User talk:Grenavitar/Archive 4

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Main — Archive 1 (end 07-01-05) — Archive 2 (end 10-14-05) — Archive 3 (end 12-25-05) — Archive 4 (end 9-11-06) — Archive 5 (end 2-07-08)



The following discussion is an archived user talk page. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page. No further edits should be made to this page.

Contents

[edit] You're up late

Only a wikiholic would spend Christmas eve prowling WP.

If you have the energy, take a look at what I did to Islam and clothing and Hijab. The two articles covered much the same material, so I moved material out of the clothing article into hijab, and then extensively cut, reorganized, and rewrote. There's lots of work still to be done. I think that it's less of a meandering mess than it was, however.

I should probably notify the other editors who frequently work on Islam-related articles.

Also, check out work I did on Abu Dharr. I'm kinda proud of that one. Zora 07:35, 25 December 2005 (UTC)

You're right about the "he"s. I copyedited. I didn't get candy, but I bought some Dove chocolates for some guests who are coming tomorrow, and I've eaten some of that, dang it. Also some pumpkin pie a neighbor gave me, and a couple of helpings of potatoes with chicken/apple sausage. That's my reserve Weight Watcher's points for the week, and it's not even Christmas yet. Zora 08:20, 25 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Nazir Ahmad

Is there a quote that supports that or is it the news articles that inferred that? Unless there's a specific quote I think it would be better to leave that out until there is some sort of confirmation that that was his motivation. Seems like he just lost it after the first one. KI 19:21, 25 December 2005 (UTC)

Yes. Excellent. If you get a chance take a look at Chadian-Sudanese War. I've been expanding it as much as I can, but another view would surely help. KI 20:32, 25 December 2005 (UTC)
The Chadian-Sudanese War was moved to Chad-Sudan conflict due to some ambiguity over whether Idriss Déby said Chad was in a "state of belligerance" or a "state of war." We now know he meant "war" as Chadian forces are entering Sudanese territory and are fighting either the Sudanese government itself, or the Rally for Democracy and Liberty. Long story short, since your an administrator could you move the page back to: Chadian-Sudanese War or Chad-Sudan War. Thanks. KI 04:21, 27 December 2005 (UTC)
The Chad-Sudanese poll is now up to 5 users for moving and 2 users against. Also, I updated Nazir Ahmad. KI 03:58, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Hey

I'm new to Wikipedia and I have a question. I have found a page I think is made up, Chung fu Tzi, and I'd like to get rid of it...if that's possible...how do I do that? KI 22:36, 25 December 2005 (UTC)

There is now a majority, 3:1, to move the page to Chad-Sudan War. KI 19:06, 27 December 2005 (UTC)
See: Talk:Chad-Sudan_conflict#War_vs._Conflict

[edit] Diacritics

Hey there. I saw your peer review for Mosque, and saw that you mentioned something about diacritics? I don't disagree with you, but I was wondering if you knew of any official Wikipedia guidelines regarding this? I fleshed out a dicussion in the Cádiz talk page, with the main issue being the Spanish Cádiz versus the general English usage of Cadiz. Do we use the anglicized version on the English Wikipedia - and how will this affect Mosque's peer review and its possible future FAC? My conclusions have all been, well, inconclusive. ;) Let me know if you have any suggestions. Happy holidays! -Rebelguys2 23:54, 25 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Hatred

Hello Grenavitar,

I have recently started following some of the Islam associated pages, and I notice that there is a lot of people who are filled with hatred toward it, that post content on the pages, and as well as on the talk pages, and try to skew the articles toward the negative. Similar things have happened on the Baha'i pages, of course not to the same extent, and I wanted to know what you think is the best way to deal with these things. I don't want to seem heavy-handed, which not only looks negative, but at the same time can reinforce the other editors negative feelings. The other thing is that since I'm a Baha'i, whatever changes I make to those negative comments, also seems biased, so I was wondering what you think is the best way to allow for a neutral POV when both sides are inherantly biased. Thanks, -- Jeff3000 19:35, 26 December 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the reply, definitely something to continue to thinking about. -- Jeff3000 05:09, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Category:Critics of Islam

Hi Gren, you may wish to note the activities of User:Amenra which mostly amount to putting people in this category. Including, for example, Nasr Hamid Abu Zayd, which strikes me as a completely unidimensional and unfair categorisation of one of the most significant intellectuals of the contemporary Arab world. Amongst others. Any idea what the best way to deal with this is? Is this category something that should be deleted as too simplistic? What the @£*& do Nasr Hamid Abu Zayd, Bat Ye'or and St. John of Damascus have in common that justifies categorising them together like this? I see nobody has answered your well-put question on Talk:List of critics of Islam.

I think I am in need of a wikibreak, before I completely lose my temper and ability to respond rationally to the way people talk about Islam and the Arab world here! Palmiro | Talk 03:12, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Shi'a rampage

I'm exhausted. Paradoxic has created a Twelver Shi'a template in bright green that he is applying to various articles -- usually so that it overlaps the article text. It is not just Shi'a, but Twelver, and accuses Sunni caliphs of murdering all the imams (described as martyrs). I remove the template and he puts it back -- without marking it as a revert, and marking the edit as minor. He is also feeling his oats on the Islamic conquest of Iran page, which he thinks is a suitable venue for giving his views on Iranian politics.

I have been working on this for hours. No sooner do I NPOV a page than he reverts to his Shi'a version. What next? Do we just play revert war, me trying to recruit Sunni to hold the fort against the Shi'a? I hate this. Zora 04:37, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Wikipedia:French Collaboration Project

Hi Gren! Well I think the project is almost ready for a drive. Have a look! Cheers -- Szvest 10:11, 27 December 2005 (UTC) Wiki me up™

[edit] Crticisms

Hello Grenavitar, I see the criticims of Islam is not on the main page, and that is the case for all other major religions, but linked in the "See also" section. The Baha'i editors would like to follow the same style, but one user keeps adding them up. I don't want to be the one who takes them down, as I am biased. I was wondering if you could look at the "Commentary" section in Baha'i Faith and see if you agree with it's removal from the main page. The Baha'i criticism page which is called Baha'i apologetics is already linked in the "See also" section. Thanks -- Jeff3000 15:45, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

Thanks again for the suggestions and statement. -- Jeff3000 19:30, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Iraqi Elections?

Hey, I was just wondering, are you from Iraq, and if so, who did you vote for in the recent elections!? Wikizach 16:46, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

The reason I asked, si because you have "Lā ilaha ilā al-ishq" — Al-Irāqī on your front page. I thought Al-Iraqi means, IRAQ! Why do you even have that there in the 1st place? Wikizach 18:00, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Thank you

...for having translated the fr:département d'Oran page. If you want, you can also translate fr:département d'Alger, fr:département de Constantine and the new fr:département de Mostaganem. --Revas 21:49, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Image:Mufti hitler.jpg

Gren this image is from the 1940s , it is in the public domain. The source is irrelevant as no one owns this image.--CltFn 05:41, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Things

Have fixed Wikipedia space/article space mix-up, thanks for tip. The Great Gavini (pigeon hole)

20:56, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Mistress Selina Kyle

She (or he -- doesn't really FEEL like a she) is feeling her oats tonight. Revert wars at Aisha, Muhammad, and hostile edits at Osama bin Laden. But the most outrageous (and no one seems to have noticed it yet) -- she unilaterally, without any discussion, moved the Wives of Muhammad template to Partners of Muhammad, retitled it as "Wives and female slaves of Muhammad", and rearranged all the names.

The intent is giving offense. What an evening! What a FUN FUN FUN vacation you must be having.

I don't think I've ever watched C-SPAN, and I don't seem to be that interested in conservatives. I've yet to read one who struck me as a deep thinker. But perhaps I need to read Burke. Zora 11:48, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

FOR GOD'S SAKE , BLOCK HIM . F.a.y.تبادله خيال /c 20:53, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

Also , cant we run an IP check on these kind of people . He might be a reincarnation of previous Islamophobes . F.a.y.تبادله خيال /c 20:57, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

Another incarnation , just came in this world 5 minutes ago . User:Countering Systemic Bias . F.a.y.تبادله خيال /c 21:04, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

And another one User:Mr Data F.a.y.تبادله خيال /c 21:26, 29 December 2005 (UTC)


[edit] Images

What images did you have an issue with. I know I've marked them all with correct copyright status... Masterdebater 10:14, 30 December 2005 (UTC)


[edit] Book Covers

Gren , as far as I understood , book covers do not need a source , they are considered freely useable under fair use. see the wikipedia page http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Book_covers. Am I missing something? --CltFn 16:21, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

I have now tagged all most of the book covers images I uploaded with the book cover tag. Thanks.--CltFn 23:52, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Requested Maps: Gir Forest National Park

Hi There! Happy new Year to you! Just saw your request for this Map. I think I will be able to create this using my previous creation of this as the baseline. --ΜιĿːtalk 08:31, 1 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Proposed merge

I propose merging Islamist terrorism into Militant Islam , Dar al-Harb into Dar al Islam & Offensive jihad into Combative jihad, please comment if you have thoughts on the matter . Thanks . F.a.y.تبادله خيال /c 21:02, 1 January 2006 (UTC)

Nice quote "Lā ilaha ilā al-ishq" . Although it can mean a thousand things . F.a.y.تبادله خيال /c 21:11, 1 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Islamist terrorism

Please protect this to stop the vandalism. KI 23:39, 1 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Classic Rock

Hello. I was wondering if you would like to participate in my classic rock survey. I'm trying to find the most like classic rock song. There is more information on my user page. Hope you participate! RENTASTRAWBERRY FOR LET? röck 00:38, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] BadJPEG tag

Hello. You asked for review of the {{badJPEG}} tag on Image:--Kyrgyzstan.jpg, Image:130.jpg, and Image:1klipermedium.jpg, so here's why I think these images need this tag.

The JPEG format is very good for images like photographs. But it doesn't do so well for images with large, well-defined blocks of solid colors, such as maps, charts, flags, screenshots of most Web pages, and so on. For one thing, it introduces compression artifacts, which are usually invisible to the human eye in photographs, but show up as "blur" or "fuzz" in pictures with sharp edges. For another thing, saving an image with large blocks of color as a JPEG will usually result in a larger file size than if it had been saved as a PNG. For these types of images, the PNG format is preferable. It does not introduce any compression artifacts into the image, and its compression works very well for things like maps and flags with large blocks of color. The PNG format is not a vector format. It just uses a different type of compression than JPEG, and PNG compression works better for certain types of images.

So for images like Image:--Kyrgyzstan.jpg and Image:1klipermedium.jpg, if someone would revisit the Web page in question, take the screenshot again, and simply save it as a PNG instead of a JPEG, the resulting file would be smaller, and the image would be sharper. The same goes for Image:130.jpg; someone needs to take another screenshot of that video game, and save it as a PNG this time instead of a JPEG. (Simply converting the JPEG to a PNG won't work, because it will still contain the compression artifacts that were in the JPEG version).

Many of the images that have been marked with {{badJPEG}}, including lots of flags, maps, and logos, have been replaced by vector images in SVG format. This is better than PNG if we can get it, since SVG files are usually very small, and the resulting image can be resized as big or as small as we like. But you're right, SVG would be inappropriate for images like the three you named. PNG is the best choice for these. Let me know if you have more questions. —Bkell 18:17, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Voile islamique en France

Grenavitar - I noticed the translation of the French Headscarf article on your to-do list. I thought I might point out that someone has written an article on a tangential subject (French law on secularity and conspicuous religious symbols in schools), although a "headscarf affair" article would still be useful. --NYArtsnWords 20:59, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

D'oh. I saw your wish list that included the French article's translation and got crackin. Then I looked at your discussion page and found the link provided by NYArtsnWords. An in-depth featured article to which the mess I just put up pales in comparison. So I thought I'd ask your opinion on it while I stick the merge tag into my translation. It looks like they cover much the same subject... JFHJr (㊟) 16:21, 23 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Images in user boxes

I have no idea, Gren, but I'd definitely sit it out if I were you. The issue has sparked two admin RfCs, a nasty wheel war, and several threads on the mailing list. Best to keep your head down. ;-) SlimVirgin (talk) 05:36, 4 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] RuneScape Template - Fair Use Image?

What exactly do you mean by I can't use "fair use" images for this template?Mike 07:51, 4 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] My Vote

I am a still a reasonable person, but unfortunately this seems to have become a liability on Wikipedia in the past few months, particularly in the past week after Kelly and those who agree with her actions. Quashing those userboxes are little more than censorship of the community, a disturbing ideal that eventually will lead from the user pages to article space if we don't stop it here and now.

Equally disturbing is her total and utter comptempt with process when it doesn't suit her whims, the message her actions and he continued defiance despite the utter chaos she and others like her have brought about threatens to turn Wikipedia into a never ending battle ground, against WP:NOT for what that's worth anymore.

