Talk:Haitian (Heroes)

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[edit] Big speculation

If Sylar can negate powers to an extant, as he seemed to in Fallout, the Haitian may have been nullifying those negation powers in Homecoming. This would mean that the Haitian's nullifying powers are stronger than Sylar's, and explain why Eden's powers worked on Sylar in Homecoming. Only problem is that I fear this is big speculation. Ace Class Shadow; My talk. 07:45, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

It is. Eden willed Sylar not to attack then put him to sleep. The Haitian didn't seem to do anything. My guess would be that like the Voice in the Dune series, Sylar just figured out how to resist it. He's good at that sort of thing. The only powers he is confirmed capable of nullifying are mentally-oriented ones. – Someguy0830 (T | C) 07:59, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
Should his page be fixed? Currently it seems to be saying that he can nullify all powers. Yet when Nathan Pettrelli was nearby him, he was still able to fly off (Hiros).--cong06 23:44, 26 May 2007 (UTC)
That seems to be more of catching the Haitian out, or could even have been an order from Angela Petrelli, I know the latter of those is OR, but since this is the only occurrence of the power not blocking, it seems more likely that It was surprise more than the specific power. Jacobshaven3 16:35, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

So what happens if Peter meets the Haitian?--Syd Henderson 05:11, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

We will probably get to find out. Peter meeting Matt was weird enough...--Hypergeometric2F1(a,b,c,x) 05:13, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] His power description

Can we come to a consensus on what to list under his "superpower" description on his template other than "telepathy"? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Hypergeometric2F1(a,b,c,x) (talk • contribs) 08:56, 5 December 2006 (UTC).

"One-way" telepathy? "Disruptive" telepathy? It's fine as just telepathy. – Someguy0830 (T | C) 09:22, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
I think Telepathy is a good description. He hasn't shown any mind-reading abilities, however, I think that at least memory-reading abilities are implied by the way he can selectively erase very specific things. The ability to read memories in real-time seems pretty close to mind-reading. The telepath-blocking ability may be passive because Mr. Bennet and the Haitian didn't seem to be aware Matt was watching them at Primatech Paper, and Matt was still blocked. --Stabbey 13:57, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

His ability to block/hinder the effects of other Heroes' power seems to be a form of Power negation. -Dr Haggis - Talk 00:37, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Possibly, but it's not a general power negation, Nathan was able to fly away. So far he's only been shown to inhibit mind reading or mind influencing powers. I'm sticking with Telepathy for the moment. --Stabbey 04:18, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
Didn't the Haitian negate Sylar's telekentic abilities also?--Hypergeometric2F1(a,b,c,x) 05:31, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
It's not clear if the Haitian was preventing Sylar from using his powers or if it was the construction of the room or something else entirely. In the last graphic novel, (spoiler) Bennet and the Haitian run into Sylar's cell immediately after he uses his powers to bring Eden through the glass, so Sylar was able to use his powers even with the Haitian nearby. Of course, it's not clear if the Haitian has to "turn on" his powers, either - we just don't know the exact nature or extent of his power negating ability. -Big Smooth 18:01, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
The Haitian's telepathic jamming seems to be a passive effect. He and Mr. Bennet didn't seem to be aware of Matt watching him outside of Primatech Paper. Given how cover-up happy and paranoid he is, I doubt Mr. Bennet wanted Matt to see him with the Haitian. --Stabbey 21:33, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
Just because he wasn't aware that Matt was there doesn't mean he wasn't deliberately using his "jamming" - he could have been generally inhibiting any powers in the vicinity. Nathan's escape could be due to his care in not revealing his powers - if Bennett and the Haitian believed that Nathan was unaware of his powers (and/or were unaware of what his powers were) then the Haitian might not have bothered to inhibit them, although this is pure speculation. Branfish 07:58, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
Actually, it's not a passive effect because in Episode 20, the Haitian is right next to Matt, and Matt is able to read minds at he same time. It seems that the Haitian is able to fix his abilities so that they don't affect people if he doesn't want them to, since at the same time, he's "preventing" Hiro from escaping.--Cong06 02:34, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

The Haitian has not exhibited the power of telepathy, which the Wikipedia article defines as "the communication of information from one mind to another by means other than the known perceptual senses". He can erase memories and can interfere with telepathy, but he has not demonstrated the ability to communicate with his mind. It is misleading to the reader to say that telepathy is his power. Primogen 21:39, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

I replace "Telepathy" in the info box with "Memory removal" and "Telepathy interference", since these two descriptions better convey to the reader what powers the Haitian has actually demonstrated on the show. Primogen 21:50, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

His power hasn't really been described in the show, so I can't say for sure. However, his powers seem to be based around the disruption of higher brain functions (explaining why he is able to erase memories and prevent Mind Reading and Persuasion). Other than the powers of Eden, Matt, and Sylar (Fallout, when he tried to resist Eden's Persuasion), there is no sign of a general negation power (Nathan could still fly, and though he has had contact with Claire, her power has not been needed while he was nearby). This would also explain his memory erasing powers (able to block or erase the thoughts which would likely be the foremost thoughts in the minds of his victims, such as Matt and Sprague's imprisonment by Bennet and the Haitian himself). However, the ability to selectively erase memories and thoughts (in the webcomic after Fallout, Bennet tells him to 'leave the guilt') also suggests some level of recognition of mental function tying into his power. Due to his comfort with his power, it is also a possibility that he has, like Claude, had his power for years. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 65.95.226.116 (talk) 22:30, 30 January 2007 (UTC).
I like this description. It seems to explain Hiro's captivity around The Haitian better then others. I wouldn't say that blocking Hiro's power falls under "blocking telepathic powers." Since Hiro's isn't Telepathic. It's clear, though, that it does require a good deal of concentration. So do we say the Hatian's power is: "Limiting Higher Brain Functions"? That sounds a bit...tacky, but I guess there's no other way of saying it while being accurate.--Cong06 02:34, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] "oddly enough"

"However oddly enough, when the Haitian, accompied by Mr. Bennet, attempt to capture Nathan Petrelli from a hotel, Petrelli is able to fly away, appearing to have his powers fully intact." - this appears twice in the article. Maybe he has to be close enough to the victim to nullify his/hers power. Maybe Petrelli surprised them and got out of range before The Haitian could do anything. There's no indication that Bennet knows everyone's speciffic abilities. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 86.106.116.66 (talk) 00:04, 7 December 2006 (UTC).

