User:Grumpyyoungman01/Talk Archive 01

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Contents 1 Welcome 2 Greetings 3 Re:culling of nsbh old boys list 4 North Sydney Boys High School 5 Re:Referencing of NSBHS notable alumni list 6 Blogs 7 ACOTF 8 Surf lifesaving is ACOTF 9 New ACOTF 10 Press Gallery 11 Sydney Technical High School 12 hi 13 Mediation Cabal request regarding STHS 14 New Australian Collaboration is Census in Australia 15 Heritability and Environment 16 NPOV tag on C. J. Cherryh? 17 Articles you might like to edit, from SuggestBot 18 Magic Pudding 19 Petition to Make Special 20 List of Australians rather large 21 Cricket 22 List of Australian Architects 23 Environment disambiguation 24 Lily Brett

[edit] Welcome

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A Y Arktos 07:14, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Greetings

Hi A Y Arktos, thanks for the welcome Grumpyyoungman01 11:44, 2 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Re:culling of nsbh old boys list

I think the list is excessively long, but as I'm not all that familiar with the school, I am hesistant to cull the list myself. I think a good test of whether someone should be in the list is whether they warrant a Wikipedia article on them (not whether they currently have a Wikipedia article - note the difference). Also, I think the list should be sorted by what field they're in instead of an alphabetical listing; that's far more useful to the reader. enochlau (talk) 10:31, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

(Thinking aloud)I obviously agree that the list is way too big and I agree that it is hard to cull unless you determine entrants worthiness individually like you say. Google may not be reliable enough for that task, but the Who's Who would be. If each mentioned Alumni had their page number in a Who's Who stated that would do the trick. As for the sorting, I agree that alphabetical isn't very useful for the average reader, so a field type sorting system needs to be worked out. I have no idea about that one at the moment. Grumpyyoungman01 10:43, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

Where can you search Who's Who? If you want an idea of a categorisation system, see what we've done at Fort Street High School. Cheers. enochlau (talk) 12:33, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

Who's Who is only available in Physical copy, I have a copy of two old ones, I imagine you would reference people in the last edition they appeared in (It doesn't list deceased people I think). The Categorisation at FSHS is very good. That is what to aim for. Now for ultra anti-lazy medicene. Grumpyyoungman01 05:19, 13 February 2006 (UTC)

If we want a good idea of how many notable alumni a school such as NSBH should produce, then Melbourne High School should give us a good example. If we added everyone who went to NSBH who was also mentioned in Who's Who, we may end up with two or three times the current number. I just don't know anymore. *Crys* Grumpyyoungman01 11:56, 14 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] North Sydney Boys High School

[1] Thank you for your hard work on this article. Just thought you might want to have a look at meta:Cite/Cite.php, which allows us to put references at the end of the page, instead of in the body of the article, so it's all in one place. It's up to you whether you want to use this system or not, but it's worth a look. Cheers. enochlau (talk) 23:25, 14 February 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the link Enochlau, it's looking cleaner now.Grumpyyoungman01 00:38, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

Someone doesn't like your work, see Talk:North Sydney Boys High School... don't feel put off but perhaps getting an alumni list mightn't be a bad idea? enochlau (talk) 10:35, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

Can't expect everyone to like my work, I have been making a lot of changes and the light doesn't shine out of my arse. Wikipedia works well because of the mass input and challenges to people's changes. Thanks for the heads up and your advice. The main thing is that the people I deleted from the list because NSBH didn't appear in their Who's Who entry haven't been reinstated. But with an alumni list the authority of that can be tested. Grumpyyoungman01 12:51, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for sending the letter. Let's hope for a positive response. Just wondering, are you a graduate of the school (I'm presuming not, because you indicate that you live in Victoria)? enochlau (talk) 12:23, 16 February 2006 (UTC)