Until the furor dies down, I will vote strong keep on any userbox put up for deletion, I will more than likely vote keep on all userboxes afterward. That's how strongly I feel about free speech. However, as evident by my subst-ed version of the "Stalin Userbox" on the bottom of my user page, I will still listen if someone discusses things rather than demands them. karmafist 03:56, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] A Pathethic Place

Yeah, it is. I just got into a huge fight with one of my best friends on here for standing up for what I believe in. I'm tired of believing in things, it just causes pain. karmafist 05:10, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Apologies for the other day

Even though we disagree, I've been way too involved in this lately, and I'm sorry if I let out that anger towards your direction, it was incredibly inappropriate. Things get so much better once you get off the computer for awhile ;-) karmafist 07:18, 6 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Early Muslim conflicts

Perhaps you could do something about Striver's latest attempt to keep this template alive. He has created Template:Highlighted events involving Sahaba which is just a template he created anew with the exact same text and links as the former template. From what I understood via the TfD process, it wasn't just the name that was a problem but the template as a whole. Pepsidrinka 05:17, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

I have to dissagree. The problem was the name. Some said we should use a military campain box. That is a bad alternative since it would covers about half the links in the template. There are plenty of non-military higlithed events in the early history of Islam that need to be interlinked prominently with a template. Zora said that there was no clear end to the list. so i renamed it to "sahaba", also people said it should not have a red-links, so i fixed that to. I dissagre with your decision to speedy delet it and ask you to undelet it and add it for a procedural vote of deletion. I do this in good faith to improve wikipedia and NOT to piss you off. Also, i dont appreciate your warning. --Striver 16:20, 5 January 2006 (UTC)
So, what do i do to voice not being content? --Striver 18:44, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] CE

No reason in particular. I just noticed the lack of any qualifier on the date and felt compelled to add CE to it. Not trying to be contentious. Would you rather me go back and undo those additions or just leave them alone and not add any further. Pepsidrinka 22:08, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Nothing really

Except to say that there are still people around who will listen to opposing views and think carefully about them, attempt to apply policy rationally not blindly, try to respect other contributors, and always remember what the goals of the project are.

Not saying that I'm one of those people, but just that they are around.

brenneman(t)(c) 00:16, 6 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Rfa thanks

Hello Gren. Thank you for supporting my Rfa! I will try my best to be a good administrator. Please ask me if you need any help. --a.n.o.n.y.m t 17:43, 6 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Dr. Heshmat

I think youre a bit confused. I didnt create Hooshang Heshmat. I think User:CHeshmat did. I created Dr. Heshmat, which should refer to Dr Talequani Heshmat, a popular late 19th century figure in Iran's constitutional revolution. User:CHeshmat and User:Gmotamedi are responsible for changing the names and causing the confusion.--Zereshk 21:46, 6 January 2006 (UTC)

The page I created was turned into a biography about somebody else. I dont know who this "Hooshang Heshmat" is. So I had no part in creating it.
"Dr. Heshmat" (which was moved to "Dr. Talequani Heshmat" by someone after the Hooshang Heshmat confusion started) however is a famous guy in Iranian history. He is whom I had in mind. He isnt popularly recognized with the "Talequani" surname, but I guess that was added because the name "Dr. Heshmat" was (incorectly) redirected to "Hooshang Heshmat"'s article. The title "Dr." is popularly recognized in Talequani Heshmat's name as a historical figure, similar to for example the way we recognize the title "Dr. Jeckel". But then again, I have no problem with moving the page to whatever you deem best. So long as the confusion is eliminated. --Zereshk 02:46, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] you're not wrong

you're not wrong about me. i don't claim to be neutral, i never have. obviously when i'm bias it'll be checked, but i'm not gunna lie and say i don't have an agenda here.

any non-muslim who looks around wiki for info on Rashad Khalifa, Quran Alone Islam, or Submission (i.e. true Islam) and they'll get the wrong idea. i hope to fix this.

any muslim who looks around wiki will find their idolatry adorned by the fact that Islam is portrayed as corrupted "muslims" have made it: the religion of Muhammad. or should i say the cult of Muhammad? Muhammadanism is very much alive and thriving, and destroying the religion of GOD: Islam.

anyways, just letting you know that i don't claim to be neutral and i am absolutely not going to abandon Wiki simply because Zora has an unhealthy obsession with corrupted Islam.

[edit] Copyright

Hi Gren, sorry I've never heard of that page, but I'll take a look and get back to you if I find anything. SlimVirgin (talk) 01:14, 7 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] French Collaboration Project

French Collaboration Project
The French Collaboration Project has been launched. Thank you for your participation and feel free to nominate and vote for the new Translation of the month. CG 13:24, 7 January 2006 (UTC)


[edit] History of Jews in Iraq

I've fixed the errors, and some others. If you come across any more, please let me know. BTW, the citation was correct. Jayjg (talk) 03:50, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] AP maps

You got it... Check commons:Category:Andhra Pradesh district maps. Cheers! --ΜιĿːtalk 11:48, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

Well, I assume beforehand that you have some hands on with graphic editors, yes? Then, all the images in the cat above are raster, so you may not require illustrator or anything heavy like that (unless you want to make some dramatic changes). Use simple tools that can select the district you are interested in, by using, say, a magic wand (you can improve the result by doing feather effect and anti-aliasing). When the region is selected, fill-in the highlight color. Go easy on the colors though (for e.g. Image:Map_rajasthan_dist_7_div.png). Bright colors can be insulting to the eye and disrupt the theme of the image. Best of luck! :-) --ΜιĿːtalk 13:11, 8 January 2006 (UTC)
PS: This may help - GIMP or GIMPShop (both are royalty free) --ΜιĿːtalk 13:31, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Template:Featured

I think that Wikipedia:Featured article review had a list of featured versions for most older articles sitting around somewhere. Unfortunately, there's really no way to add them automatically; it's still going to take manual changes to ~750 talk pages to get this to work ;-) —Kirill Lokshin 18:09, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Re:User against scientology

Eh, I'm not in a bold mood today. I'll cast a vote at the TfD. Thanks! --Sean|Black 20:01, 8 January 2006 (UTC) P.S. You be happy too! ;)--Sean|Black 20:01, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

Pretty appalling behaviour Grenavitar trying to make back-door deals with other admins to get the template deleted out of process.. --Mistress Selina Kyle (Α⇔Ω ¦ ⇒✉) 20:46, 8 January 2006 (UTC)
Or undeletion. Consistency. gren グレン 00:03, 9 January 2006 (UTC)
How is an entirely public converstion "backdoor"?--Sean|Black 11:49, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

In regards to the templates, you tell me to not bypass deletion discussion but then you go and delete the new template itself. And anyway these deletion discussions are basically just farces anyway, where administrators contact each other to vote together and censor any ideas of free speech on this website. --Horses In The Sky 12:00, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

Seeing as userpages and anything that might be put on them can only be proved as true or false by the person whose userpage it is, I dont see why they should be classified as part of the encyclopaedia. --Horses In The Sky 12:20, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Template talk:Stars

Would it be possible to have the old versions of Template talk:Stars restored as, say, Template talk:Stars/old? They contain discussion that is relevant to the archived debate at TfD. —Ilmari Karonen (talk) 08:14, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

Thanks! —Ilmari Karonen (talk) 12:07, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Photos

Image:DSC_0326.jpg can be deleted --Horses In The Sky 12:33, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Thanks

Sun shines, Gren writes a
fantastically good haiku.
Appreciated.

Talrias (t | e | c) 13:06, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/JzG

I note your comments and (ever one to learn from my mistakes) have added the "force edit summary" js to my monobook.js, to stop me forgetting in future. Thanks for the heads-up. - Just zis  Guy, you know? [T]/[C] RfA! 16:20, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Just in case you missed it

I responded to something you've written here: [1]. Please note that my questions are not rhetorical. I would really appreciate it if you care to answer. Thanking you in advance, --Twisturbed Tachyon 17:39, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Re: Odd

You're right, that is odd. And irritating. I can only assume it was exactly what you said it was;: my browser decided it didn't like those characters very much. I shall have to be on guard for such things in the future. Lord Bob 16:33, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Thanks for the help.

Hi Gren. Thanks for sending me that info. I'll be sure to categorize my articles from now on. Hope to see you around. LeoNomis 15:31, 12 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] History of writing

thanks -- it was certainly lacking as an independent article, but all I did was copy-paste material from other articles, see Talk:Writing system. dab (ᛏ) 15:48, 12 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] rfa comment

Hi! I just thought that I'd ask you about your comment on my rfa. I should make it clear that I'm not upset. And you should not feel mean. I expected to get a "do these things and try again later" result - I mainly accepted the nomination to get this sort of feedback. A user's perception of themselves doesn't always reflect what others see and this RfA been helpful to me in that regard. The big thing that I've learned is that I need to actually comment in the Wikipedia:* pages that I watch. I just haven't been doing it, not sure why, and I plan on doing this more in the future.

The question I have for you is about your comment in which you say that I have not done janatorial tasks. By my count, 546 of my 955 article space edits are vandalism and spam reversions. In the user talk space 79 of 184 of my edits are {{test|bv|spam}} templates or more personalized versions of these warnings. I even created the {{spam-n}} template. Of my 109 deleted edits, unless my memory is failing, almost all of these are speedy tags of garbage articles. I occasionally feel bad that over 50% of my contributions are what I consider janatorial in nature - so, as you see, I am confused by your comment, what should I be doing differently? Thanks for your time! - Trysha (talk) 19:52, 12 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Articles on specific dates

Are articles on specific dates neccessary/allowed/desired? For instance, there are articles on June 8, 2005, June 9, 2005, June 10, 2005 so on and so forth. The reason I bring this up is because they all contain the exact same information as June 2005. Pepsidrinka 22:54, 12 January 2006 (UTC)

See Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/June 3, 2004. Pepsidrinka 21:40, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] French Collaboration Project

You showed support for the French Collaboration Project. This week Little boy was chosen to be translated from fr:Little boy. Hope you can help.

[edit] Template:Stars

Grenavitar, I was wondering is the usage of Template:Stars proper in album infoboxes? and if so why isn't it mentioned in Wikipedia:WikiProject_Albums ? Nooby god 16:05, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

I've added a mention. As for whether it's proper, as the creator of the current template I suppose my opinion may be somewhat biased. ;-) —Ilmari Karonen (talk) 18:05, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] My RfA

Thank you for your support in my RfA. I am working on improving m edit summary usage. Dsmdgold 20:13, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

User:Ingoolemo/Threads/06/01/17a

[edit] You

Hi. I've been seeing your edits around a lot lately and wanted to say hi. I also wanted to get to know you better. Many editors come and some come on crusades to change things. You go to the University of Chicago apparently which means you should have a pretty good backing in social sciences. One nice thing about wikipedia is once you get to know people you can decide how closely you look at their edits. I've found Zora to be reasonably neutral and when she makes an edit I often don't bother to check it out unless it's interesting. However, sometimes editors don't leave edit summaries and you need to be more wary. So, what kind of person are you? You use footnotes so that's a good sign. Hi. Just making conversation... do do do... hi.

How do you do. The only crusade (jihad if you will) that I'm on is to make articles that I like to read on subjects that I like to read about, which often involves tedious research and frequent revisions to my own work. I'd like to say I'm neutral, but everyone carries a POV, so don't assume that what I say is correct. I've also found that nothing mutes criticism better than a well-placed footnote. :) Palm_Dogg 04:09, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] AfDs

Is there something you should know? Debatable. May I suggest that you look at Louisiana Baptist University and its history, also Jason Gastrich (talk · contribs) and most especially List of Louisiana Baptist University people. Look at the edit histories of the people linked and check for Gastrich's edits to user talk pages; also see Big Lover (talk · contribs). I think you will then be able to make up your own mind. Your conclusion may be different from mine, I am quite a supicious type :-) - Just zis  Guy, you know? [T]/[C] AfD? 09:35, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] RfA Thanks

Please accept my embarrassingly belated thank you for supporting my RfA, which much to my surprise passed 102/1/1, earning me minor notoriety. I am grateful for all the supportive comments, and have already started doing the things people wanted me to be able to do. And hopefully nothing else... Just zis  Guy, you know? [T]/[C] AfD? 12:13, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Alireza Rahimi Boroujerdi

Hi, Alireza Rahimi Boroujerdi has been recreated and is up for AfD again. But I note that you and another have left messages on the User Talk page which did not explain the problem. I have made a template template:nn-userfy which I use for cases where I userfy trivial biogs instead of deleting them as speedy, and I've now exlained to him why what he is doing is wrong. He may not care, of course, and I am notoriously naive. Anyway, I just thoguht I'd share my thoughts. - Just zis  Guy, you know? [T]/[C] AfD? 15:03, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] EMS-2

see into the Euro-category:

Category:Euro

There are too many such articles: - EMU - Economic and Monetary Union of the EU - ERM - Exchange Rate Mechanism - EMS - European Monetary System - Euro - "the money" - Eurozone - "the monetary zone" and now: - EMS2 - European Monetary System-2

It is too much. Many of the content is doubled in multiple of these articles.

  • EMU and Eurozone are very similar things. The Eurozone is more like the "street-name" of the EU's EMU. Maybe they should be merged.
  • ERM is a tool inside EMS. EMU is the core of EMS (but of course some member states are outside the EMU and only in EMS/ERM). OK. Some distinction here.
  • Euro is more clearly defined - focused on the currency/money, not on the institutions, instruments, etc.
  • There are three stages: ERM-II stage (fluctuation bands, etc.), "full EMU" (stage III) and what is stage-I? Maybe the EMS. Or ERM-I. It looks like the ERM article covers both I and II stages. Also the EMS article has virtually all info from the EMS-2 article. And it is not too long totaly too. So, I think it would be good to unite somehow at least EMS and EMS-2 articles. Maybe structurize the EMS article better: Stage I (description, appropriate links), Stage II (description, link to ERM), Stage III (description, link to EU's EMU). I will try to do something like that. Then redirect EMS-2 to EMS-general. See if you like it that way. 199.64.72.252 08:20, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] peel island

hey, peel island is a place in both australia and britain so how should i go about making a new page. Could you make it. It has such a facinating history but i am not good at making pages. peel island was a dropping off point for this guy who chalenged the king of england. he made the owner of the pub a king. this tradition has been going on for ages but will end soon as the king will abdicate.