There's no indication that the Haitian could block Nathan's ability even if he knew about it. We've only seem him blopck telepathic and mind control attempts so far. Besides, Power Negation and Memory Erasure seem to be two distinct abilities, Mr. Benent's dialogue indicated they've only met people who had one ability do far. --Stabbey 21:33, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
He blocked Peter's mimicry powers (and/or Claire's powers) so that he was unable to duplicate Claire's healing factor when they were in jail. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 75.28.111.204 (talk) 11:45, 11 December 2006 (UTC).
It's more likely that Peter's illness was caused by an overdose of powers. He was near Claire, Matt and Nathan in a close space of time. I presumed that was the cause, not anything about healing powers reversing, especially since he's been away from Claire between his "death" and seeing her in prison, and he doesn't keep powers permanently. Jacobshaven3 11:52, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
Actually as was just revealed in episode 14 he does in fact permanently retain those powers that he encounters (Peter, i mean) - one of my friends even went so far as to say the "Peter is like a better version of Sylar given that he doesn't have to kill anyone to absorb their power". Anyway this is about the Haitian; shouldn't there be a section on possible side-effects of the overuse of his memory erasure on a single person? Sandra Bennet is now suffering neurological complaints and rolling, increasing memory loss that's causing her to forget more things, faster- and it's already been revealed that the Haitian has used his powers more than a few times on her - "Many, many times" by his own admission, and even Mr. Bennet saying "...help you forget again" indicates that this has been done over and over and over again, possibly many multitudes more than we have seen. So I think the deleterious effects of his powers should be added as well. 61.69.209.180 16:18, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Given that a subdural haemotoma is caused due to trauma on the brain, is it not more likely that it was caused by sylar throwing her against the wall - the doctor tells clair that it could have been caused by some kind of accident. 86.138.7.106 10:44, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Also, other than conjecture, by Claire an Mr. Bennett (not medical professionals), there is nothing to establish any harm from the Haitian using his powers. It would either have to be stated, unambiguously as a fact, on the show or more than one case history would have to be presented. We can't make an assumption based on one case. Padillah 15:50, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Then again, Peter may have already absorbed the Haitian's power-negation abilities from the point the latter entered the vicinity on the night he and Bennet came to capture Peter and Claude; this means that Peter may have duplicated (albeit unconsciously) the Haitian's power in such a way that it rendered him immune to the Haitian's powers. This might just be the case since most superpowered individuals in the Heroes universe are typically immune to the affects of their own abilities. 125.60.247.98 01:08, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

Peter isn't immune to the Haitian. In "Five Years Gone", the Haitian is able to block his powers. However, it is not stated "which" powers that Future-Peter absorbed are susceptible to the Haitian's influence. Ophois 05:24, 13 September 2007 (UTC)
Peter's Future-self, anyway. So it's possible that the Haitian's Future-self's powers has evolved to the point where he could negate all existing powers in the Dark Future. This might be the case since all the other characters appeared to have gained a much better degree of control over their own respective abilities. In the episode "Unexpected", Peter, apart from invisibility, has displayed being able to recall at least 2 powers before escaping: Hiro's Space-Time Control (evident by the cascading sound effect when he stopped the two tasers in mid-air), and Nathan's Flight (evidenced by the...well...flight)
by stopping time the tasers would not fall to the ground. i think peter used telekinesis to stop the tasers in mid air 99.246.102.154 03:24, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Pretends to be mute.

Should we mention that he pretended to be mute. When Eden was trying to get Mr.Bennet to kill Sylar she mentions that "he would tell you to if he could speak" while looking at the hatian, and then he speaks to Calra. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 4.157.5.206 (talk) 18:39, 10 December 2006 (UTC).

We should add that the Haitian doesn't speak until near the end of "Fallout" and that Eden believes him to be mute. We don't know if he was intentionally deceiving anyone, though. Primogen 19:05, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

In the episode where Mr. Bennett finds out that the Haitian didn't memory wipe Claire, he asks the Haitian "who else knows that you can speak?" (or something to that effect). This seems to pretty clearly indicate that his mute-ness was purposeful. 128.239.152.92 19:11, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

It was purposeful but was it deceptive? Did he try to make people believe he was mute or did he just not talk? There is a difference. Padillah 15:53, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Interference of mental-based superpowers

I've removed that as being original research. For the time being, all we know is that he can interfere with powers. However, we do not know if this is only mental based powers, or superpowers in general. Being specific like that and saying that he can block mental powers only is wrong because no one has said that yet. dposse 21:18, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