Someone was bound to ask me eventually :) Presumption correct, I went to Melbourne High School but graduated from Collingwood College, a somewhat less prestigous institution. However my Dad went to the school and embarrasingly appears in the list of 'notable' alumni. You could say my interest in alumni lists is a manifestation of an undiagnosed Obsessive Compulsive Disorder, or more likely biding my time until I start uni in a week. I have also alphabetisised this list of performances, before the creation of my account. I am also guilty of vandalising the Collingwood College article with a sock puppet...For purposes of humourous alumni capers. God help me, or an admin might do. Grumpyyoungman01 12:42, 16 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Re:Referencing of NSBHS notable alumni list

• Administrators do not facilitate discussions for content-related issues, and we participate in content discussions as normal editors.
• However, I wouldn't think it's a problem if you delete someone without a reference and without an article; if they are indeed notable and from the school, someone will add it back in - and the list is long enough as it is.
• And finally, Be bold!

enochlau (talk) 12:31, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Blogs

I don't think that's either very encyclopaedic or very useful as it stands. Why not write Political blogs in Australia and attach the list, with descriptions, to it? Adam 09:46, 25 February 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the good idea, it is at least now looking like a stub of some sort. Grumpyyoungman01 22:57, 25 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] ACOTF

You voted for Rum Rebellion. It has been selected as the new Australian Collaboration. Please help to improve the article. Thanks. Scott Davis ^Talk 12:32, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Surf lifesaving is ACOTF

Hi. You voted for Surf lifesaving as Australian collaboration of the fortnight. It has now been selected, so please help to improve it in any way you can. Thanks. Scott Davis ^Talk 13:16, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] New ACOTF

Australian Football Hall of Fame has been selected as the new Australian collaboration. As you voted for it, please help to improve the article in any way you can. Scott Davis ^Talk 14:10, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Press Gallery

I have done some work on this article. I have Lloyd's book somewhere and will add some historical info when I find it. Adam 02:20, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

You're too kind. You haven't seen me in nasty-mode yet. Adam 07:09, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Sydney Technical High School

As someone who edits the school articles frequently, I would like to ask for your opinion on this edit - the insertion of the link to the class of 1984's website. For the rather heated discussion, you might want to consider User_talk:Enochlau#Removal_of_Class_of_1984_external_link. Many thanks. enochlau (talk) 11:27, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Excuse my perversity but I am reading up on the issue with fascination, I only recently have come across my first continous revert disputes on Wikipedia at Psephos and have subsequently noticed that many of the pages which User:Adam Carr has edited suffer similar problems from immature editors who know very little about the topic that they are editing and yet refuse to bow to someone with expertise and sophisticated arguments.

I have also noticed that the majority of the recalcitrant contributors to those pages have now all been banned as they are sock puppets (I don't accuse anyone in this discussion of being a sock puppet). Fascination quickly turns to digust at childishness and brings out the facist dictator in me, like we need to send would-be editors of Wikipedia to off-shore processing before they are unleashed with their petty arrogance and opinions. While the two people who are in favour of keeping the link to class of 1984 are borderline abusive, ignorant and arrogant and you have a cool head and killer lines such as "While Wikipedia isn't paper, it isn't toilet paper either" and they have lame comebacks like "Excellent. I'm glad you've understood the "toilet paper" argument" I will not let that cloud my judgement. But seriously, take my opinions with a grain of salt, I am not widely read about the rules and guidelines on WP, have less than 500 edits, haven't been involved in a 'proper' dispute before etc...etc...

Cheers. -- P.S. Funnily enough my Dad also went to that school before he went to NSBHS. Grumpyyoungman01 23:56, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] hi

Thx for your message. That link isn't, in fact, what I thought it was. I hope to replace it with a better one—which has something to do with Hallidayan systemic functional grammar.

On spelling reform ... well, I kind of like English spelling, as chaotic as it is. Tony 03:19, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Mediation Cabal request regarding STHS

Yes, I know, you're probably sick of hearing about this, by now. But. I'm here to let you know that someone has requested that the Mediation Cabal attempt to calm down the situation, and I noticed you got (a little bit) involved with some of the discussion. If you're not interested, feel free to disregard this message. If you are interested, I'll ask that you try to put any harsh feelings behind you, and remember that you and all of the editors around you are all trying to build the best Wikipedia possible; disagreements in how to do so shouldn't get in the way of our good faith towards each other. Wikipedia is not particularly accessible to newcomers, and as beneficial new users are arguably our greatest resource, we would do well to remember that they can have thin skins. Likewise, I've known firsthand how tiresome it can get, reverting vandal after vandal, and I see that this article in particular has a bit of a history, there.