Themoomin 20:07, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Optimum Currency Area

I added a citation stating that Mundell originated the OCA concept. He did not develop the entire theory, but he was the first to attempt to formulate it. People added other features, like homogenous preferences, after he made his initial proposal.--Bkwillwm 01:01, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] from jayanthv

regarding the licensing of the images,User:durin(an admin) and i have had a long talk with each other regarding images.you can check out my more recent uploaded images on Anna Kournikova and Britney Spears.thnks for reminding me anyway.--Jayanthv86 13:13, 28 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Zayd ibn Ali

On January 11 you removed most of the text of Zayd ibn Ali because it was a copyvio. On January 13 an anonymous user restored the text saying "rv no violation." Are you sure it's a copyvio? Normally I wouldnt ask, but if all of that text is removed then the article will be about two sentences long. KI 15:22, 29 January 2006 (UTC)

I removed the copyvio text, and kept references to his shrine and a quote about him. KI 04:57, 30 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Image:Sealtemplarsbarrech2.jpg

The image was created 100% bz me so zou can remove the copzright tag Still the text on my discussion page does not specify what to do if I'm the copyright owner of the image:) :) CristianChirita

[edit] Islam in the United States

How did the page protection come off? An anon seems to have been able to take it off.--CltFn 00:55, 30 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Template:Featured

Very nice! I think that your version is probably as clean as we can get it (unless MediaWiki gets conditionals). —Kirill Lokshin 17:40, 30 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Jihad Watch/Dhimmi Watch

Perhaps you can shed some light on this. Is it acceptable to copy whole paragraphs from the site as long as you cite that they come from the site. Having looked, I didn't see any copyright on the page, but I also didn't see any mention that the info on the site is fair game. Pepsidrinka 20:27, 30 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Request for deletion

Please delete the "George W. Bush's Second State of the Union Address" page, which I accidentally made, and then moved to the correct title (so it redirects) at George W. Bush's Fifth State of the Union Address. Thanks. KI 23:06, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Please edit George W. Bush's Sixth State of the Union Address in anyway you see fit. Thanks. KI 02:17, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Meetup

If we were to have a Wikipedia meetup on Main Street, would you and Rydia be interested in attending? Raul654 18:30, 2 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Heidenheim an der Brenz

Hi, Grenavitar, just wanted to stop by and let you know that I just completed the translation you requested last June (I believe it was). It's out there. Should be pretty clean - although no one but me has so far proofread it. Cheers, --Mmounties 03:21, 4 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] To Fritz

Hey fritz im sorry I delted your page. Don't ban me.

08:34, 6 February 2006 (UTC)~


[edit] damn neologisms

Thanks for instructing me. Silly "Islamophobia" sticks out like a sore thumb! :D Kyaa the Catlord 12:03, 7 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Bora Bora Image Usage

Grenavitar, Just noticed that you have attributed an image of Bora Bora to NASA. In fact, the image was taken by former Space Imaging (now GeoEye) IKONOS satellite. While we don't mind the image appearing elsewhere, in fact we encourage the practice, we do require proper credit. Copyright GeoEye will suffice. The link to file on SpaceImaging.com. http://www.spaceimaging.com/gallery/top1001/borabora.htm

[edit] Grenavitar Bora Bora Owned

Grenavitar,

Haaa you got FCCed.

ColenFace 22:13, 7 February 2006 (UTC)

BTW I'm a big fan of spaceimaging.com

[edit] AFI Movie

[edit] Nikolay Yakovlevich Danilevsky

I've removed {{fact}} as the claim was cited, along with the whole article (see "Source"). If you know of a source that contradicts it, that needs to be dealt with in the article, of course. --Mel Etitis (Μελ Ετητης) 10:27, 8 February 2006 (UTC)

The article does mention that Heinrich Rukkert was responsible for some of the concepts that Danilevsky used, but I can't find a mention anywhere of an earlier writer who presented the theory that Danilevsky did (and which seems to have influenced the more famous presenters of that sort of view, such as Toynbee). I'll keep looking for more evidence either way. --Mel Etitis (Μελ Ετητης) 10:52, 8 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Dear Mr.Vitar

This is in response to an edit I preformed in order to eliminate smut from the Wikipedia server and promote progress made by my sisters during the Woman's Rights Movement of the 1960's and early 70's. I was surprised to see that my edit was reverted back to its original defamatory offensive being. You sir are a bigot, male chauvinist? Perhaps...no most likely. I will bring this issue up at the next N.O.W conference, you will regret the day you meddled with me, a zealot of Womans Rights. I AM WOMAN. I AM STRONG.

ColenFace 05:37, 9 February 2006 (UTC)

Article in question: [2]

[edit] Goh Kang Ning

Thanks for fixing those ref on Chadian-Sudanese conflict. Please delete the nonsense page Goh Kang Ning. Thanks. KI 03:06, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Wikimeetup Delaware

As discussed, I've "officially" announced the meetup. See Wikipedia:Meetup/Newark Raul654 06:04, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Edits

Hey Gren,

As a student of Arabic and Farsi, I am updating the thousand-fold, seemingly random & often terrible transliterations of Arabic and Persian words to the standards found in modern scholastic work. There is no accepted standard used outside of scholarly works for many Near Eastern languages, but it is very frustrating to me to read a text discussing, ie., the Companions of the Prophet and run into the same name spelled five different ways, all according to the English or French spelling habits of the writer in question.

As for the content you noticed, I didn't write it. I've been sticking to making transliterations systematic, though if you think the use of certain letters (like Š) should be left (as Sh), I can see the argument. Nothing drives me battier than an awful transliteration system - as an example, for the Persian New Year, I've encountered in my travels nauruz, nawrooz, noroz, norooz, navrūz, nowruz, nowrooz... and I could continue on ad nauseum. In systematic modern Farsi transliteration by scholars, this appears as Nowruz. I dislike the umlaut, but if it is confusing, maybe I can choke on it.

I did not write the partisan slop that bothered you, though oft I reorganise it. I am more interested in grammar, spelling & systematic transliterations than anything else; sometimes I remove things that seem appallingly partisan, like in the article about Allat where they erased well-known historical fact and accepted traditional explanations of her name as meaning "the goddess" in favour of some ridiculous and unsubstantiated legend about her cult arising from the deification of a (male) Jewish water seller.

Sælum Gren, just an update. I am continuing to update badly-transliterated forms; particularly egregious to me are the Farsi nightmares caused by no well-known romanisation forms. I do think it is worthwhile to embark on a systemisation of Persian words: as an example, Qom notes that its name in ancient times was Kum and in modern Persian it is Qom, sometimes spelled Qum. In comparison, the names of the Shi'a Schools of Learning, the howzeha, are spelled hawza, hawzah, howzeh, hozeh, huzah... etc. These I standardise to modern Persian howze, just as I standardised the name of Fatema and the Ayætollah and many other forms. There is a simple, one-to-one transliteration available for Farsi once you realise that you either have to mark the "two as" differently, either as æ a (as i prefer) or a å (which is more confusing). I think it is reasonable to use æ given its use in European languages, but I keep sh, zh and gh as is. em zilch 07:32, 22 February 2006 (UTC)
Thing is, there is a standard romanisation used by scholars and by modern language-learning texts, and it is a boldly phonetic one, ignoring the niceties of, say, the many Arabic sounds that don't correspond. (There's like four ways to write a z as a result.) The romanisation is un-tricky and the only oddity is the use of æ. I think the systematic use of a simple romanisation system for Farsi is far and away the best thing we can do for the ease of the reader; for words with standardised forms, like "Ayatollah", I mark the standard form as well as providing the Farsi equivalent. It is a massive disservice to students and interested parties that, say, Olæma is spelled in fifteen different ways, and when appropriate (as, say, in the names of Iranian saints like Hæzræt Fatema Mæ'sume - who oddly enough has no entry of her own yet!). em zilch/nahid særvi 07:47, 22 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Template question

I'm having trouble with formatting a template I created - Template:Chadian-Sudanese conflict. Any ideas how to fix it? KI 23:04, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for fixing the code. I agree, it is too large. Is there a way to reduce the space between the columns and the rows? I took the original formatting from the Buddhism2 template. KI 23:41, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
Any idea on how to make this smaller? KI 04:16, 14 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] ColenFace

Colenface left messages here that were frankly, bizarre and harassing. I blocked him for a week, but he's claiming he knows you and asking to be unblocked. I leave the decision in your hands. Raul654 07:49, 13 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] ColenFace

Hey Grenavitar I dont understand. Come back to AIM this form of communication is too slow. 20:40, 14 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Question

Over on the Pakistan page, one of the users insists on inserting "(coincides with Indian history)" as part of the headers within the history section. There has been no consensus to do so, yet he goes about adding it on average of almost once a day for the past 4-5 days. Is there any like policy to keep him from doing so, as it isn't neccessary because it is inferred from the article that Pakistan was once apart of India and its obvious that the histories coincide with each others. Pepsidrinka 19:41, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Wikisource?

Do you have a wikisource account? If so can you add the text from User:KI/Temp and then add a link to the Chadian-Sudanese conflict. This would be much appreciated. KI 20:15, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

It was released to the public right after they wrote it, to let Chadians know that the UFDC was now the biggest rebel force in the area - to attract more recruits. KI 14:53, 18 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Why the Hostilities ??

Look,I tried to argue it out with the people in the talk page of pakistan but they kept coming up with stuff like "there have been armed separatists in Tibet","Neither country has continuously existed for thousands of years" etc. ........And when i went the distance and replied to all of their so-called arguments they wrote a short paragraph each murmuring something about me saying "monolithic and continuous" and not replying to my questions or even justifying their stands any longer.......,so your idea of attaining a consenseus is an option i've been trying but the opposition is resorting to making fraud remarks( like armed seperatists in tibet or LTTLE being buddhist),not responding to my stand or just hightailing it on the talk page............................Having said that,what exactly is wrong with saying that the 60 years old pakistan's history coincides with india,it actually does y'know that ,right ???.........................So,quite simply plese stop threatening to abuse your power as the people you asked me to obtain consenseus from either tell lies or simply run away..............and the history of pakistan does coincide with india's.............Try not to abuse your power by asking me to do the impossible and try telling those in my opposition to argue their case out in the talk page and justify their stand there,thank you Freedom skies 16:02, 16 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] You're becoming a Bollywood fan?

See your imprimatur on a lot of articles on my watchlist :) Zora 11:22, 17 February 2006 (UTC)

Films: Roja, Yi Yi, Waiting for Guffman, anything by Ang Lee, Chunhyang, Tampopo, Raghu Romeo, Kondukain Kondukain, Farinelli, Mughal-e-Azam, Umrao Jaan, Main Hoon Na, Jhanak Jhanak Payal Baje ... enough to get you started? Zora 12:11, 17 February 2006 (UTC) P.S. Anything by Miyazaki.

[edit] Casinos in Las Vegas

In reply to your message, see Category:Casinos in Las Vegas - almost every casino under the sun is being listed, whether large or small, some I've never even heard of before. Model Citizen 16:29, 17 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Template:User independent Quebec 2

Jimbo offered a personal appeal against political templates, but on a voluntary basis. T1, however, is limited to "divisive" and "polemical" templates. In particular, polemical refers to controversial templates that are *against* something, rather than *for* it. For instance, "This user hates communists" is divisive and polemical. "This user supports the independence of Tibet" isn't, because although some will disagree, the template does not attack anyone or any organization, it simply states a belief that Tibet should be independent. I don't understand how these templates meet grounds for deletion, and thus reversed the decision. Although I'll stand down from these sorts of efforts to avoid wheel warring, I think T1, while honorable in its intent, is far too subjective and grants way too much power to administrators to work effectively as a policy. Sarge Baldy 19:31, 18 February 2006 (UTC)

Or perhaps I just find the misuse of T1 policy to be inflammatory :P Sarge Baldy 19:42, 18 February 2006 (UTC)
Agreed with Sarge. Would you object if I'd restore this template? I can move it to my userspace if this would be a reasonble compromise.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 00:08, 19 February 2006 (UTC)
Well, I'd definetly like to avoid any kind of admin revert war, especially over such a petty issue. My biggest problem with userboxes is that they waste valuable time that we can put into editing articles, so this entire debate is to me a fairly pointless excercise. But, paraphasing Voltaire, I think that unless a userbox is clearly dangerous or illegal, we shouldn't worry about them.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 00:14, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Wikipedia:Proposed deletion

Thanks for the info. =) At the time I made that edit, I don't think {{prod}} had gone live yet, so I left it as it was. Speaking of contributers forgetting the articles they edit - I had completely forgotten that I added that template. It was just one of the many uncategorized stubs I came across while perusing Category:Stubs. I don't really enjoy putting deletion tags on articles, but I guess I'll have to suck it up eventually. Hopefully I'll see you at the meetup. I'm still not sure if I'll be there since I only recently made a user account. — Indi [ talk ] 18:45, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Natzweiler-Struthof

Thx for your comment and translation and nice to meet you. salut ! :) --Pontauxchats 19:09, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] History of art now COTW

Thanks to your support, this article is now the collaboration of the week. Feel free to help in any way possible during this week. — 0918BRIAN • 2006-02-19 20:22

[edit] Arirang Festival

Regarding Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Arirang: Grenavitar, I have uploaded a larger (1200 x 514) image, would you like to take another look? Thanks,--Colle|Image:locatecolle.gif|Talk-- 21:16, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Conical pendulum

Hello, I am notifing you as an editor of the article Conical pendulum that this article is need of some wikification. Can you please take a look at the article and clean it up a little? Thanks. James084 00:34, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] RE: Niki Karimi

The references for the English titles are in the 'References' and 'External Links' --Kash 16:23, 22 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Arm wrestling

Keep Needs much work. image:VirtualSteve.pngVirtualSteve 06:13, 23 February 2006 (UTC)
keep certainly more than one sentence there now. Jcuk 08:59, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

I am glad that they wanted to keep the article, but don't they see there is more then one sentence? They just ignore me efforts. Oh yeah how do i configure my signature or do have to copy and paste グレン every time? rydia 13:00, 23 February 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Meetup reminder

Just a reminder that there will be a meetup in Newark, DE, this saturday at 3:00 PM. (Since people have complained after previous meetups that they had forgotten about it, this message is going to everyone listed on Wikipedia:Meetup/Newark) Raul654 15:37, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Fritz You should move to Iraq

[3]

[edit] Salam!