I rhink you made a good move, dposse. Certain scenes in the show have implied that the Haitian interferes with Matt's telepathy, and the Matt character has observed that the Haitiain was nearby when his telepathy hasn't worked. Because of that, people have inferred that the reason that Mr. Bennet told Eden that "her powers won't work here" when she was first captured was because the Haitian was present. As for Sylar's psychokinesis during his captivity, people have assumed that the Haitian was preventing him from using it (although Bennet and the Haitian felt comfortable enough to leave the building while Sylar was in his cell, suggesting that they trusted that something else was keeping Sylar's powers in check). But neither the show nor any other source to my knowledge has ever stated directly that the Haitian can block powers. Primogen 21:47, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
Thank you, but i'm not saying that he can't block powers. I believe he can block powers, but i think saying that he blocks only "mental based" ones when there is no evidence one way to the other is wrong. Perhaps there is middle ground here, like we did with Micah? Or shall we wait until the second part of season one? dposse 00:44, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
I think he can block powers too, but I don't think any episode has direct evidence of this. Several episodes strongly implied he can block mental powers, but I don't know if it meets the standard of verifiability. I think we did directly see Micah using a power to affect the phone -- we just can't point to a source saying exactly what that power is. So, I'm not sure that we can say that the Haitian can block powers yet -- especially since Bennet told Sylar that he's never seen anyone before with more than one power. Primogen 05:16, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

I think that his ability to disrupt abilities and to erase memories is the same ability, I'm just struggling to find a good term to cover it. firstly, I don't think he does block abilities. So far the only things he's done is stop (partially) mind reading, and stop "persuasion", both abilities that effect more than one person. I think he can telepathically prevent someone from being affected by a power, like giving someone a mental shield. Thus why he couldn't stop Nathan (though it could be that he just wasn't expecting it to happen) or Sylar (If he could stop Sylar, why bother using Eden to catch him, HRG could have just gotten the haitian to stand near him and knock him out, or even before that, get the Haitian to bodyguard Claire. It's actually possible, that he can cloak parts of the mind, preventing susceptibility, and also erasing memories (by making a permanent cloak that the target couldn't sense), which would explain how he can do both. Though all of this is OR, any attempts to guess his powers is, so I thought I'd drop by another idea. Jacobshaven3 11:10, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

On further comment, we haven't actually seen him block someone using their power, we've merely seen him make a power uneffective. For example, when Matt was in the bar, he could hear everyone, except the Haitian, it wasn't that the Haitian block Matt using his power, he prevented his thoughts being detected.Jacobshaven3 11:26, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
After Matt unsuccessfully tried to read Claire's thoughts while she was being interviewed by Audrey, he said that he felt interference. The show then implied that the Haitian was causing the interference by showing his presence right after Matt makes the comment. I'm not sure that's direct enough to make any claims in the article, but if it is, the term I would use is "telepathy interference." Primogen 19:45, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
I think we should just leave it as "unspecified power negation" for now. Just like with Micah, until we get some definative proof either way, it should be catagorized as "unspecified power negation". dposse 20:19, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
The problem is that it is not power negation as evidenced by Nathan being able to fly away while in close proximity to the Haitian and even moreso that Matt can continue to use his telepathy, it simply can't read the thoughts and instead "hears" static. –– Lid(Talk) 13:35, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
We have the same problem with Micah. We know that he has Technopathy just by the definition of the word. However, until someone says that Micah can repair any technology because his power is only Technopathy and not something else, it's original research. It's the same thing here. We do not know that it is only "mental based" powers he can block. For now, it's better to leave it as "unspecified power negation". Like WP:V says, "The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth." dposse 13:24, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

I don't know if this is worth mentioning, but when Matt Parkman is being held by Bennett, the latter asks if the former is trying to read his thoughts, adding "not with my friend here", at which point the Haitian steps into the shot. I think this is the only clear statement that the Haitian can inhibit telepathy, and possibly worth noting in the article. With regards to whether or not he has two powers, the inhibition of telepathy (which is the only inhibition we can really be sure of) could be explained by him instantly erasing from Parkman's memories anything that he manages to glean from Bennett's or the Haitian's own mind. I don't think this is the case, I'm just demonstrating that it is possible to reconcile the two powers. Branfish 08:07, 22 December 2006 (UTC)

Well, technically, no. "Instant erasure" would leave no room for what Matt has done. Ace Class Shadow; My talk. 17:38, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
I'm not being difficult, but that last sentence made no sense to me; could you rephrase it? Branfish 01:28, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
Not trying to be, anyway. Ha! My point was that if knowledge is erased from one mind's within minutes of learning it, Matt wouldn't be able to "grab" the names "Claire" and "Sylar" from Bennet or the Haitian; Matt would forget whatever he learned too fast to properly register it. Ace Class Shadow; My talk. 01:40, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
Well, whatever the Haitian's technique, it's clearly not perfect if Matt can get round it slightly, so I see no reason to assume that the technique I suggested would be any less fallible. It's irrelevent anyway, because I wasn't suggesting that that actually was what he did, I was just demonstrating that we have no real proof that he has more than one power, and so as yet no reason to disbelieve Mr. Bennet. Branfish 02:37, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
I agree with dposse and have removed the paragraph describing the nullifying powers. To date we don't have anything remotly close to an affermation of his ability to negate others powers. And, in light of recent episodes questioning his loyalty to The Company, I think it's fair to suggest that any lack of effect could be attributed to his not wanting to stop the others powers (i.e. he didn't want to stop Peter or Nathan since he didn't want The Company to capture them). Until the show can reach some sort of concensus we can't possibly be expected to. If it's allowed for I'd recommend describing the allusion to his powers (since Mr Bennet does allude to them). Padillah 14:42, 26 April 2007 (UTC)
I have to partially disagree with User:Padillah. The part with preventing or trying to prevent the Petrellis' powers is somewhat speculative, as is Padillah's comment on whether the Haitian chose to not, or could not, nullify them. However, the facts are that he has completely nullified Eden's power ("Six Months Ago") and that he can severely inhibit Matt's power on several occasions, and he has some control over its usage since Eden has used her persuasion while in his presence. --Pentasyllabic 17:43, 26 April 2007 (UTC)
Yeah, you're right. I guess we have to make a concentrated effort to determine what we actually know about his powers. I am utterly unconvinced that his power makes distinction between mental and physical powers. I'd be more inclined to accept this if it turned out he was shielding others minds rather than affecting the person with the powers but since his only exposure to physical powers has been two occasions that we can expect he wanted the subject to escape (speculation, of course, but so is my assertion that his power is limited). That he is doing something is an acceptable supposition (since his power is passive, and has been claimed to be reproduced by technology when Sylar was in the holding room at Primatech, we can't be sure that it is, in fact, the Haitian that is causing the effect). However, we can't be entirely sure what it is he's done exactly. So how do we handle this? Padillah 01:01, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Powers

