Talk:Gustav Stresemann

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I swear he got killed.... or does my memory fail me?

Heart attack. You're thinking of Walter Rathenau, I think. Mackensen (talk) 15:02, 29 Nov 2004 (UTC)

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[edit] Poland

Molobo, in the final analysis international scholarship agrees that Stresemann was rather a peacemaker than a warmonger. On a more speculative note, he might arguably even have felt compelled to pay lip-service to the anti-Polish consensus of the time in order to keep his conservative adversaries at arm's length. Anyway, his occasional aggressive remarks concerning Poland remained inconclusive, which is why they are often forgotten. Kindly do not reverse the text's meaning to give our readers the opposite idea. --Thorsten1 22:25, 24 July 2005 (UTC)

In response to repeated attempts at disfiguring the wording on Stresemann's position towards Poland, let me repeat the point above: Stresemann's aggressive remarks towards Poland notwithstanding, it remains a fact that Stresemann is generally credited with stabilising German democracy and preserving peace. This included containing nationalist forces that were pushing towards a renewed border conflict with Poland. Wikipedia should not present Stresemann as a warmonger, when most scholars, all things considered, describe him as a peacemaker. Such an incongruity would certainly damage Wikipedia's esteem more than Stresemann's.
If anyone believes that Stresemann's overall peacemaker image in historiography is undeserved, they should try and revise it outside Wikipedia first, preferably in peer-reviewed publications; if their views gain wider currency, we can include them here. Anything else constitutes a violation of the no original research rule.
Before anyone accuses me of whitewashing interwar German foreign policy or Stresemann in particular: It was me who translated and added Stresemann's hostile statements about Poland. But, ultimately, such information can only add nuance to the big picture - we should not try to redraw it here. --Thorsten1 08:18, 4 August 2005 (UTC)

I don't really believe this to be true

Wikipedia should not present Stresemann as a warmonger, What you believe about him is unimportant. Facts and what he said is important. --Molobo 19:06, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

Streseman a peacemaker? Maybe for the west. Streseman once said that Germany has no territorial quarrels and demands - and that he is quite satisfied with 1914 borders. Streseman policy was actively agressive against Poland and he wanted to get Silesia and Pomerania. What's most terrifying is that France and UK were actually agreeing with him, causing a lot of bad blood and distrust in Poland. Szopen (talk) 14:18, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Molobo's renewed attempts to overstate Stresemann's "aggressiveness" towards Poland

I just reverted Molobo's latest attempt to distort the description of Stresemann's role. For my rationale, see above. --Thorsten1 17:29, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Moved text

Somebody wrote a long text on Stresemann at Stresemann, Gustav (Weimar Era). I couldn't identify it as copyvio through just googling, and moved the text to Talk:Gustav Stresemann/Moved text, where it is available for possible later merging or other use. up+land 20:36, 2 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] From WP:RD/H

I read an article recently that suggested that Gustav Stresemann was the one senior German politician who might have stopped Hitler. The Wikipedia page says that his death further 'tilted the slippery slope towards towards World War II.' Can either of these statements be supported? Captainhardy 07:37, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

Sort of and yes, Captain. Hitler's rise to power was, in one way at least, the failure of democratic politicians to solve the crisis of the Great Depression. After Bruning, von Papen and Schleicher (that spelt right?) had come and gone, the Depression was still there. Stresemann, if he had survived to see it, could have been a "fourth lifeline" for Hindenburg before having to resort to Hitler. Other than that, personally I don't think it's fair to say "Gustav Stresemann was the one senior German politician...". Maybe there were other politicians who could have, but circumstances didn't work in their favour.martianlostinspace email me 10:40, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

Tilted the slippery slope?! How on earth does one tilt a slippery slope? Sorry, sorry; please forgive the levity, Captainhardy; this is a good question. Unfortunately, it is not one that can be answered with any real authority, because so much depends on hunch and guesswork. I have seen statements to the effect that Stresemann was the one individual who could have given real leadership to the 'middle ground' in German politics in the crisis that followed the Crash of 1929; that a new form of Protestant Liberalism may have been shaped from the ruins of the DVP, Stresemann's own party, and the DDP. He certainly had the personal and the organisational skills; but there is nothing to suggest that the hemorrhage of votes away from middle towards the Nazis could somehow have been prevented by force of personality alone, even if the personality was Stresemann.

The only possible grounds for serious counter-factual history would have been if Stresemann had stood for the Reich Presidency in 1932. The possibility was certainly discussed before his death. People often assume that Hitler came to power by electoral means; he did not. At no point did he obtain a majority in the Reichstag. He was, rather, 'elevated' to office by a small clique drawing on the constitional powers of President Hindenburg, himself lapsing into a state of senility. The Presidency, therefore, was the crucial political factor in Hitler's Machtergreifung. So, no Hindenburg, no Hitler. Stresemann, as President, is most unlikely to have appointed Hitler as Chancellor. But even then there may have been factors not completely within his control, not least of which was the attitude of the German Army, which had its own political agenda in the winter of 1932-3. Hitler happened; that much we do know. Clio the Muse 02:26, 13 September 2007 (UTC)