Yeah, i got fedd up a while, but since some people missed me, one even wanted to give me a award, i started to change my mind... However, i have had enough of a "certain" person, and i will not address that person again.

Regarding the template: [4]

And yeah, i have been improving my english :)

Thank you for you message, pease :) --Striver 16:20, 25 February 2006 (UTC)


Bro, what do you mean by "not all Sahaba were Muslims... so this can't be a sub category to Muslim"? [5] ? --Striver 16:29, 25 February 2006 (UTC)


look again:

Do it. --Juan Muslim 08:33, 5 November 2005 (UTC)

This is not a big deal for me. It was just my very subjective taste that it looked better stating it in that way, rather than having it somewhre among the first lines. The reason is that often, being a Sahaba is the main thing about them that makes them notable. And since nobody objected, and Juan Muslim said Do it, i did it. But i wont put up a fight if you really hate it. No big deal.

Muhammad's (pbuh) uncle is a Sahaba only according to Shi'as, Sunnis dont belive he said the Shahada. A Sahaba is per part of the definiton a person that died a Muslim. --Striver 16:39, 25 February 2006 (UTC)

Sounds good.

I havent even bothered with the complexity of the Sahaba issue, i mean, my efforts to present the Shi'a view of muawiya is vandalized, and with the battles regarding the 9/11 issues, and the Muslim list, i dont have time to go in to the Sahaba article. I mean, everyone, EVERYONE hated me in the beginning when i wanted to NPOV it, and they called everything they could come up with.... Just look at the bottom the Sahaba talk page, youll see that the one that gets me angry just thinking of the person is still having it the POV way....

Shi'a dont even share the same definition of being a Sahaba as the Sunnis do, Sunnis consider it enough to be a Muslim and seeing him, Shi'a demand that they understood him and spent a notable amount of time with him... Im not even going there, i dont even bother puting a pov sign over the article, im so damn angry of how i was treated, just read the talk page... First i was called, basicly, an ashole for demanding the Sunni list of Sahaba to be complemented with a Shi'a list, the i was called the same things for claiming that all Muslims agreed there was 100 000 sahaba.... *pause* im gonna stop writng now, i just get so mad... --Striver 16:53, 25 February 2006 (UTC)


Oh... dont even go there... You will be put in a crossfire between Shi'a, Sunni and the *peep*.... I get dizzy just thinking about that... --Striver 16:56, 25 February 2006 (UTC)


If you want to remove the [Catergory Sahaba] from the articles, i wont oppose it. --Striver 16:57, 25 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Sunni - Shi'a - Sahaba

Looking at your comments on Striver's page, it seems that you're accepting a sectarian view of history, namely, that the split between Sunni and Shi'a goes back to 632 CE and the death of Muhammad, that there were well-defined parties that correspond to today's Sunni-Shi'a divisions, and that early Muslims can be easily slotted into those categories and called Sunni or Shi'a.

That's historically inaccurate and seriously misleading. That is projecting today's Sunni-Shi'a antagonisms onto history. All the academic historians I'm reading say that before the Abbasids, the Shi'at Ali was simply a shorthand for the folks that thought Ali or one of his descendants should be the leader. People moved in and out of that camp depending on circumstances. It is only with the Abbasid suppression of further Alid claims and the Jafari embrace of quietism that the Shi'a start turning into a religious sect.

I'm dealing with a Shi'a fanatic right now, who has decided to wipe the term Rafidi off the face of Wikipedia. He views it as a slur on Shi'a. He's ready to revert as much as necessary to get his way. Aargh. I knew that the bombing of the shrine was going to affect Wikipedia, I knew it. Zora 18:45, 25 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] O&S Group and Eli Oliveiro

I noticed your {{Prod}} of O&S Group. I am suspicious of it not simply as n-n, but as a hoax, or even part of the setup for a fraud.

Here's my very prelim dossier:

I'm tempted to tag them both for questioned accuracy & see what happens...
--Jerzy•t 03:54, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Followup to meetup

Since you had apparently not heard of it, see this Raul654 09:31, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

Congradulations... I think. You made it onto Al Jazeera. Raul654 07:30, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Category:Orientalist

Hi Gren, could you delete this category page Category:Orientalist . I created this category without realizing that there already was a category -Category:Orientalists-. --CltFn 16:11, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Christoph Luxenberg

Hi, Gren. I'm having more problems with CltFn imposing their version of the article, which I believe to be factually incorrect and misleading. I cannot be sure, but it appears that there might be an anti-Islamic motivation to the edits. I really don't fancy getting into a one-on-one edit war over this. Could you help out? Thanks. — Gareth Hughes 17:25, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Please look at this page

If you are a supporter of Don Bosco, take a look at this page.

[edit] DP

The problem with DP is Project Gutenberg is Michael Hart. He is a bad god-emperor of PG. He won't share power, he won't change the way he does things, his head is stuck in 1980. DP is increasingly just ignoring him. We ARE re-doing the older texts and putting them in XHTML, we are talking about saving texts in XML format, with page scans attached, we are talking about having a library with proper metadata. But doing those latter two means either overthrowing Michael Hart or waiting for him to die.

As for the Islamic texts -- we're doing a few, but they're still stuck in second-round or post-processing. We recently changed the way the site ran, moving from two rounds of proofing to four (for extra goodness!) and things are backed up now.

DP Europe is doing Unicode-based stuff and has done a few Urdu texts.

You would be a wonderful addition to DP and the folks there are generally sweet and wonderful. It's a much nicer place than WP. Just not as ... compelling, if you like intellectual fisticuffs.

Tell me more, in email, about how other folks view the Islam-related articles in WP. Zora 04:37, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] User 82.194.62.22

If you're still up and around, could you check out this user? He's driving me nuts. He was banned for vandalizing my userpage but he's back with a vengeance. He thinks I'm a Salafi out to massacre Shi'a. He seems to be seriously unhinged. I've run out of energy and reverts. Zora 06:28, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

El C seems to have done a round of reverts. Zora 06:33, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

Oy, oy, oy, he's still at it ... he's reverting just about everything I edit, no reasoning, not limiting it to Islamic articles. I posted at the ANB, but no one seems to be paying attention.

This is so depressing. Zora 06:28, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Arabic texts

Mustafaa (how I miss him! and Ifaqeer!) gave me this link:

[6]

It's a compendium of classic Arabic texts, gathered online. But I can't read any of it yet. If you're learning Arabic, this may be of some use to you. Zora 08:04, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] I saw your note to Raul

My goodness, you mentioned me and my username appears on Al-Jazeera! The CIA will certainly take notice of me now :)

A valiant effort to communicate with that columnist but ... it failed. The usual: the concept of doubt, of uncertainty, just doesn't seem to penetrate. There's the TRUTH, and then there's everything else. How long will this take to be "common sense"? A hundred years? Two hundred? Zora 08:19, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Movies

Waiting for Guffman does feature weird, creepy characters, and it's incredibly depressing and funny at the same time, so don't watch it.

As for Ang Lee -- The Wedding Banquet is one of the funniest movies I've seen. The Ice Storm is amazing, but depressing, so I suppose you don't want to watch it. Sense and Sensibility is a marvelous take on Austen, one of the best. You would like Eat Drink Man Woman. I haven't seen Push Hands.

Hmm, Austen movies. The English Persuasion -- I think it's the one with Ciaran Hinds? The Colin Firth "tempestuous Darcy" version of Pride and Prejudice. Zora 08:28, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Oh, and thanks for intervention re Shi'a harrasser

I put up a link to an article from a Shi'a website that may convince him that Rafidi is an old, old word. Zora 08:49, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] IP 82.194.62.23

Hi Grenaviatar.. I read your message to IP 82.194.62.23 and I want you to know that mistakingly blocking me (or others who share this IP) is not fair. I had nothing to do with his/her edits. I never edited articles on religion in Wikipedia and I will never do it. You can simply compare the contributions to check for the truth. --Unbreakable_MJ 10:21, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Devdas

Devdas (novel) is good. However, how about formatting the film articles like this: Devdas (2002 film)?

Could you take a look at Rang de Basanti? We have one contributor inserting an essay on Indian politics in the synopsis. I've reverted once, and I don't want to get into a revert war. Since I wrote the original text, I don't want to appear to be defending my prose to the death. Zora 07:40, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

Dwai says I jumped to conclusions. I thought it was an instant revert, and it may have been only that he was wikifying while I was reverting. We may have it handled -- dunno. Have a look. Zora 07:47, 3 March 2006 (UTC)
Yes, that is what happened.I was wikifying while Zora was editing, and the whole thing messed.Anyway,that insertion was NPoV and quite like a musing by the anon.However, as I tol to Zora just now, as the film as 1 month old now, don.t you think such edits as this (the anon) - of course taking care of NPoV may be added? may be in a separate para like "Influence of the movie" or something like that? the movie really made some impression on us.Please comment.--Dwaipayanc 07:59, 3 March 2006 (UTC)
That is why I am proposing not to include anything more to the plot summary/synopsis.We can start a new sub-heading.Regarding source,we shall have to find out comments from online/print reviews , especially by professional reviewers.I will be trying to start.Please see the article periodically ro see changes and decide if the changes are acceptable.thanks.--Dwaipayanc 08:05, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Millsy62

Thank you. I've moved the rest of my new album page's templates to the talk pages. I'm still learning here! Thank's for the comment and compliment. Millsy62 09:16, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Thought you might enjoy this.

[7] Zora 09:37, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Devdas (disambiguation)

Hey, I saw your edits and I want to question one thing. You stopped hiding the disambiguation parts of the title... is that really part of the MoS.... because that's incredibly stupid. It now says "Devdas (1955 film), 1955 film"... which is completely redundant and the reason I made it say "Devdas, 1955 film" is because it gave me the opportunity to properly format a disambiguation. Can you show me where in the MoS it says to do that... because, if it really does then I think that's really a stupid idea. gren グレン 14:01, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

Hi, see Wikipedia:Manual of Style (disambiguation pages), specifically the guideline on piping. The purpose of a dab page is to let the reader choose between several articles with the same title, and the parenthetical clarifier helps to disinguish them. Regards. --Muchness 19:11, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Gay rights in Ghana

You added unreferenced and accuracy tags to Gay rights in Ghana a while ago. I have found an excerpt of the Ghana penal code, and a mention in an ILGA survey of gay rights in the country to persecution of a homosexual, that supports the claims on the page. As such, I have removed the tags. KI 00:52, 4 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Stormy petrel

Striver set up an article for Haydar, which he used as a subsidiary article for Ali ibn Abi Talib, to siphon off the overflow of praise that had built up :) When this was turned into the usual name disambiguation page, he started regular reverts to his version, on the grounds that the other editors were removing information. All the information is in the Ali article but ... this is not good enough.

Could you join the revert team? It's going to be a matter of wearing him down, I guess.

In other news, I've run head-on into the Persian nationalist cadre again. The Persians are sure that all the Arabs of Khuzestan are later immigrants and interlopers, invading the sacred Persian lands. When I insist that this is not proven, that it might also have been the local population that was Arabicized, I'm reverted. I put up a POV tag, which Southern Comfort removed immediately. His position seems to be that I'm just to be ignored, swatted off like a fly. I let him do this to me earlier, which I'm sure is why he thinks he can do it again. This time I'm ready to take it to arbitration if necessary. I'll just replace the POV tag a few times, let him remove it, and then file an RfC, if it comes to that. Do you have any other suggestions? It's late and I'm tired and I might be too upset to think straight.