I have two things to say. Since we don't know all of the Haitian's abilities yet, perhaps it would be better to list is powers as "Unknown Psychic Abilities, including memory removal and interference of telepathy and suggestion." The other thing I wanted to ask is, what other abilities does he have? Can he knock people out?It seems that even though Eden commanded Sylar to sleep in "Homecoming", he didn't fall until the Haitian grabbed him, suggesting that it was a combination of both his and Eden's powers to put him down. It's possible that he had a pad soaked with Chloroform or something in his hand when he knocked out Sylar. Still, if "Hiro's," Mr. Bennet told the Haitian to "put him down" when they tried to capture Nathan Petrelli. He also told the Haitian to "dig deep" when the captured Matt, suggesting that he is able to search his memories. Perhaps when he has physical contact with another person, he is able to mentally link with them and alter their minds in ways such as causing unconciousness and searching for and blocking off memories. I understand that this is speculation, but I feel it is at least worth considering and keeping in mind when viewing episodes, as it may help us understand his abilities. Briham 00:38, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

See Talk:The_Haitian#Interference_of_mental-based_superpowers. We know that he can remove memories, as he said himself during Fallout. We also know that he has some sort of power negation. What we do not know at this moment in time is if the power negation is for only "mental-based" abilites or for super powers in general. Until we get confirmation from in the show or from a writer of the show, everything is speculation, and speculation has no place on wikipedia. dposse 14:09, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
I know, I know. I said I realized it was speculation. I put it on the talk page because I wanted to point out the possibility of other powers. There seems to be so much focus on power negation that I wanted to make sure everyone kept in mind other abilities that may have been implied. Briham 15:00, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Is it really speculation to say that his negating powers and memory powers are connected? Mr. Bennet stated that he only had one power, so they have to be connected... Ophois 21:42, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

his power to negate power and negate memory are probably the same but at different strentghs. he can negate powers from a distance by preventing the part of the brain that has the power. and he can negate the memory by negating the part of the brain where memory is stored. since the power is not stored it is part of the brain his power can not remove it, only hinder it. this is my speculation. and since this is my first edit. it might not follow the guidelines. if so feel free to fix it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.104.90.230 (talk) 01:25, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Question on Mental-Based Powers

I'm not sure if this has been pointed out or discussed. Is it definite that the mental powers belong to the Haitian? For all intensive purposes, both Bennett and the Haitian are around when this occurs, and the only time I remember seeing the Haitian alone is with Claire. I know Bennett says the Haitian is the one stopping Matt, but is there any instance where the Haitian stops this alone? Also, is it definite that Bennett is without powers? If I remember correctly, when he met with Sylar through the glass of the white room, he was alone and Sylar was unable to control him. If anyone can answer these, please do so as soon as possible, because it is bugging me. Ludichrisspeed 05:13, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

Three words: One Giant Leap. The end, specifically. Ace Class Shadow; My talk. 08:26, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
Even better, in Six Months Ago, he manages to capture Eden, whose power of Persuasion would otherwise be quite effective in preventing capture —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 65.95.226.116 (talk) 22:38, 30 January 2007 (UTC).

[edit] Powers ARE God

My interpretation was that he thinks that the powers ARE God and not simply "from" a God. Can someone update the article with the correct quotation and reference? Thanks. 71.225.125.176 14:49, 23 January 2007 (UTC) --Stexe

[edit] Powers and abilities

I removed the speculation from the powers and abilities. Personally, I don't think that his mere presence negates powers, telepathic or otherwise.

If indeed true, as Mr. Bennet said, that the characters can only have one power the answer is pretty obvious to me: telepathy. I guess you guys got into a whole argument with "unspecified power negation." That's just a by-product of his real power. Let's use Professor X for example:

  • mind wipes: Erased Magneto's memory (multiple times), the whole story of X-Men: Deadly Genesis, etc.
  • telepathic shielding: can shield his own thoughts and that of others. The Haitian's presence isn't interfering with Matt's and Eden's powers. In Matt's case shielding the thoughts of Mr. Bennet. Or in Eden's case, he's protecting his mind from her "suggestions."
  • mind reading: to erase specific parts of someones memories he would have to be able to "see" what he's erasing.
  • power negation: If he wants Professor X could just shut down the part of the brain that controls your powers. While the Haitian has yet to stop someone with non-mental abilities, I'm pretty sure he'd be able to stop the, uh, flying guy from fying.

"the communication of information from one mind to another by means other than the known perceptual senses" I think there's some sort of information exchange between minds because the Haitian can erase specific memories. --EXV // + @ 09:24, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] His name is...

