as long as the same plural is used consistently within the article or at least within a section, we should leave the version the original author has written. --Austrian 19:46, 10 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Burg ---> borough

My English isn't that good, so I won't add anything to the article, but as far as I know, the ending -burg means "castle". Might be that it is related to borough, but in "Hamburg" it definetely means castle. The arms of Hamburg shows the "Hammaburg" or "Hammerburg" castle, which was situated by the Elbe river and more than likely gave name to the town. Shortly archeologists found some parts of the castle under a construction ground. --84.144.90.165 23:55, 10 October 2005 (UTC)

I would just like to add that according to the offical website it is fortress, so I can see the confusion there. Also in the article it call the fortress "Hamma Burg" I beleve it should be one word "Hammaburg". I'm not changing anything in the article incase I'm wrong but if some one knows for sure please change it. Big-Pat 16:46, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] east or west

Was Hamburg part of east or west germany?--Gbleem 14:09, 22 November 2005 (UTC)

West. Ianb 21:02, 22 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] firestorms

I don't quite find that firestorm discussions should take place in an article about Hamburg. To me, the bombing of Hamburg is way too long and explicitly discussed. --mattinaetnea


This might be, but even you or others should know something about it...

--Modgamers 08:34, 29 June 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Freie Stadt or not?

The Groß-Hamburg-Gesetz article [1] says the city lost its Freie Reichstadt designation under this 1937 statute, but this article says it still (or again) has it. Did the city get this name back after WWII or what?--Fitzaubrey 02:59, 2 July 2006 (UTC)


I guess this is refered to their trade system (duty free zone etc.). Also this "Freie" City refers to the time when the french occuiped Hamburg. After the town was freed again it should mean that it belongs to nobody.. and today you can see that as a tradition, or if you want a stylistic device and refers more to their special role in oversea trade (duty free etc.).

--Modgamers 06:29, 2 July 2006 (UTC)

Firstly, it has to be clear that this is only a name and it indeed comes from tradition. During the middle ages and later in the Holy Roman Empire, cities could become (by various ways) independent from their former rulers and would then only be subject of the emperor. These cities got the title of a Free City or an Imperial City.[1] Anyway, of these cities only Bremen and Hamburg managed to stay independent and proudly retain the title in their names. It has nothing to do with the duty free zone or the french occupation. --Jonathan Jacobsohn (talk) 23:40, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Light rail

Why are S-Bahn and AKN referred to as light rail systems? JensMueller 08:58, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

Point taken. Wikipedia article on Light rail would suggest that S-Bahn is heavy rail, and more specifically "mass transit". AKN two-car units have light-rail characteristics. --PubliusTacitus 15:47, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Suburbs

Does anyone know the history behind any of the suburbs of Hamburg? Mainly Eilbeck? I see from the map on the page it was a village on the outskirts in 1800....any other information? --Davideilbeck 14:34, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Music

"Wir sind Helden" are from Berlin, Annett Louisan has nothing to do with Hip Hop and I think Ian O'Brian is not even from Germany so cut them off please.

[edit] Humongous Lists

Prose above lists and all that...

The culture section especially needs some attention, does anyone really need that huge list of dance clubs with their websites linked? That could even count as advertising.

The lists could also be cut down the most culturally significant theatres/clubs, as well as an explanation as to why they have been included.

I personally don't know the city well enough to write prose on these subjects.

If someone else can that would be great. --Evilhairyhamster 12:41, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

I'm going ahead and deleting the dance clubs section, there's no real factual merit, no prose on any of the clubs and an unnecessary amount of links. --Evilhairyhamster 00:05, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

yeah.12.34.47.30 15:21, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

-- I think the club list would be good stuff for Wikitravel...

[edit] inner city lakes

The so-called "lakes" Außenalster and Binnenalster are NO LAKES, but only very wide, lake-like parts of the river Alster. They only appear to be lakes to guests. Maybe a native can phrase this more perfectly?

Kajjo —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 84.143.122.69 (talk) 21:20, 8 January 2007 (UTC).

They are indeed lakes, because there is a tide lock at the end of the Binnenalster. I live in Hamburg btw.

I don't know whether there is a real technical definition for "lake", but the Alster is a storage lake. The river alone would not be as wide in the region, if there weren't a dam for hundreds of years. So I guess, lake should be correct. "We" in Hamburg consider them to be lakes at least :) -- Ulkomaalainen 09:59, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Largest Non-Capital City