Stormy petrel, always flying over rough waters. Sigh. Zora 12:05, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

Of course Zora never provides references for her controversial claims - she only makes personal attacks and accusations against others with no basis in fact. And yet she will quickly condemn anything that is sourced. Funny how she had no problems with the article until recently. I'll be gathering evidence against her (of which there is plenty) for the upcoming ArbCom. SouthernComfort 12:15, 6 March 2006 (UTC)
I've removed the tag until she can justify that the section is not neutral. She has provided no opposing references or any sources to back up her claims. Until she does so, she has no right to call it POV. If she wants to add opposing sources, that's perfectly fine with me. Unlike her, I have no prejudices and I am not selective in picking out sources. SouthernComfort 12:19, 6 March 2006 (UTC)
Tell me, if she has no sources to counter what is in the article, where is the problem exactly? If someone doesn't like the information in an article and decides to put up a tag, but has no sources or references to back up their claims that the article is not neutral or accurate, they have no justification. Do you see what I am saying? If everyone on WP behaved this way, none of the articles could ever proceed because the content would constantly be disputed - it's only when opposing sources are added that any disputes can be added, which she doesn't have. Review her edits yourself - she injected her own speculative opinions into the article, as she has done so before. She has never attempted, in these instances, to back up any claims with sources. Does she take WP as a joke? SouthernComfort 12:44, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Re: A BEST -> A Best

Well, the first page of results from a Google search for "A Best" "ayumi" had the title capitalised as "A Best" in every instance, but I'm uncertain about Wikipedia's naming conventions regarding this issue so I won't mind if you move the page back. Thanks! Extraordinary Machine 20:46, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] I'm Sorry

I'm Sorry, I didn't know I thought it didn't amtter could you tell me what the colors mean??Fullmetal Alchemist 22:38, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Homosexuality and Islam

Just wondering if my suggestion on Talk:Homosexuality_and_Islam#Homosexuality_in_the_Sharia is sufficient for you to accept the removal of the NPOV on that section? It would seem to solve the issue as you stated it.--Myk 00:17, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Lol Thanks For your help

Thanks again for explaining it to me yeah I did like the colors.......*looks sad* thanks for the help and the compliment--Fullmetal Alchemist 03:00, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Wikipedia:Defense of content

Hi Grenavitar - I'm hoping you will have some time to look into this proposal - its a new idea that I'm hoping will help protect Wikipedia's content quality by delaying the incorporation of potentially problematic edits. You are a respected admin with experience in policy, so your input is especially valued. I hope you will give us your opinions and ideas on making it work. Thanks! Rama's Arrow 05:57, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] DPers use Jabber, I think

I prefer BBS style conversation to chat, so I stopped using Jabber. Here's a link to a FAQ at DP on using Jabber [8]. Zora 00:06, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

Post-processors have an enormous influence on what is produced. The texts I post-processed are ASCII only, since at the time I was nervous about learning how to format XHTML. I think I'd like to learn now (also PGTEI), but I'm too busy being hated by Sunni, Shi'a, the RSS, and Iranian nationalists. Woo-hoo! Zora 03:53, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] User:CltFn

Hi Gren, personally I wouldn't block him for that. If you look at the log, [9] he hasn't uploaded that many images, and many are book covers that may not need a source. There's no doubt that he's often disruptive, but the image uploads in themselves may not be grounds enough. That's just my opinion, however, and it's a judgment call, so I certainly wouldn't interfere if you go ahead. SlimVirgin (talk) 16:00, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

Though things have been quiet at Reading Lolita in Tehran for the last few hours, you may wish to take a look at that and its talk page from time to time. -- Hoary 07:25, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Songs by Language

Hi. Have you thought this through?! This is the English Wikipedia. You'll end up with potentially 100,000 or more in "English" and a handful in "Bulgarian". I've removed My Sweet Lord from the category as I consider it pointless.

If you want to put the Beatles and solo songs in, then you can add their categories to your cat instead? --kingboyk 00:45, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] RFC

Please comment on my rfc Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Jersey Devil--Jersey Devil 22:00, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Hadith names

Yes, hadith have names. I googled and found a site selling a Hadith Encyclopedia and it advertised:

"Famous Hadiths’ (al-ahadith al-musamma). This index allows a hadith to be located by the name by which it is popularly known."

Plus I believe Zereshk also names hadith, with Shi'a names, and he is somewhat more grounded in reality than Striver.

I don't know if Shi'a and Sunni choose the same hadiths to name, and if so, if they agree on the names.

Zereshk always gives the names of the hadith in Arabic first, and then a translation, so it's possible that Striver doesn't know the Arabic (he seems to avoid using Arabic) and he has mangled a translated name. Or, he might have made up a name. Zora 10:28, 13 March 2006 (UTC)


[edit] AID

 Thank you for your support of the Article Improvement Drive.
This week Great Leap Forward and Decline of the Roman Empire were selected to be improved to featured article status.
Hope you can help…

-Litefantastic 17:43, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Umrao Jaan

My DVD is from Bollywood Entertainment. The picture is OK, but not of the sharpest, and the film stock color flickers. I think that's just because it's an old film. The introductory ads are from newer pictures and they're sharp.

The biggest drawback for me is that there are no subtitles. I have to be a good guesser. Zora 08:05, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

Well d'oh. I forgot to turn on the subtitles. I'm watching it again. No wonder I knew so much about the plot. Rekha is not a good dancer, really. She's too abrupt and angular. A friend took me to a performance of Odissi dance and wowee! zowee! was that amazing! Dancers a hundred times better than Rekha. Zora 10:22, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
No ASIN number. Do I have a pirate version? Zora 12:31, 15 March 2006 (UTC)


[edit] afd

See Wikipedia:WikiProject Islam:The Muslim Guild/Articles for deletion#Jersey_Devil--Striver 16:05, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] New article accusing Muhammad of pedophilia

A brand new user took all the material on "age at marriage controversy" from Aisha and moved it to a new article, Mohammed's sexual orientation, which accuses Muhammad of being a pedophile. I'm exhausted and involved in too many things -- could you see about dealing with this? I dunno if it deserves a speedy delete or whether we have to grind through a regular AfD.

Given that the article deals with one marriage out of twelve, all of the others being to women who were in several cases much older than Muhammad, and that no argument is made, or cited, that this demonstrates "sexual orientation", it could be argued that it is original research.

It could be that it would make sense to move this material OUT of the Aisha article and into one specifically on the controversy but if so, it should be retitled. But leaving it in the Aisha article seems fine to me too.

This new user knows too much about how WP works for a new user; I suspect that this is the return of someone banned. Enviroknot? Aargh. Zora 05:23, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] You are in the news again

See here Raul654 03:54, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Much appreciation

That is exactly what I was trying to do but I didn't know the appropriate syntax. Thank you! Pepsidrinka 06:58, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Mohammed's sexual orientation

It was my understanding that this page had in fact been re-created, or at least blanked and reverted, several times. Of course, the deleted-page template does absolutely nothing to prevent the re-creation of similar material at Muhammad's sexual orientation, which by my understanding is now the preferred scholarly Classical Arabic transliteration, and conforms to the location of the chief article at Muhammad. Verbum sapienti satis. . . Smerdis of Tlön 17:30, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

I turned it back to a simply deleted page. Smerdis of Tlön 19:18, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] My Rfc

Please comment on my Rfc. Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Jersey Devil--Jersey Devil 02:14, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] a slightly more professional sentence

You're joking. You mean you got paid to write that? Jeffmatt 06:09, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] I know

... you were joking. So was I! I just had to pee something fierce and I couldn't find the the stub tag. No harm, no foul, peace, love...etc. etc. Cheers from Naples, Italy. Lovely spring day. Jeffmatt 06:32, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Abdul Rahman (convert)

Gren, I think you're right to worry about that statement. The Afghan mullahs who are calling for a death sentence seem be Taliban remnants following a stern Deobandi tradition. They're country hicks. Snake-handler types :) It's not fair to sane Muslims to tar all of them with the same brush. I'd suggest revising to "some interpretations of Islam" and linking to the Islam and apostasy article, or whatever it's called, which goes into it in more detail. Zora 02:09, 25 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] 1.0 core topics

 You showed support for Boat at Wikipedia:Version 1.0 Editorial Team/Core topics/Core topics COTF. This article was selected as our collaboration. Hope you can help.

[edit] 'ishq and gender

There has been much equivocation and rationalization and distancing in the last hundred years or two regarding the love of boys in Islamic verse and thought. The one you mention is a not infrequent refrain. But recent historical writings contradict much of that. The interpretation you suggest sounds like a typical half-truth. I would point to a recent work, Islamic Homosexualities, Murray and Roscoe, 1997, in which Louis Crompton has an essay, "Male Love and Islamic Law in Arab Spain", in which he discusses Ibn Hazm at length, mentionng that about one tenth of his anecdotes are about the love of youths (why would the purported "respect" towards women not obtain in the other 90%?) and gives explicit examples, such as the potentates who rejoices when the page-boy notices his gaze and slaps him. At any rate, Moorish Spain was a hotbed of boy love, both among the Moslems and the Jews, why would Inb Hazm not have reflected on it? Haiduc 11:47, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

I am unfamiliar with Chejne's work, and I will return to the Hazm article when works eases up a tad. Thanks for looking at that article. Cheers, Haiduc 12:06, 28 March 2006 (UTC)
Thanks for the links to DP and PG. I had run across PG without knowing what it was. Worthwhile work - if I had ten livetimes I would never get to the end of all I would like to do. How do people still get bored? It is beyond me. Cheers, Haiduc 01:11, 31 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Khomeini

Please see User:Aucaman's recent addition to Ruhollah Khomeini. These views are not specific to Khomeini, but to all Shi'a marjas. I'm in no mood for conflict with this particular user, so considering the recent ordeal with CltFn, perhaps someone else can explain to him why the inclusion of this new section is wrong. There is also a a lack of context. Also see Dhimmi#Shi.27a_ritual_purity and the same sources used in Persian Jews. The sources in question are all from Bernard Lewis. He is also apparently claiming that the section (which he added) is only about non-Muslims, when it is actually about ritual cleanliness and reverting as such to his version. I am not interested in getting too involved, but at the same time NPOV is only fair. Any help you can provide would be appreciated. Thank you. SouthernComfort 14:07, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Islamic Rulings

I am sorry to bring this conversation to your talk page. I keep thinking that people will not visit my talk page after they post a comment so they may not see my response. I understand what you are saying. Somebody has already edited Islamic Rulings to include viewpoints from other areas. I realize that there are many views on how to interpret the Quran. The most accepted way is based on the Hadith but I realize that progressive Muslims and other sects are going away from the Hadith. Generally in the sunni and salafi sects of Islam, these people are not classified as Muslims. But I realize that a neutral viewpoint needs to be given. I wrote an article on Dua, from a sunni viewpoint from a salafi book. The controversial stuff was eliminated. The stuff such as bid’ah of wiping face after dua I did not include. Some people say that the seven hadith refering to it are weak while others say that those are authentic. And there were several other issues. I know some other sects may have a different take on the interpretations. Also I realize that there are hadith that were fabricated that some other sects rely on and those have not been included. If you can find me help to expand my Dua and Islamic Rulings article with other view points, it would be greatly appreciated. I guess its best too include points from every sect, but not too take out anything though. MuslimsofUmreka 17:42, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Request

I heard about it on the history channel tonight, so I quickly spun out a stub - Three Whom God Should Not Have Created: Persians, Jews, and Flies (a racist pamhplet by Saddam's uncle/adoptive father). I'm having trouble finding any information on the actual contents - do you have any ideas where I could find some? Raul654 08:02, 1 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Wikipedia survey

Hi. I'm doing a survey of Wikipedia editors as part of a class research project. It's quick, anonymous, and the data will be made available to the Wikipedia community later this month. Would you like to take part? More info here. Thanks! Nonplus 00:54, 2 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Mistakes

Thanks for the advice Gren. Oscabat 15:22, 2 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Thank you

You were ever so much nicer and more patient than I would have been. Thanks for devoting the time to this. You have a future in diplomacy, young man. Zora 20:24, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Lechaeum

Xenophon's reliability isn't a huge issue for this particular topic, since his account gibes with the less detailed account by Diodorus Siculus, and modern scholars have found no reason to question it. Any time I cite something to Xenophon, I've checked to see that modern scholarship supports it, but I like to provide the most direct source of the citation. In this case, the detailed account of the battle is accepted by scholars, as best I can tell; the one sneaky thing he does is withhold the name of the commander, presumably because the man had disgraced himself with the defeat. All this means that the Lechaeum article was pretty straightforward. If you'd like an example of how I've handled this on issues where Xenophon's account is problematic, Corinthian War is a pretty good example. Does this address your concerns? RobthTalk 21:18, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

After deep and profound meditation, I finally came up with the obvious and simple answer for how to discuss Xen's account (for some reason I originally overlooked it and spent a great deal of time bouncing around overly complex and unworkable ideas.) Let me know what you think. RobthTalk 02:02, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Thanks

Thanks for the advice,I am new and can learn and thank you for all the tips, most of which is warranted as i just do not know the rules or the way to do things, and thanks for helping out on the Waqt disambuagation , wherever i feel the advice is warranted i will take it but a few points I am sore about and would like to get across.

1. I think that the advice on copying and pasting is unwarranted- The content section that I have pasted has been commented upon by Zora and after that I have not pasted, I have used websites for getting information and written about it. Filmography is based on imdb, but worked on and then put.( So is that acceptable or not ? because i have seen straight lifts from imdb filmography being pasted) So i think the threat to have me removed is excessive here.

2. The language which seemed grammatically incorrect to you in the Waqt piece is bollywood speak, so multistarrer is what multi star cast films are referred to as in the "English" print in India. So anyone familiar with bollywood would be familiar with multistar and multistarrer.I am aware of my limitations, and grammar is not one of them, this is not an objective matter so I would request you not to pass judgement like "don't write prose outside your limitations. If one wears a critcs hat one can find fault with anything, and if one was just to look at English, Grammar and spelling I am sure none of us are 100% correct all the time.

3.I am trying to make some content here about people who are not represented. Om Prakash being a case in point would be a part of the cast and not come in the movie for a frame or two, but have a character. So he has a role to play wherever I am making a point about him, I have seen the movies where I am making an addition so trust me on that. And I will not be looking to just adding Om Prakash, but when I would work on one artist, I would like to cross reference him to his/her body of work, and i think that should be a part of what the encyclopedia would want.