Slim... errrr ummmmm "Claude" did I hear that right? Did Mr. Bennit say "Claude this will have to wait" or something to that effect? --Bushido Brown 03:08, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

  • I'd want to double-check against a recording of this, but my impression of what was said was that "Claude" was the name of the invisible dude, not the Haitian. Tabercil 03:54, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

Mr. Bennet did say that. He was referring to someone else though. Claude is the Invisible Man. The Haitian remains unnamed. Valaqil 16:44, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

If I remember correctly after the phone call and after shooting Claude he said "Claude will have to wait" not "Claude this will have to wait" Toxic Ninja 21:27, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

What's the bets his name is Hadad? scott.lyon 21:38, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

emm, Im pretty sure they said it in one episode, Im too lazy to look for it,but they did Anow2 03:52, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] AWI??

In the Loyalty article, it is stated "Although The Haitian works for Mr. Bennet and AWI..." So who or what is AWI? It's not mentioned in Bennet's profile nor on the Primatech article? -- (Mrja84 20:22, 27 February 2007 (UTC))
For those reasons, I removed the references. Until someone can give a reason to call it AWI, it should be left out of the article. 216.165.38.83 01:58, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
AWI is an abbreviation used at Heroes Wiki for the Agency Without Initials. It's a reference to when Mr. Bennet tells Matt that he doesn't work for an organization whose name uses initials. - fmmarianicolon | Talk 20:50, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] How do people know he's Haitian?

Is it a plothole that people always seem to know he's Haitian, even when though there's no way for them to know that? I haven't scrutinized this or anything, but I feel like at least Parkman and Sprague have mentioned the Haitian without ever having heard him referred to as such? -VJ 00:19, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

They know him as the Haitian because hes black, simply put. Hell in company men in a flashback Thompson mentioned "We have a boy who can clear memories, we found him in Africa etc etc." Therefor hes African not Haitian. Show wise its probable they wanted to be politically correct to some degree and when Ted and Parkman were talking about seeing him Ted mentioned "he was... a Haitian" instead of saying "he was that big black dude" or "that nigger" or whatever else you want to say since even assuming a black guy is from Africa is racist now. 21:25, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Incorrect about the flashback--Thompson clearly says "There's a boy we discovered in Haiti..."

I could've SWORN he said they found him in africa. I can't even find the damn episode on youtube due to "copywrite" crap. Toxic Ninja 02:04, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

I've verified that quote from the particular episode downloaded as torrents. But I agree, ppl have been refering him as the Haitian even before learning where he's from. I guess it's from a word of mouth. --Kvasir 18:16, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
Most recent comic states he's from Haiti. Jacobshaven3 09:56, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Negation

I think the Haitian can cancel others powers out by using his memory wipe power, he can make a person to temporarly forget how to control there ability by being near them, but to make them forget perminitly he has touch them- RREDD13 19:15, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

On the commentary for Company Men available online the writer and director admitted to playing fast and loose with the Haitian's abilities. I think no one can answer exactly what the negation does because even the writers don't seem to understand it.

[edit] The Mute Haitian

Has anyone else picked up on the play-on-words with this character? Initially he was mute, or known to be mute, and a Haitian. A Mute Haitian... which sounds a LOT like Mutation if you say it fast enough. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by MarkyMarc413 (talk • contribs) 04:32, 3 March 2007 (UTC).

Hehe..nice one.--Hypergeometric2F1(a,b,c,x) 16:27, 3 March 2007 (UTC)
Good call. --Kvasir 18:16, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] "The Haitian" or "the Haitian?"

All right, some people have been engaging in edit wars with me. Some summaries on NBC's website always capitalise "The" in his name, but some don't (like the recent one). So what is it? 24.83.211.180 01:31, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

That's a tough one. I guess it would by "the Haitian", just like we say "the Hulk". But i'm not too sure. dposse 13:03, 10 April 2007 (UTC)
I'm going to move it to The Haitian. That seems the consensus here, and I've never seen him referred to without the "The".--Pushsense 09:48, 6 May 2007 (UTC)
Move reverted - there's been no consensus established, let alone any discussion about a move. There is also no concrete proof as to whether "The" (capitalized) is part of a formal name, or if the phrase means "the (guy who is) Haitian". --Ckatzchatspy 19:26, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] More Negation

In Five Years Gone, Hiro says the Haitian can disrupt their powers, thus he can block all powers? Sylar, in one episode (I can't remember which, the one with the phone conversation with Chandra Suresh) says something like "You were right, it's in the brain". If the Haitians power is mental manipulation, theoretically, he could "block" the bit with the powers? Meh, seemed logical. Blkmasta 17.11 GMT 02 May 2007

Let's not get into speculation. All we know is what we have learned so far, and that is that Future Hiro stated that he can "disrupt" abilites. dposse 23:50, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Others using powers around the Haitian

I'm changing the wording because I don't think others overcomming the Haitians negating powers are a measure of the power of the other hero, not a lack of ability on the part of the Haitian. That Matt overcame enough to get a single word from HRG even with the Haitian blocking him speaks to Matt's power, not the Haitian failing. Padillah 12:34, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Future allegiance

'... in "Five Years Gone", the Haitian is aligned with Matt Parkman in Homeland Security. This is strange, since he has previously said that the powers of the heroes were "gifts from God," yet he was working to wipe them out. Also, this would imply that his loyalty to Angela Petrelli is either not very deep, or...'