The claim that Hamburg is the largest city that's not a capital is based on another wikipedia page that's highly contentious, as there's no clear definition of what a city is. So in this case, for example, the whole population of the Hamburg bundesland (so all of Harburg, the Vierlande, Bergedorf etc that wouldn't normally be considered part of the true Hamburg) is included in that list as a "city", but the population of Greater Manchester is not. Cavort 14:15, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Being from Harburg - yep, we'd like, no, love to tear down the bridges and get back to Lower Saxony. By the way, by now we'd take most of the harbour with us. While it is true that definitions in some countries differ significantly (Barcelona would be another candidate), there is absolutely no need to discount Harburg or Bergedorf - why didn't you mention Altona and Wandsbek by the way? They are part of Hamburg city proper, not only the "Bundesland". All those cities ceased to be entities of their own in 1937 and are nothing but boroughs of Hamburg, which (like Berlin but unlike Bremen) is the same whether city or Bundesland.
Of course, if you'd talk about the historical Hamburg, you should not count anything outside the Wallanlagen. Maybe include Rothenburgsort, St.Georg and St.Pauli, (and Moorburg in Harburg) which were founded "by Hamburg". All other parts used to be different cities. So no, this is no valid objection, though of course the statistic is debatable. -- Ulkomaalainen 22:46, 16 June 2007 (UTC)
This is exactly my point. I'm sorry for picking on Harburg. The definition of Hamburg as "largest city" is based on the definition of Hamburg that includes all its constituent boroughs such as Harburg, etc (the etc is for Wandsbek and so on). However the definition of Manchester used, by comparison is only for the borough "City of Manchester" - which is only a name, in the same way as the "City of London" - and leaves out all the other boroughs of metropolitan Greater Manchester. Cavort 11:39, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
In case of Hamburg, the population of the suburban areas are not counted, because they are not part of the city of Hamburg. If so, the population in the list mentioned would even be higher. In example, Norderstedt belongs to Schleswig-Holstein, although it could easily be a part of "Greater Hamburg", which doesn't exist as in case of Greater Manchester. Maybe Hamburg Metropolitan Region is compareable to Greater Manchester? Bergedorf, Mitte and Altona are boroughs that grew together and shaped Hamburg. In fact, a comparison between cities of different countries is usually difficult. But within Germany Hamburg may be the only city besides Berlin that feels like a cosmopolitan city of international importance and size. 85.178.20.190 07:33, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Missing

There is no geography section in the article and climate data is also missing. I looked up the average monthly temperatures for for city: [2]. If anyone knows how to make nice tables and charts, please don't hesitate to help out. Thanks, (Einstein00 (talk) 19:39, 21 January 2008 (UTC)) Aswell I have to say that the Coordinates are not completley right. It is not 9deg'59" but exactly 10 degrees east , as the meridian goes exactly through the City(as seen on the Lombards bridge or in a shop on Hamburg mainstreet.)


[edit] Sports

Hamburg has actually more Cricket clubs than two. Being a member of one of the clubs ("Alster CC", now: "Alster Rot-Gelb" as being part of the "THC Rot-Gelb Hamburg" hockey and tennis club of klein flottbek)I can say that there is also the club :"Pak Alemi " and "Hamburg International Cricket Club" They play in the North German League(of the North German Cricket Federation(NDCV)which is a subpart of the German Cricket Federation(DCB). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.83.115.216 (talk) 14:48, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] The numbers in the "religion" section are wrong

The numbers in the "religion" section, purporting to say what percent of the populace belongs to each of several religions, add up to more than 100%. If this were about a city in China I might just think maybe it's one of those situations where some people belong to more than one religion, but that sort of thing doesn't apply to Christianity or Islam, so there's a problem here. Michael Hardy (talk) 21:50, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

I've changed it so that it now says 41% are Christians, including 10% who are Catholics. That's what German Wikipedia says. Michael Hardy (talk) 04:38, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

I think things are more complicated: 31.7 % of the population belong to the lutheran "Landeskirche", 10.2 % to the roman catholic church. Source [3]. All other figure may be estimations only. There ist no official statistics of religious affiliation in german census. So the rest on 38.1 % includes mainly mulims, members of smaller christian churches and those without any affiliation, but also buddhistm sikhs, hindus, jews and others. --Catrin (talk) 21:34, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

Either you must have meant 58.1% rather than 38.1% or else I've misunderstood something. Michael Hardy (talk) 00:16, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

You are right. Should by 58.1. --Catrin (talk) 17:05, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] I'm not sure how to use this site...

I'm a first time user... I tried to delete the... weird... last sentence on the "Religion" part but had some problem... I think it's a rather unfortunate word choosing... can someone please edit it? Or even just delete it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Slonim (talk • contribs) 01:29, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Czech territory in Germany

The Czech Republic article currently states: "The Czech Republic also possesses a 30,000-square-metre (7.4-acre) exclave in the middle of the Hamburg Docks, which was awarded to Czechoslovakia by Article 363 of the Treaty of Versailles to allow the landlocked country a place where goods transported downriver could be transferred to seagoing ships. The territory reverts to Germany in 2018."

Is the above true? While it may have been in the Versaille Treaty, is this still legally the position? Can any one provide a source for this? I have found one source:[4], but it is a magazine article and I would not consider it reliable. The Czech-German territory is not on the list of exclaves so if it can be properly shown that it is true, it should presumably be added to the list. The topic is also being discussed at Talk:Czech Republic. Could any one help in verifying the claim? Redking7 (talk) 17:55, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

You can read an German-language article about it on the website of the Czech world service (http://www.radio.cz/de/artikel/58990). It is not an exclave since it is no sovereign Czech territory but German territory leased to Czechoslovakia for 99 years. It will revert in 20 More information can be found in the article on Moldauhafen. MaartenVidal (talk) 15:48, 14 May 2008 (UTC)
In the German-language counterpart of this article I searched for "Tschech" (as in "Tschechien", German for "Czech Republic") and found nothing. Michael Hardy (talk) 17:22, 14 May 2008 (UTC)
You can read about it in the German article about the Port of Hamburg. MaartenVidal (talk) 22:07, 14 May 2008 (UTC)