In the end overall I am glad you wrote , and beleive me I appreciate your effort, but I think that some effort is being put in by me to create content about a lot of things and people who do not have any representation ( or very little representation). hence it is work in progress, and I have even asked for help (defintely NOT on grammar and English) by posting the articles I am working on on the bollwood related link. So I am exposing what I am doing and not just trying to get my bias or point of view across. Some polishing is always possible and welcome.

thanks once again

Haphar 07:12, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Thanks again

Thanks for cleaning up the I.S Johar, Om Prakash and Motilal pages too

Haphar 07:37, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Rules of war in Islam

I have been attempting to make some corrections for NPOV at the above article and am constantly reverted without explanation. I believe I am correct, but could you please check to be certain? Thank you. SouthernComfort 08:31, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Songs of Innocence (album)

Hi Grenavitar. You originally created the article on David Axelrod's 1968 album, Songs of Innocence (album). Is the title Songs or Song (singular) of Innocence ? The artwork on the album cover says Song of Innocence it seems, as shown in the Wikipedia article. Also consider this review which is pointed at by the article. [10]. Admittedly, it was inspired by Blake's Songs of Innocence.

Perhaps the 1968 release was "Song of Innocence" and later re-released as "Songs of Innocence" ? See this link and new artwork for a later re-release in the 1970's where it seems to be "Songs of Innocence". [11]. But the 1968 original album seems to have been "Song of Innocence". Thanks. --- (Bob) Wikiklrsc 17:46, 5 April 2006 (UTC)

Hi Gren. Thanks for your reply on my talk page. It seems that the original album was released as "Song of Innocence" (see cover art) and perhaps re-released as "Songs of Innocence" later. I am not sure. But it does appear that the 1968 album cover artwork says "Song of Innocence". A web search shows conflicting results. BBC just played out the album from 1968 and called it "Song of Innocence" ! I think a subsequent album was always called "Songs of Experience". Perhaps there was a re-release after that. But the actual song on the album is called "Song of Innocence" (singular), too. Complicated. Perhaps a re-direct from an new article on "Song of Innocence" or vice-versa ? Best Regards. --- (Bob) Wikiklrsc 23:17, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Maser of Arts

I am not really concerned about what happens to Master of Arts - I simply wanted to highlight the different definitions of the degree. I would happy so long as Master of Arts (Scotland) and Master of Arts (Oxbridge) are maintained... Davidkinnen 17:50, 5 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Salesian

I have been involved with the Salesians for many years. The Oblates are not Salesians. The Salesians were found by John Bosco. evrik 14:50, 6 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tawkerbot2

I think you just experienced a case of "bot thinks its on another page and thinks the word looks out of context" bug, I'm going to put it on tomorrows list as i'm about to fall asleep over this keyboard -- Tawker 08:42, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Films by language - renaming/merging. Where was the discussion?

Hi, I notice that on 10 February you deleted "Category:Films in Chinese" (deletion log) and created Category:Chinese language films. I am not aware of any discussion regarding this matter and I am under the impression that all category deletions (even speedies, which this would not qualify as) should be tagged and posted at CFD for discussion. The naming of this category as "Films in Chinese" was in fact the subject of discussion on CFD previously and the consensus was to use the name "Films in Chinese". The discussion is at Wikipedia:Categories for deletion/Log/2005 October 26#Category:Chinese-language films to Category:Chinese language films. I also notice that on the following day you merged "Category:Films in Spanish" into Category:Spanish language films (deletion log). Could you point me to the appropriate discussion of both of these please. It doesn't appear to be in CFD's archived discussion. Thanks. Valiantis 13:48, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

Further to the above, I notice also that you renamed "Welsh-language films" to "Welsh language films" on 10 February (deletion log). Again no obvious discussion. The form without a hyphen is grammatically incorrect. Valiantis 13:57, 8 April 2006 (UTC)
Thanks for the reply. I don't believe there is a solid convention. There was no consensus on my proposal (Wikipedia:Categories for deletion/Log/2006 January 16#Films by language) to block rename to "Films in XXX" - "votes" were split 50/50, but only six people cared enough to "vote". Most other "by language" cats are in the form "XXX-language" (with or without hyphen), but this is generally problematic (IMO). Firstly, and most trivially, there is an issue about hyphenation. As WP's own article Hyphen#Rules and customs of usage makes clear, compound modifiers like "German-language" should generally use a hyphen to avoid ambiguity about what modifies what. Some people, however, don't seem to know of this spelling guideline so we get a mix of both usages. Secondly, the "-language" is only needed where the name of the language is also a nationality adjective: - i.e. we need to distinguish between "German films" (films from Germany) and "German-language films" (films with German dialogue), but we only need "Telugu films" as "Telugu" is not a nationality adjective. Consequently, we will always have a mix of "XXX-language films" and "XXX films" and hence no consistency. Thirdly, specifically with regard to Chinese, there is a debate (as much political as linguistic) as to whether Chinese is a language or a group of related languages. The form "Films in Chinese" was proposed as a compromise as "Chinese-language films" implies that Chinese is one language and is therefore POV. I prefer the "Films in XXX" form as it avoids all three problems (and also creates shorter cat names!), but I could settle for correctly punctuated "XXX-language" cats where required, (though this doesn't solve the Chinese issue). I appreciate that you acted in good faith, but I feel these categories are now consistently wrongly named as opposed to inconsistent but at least correctly named in places :). I am minded to re-list the Chinese cat on CFD for renaming back to what was previously agreed on (especially as the subcat "Films in Cantonese" still has that form), but before I do, I'm wondering if you have any further thoughts. Valiantis 00:07, 9 April 2006 (UTC)
OK, I will probably list them all for renaming with a hyphen. I suspect I will have to argue the point. Correct punctuation seems to be the hardest thing to get agreement on! It would be inappropriate for me to list the whole lot for renaming as "Films in XXX" in any case as my failed proposal to do this was made only a couple of months back. I think the Chinese issue may be a sticking point, but that will probably depend on who happens to be reading CFD at the time. Re: Tamil films - I don't think there's an issue with your point. Films are categorised by country and by language; they're not categorised by geographical area or by subnational entity. Films in Category:Tamil films will also be in Category:Indian films (or perhaps Category:Singaporean films or Category:Sri Lankan films). Valiantis 17:45, 9 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Categories

Too complicated:D But sounds good! Thanks for letting me know. --Aminz 10:47, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Your recent excisions from the Mohamedou Ould Slahi article

You recently excised a large block of material from the Mohamedou Ould Slahi article. Your edit summary said merely "rv odd additions".

Were you planning on putting a more meaningful explanation on Talk:Mohamedou Ould Slahi for this excision? You might think it is obvious why you regarded this material as "odd". But it isn't. I have been going through the transcripts of Guantanamo detainees Combatant Status Review Tribunals, and this is how they look, when they are summarized. I sure hope you don't start excising the material I have summarized from other detainees transcripts because something about them makes you regard them as "odd". -- Geo Swan 12:44, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

Ah. You make several excellent points. In particular, it did not occur to me that it might have been a copyright violation. All right then, like you, if I come across a verifiable source I will summarize it, otherwise I will leave it as is. Cheers! -- Geo Swan 14:23, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] World Sevens Series

Regarding your comment on 2005-06 World Sevens Series... what do you think about the article now?  :) — Dale Arnett 18:27, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cast lists

Thanks for the comment; I've left a comment at the Talk page. --Mel Etitis (Μελ Ετητης) 12:11, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Speedy deletion

Regarding the article Image:Saudi coa.jpg, which you tagged for speedy deletion with the reason "Replaced by Image:Coat of arms of Saudi Arabia.png and unlinked", I wanted you to know that I have removed the speedy deletion tag. This article does not qualify for speedy deletion because the image referred to is on Wikimedia Commons, please see WP:CSD. If you still want the article to be deleted, please use the WP:IFD process. Thanks! Stifle (talk) 00:49, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

It's CSD I1, it's a redundant lower quality version of the other image... and it's also a Now Commons candidate... which, it already was. So, it would be deletable no? O_O gren グレン 01:03, 18 April 2006 (UTC)
CSD I1 specifically excludes images whose replacement is on Commons. See Wikipedia talk:Moving images to the Commons for full reasoning. Images that are redundant to an image on Commons must go through IFD. Stifle (talk) 15:25, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Edit Summaries

I will endeavour to use more edit summaries; apologies to all. em zilch 16:35, 19 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Very long

Comment Important: This talk page is becoming very long. Please consider archiving.
Stifle (talk) 00:49, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Friedman test

Thanks for alerting me to the changes. As far as I can tell, it seems to me that the method as it appears now isn't correct. I'll revert the changes and see if I can add a citation. Jogloran 01:41, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Hullo

I'd bet you'd enjoy this article at Wired [12]. Nice quote:

But why should I contribute to an article? I'm no expert.
That's fine. The Wikipedia philosophy can be summed up thusly: "Experts are scum." For some reason people who spend 40 years learning everything they can about, say, the Peloponnesian War -- and indeed, advancing the body of human knowledge -- get all pissy when their contributions are edited away by Randy in Boise who heard somewhere that sword-wielding skeletons were involved. And they get downright irate when asked politely to engage in discourse with Randy until the sword-skeleton theory can be incorporated into the article without passing judgment.

Hope you're having a nice weekend :) 05:59, 23 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Its actually very common

It's actually very very common for small indepedent features to not be added to IMDb for a long time... besides the producers have bigger prorities like making the actual film right now. If you need proof of my involvment, then I will see if I can get my release form scanned and sent to you. Ryan Moore 08:47, 23 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Lists of Islamic Jihads

Gren, that list is not copyvio, it is a whole different list than "List of Islamic Jihads". Please restore it .--CltFn 13:36, 23 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Maps

I have answered your queries at WP:PUI. If you have further questions or doubts let me know .--Aesed 22:34, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

I don't think you understood what I said at WP:PUI. I used a template of spain to fill in the frontier line based on the U of T data plus others. I did not use the contour from the U of T scans. --Aesed 21:32, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
What exactly do you need to know from me that will re-assure you that these images are legitimate. do you want to see the templates I used? Are you applying this same scrutiny to all other maps that you see on wikipedia ? What? In any case , I am currently making more maps , that I will be uploading shortly when they are completed.--Aesed 13:09, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Name change for Ali

Hi Gren, Zora and I are discussing a name change for Ali on Talk:Ali ibn Abi Talib. Would you please add your thoughts. Currently it's just her and I. Cuñado - Talk 17:31, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Aisha

I completely revised the "age at marriage" section for Aisha. Please take a look. Oof, that took hours. Zora 03:53, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Lex Mahumet pseudoprophete

Hi Gren. I can try to cite the source for the quotation. I pulled the text from a photocopy of a 16th century printed edition of the translation that I received in a medieval Latin class. So it'll take a bit of work in order to figure out how to cite it. --Wzhao553 02:56, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Thatsa lotsa movies

Maybe you'll be a film critic rather than a diplomat.

Was Walk the Line worthwhile? I've sorta been wanting to put that on my Netflix list. Right after Hairspray, which I haven't seen in a while, and adore. The ultimate feel good movie for girls who were fat in the 1960s. Zora 08:41, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Www.michaelmyrick.com

Please delete Www.michaelmyrick.com. Thanks, KI 00:35, 3 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] The Muslim prophet POV fork

Sorry to be so slow in replying.

I haven't gotten involved with that little POV fork because I'm exhausted. I really don't think it should exist. The articles on religious figures like Abraham should be expanded to include the views of all the "Abrahamic" religions -- Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Baha'i. The Jews and the Christians shouldn't monopolize them, and the Muslims shouldn't set up their own POV fork.

If any of the Muslim articles are so long that they threaten to imbalance the main article, then they can be set up as breakout articles. Whatever main article there is on "Muslim prophets" should be allowed to continue too, as Muslims recognize figures unknown to the other religions, and the Muslim view of prophets is different as well.

Does that help? Sorry, I'm stretched thin. Zora 11:50, 4 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Request for Comments on Current events

Hello Grenavitar/Archive 4 –

I'm trying to get some discussion going on two proposals regarding the current events page, but so far have gotten little to no response. Since you have recently edited the current events page, I'm asking for your input on these two proposals:

  • One proposal (this is the big one) involves putting the daily events from the current events pages into article-templates, a lá the monthly pages from 2003 to 2005, as well and having a consistent number of recent days on the current events page instead of a monthly archive. This would allow for the current events page and the respective month pages to be updated simultaneously without the monthly archival. For more, see the current events talk page.

Your input on one or both of these issues would be appreciated. joturner 22:09, 4 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Waqt

Well the movie focuses on a family and the focus is not on one character throughout the film. Unlike KKHH where Shahrukh is in focus all the time. The movie starts with Balraj Sahni, then switches focus between him and his three sons, so Balraj would be pretty integral to the "Star" part of the movie. About the rest, where does one put the cast of the film if not on the page on it ? And if one wants to create a sublist for all the cast are we not causing more complication and too much regimentation ? As the page is developed , the roles and stars part would be clear. But I think having incomplete information ( ie retaining "stars" and not the rest of the cast) is not what an encyclopedia should focus on. I am not going to be doing any reverts but I do think that brevity should not be at the cost of vital information which might be harder to get some years down the line.