I just took it to imply that life in that future sucks, and that the Haitian and Parkman are doing what they think they have to do to survive.
—wwoods 18:57, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

I would think this would cement the idea that his loyalty to Angela Petrelli considering how her son, Nathan, is president. Well, at least the Haitian thought he was taking orders from Nathan. (Slick023 16:14, 15 June 2007 (UTC))

[edit] The Hatitian's Power Examined

The Haitian's abilities include the prevention of certain mental-based abilities (and quite possibly, physical abilities as well, though this will be examined below) and wiping memories from people (those seen in the series tend to lose recent memories primarily, though there may be instances of more specific memory removal). As of the latest comics, it is known that he could negate his father's abilities and turn an entire village into zombies when he lost control. As such, it appears that his power revolves around blocking the higher brain functions of others. Powers that don't need to be 'activated' (such as Claire's Spontaneous Regeneration) would be theoretically more difficult for him to prevent (though such a situation has never arised, so this cannot be verified). Of course, the element of surprise may explain why neither Nathan or Peter was prevented from flying.

In light of the ending to the graphic novel It Takes a Village, I think his power section needs to be rewritten. It seems that his power is that he can get into your mind where he can search your memories and read them. If he chooses, he can either show the memories to you or remove them from your head completely. How this relates to power negation does not seem clear at this time. (Slick023 15:37, 19 June 2007 (UTC))

Memory removal should definately be changed to Memory manipulation in light of his actions in ITaV 4. Cherries Jubilee 06:22, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Image used twice

Is there a reason the image of the Haitian holding Claire is in the article twice? --iTocapa t 18:29, 29 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] "Secretly" working for Angela Petrelli

Can we stop with the "secretly" working with Angela Petrelli? It has been revealed more than once that Mrs. Petrelli and has connections to Mr. Linderman who runs the company so there's no reason for Mrs. Petrelli to keep herself secret from the very people that have her allegiance.

For those of you that missed last season: Mrs. Petrelli knew and worked with Mr. Linderman who employed Thompson to guide Nathan through the "Exploding Man" scenario. Thompson worked for the company. Sure, Mr. Bennet may not have known about her but then it turns out there's much he didn't know. Not that it was kept secret, he simply wasn't important enough to know. Padillah 12:36, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Haitian's name revealed?

In "Crossroads" when Mohinder enters the Haitian's room, I thought I heard him say the name of the patient that he is about to treat before we find out it's the Haitian. I didn't hear it that well, because it was so quick, but it sounded like "Au Jean" or something like that. Could someone look into it? Lore aura 19:19, 3 October 2007

We're not that lucky. what he said was Ja'mapple Mohinder suresh.my name is mohinder suresh Je suis Médecin i am a doctorSpread The Word 17:22, 3 October 2007 (UTC)


[edit] The Haitian's Picture

Can someone change the picture of The Haitian holding Claire for his Bio Pic. it makes him look pedofile almost —Preceding unsigned comment added by Homeman892003 (talk • contribs) 17:24, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The Hatian's power Revisited.

The reason I am reverting the assertions regarding the Hatian's power being physical is because it's speculation and not notable. How the power works does not change anything and it applies real-world limitations to decidedly non-real world phenomenon. To logically discuss the mechanics behind a fictional characters powers work is the pinnacle of silly. No one is discussing how Claire's powers work, or Nathan's... or, indeed anyone else's. If it were a plot point, that would be different but thus far it hasn't proved to be the case. Also, if we allow this line of reasoning then we open up lines like "psychopathy is a chemical imbalance in the brain and therefore Adam's blood can heal it." and that is a road paved with OR. It has already started with the speculation regarding an almost insignificant event now, Mrs. Bennet's hospital stay. Now we've got people saying it was the Hatian and completely dismissing that she was thrown across a house! That Peter could heal from the effects of it is close enough, the reader can figure out the rest. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Padillah (talk • contribs) 20:44, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Use of categories for the Hatian

I don't feel the Category of "Fictional Haitians" applies here. He's not fictional, he REALLY IS HAITIAN. Are we going to put a Category on Noah Bennet: Fictional White guys? There is nothing fictional about it Jimmy Jean-Louis IS Haitian. Padillah (talk) 13:37, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

In other words, the CHARACTER is Haitian because Jimmy Jean-Louis is Haitian. It's not like Sacha Barron Cohen who plays Borat. That Borat is from Khazakstan is part of the character, it's central to the character. If ANYONE were to portray Borat they must portray him as Khazakstani. Jean-Louis is not portraying a Haitian, any more than Greg Grunberg is portraying a white guy. Padillah (talk) 13:52, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