Now, the link in question does have some issues, for and against it; I find things to sympathize with and things to fault in all parties, here. For the time being, my interest is in calming things down. I would appreciate it if you (along with any other involved editors) would agree to set aside hard feelings in the pursuit of a better Wikipedia -- our reputation on an encyclopedia depends heavily on interactions between editors. All that much better if we can all agree to work side-by-side, and do so in a public, transparent forum for all to see. Let's try to make this a positive experience for everyone.

I have nothing but respect for your experience, and your contributions to Wikipedia. Thank you for the time you've taken to read my message, and any subsequent time you might put into this case.

The particular case page can be found here. As you're probably aware, the cabal has no official authority, but in this case that may work to everyone's advantage. Luna Santin 17:11, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] New Australian Collaboration is Census in Australia

Hi. You voted for Census in Australia as Australian Collaboration of the fortnight. It has been selected, so please help to improve it in any way you can. Thankyou. Scott Davis ^Talk 14:31, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Heritability and Environment

You are right. There is no good way to link from Heritability to anything worthwhile about environment, so I've taken away the link altogether. Ted Talk 16:07, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] NPOV tag on C. J. Cherryh?

You placed an NPOV tag on C. J. Cherryh [2], but didn't leave any information on the talk page about why. I'm taking it off for now... if you have a specific point that you disagree with, let's discuss. --Alvestrand 14:04, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

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[edit] Magic Pudding

Hey. Got your message, and I did some work on the article; basically I just took out the offending lines. You can read my reasoning on The Magic Pudding talk page. I'm not especially active at the moment, so if you disagree and want to change it back or whatever, be my guest. Glad to see others are interested in the page I started anyway. Take care. NoahB 01:07, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Petition to Make Special

Thanks for your edits. --Nowa 08:06, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] List of Australians rather large

I think splitting this list into smaller lists is a good idea. We've already got a category to suit, Category:Lists of Australian people. Perhaps raise the issue on the article's talk page first so it doesn't look like you've taken an axe to the article as a whole. -- Longhair 19:13, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cricket

There's no magic button. The category is still quite small so it's easily managed. I can delete the category for you if you like so a new correctly named category can be created, however I also noted the following earlier deletion from the deletion log.

Sam Vimes (Talk | contribs | block) deleted "Category:Lists of Australians in Cricket" (speedy renamed to Category:List of Australians in cricket)

Let me know what you want to do and I'll see how I can help. -- Longhair 00:54, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] List of Australian Architects

I reverted your last edit to the lead of the List of Australian Architects. I can't see why one might want to see a list of Australians if you had come to look at a list of Australian architects. Regards (cheerfully) --A Y Arktos\^talk 05:43, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

• I think in general people might want to go from the general to the specific but not usually the other way around - ie perhaps to list of architects but not list of Australians Regards--A Y Arktos\^talk 05:50, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

Yeah You're right, its just common sense really. Wikipedia works because other people see this stuff and can change it if someone loses their brain temporarily. Grumpyyoungman01 05:52, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Environment disambiguation

We seem to be disambiguating simultaneously. If you want I can just go for the obviously computing related articles and leave the natural environment/ecosystem related articles to you to avoid either of us loading up pages just to find they've already been done. --Daduzi ^talk 11:31, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

Hey, no apologies necessary. I was trying to just do the programming ones but it can be hard to tell which is which just from page titles. I figured I'd let you know what was going on in case you were wondering. Anyway, let me know when you decide to take the break and I can pick up the slack. --Daduzi ^talk 12:24, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Lily Brett

Hi grumpy, I have reverted your cat. change as Brett was a music journalist not a musician. cheers. Design 12:55, 10 July 2006 (UTC)