Haphar 07:47, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

Apart from Balraj Sahni ( and maybe Sharmila Tagore) the rest do not really "star" in the film, my point is that getting the cast in is also important, and a sub category complicates/ clutters, a sequence of the larger "star" roles first followed by the lesser elements would be

logical. Of course the question of where does the cast end does arise. But listed names in imdb/ wiki should be a good indicator.Haphar 08:16, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Follow up

Per our conversation, I passed on your sentiments regarding Zora's part in the Aucman case, and I see now that the case has been closed, that the rest of the committee agreed. See? The system works. Raul654 14:53, 9 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Template:Islam

Hi , I have included a new image in the talk page of the Islam template, please make your comments about it to be included in the template, thanks  «₪Mÿš†íc₪»  (T) 18:49, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Image:MuslimOccupation.jpg, Image:Iberia 1150.gif, Image:Iberia 1300.gif

It looks to me as if the uploader of these images never fully accounted for the source of the blank Spain template but I wanted to make sure with you. Should these images go? Thanks -Nv8200p talk 00:54, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Merge salla Allahu alayhi wa salaam

I saw your comments on the Peace be upon him page. I put a topic about it on the talk page. They definitely refer to the same thing in the language. I thought the talk page would be the best place to discuss it in case some others have different opinions. If I don't hear anything in a couple of days, I can merge. ZaydHammoudeh 19:49, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Psycho

Hi there! Thanks for your suggestion about Psycho. The WP naming conventions favor the "straight" title for the work that came first (in this case, the book) and disambiguation for different versions within the same medium (1960 film, 1998 film, etc.). If there were only one film adaptation it would still be Psycho for the book and Psycho (film) for the film. If you want to suggest a change in the conventions, please feel free. I think the film article will get found all right, though. Cheers, ♥ Her Pegship♥ 15:13, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] List of Islamic Jihad

Gren , I want to create that article . I have modified the content so that it cannot be labelled as copyvio. So if you have any questions about it then discuss it first. THe act of just blocking me was innapropriate since you had not bothered to see that the new article that I had created did not match the original one. --CltFn 04:09, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Template French communes

That's nice of you to add a template to French communes. Could you use the standard (in English Wikipedia) Template:French commune rather than Template:Tableau comm. Thanks! olivier 12:16, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] FYI

During the week of the 12-17, UD tech services is putting on a course for professors on intergrating technologies into their lectures. I will be talking about wikis in general, and Wikipedia in particular. And one of the other speakers, Muqtader Kahn, (who from your college courses page, I see you are familiar with) will be talking about blogging. Raul654 04:04, 6 June 2006 (UTC)


[edit] undelete

Salam bro. Don't you think we should undelete Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Sahaba's ancestors? I put quite much time on it, and are proud of it, i belive its to usefull to be deleted. Im trying to see what people think before taking it to undeleteANI. What to you think?--Striver 08:53, 11 June 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Template

Bro, would you support a template that includes all articles about events that the Prophet was involved in? --Striver 18:59, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] INCOTW - Islam in India

You voted for Islam in India, this week's Indian Colloboration of the Week. Please come and help it become a featured-standard article. - Ganeshk (talk) 23:45, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] The

Thanks, Gren. I think this once read, "the murderous Muhammad...", I got rid of "murderous" but missed "the". How did this get in the article? Sigh. WP ideology aside, permanent sprotection would be desirable.Timothy Usher 11:41, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] DYK

Sure, it was created a long time ago, but it was de-stubbed in the last 5 days. Read the top of Template talk:Did you know. — BRIAN0918 • 2006-06-16 21:12

  • The practice isn't new; it just hasn't been written out in words until now. — BRIAN0918 • 2006-06-16 21:16

[edit] Banu Nadir

Done. I didn't really take offense tho, considering the source, I just thought it was predictably ridiculous. My remark wasn't really constructive, but there really wasn't much in the way of useful discussion fodder, vis à vis the article, in his post. Another happy day on the ranch. I'm out of here ... shabath is coming... keep up the good fight while all us arrogant dishonest Jews are /away. :-) Tomertalk 23:39, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Guest Worker Program

Hey -- just to let you know, I deprodded this and changed it to a redirect to Guest worker program, which was an identical article. Mangojuicetalk 16:16, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Wikipedia:Redirects for deletion

You placed a comment at RFD under an entry that had already been closed (Do No Harm(Tv Episode)). Based upon the comment & the fact that it wasn't in the correct place within the entry you did vote on, I think you actually meant to place it at the entry above that one (Barine). I have moved it to that entry. If this was incorrect, please delete the opinion and remember that you should not modify a closed entry & that you should always add your opinion at the end. If it was correct, what happened was that a closure header will show up at the bottom of the previous entry (if the next entry is closed). You need to place your opinion before the closure header. If this didn't make sense, please let me know! Thanks. -- JLaTondre 22:56, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "Balle Balle"

Uh, hey, sorry, but I've no idea.--AeomMai 19:20, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

It means something similar to very good, or hurray. It is used when something good happens.It translates into "good.Very good."--AeomMai 23:08, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] COTW Project

You voted for Fourteen Points, this week's Collaboration of the week. Please come and help it become a featured-standard article. - Davodd 23:20, 20 June 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Muhammad

Without doing it I cannot tell that Why Pecher has added Khyber in such a great detail and neglect other wars. Can I? It is a fact. I tried my best not to name him or attack any way on him. I feel no guilty as my intension is only to improve the article and not to attack Pecher. This is the best wording I could find to present the fact that writter is biased towards khyber war without attacking him. BTW he himself mention my name multiple times while attacking me. I had never mention his name and this is the first time I have written such a post because it was necessary. --- Faisal 06:06, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

Yes my point is that they have added not from neutral point of view. I might not able to express my point in a good way.
"Balle Balle" does not mean anything in Urdu/Punjabi exactly. It is a just a prase to appreciation people. You can say it mean "Good, Good" or "Excellent Excellent" or "Good job, Good Job". It is also sometimes used to express astonishment ("What a Job"). Depending upon the context it is used in. --- Faisal 06:46, 22 June 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Punjab (state)

Hi Grenavitar, which info on the article, which you think would better if more data was given. I will be happy oblige. -- Historian_info

Hi, thanks for your guidance and help :-) ---Historian_info


[edit] Are an Iraqi Muslim????

Asslamu-Aleikum wa'a rahmaatu'lahi wa'braakatu. Hi I was just wondering are you an Iraqi Muslim, becas=use on top of youe User page it says an Arabic phrase "Lā ilaha ilā al-ishq" — Al-Irāqī meaning in my own words there is no god except divine love-Iraqi To me as an Arabic speaker the sentence structure is rather weak and very cliché. --Abdullah Geelah 20:41, 20 June 2006 (UTC)--

[edit] Re:NPA

I can't accept your warning. Faisal announces his religion publicly on his userpage, so I was not speculating. Further, please refrain from phrases like "stop this kind of crap"; if anything clearly qualifies as a personal attack, then it is, of course, the latter expression. Pecher Talk 07:56, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

You have misrepresented my comment: BhaiSaab said that I might misinterpret something else, shich was a baseless insinuation. My comment regarding an aspect of Islam was not an "assumption", but a purely factual observation on one of the most critical aspects of Islam, namely that Muhammad was a perfect man. Faisal himslef once said on a talk page "I idealize Muhammad". Thus, please stop accusing me of making unwarranted assumptions about his faith; my comment was entirely factual and correct. Pecher Talk 09:21, 23 June 2006 (UTC)
Gren, your observations and commentary surrounding this discussion are appreciated... I think I may need to follow your recommendations therein a bit more myself. Netscott 11:53, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Bot on ku:

Hi,

create the bot, I'll set the flag. I am a bureaucrat there. --Erdal Ronahi 08:00, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

Have you not forgotten to create the User YurikBot? I haven't seen it. --Erdal Ronahi

[edit] re: abid ullah jan

as-salaamu 'alaikum. i was reading your comments about abid ullah jan... i wonder if he has a wikipedia account (or is an editor in disguise)! ITAQALLAH 13:21, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

i was reading your user page regarding what happened.. i happen to have read a lot of his articles and stuff [13] and i think he is a pretty good author. had to ask though about if he edits on wikipedia because that would be amazing if not suprising :) ITAQALLAH 15:15, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Saudi influence in Mosques

So what would you like to be done with the section on Saudi influence in the Mosque article? That's the last item that needs to be cleared up prior to the article's appearance on the Main Page Tuesday. joturner 20:40, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

Hey... in the end I really don't care. I've lost enough hope in the wiki system at present that I'm not willing to fight for what I think would be a better article because I would have to get into a constant battle to keep it that way... and, it's not worth the time. Creating conversion of houses of worship of other religions into mosques was a mistake because it will never be NPOVed and will be used as a tool... the first thing Pecher did was remove the neutrality tags which the article desperately needs. So, the Saudi section should be cut in half (at least) and the rest should be pushed into another article if it's good information. You may also want to place it under social conflict because nothing makes it more important than other influences of social conflict in history. I'm not really going to invest any work into it, so don't let my opinions keep you back. gren グレン 06:33, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
Perhaps I or someone else will take care of the section, but I'm not sure the information would go well with the rest of the information in the Social Conflict section. But I won't be tackling it right now; it's past 2:30am (UTC-4). joturner 06:39, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Sahaba's ancestors

As you requested: Wikipedia:Deletion_review/Log/2006_June_26#Sahaba.27s_ancestors--Striver 19:51, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Bro, are you there? --Striver 15:04, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Kurdish title of Turtles Can Fly

Hi,

I reverted the title that you entered here [14]. Your entry is simply the transliteration of the Persian title in Latin alphabet, and that was also the official title of the film. This is due to the internal issues in Iran. I added a reference for the Kurdish title as well. I have explained it more on the Talk page. Thanks.Heja Helweda 02:29, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Re: naming

I see your point, however, because Tarkan uses his first name for showbusiness I don't think this could be compared to 50 cent... + this is an encyclopedia if I am right and encyclopedias usually list people by their full names. I mean, this is a serachable site, one who looks for Tarkan will type Tarkan and then get redirected and see that the person actually has that name... Look at for example most of the prominent people of England, usually they were known by their titles (earl, lord) but the articles redirect to their full name. And I think this should be followed for every entry. 50 cent is just a name he applied but believe me there are people who would think that ACTUALLY that's his proper name... So 50 cent shold also be redirected to his full name. Regards --Teemeah Gül Bahçesi 16:16, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Copying VS Being Copied

I am sorry Grenavitar because is disagree with whatever you posted on my talk page. First of all I would like to talk about binte VS bint. Well bint has a spelling mistake since it leaves out the -e- from binte. After editing a wikipedia for a while I started noticing that some of the article that are written about important females figure in the history of Islam have bint instead of binte (which is wrong and inaccurate). I don’t how wikipedia came up with bint maybe for the sake of neutrality they wanted to leave out the -e- from binte. About the copying of the articles well let me bring that issue in front also. There are many websites that copy material from wikipedia to their websites. I am saying that because I have encountered some websites. For example, one I wanted to get some information about Imam Hussain ibn Ali (AS), the website I went to had the same information about Imam Hussain ibn Ali (AS), as wikipedia.org. It not only about the article of Imam Hussain ibn Ali (AS), I have also seen it happen with articles like the Battle of Karbala, and I am sure there are many more I haven’t encountered yet. Since I wrote the article about Hazrat Qasim ibn Hassan (AS), and since you are going to change my editions. I am once again going to write the article in a neutral way but I am sure that the article is going to appear on someone else’s website in few days. Thank You Salman


[edit] article

Did i ever creat Amin Ahsan Islahi? --Striver 00:43, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Stop violating the GFDL!

Please don't delete articles when you move them; it's horribly horribly GFDL-violating. I refer to the following:

You're an admin; you should know better. Don't do it again. Thanks, [ælfəks] 10:38, 2 July 2006 (UTC)

User:Salman01 had been moving pages and I was reverting his moves. Since he had moved the page and I was using move as well back the the original source there was no GFDL violation because the history of the content remained intact.
There was no page history on Khalid ibn al-Walid until I restored it last night. When you "Delete to make way for move", the entire content of that page is deleted. Unless you manually restore it, the revisions will remain deleted, and as some of the content still existed on one of the pages (an editor restored it from a Google cache as they were unable to find revisions), the GFDL was violated. Please be careful to restore any deleted revisions when moving pages. Jude (talk) 03:01, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
The move comment is from the MediaWiki software... not myself and I am not sure there is any other way to stop move vandalism.
For starters, there's this nice shiny "protect" button that you've got; one option is to protect against moves! YOU'RE AN ADMIN, YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO KNOW THESE THINGS! Yes, you can delete stuff when you move a page, but you're meant to restore (undelete) it afterwards! [ælfəks] 03:08, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
Did those pages have any content besides the automated creation of redirects? gren グレン 17:13, 2 July 2006 (UTC)
They would have, but you deleted it. [ælfəks] 03:08, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Sahaba's ancestors

Bro, looks like the undeletion is failing :( Ooh, well, can you past me the latest version i did of that article to User:Striver/Sahaba's ancestors? Thanks. --Striver 01:14, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Image:Ayyubid.png

The map was designed based on a number of historical atlases, in particular Atlas of World History by John Haywood. Briangotts (Talk) (Contrib) 01:24, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Reminder

Image:Benedict XVI.jpg You showed support for the Catholic Collaboration Effort.
Remember that voting to support an article implies a commitment to contribute to the article.
This week Catholic social teaching was selected to be improved.
We hope you can contribute!

[edit] Image:MedievalIberianPeninsula.jpg

I have already told you that I made and and what the sources are . Furthermore the manner which you blocked me for a whole week was completely excessive, you did not even give me an opportunity to make my case or answer your concerns. Why you are so obsessed on this issue is beyond me, if you had not notice wikipedia has many maps , images , very few of which has been put through the test which you have required of my maps. Are you interested in creating and encyclopedia or are in rather interested in preventing one from coming about?--Aesed 03:31, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] pic

i hope you agree with this, peace. --Striver 08:30, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] R-H-M

I redirected R-H-M because it's the 11,987th lame little stub created by Striver (in violation of the promise Striver made at Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Jersey Devil, when he wrote "Ill try to follow that User:Striver 03:07, 21 March 2006 (UTC)" in response to Georgewilliamherbert's remarks "I urge that: Striver slow down on stub creation; place more fully formed articles into main namespace, and utilize sandboxes more when working on potential articles, so that they are properly formed when they reach main namespace.").