One, I think you're confusing the actor for the character. The category classifies characters that are Haitian - that would suggest that the actor's origin is irrelevant. Second, do we know for certain that the Haitian is Haitian because of Jean-Louis' heritage? --Ckatzchatspy 22:23, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
Both valid points. However, your first point hinges on your second. As I posted in the Mohinder talk page, it's a "chicken vs. egg" argument: Is the character Haitian because Jean-Louis is Haitian? Or did they hire Jean-Louis because the character was Haitian? I admittedly have a much stronger argument in the cases of D.L. and Mohinder. In any case it's speculation to assume the character drove the casting rather than the other way around (as is usually the case). I think the Categories are being misused, however, it's not something I feel strongly enough about to put up much of a fight. Padillah (talk) 23:31, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
(For the purposes of this discussion, let's call the character of The Hatian "David".) The most noticable feature of David is the fact that he is Hatian. That's all he has been called by so far, so obviously it's an important part of his character. I can see what you are getting at from this, however, but the fact remains that this page is about the character and not the actor. Just because Jimmy Jean-Louis is Hatian doesn't mean David isn't. If Hayden Panettiere was really from Texas, should you remove the Fictional Texans from her article? No, because it doesnt matter about the actors. If Jimmy Jean-Louis was African-American instead of Hatian in real life, you wouldn't put Fictional African Americans on the article, because even though the actor is the character isnt. Pretty much all live-action fictional characters are the same race as the characters they pretend to be. Just remember, David isn't a real Hatian. He is a fictional Hatian because David isn't a real person. --Piemanmoo (talk) 06:17, 25 November 2007 (UTC)
Let me get this straight; the man can erase memories and negate powers but the most notable thing about him is that he's Haitian?!? I think you need to watch the show more. And my argument is that "yes", if Hayden Panettiere (no need for a link, I know who you mean) were from Texas I'd vote to remove the "Fictional Texans" from Claire's entry. The "Categories" are being abused. They are being used to sneak in cruft at worst, to overstate the obvious at best. To answer what I believe was supposed to be your second question, "yes" if Jimmy Jean-Louise were just some Black guy I'd have no problem with listing him as a fictional Haitian. Because then he would be fictionally a Haitian. As it stands now he really is a Haitian. And one of my biggest original arguments still stands: are we going to go through and put "Category: Fictional White Guy" on Bob? Or Matt? Or Nathan? Or Adam? If it's required for Haitians and Black people then it should be available for Average White Guy too, right? According to your final argument every fictional character in Wikipedia needs to have their race pointed out because they are fictional, right? Are we saying a persons race is so important that we need to segregate their character profiles too? You're suggesting we go through and tag Jack Bower as a "Fictional White Guy" because Jack Bower isn't a real White Guy. He is a fictional White Guy because Jack Bower isn't a real person. Or Indiana Jones isn't a real White Guy. He is a fictional White Guy because Indiana Jones isn't a real person. I don't think I'm up for putting racial epithet's on every fictional article in WP. If it becomes a plot device (and I mean Plot Device, not just a way to refer to someone) then we can discuss whether it's significant enough to warrant mention. Otherwise it's abuse of the criteria at best, and could even get into the realm of racism if we keep it up. Padillah (talk) 13:26, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

First and foremost, this should not involve, in any way, Jimmy-Jean Louis's ethnicity or nationality. This should be strictly focused on the character of the Haitian, which besides physical characteristics, Louis has nothing to do with. Noting that, the character of the Haitian is, in fact, both fictional, in that he doesn't exist in real life, only in fiction; and is Haitian, which should be obvious being he is referenced as such by every character in the series. For those reasons, I think it is acceptable to categorize the Haitian under Category:Fictional Haitians. As for your point of notability, I think before we discuss it in reference to categorization, we should discuss how much, if any, information in these and all Heroes articles is notable. Categorization is not about simply what is notable about a person. For example, George W. Bush is categorized under 25 not self-referential categories, including, among others, Category:Living people and Category:American cheerleaders. Are either of these particularly notable in regards to the boy? Not really. Until we come to a consensus, I won't restore the category, but I think we need to take these points into consideration. --iTocapa t 00:17, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

If these are the criteria we are going to use then he should also be marked as a Fictional Male, Fictional Human, and Fictional Bald Person... You say Jimmy Jean-Louis' ethnicity doesn't enter into it, I say it does. He's not portraying a Haitian, he IS Haitian. If he were portraying an African then he would be a Fictional African. It's like you "pretending" to be a Wikipedia editor. You can't, you really ARE a Wikipedia editor. It's the same as when people tell me "you don't look 38", well, yes I do. I AM 38 therefore, by definition I look 38. To clasify him as a fictional Haitian means he is pretending to be Haitian, and he's not. Padillah (talk) 14:30, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
I'm still not quite understanding how Louis figures into this. If the character's ethnicity were unknown, then it would be wrong to categorize him as Haitian based on Louis's ethnicity. However, being that, within the context of the show, the character is Haitian, then the character is a fictional Haitian. This is only the character we are talking about. If Louis were not Haitian, or if a different, non-Haitian actor were playing this character, then we wouldn't be having this discussion. As this article is solely about the character, the category of fictional Haitians is appropriate. As for fictional males, fictional bald people, etc; if those categories exist then it wouldn't be beyond us to categorize him as such, since the character, being fictional, is male and bald. --iTocapa t 16:56, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
Then do what you wish. If you can't tell the difference between a Fictional Haitian and a Haitian who is fictional, I can't think of any other ways to describe it. Since I am apparently the only person that feels this way (or, at least the only person that sees the abuse and is speaking out) then I am obviously not in consensus. If I sound (read) hurt or snippy, that's because I am. I am frustrated at my lack of ability to communicate an abuse and so must sit here, ineffectual, and watch the abuse continue. Padillah (talk) 17:53, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
I fail to understand what bearing Louis has on the ethnicity of the character of the Haitian. Yes, Louis is a real Haitian, but the character of the Haitian is not real, he is fictional, he does not exist. Did the writers decide that the character would be Haitian because of Louis? It's possible, even likely, but Louis is irrelevant in the context of this article, in which we only care about the character, and whether or not the character is both fictional and Haitian, which he is. I understand what you're trying to say, but I don't understand why we aren't separating actor from character. --140.160.105.29 (talk) 19:22, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
The bearing that Jimmy Jean-Louis brings is this: is he "portraying" a Haitian mutant or is he Haitian portraying a mutant? It's a chicken and egg argument, is his character Haitian because Jean-Louis is or was he chosen because the character's Haitian and Jean-Louis can act? The other approach is to ask would you would classify Bob or Noah as fictional White Guys? They are, in point of fact, white guys... and fictional. All of which has been stated and over-stated. If I can't communicate my ideas by now it's a failure on my part and I'll have to live with it or find a better way to communicate. Or race is more important than I originally gave it credit. Padillah (talk) 19:53, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
Maybe this repost of my point from Talk:Mohinder Suresh might help

In other words, the CHARACTER is Indian because Sendhil Ramamurthy is Indian. It's not like Sacha Barron Cohen who plays Borat. That Borat is from Khazakstan is part of the character, it's central to the character. If ANYONE were to portray Borat they must portray him as Khazakstani. Ramamurthy is not portraying an Indian, any more than Greg Grunberg is portraying a white guy.

Padillah (talk) 20:05, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

But he is portraying an Indian, as the character Suresh is Indian. To correlate with the Borat example, if for whatever reason Louis could not play the part of the Haitian, someone else would have to step in. If that person isn't Haitian, does the character suddenly become not Haitian because the actor isn't? Yes, I agree that the character's ethnicity is probably based on Louis's own, but as soon as the character is established as Haitian, there's nothing that can be done to change that. There seems to be an idea that the character's ethnicity in these cases is completely dependent on the actor's, and while, as we've said before, the character is probably Haitian because Louis is, that doesn't change the fact that the character, separate from the actor now, is Haitian. --iTocapa t 20:58, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Use of categories for the Haitian (arbitrary edit break)

It's not about what the character is, it's about how the character is portrayed. In other words is the actor pretending to be Haitian in order to correctly portray the character. Just slapping labels on people because of their race is simply a muted form of racism. Borat is a Fictional Kazakhstani because the actor needs to pretend to be Kazakhstani. Even if the actor was Kazakhstani, Borat would still qualify in my mind as Fictional Kazakhstani, because the character is dependent on being Kazakhstani, regardless of the actor involved. You know what? Forget it. What you are saying is not correlating to what I am saying and there are only so many ways I can rephrase the argument. Pieces of the argument are being ignored in deference to ones that can be addressed (or obfuscated) and I'm getting frustrated at the lack of input from others (especially User:Ckatz who started the other side of this). I leave it at this, answer one simple question to yourself: Do we categorize Matt Parkman as a Fictional Caucasian? If the answer is "Yes", then let's do it and race is a perfectly legitimate tool for segregation. If the answer is no then let's get rid of all the other racial categories unless they actually apply (as the Borat situation above) Padillah (talk) 21:28, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

Padillah, you are of course free to feel frustrated. However, for my part, I have avoided adding to the discussion because, quite frankly, I think the comments others have left so far explain the rationale for using the category quite clearly. Furthermore, I don't see why you're persisting in this, as I feel you have misunderstood what the category represents. However, I really didn't want to just "pile on" and add yet another series of comments in opposition, as I thought that might just add to your frustration. Simply put, the character is Haitian; whether or not that is inspired by the actor is immaterial for the purposes of categorization. Someone searching for Haitian characters needs to be able to find all of them, and this character's "Haitian-ness" has been established throughout the series. --Ckatzchatspy 01:08, 28 November 2007 (UTC)
Well, thanks for the weigh-in and I appreciate the understanding. If that's what the classification means, then so be it. Everything in my character is repulsed when people classify others by race. I don't think I'll ever understand the reasoning behind it. Padillah (talk) 02:06, 28 November 2007 (UTC)
I would think most of us, including myself especially, can agree on that point. --iTocapa t 02:12, 28 November 2007 (UTC)
It may or may not help to point out that 'Haitian' isn't a race; it's a nationality/ethnicity. Also, it's rare enough to be at least marginally noteworthy.
—wwoods (talk) 07:48, 28 November 2007 (UTC)
That's how I perceive the category - not as representing a particular race, but a nationality. As such, it doesn't bother me at all, just as I don't object to having Stargate's Rodney McKay categorized as a "fictional Canadian". Thoughts? --Ckatzchatspy 09:45, 28 November 2007 (UTC)
Point taken. And I guess that's why I've not got this kind of push-back from D. L. Hawkins or Mohinder Suresh, those were pretty blatantly about race (although Indian could be either). I was also talking about this to a friend and he suggested I look at it this way; if someone were trying to find The Haitian, what's the easiest way? Look in a categorized list. So that's how I'm going to view this from now on and see if that helps. Thanks for the discourse guys. Padillah (talk) 16:12, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

Not to reopen the debate, but I like the new "Fictional Characters from Haiti" much better than the other categories. 100% support. Padillah (talk) 06:29, 28 December 2007 (UTC)


[edit] The Haitian's Powers

The Haitian has the power to remove memories. Fair enough. But he can also interfere with telepathy and stop a hero's powers, or at least mental ones. This seemed completely random to me at first, which didn't seem right. But then I realized that he has one "overall" power, the ability to affect minds. He can removes memories from the mind, and he can stop communication between minds.

irrelelvant speculationAdroa (talk) 00:53, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] The Hatians power blocking mental abilities

There are like 400 statements about this. All the abililties are mind based, as Sylar is able to steal people's powers based off their brains. In the interview it was stated that "There is a connection between their powers and their brains, and Sylar has found it" meaning that all these abilities are mentally based.Adroa (talk) 22:23, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Cellular Regenration

The description of his powers state that tose with cellular regenration can reverse the memory loss, but how do we know this? We only know that Adam's abilities can reverse these effects, as Adam is shown as knowing how to do this, and if Claire happens to lack this ability Peter gained it when he met Adam. For all we know Adam's power is unique in this aspect therefore, I'm removing this statement. We should not assume powers are identicle because thye appear the same in some aspects.Adroa (talk) 22:26, 2 June 2008 (UTC)