Striver has no ability and/or will to make the mini-stub into something repectable, and I've really lost all desire to clean up after Striver's numerous mini-stubs, and it really doesn't deserve to live in its current very inadequate state -- therefore the redirect. AnonMoos 17:00, 6 July 2006 (UTC)


[edit] A very speedy deletion

I think you'll find that many Esoteric programming languages don't assert their importance, and that many unused languages exist on wikipedia. I created a stub for eubonicode intending to fill in more information later, but by the time I arrived home the article was gone!


[edit] Move of articles

Gren, what is your opinion of the recent moves from Abd-al-Muttalib to 'Abdul Muttalib? I personaly hate it. See Contributions--Striver 15:29, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Maybe we should involve a third party? Do you know of any neutral admin? --Striver 16:11, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] INCOTW - AIDS in India

You voted for AIDS in India, this week's Indian Colloboration of the Week. Please come and help it become a featured-standard article. - Ganeshk (talk) 00:49, 11 July 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Sahaba's ancestors

Man, gren, i am getting more and more annoyed that the article is delted, i NEED it, i dont get that its still deleted... damn deleters... the afd said "merge with Sahaba", so can you give me a copy of it so i can merge it with the Sahaba? put it here: User:Striver/Sahaba's ancestors ... oh you have already done it! i LOVE YOU! I have missed it so much! Thanks! --Striver 02:04, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

How do you like this compared to this?--Striver 03:01, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Voile islamique

Hello Grenavitar,

I'm Mirmillon and I noticed you 've added a link in the french article Rothmund-Thompson's syndrome I wrote.

The good translation de voile islamique is yashmak from Oxford-Hachette Dictionary. Regards Mirmillon 18:30, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

Very useful the link to my french user page. Good Idea !!! Mirmillon 20:05, 11 July 2006 (UTC)


[edit] deleted

Green, can you userfy Shi'a view of Uthman for me in the same way as you did with the sahaba? User:Strtiver/Shi'a view of Uthman, thanks. --Striver 02:59, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Dhimmi

Hello Gren. I've seen your comments on the Dhimmi talk page. Don't know if you watch the page, but if you do, you'll have seen that I've recently got quite involved in the debate. I saw in particular that not so long ago you had some points to make about the Mughal period. Would you be able to recommend some solid sources, and/or is there any other input you can make into the page at the moment? Thanks in advance. Itsmejudith 09:11, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Islam Links

Hi Gren. The Contra Islam directory was removed as a result of the last discussion regarding it. BhaiSaab talk 22:24, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] copyvio question

hey gren. i have a question regarding whether or not something i proposed here would constitute as a copyright violation? i'm not really sure.. help would be appreciated. thank you! ITAQALLAH 17:22, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

[15] ITAQALLAH 17:57, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Dhimmi

Thank you so much for your extremely interesting message. Yes, I would like to read the articles that you can access. It was refreshing to see you taking a step backwards to reflect on the general issue about how Wikipedia articles get (or don't get) researched and balanced. These questions are much nearer to my research interests than the substantive issues of Middle Eastern history and politics are. I need to take a few days to think all this through and will reply to you properly after that. I haven't had an email message from you so far BTW.Itsmejudith 09:36, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Re: Natural

Hi Gren

> How can I tell when colors are natural?

That's mostly subjective. I ask myself, have I ever seen a sky (outside of a photo) that looked like that? It can be hard to do, because sometimes we get so used to seeing disneychrome-style pumped-saturation photography that we forget what real life looks like. If somebody ever walked outside and saw a sky the color of that in the Pangong Lake image, I think it would freak them out. I know it would freak me out.

> Also, is it always a better looking picture if it's natural?

A bit of contrast and saturation enhancement can often help a landscape photo. But I think people tend to get too carried away with it when they're playing around in Photoshop. If a little is good, then a lot should be better, right? I don't think so. Eventually the image just starts looking fake. It's bad enough when it's done for commercial purposes, such as in a travel brochure. But it's an even bigger problem for an encyclopedia, which I think should strive towards accurate depictions.

> (or is your argument that if it's vignetting or blownout, etc. for artistic effect it shouldn't be in an encyclopedia article?).

Both vignetting and blown highlights are generally recognized by photographers to be serious flaws in an image, and so wouldn't likely be used on purpose. Oversaturation and heavy-handed contrast adjustments are valued by some, though these can lead to blown highlights in an image that previously had none.

> Also, if you know of any little reference on this kind of thing that could help me become a better judge then please do tell me.

If I can think of one I'll point you to it. -- moondigger 14:47, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Possibly unfree images

Images that you uploaded have been listed at Wikipedia:Possibly unfree images. If the images' copyright status cannot be verified as being free, they may be deleted. Please go to the image pages to provide the necessary information on the source or licensing of this image (if you have any), if you are interested in it not being deleted.
  • Image:Abaya.jpg
  • Image:Boushiya.jpg
  • Image:Buknuk.jpg
  • Image:Burqa_(1).jpg
  • Image:Burqa_(2).jpg
  • Image:Dupatta.jpg
  • Image:Hijab_(3).jpg
  • Image:Jilbab_(2).jpg
  • Image:Khimar_(2).jpg
  • Image:Niqab_(2).jpg
  • Image:Shalwar_kameez.jpg
Sorry. Kevin_b_er 02:17, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
The images are all clearly noncommercial. And as per the Jimbo on May 19 2005: "As of today, all *new* images which are "non commercial only" and "with permission only" should be deleted on sight. Older images should go through a process of VfD to eliminate them in an orderly fashion, taking due account of "fair use". Now, if you honestly think they should go to WP:IFD rather than WP:PUI, I'll move them there. IFD says, however, to take copyright issues to PUI. The images prior to May 20th are not allowed, they just can't be speedy deleted if I interpret it right. Thus, I'm listing old noncommercial images on PUI. Kevin_b_er 02:53, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
Well, its struck off PUI. I'll work on figuring out what to do with old noncommercial. In the meantime. commons:Category:Islamic_female_dress has a good many images. I'll try to match up and replace imagry, though you look like you are capable of discerning which is which without that much trouble, so you too should take a look through that category. Kevin_b_er 03:41, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] French Album template

Hi,

I'm part of the French "Metal Project". I've seen that you add an "Album" template. I tried to use it on this page, but I can't find a way to add the image that I store on my computer (I'm not using Wikipedia for very long ...).

Can you help me please ?

Thanx 193.56.114.156 14:37, 21 July 2006 (UTC)cglaume

Finally, I partly succeeded to display it, but the result is still not really nice ... so I guess I cheated instead of doing it the right way ... ==> page

By the way, I don't have an account on the English WikiPedia ... You can find my page here


[edit] Petition

Thanks for your comments on my petition. Let me first say that this is not an add or a request. You seem to be in support of my petition, if so, you should sign in the support section of the page. Thanks! Wikipedia's False Prophet holla at me petition 01:24, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Lebanon harat hreik neighbourhood image

Alright, thanks for the update. sikander 17:19, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] vandalism

You left a message on my talk page saying that I reverted vandalism at Salman Ahmad, but I did no such thing there. You must have clicked the wrong name or used the wrong link. Here is the message you sent me:

"How was this edit reverting vandalism.... you removed a celebrity infobox.... I don't understand. gren グレン 10:01, 22 July 2006 (UTC)"

--Ryūlóng 19:33, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

Ah, that edit. I believe I was going through edits of people listed at WP:AIV that night. Ryūlóng 20:13, 22 July 2006 (UTC)
Nope, the infobox removal was due to constant vandalism from the IP address. I bet you could check the block log and that IP was blocked that night. Ryūlóng 20:19, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Help!! Again

Hello Grenavitar, Can you help me to find when did I start Wikipedia, What exact day, time, date and year because I dont know. --Abdullah Geelah 19:24, 23 July 2006 (UTC)--

[edit] Help!!................Again

Hi Grenavitar, I got another promblem, can you tell me how to make my Wikipedia userpage the same in my Wikitionary userpage and Arabic Wikipedia userpage, with a link to all of them just like yours Abdullah Geelah 23:25, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] banu nadir/banu qaynuqa dispute

السلام عليكم

(i originally posted this for anonym but then realised he hasn't been around for a while :o) the banu qaynuqa article is currently set to develop into perhaps a full-scale edit war[16]. this is in relation to (the same) content present in both the banu nadir and banu qaynuqa articles. the specific section of focus was something i had offered to discuss and suggest alternatives for (on talk:banu nadir), which could then be modified and analysed for suitability [17]. unfortunately this has not really seemed to work and now this is exactly the same content being reverted back on forth on banu qaynuqa. would it be o.k to request protection of the banu qaynuqa article (which is currently the condition with Banu Nadir), or at least the section, until the dispute is resolved? what other courses of action would you suggest (i'm still pretty much a newbie to WP)?

we tried mediation for the banu nadir article in hopes to settle the dispute but it seems that the opposing party isn't particularly interested in working to build a consensus article. at this point in time.. it seems that the mediation process is stagnating. what is your opinion of this and what steps do you recommend be taken in order to resolve the ongoing dispute? thank you ITAQALLAH 16:05, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Article

Hi. I have created a new article that will surely be afd'd very soon, and i would appreciate some help improving it before it happens: Controversial Israeli and Zionist quotes --Striver 13:32, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Thanks

Thank you very much. :) --Golbez 15:44, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Date Movie Responce!

Hey would you like to help me out with that...I have photos but cant get them on.....

I got all the articles of the people on date movie. I got rid of brigit jones because it wasnt on the movie only the speacial clips...MarkDonna

[edit] Somali Articles

Hi Gren! I was just wondering, I have expanded lots and lots of articles and made many articles regarding Somali or Somalilandian culture and cuisine:

But unforunately I feel that no-one is appreciating it. For example, you made lots of articles and people appreciated it and gave you many awards but I did the same but on a different country but no-one is appreciating it. what shall i do! Abdullah Geelah 17:45, 5 August 2006 (UTC)

Hi Gren, I stumbled upon a map of the Declonization of Africa, and I want to ask you is there a way of putting the names of the African countries on? Abdullah Geelah 13:48, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Low-stress

Nice to see a message from you, Gren.

So far I'm managing to keep it low-stress. I've stayed away from any of the Muhammad articles (the character assassination continues apace) and I'm not playing edit war with CltFn. He thinks Hagarism is true and beloved of all Islamic scholars. I think he's delusional but there's no dealing with someone delusional with time on his hands. Maybe I can even let Shez have the Rani Mukerji article as a shrine to his idol :)

The Hindutva folk have been attacking Michael Witzel. If he dares to oppose THEM, well of course he's a racist who hates Indians. Oh, and I've got low-class tastes for liking Bollywood :) according to one of the combatants.

I've been thinking that WP should be a rachet -- every click means we've attained a greater level of reliability -- and instead it's a sandcastle. Disintegrating in periodic tides of human stupidity. Yes, DP is much more satisfying. I'm working on the only full-length public domain translation of the Ramayana into English, in P3. Zora 05:22, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Your note

How cautious you are! Of course it should have been moved, it was only named that because of a copy/paste mistake. Thanks for bringing this to my attention. --woggly 04:57, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Return of the Green Goblin

I will fix the tag then. Out of curiosity, is there any reason in particular you decided to target that article? 66.229.160.94 07:42, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

(As per already having a prod tag): Well then, I suppose I'm in the wrong. I only added it because all the other articles in the set had it (and I agreed with the motion for deletion.) 66.229.160.94 08:26, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Sources

Hi Grenavitar,

I've started working on Islam and anti-Semitism article. Its quality was horrible when I touched it. Anyways, I've stuck on the [18] section. Do you know any sources for this? Thanks --Aminz 10:11, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for your comment, Gren, on the Islam_and_anti-Semitism talk page. --Aminz 04:15, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Khwaja Mir Dard

Is there any chance you could put the text in the image Image:Dard Gazal 1.gif into the article as Unicode characters, instead of as an image? Regards, -- The Anome 11:40, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Avex Trax List

I got it from here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Avex_Trax_artists Why sigh, cutie pie? 21:48, 11 August 2006 (UTC)


[edit] drv

Gren, take a look at this: [19]--Striver 11:44, 13 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Re: Template talk:Infobox Sura

I responded to your comments at Template talk:Infobox Sura, although the infobox isn't getting much attention right now. -- tariqabjotu 13:13, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Theta Beta Potata PUNK HOUSE Deletion Review

[edit] Theta Beta Potata

This article was first started by me and was deleted back in May '06. I was reading the punk house article and saw that the link for the TBP article was no longer red so I clicked on it and there was an article back up, started by another user. I dont know who started it because, it was deleted soon after I saw it. The decision made in the "Article for Deletion" debate should be reconsidered. The article is about a punk house not a fratenal organization. It seems that the debate, run by User:ChrisB and results were reported by User:Mailer Diablo. I will post this on their talk pages. This is the first time I have requested a deletion review so please let me know what else I need to do. If there is anything. I am on wikipedia frequently and I want to learn. Thanks. Xsxex 16:28, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

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[edit] Bush-Blair memo title

I've replied to you here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Bush-Blair_memo#Title discussing the title for this article, I'd be grateful for a response-thanks (what was the title originaly before you chnaged it BTW?)- Greeny 17:46, 30 August 2006

[edit] THis

is my page

[edit] Signpost updated for September 5th.

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[edit] E-mail

Salam Gren,

Please check your email. BhaiSaab talk 00:59, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

My suspicions were confirmed. [20] BhaiSaab talk 02:28, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Help the infamous?

Feel like helping an unjustly blocked, but infamous user? I've been blocked under my current account for 48 hours under the most ridiculous of pretenses. If not, I can understand... but please let me know one way or the other. -Freestylefrappe