User talk:Greece666

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Contents

[edit] Welcome

Hello Greece666! welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for contributing. Here are a some recommended guidelines to facilitate your involvement.
Best of luck. Have fun! --Miskin
Getting Started
Getting your info out there
Getting more Wikipedia rules
Getting Help
Getting along
Getting technical

[edit] Geia sou

Theoreis oti tha mposouses na suneisfereis psahnontas gia sygkekrimenes phges sto arthro gia tin Macedonia? Polu tha epithymousa na dw kapoies adiamfisvithtes phges gia ta osa les... --Hectorian 21:39, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

OK! as doume ta pragmata apo tin arxi (tha grafw sta agglika, gia na summetexoun ki alloi an theloun):)
I suppose that there are no objections concerning the 3 first sections (Etymology of the name of Macedonia, Boundaries and definitions, Demographics)-they are well-written and well-sourced. I suppose that u also do not have any objections concerning the ancient, byzantine and ottoman periods (for the reason u told me). so, lets go to 1903. the article says After the revival of Greek, Serbian, and Bulgarian statehood in the 19th century, Macedonia became a focus of the national ambitions of all three governments, leading to the creation in the 1890s and 1900s of rival armed groups who divided their efforts between fighting the Turks and one another.. thus, there is reference about greek involvement prior to 1903. but the Ilinden uprising forced the Greeks to react more. i guess that there is noone who could say that this uprising was caused by the Greeks, but many claim that this uprising had effect on their actions. i think that prior to 1903, the ethnic groups of Macedonia were in a sort of status quo, having to fight primarily the ottoman rule. after that date, they started fighting one another with more passion (have in mind that there were 3 groups: pro-serbian, -greek, -bulgarian. there was not such a thing as pro-'macedonian' group). about the 'Macedonian identity': they are not just opinions, but repetition of historic facts, since no 'Macedonian ethnic group' was ever shown on censa or reported by western (or not) historians or travellers. It is another thing to try to be NPOV and another to accept modern theories with no historical base. I also think that there are no 100% accurate and reliable sources that would be able to guide us in all the matters of conflict. since (as u said and i agree with u) all the modern historians (Greeks, Bulgarians and 'Macedonians') see the whole issue from a nationalist perspective, i guess we should either look for non-ethnically-involved historians and/or (even better) on contemporary historians.
Oi apopseis sou sto talk mou fanikan 'perierges' kai gi'afto skeftika oti tha ekane mono kalo mia proseggisi twn apopsewn sou. --Hectorian 22:33, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
I have made the corrections in the errors u spotted. i also believe that these edits were not accurate and historic. but concerning the 'Macedonian Slavs'... Δεν σηκώνω μύγα στο σπαθί μου! there are no contemporary references, but only people like the one u mentioned, who cannot be considered NPOV. the article says about him Misirkov mentioned the necessity of creating a Macedonian national identity which would diverse the Macedonian Slavs from Bulgarians, Serbians or Greeks.. in western cont. historians' books there are references about the ethnic groups of Macedonia. none of them mentions 'Macedonians'. ottoman censa were based on religion, as u correctly said. so, i cannot see any debate on that matter... such an identity simply did not exist in the way it is presented today.
Se genikes grammes sumfwnw mazi sou, oswn afora tis istorikes anakriveies pou entopises. kai afto epithumw gia ola ta arthra pou sxetizontai me to thema: na sevastoume tin istoria...
Regards:) --Hectorian 23:46, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] If you are Greek, I'm Martian

You know that claiming a false identity will cost you my FYROMian friend... --   Avg    00:54, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

if im martian you are greek--Greece666 02:07, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Από πού είσαι "Γιωργάκη" ; Για πες μας...--   Avg    02:15, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

από αθήνα φίλε, εσύ;--Greece666 02:20, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Suggest whatever you want, claiming a false identity is not following Wiki etiquette is it?--   Avg    02:21, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

ειλικρινά, νομίζω ότι έχει γίνει κάποια παρεξήγηση, αλλά δε νομίζω ότι έχει νόημα να συνεχιστεί αυτή η συζήτηση. --Greece666 02:25, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Δε θα τη συνεχίσω, αλλά είσαι ο πρώτος Έλληνας που βλέπω να αναφέρεται στους Σκοπιανούς σα "Μακεδόνες". Για μένα το πιο πιθανό είναι να μην είσαι Έλληνας αλλά να ξέρεις ελληνικά. Εκτός αν έπεσα σε έναν από τους 2000.--   Avg    02:28, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

οκέυ, ευχαριστώ. αν θες να γράψεις κάποιο σχόλιο για αυτά που έγραψα στη συζήτηση για τη Μακεδονία (περιοχή), θα ήθελα να το διαβάσω.--Greece666 02:32, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Να ξανατονίσω ότι το αν διαφωνώ ή όχι με το τι γράφεις δεν έχει σχέση με το ότι ονομάζοντας τον εαυτό σου "Greece666" και λέγοντας ότι είσαι ο Γιώργος ο Έλληνας αμέσως η άποψή σου παίρνει άλλη βαρύτητα. Φυσικά δεν περίμενες εμένα να στα πω όλα αυτά. --   Avg    02:39, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Μπορεί να είναι ακροαριστερός, ξέρεις, από αυτούς που ψηφίζουν Ουράνιο Τόξο (το 666 πλάι στην Ελλάδα για εκεί μου κάνει). Μάλλον όμως θα είναι Αλβανόπουλο 2ης γεννιάς. Έλληνας που να λέει τους Σκοπιανούς 'Μακεδόνες' δεν υπάρχει. Miskin 02:47, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Greece666
 hi my name is giorgo
im greek

Κάτι βρομάει Γιωργάκη, και έρχεται απ' τη μεριά σου... :) Miskin 02:50, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Haha what's going on here? C-c-c-c 02:53, 14 May 2006 (UTC)


to continue your argument miskin, a leftist (which by the way i am not) cannot be a greek. he most probably is "a second generarion-albanian", as you said. i would suggest that you d spent your time doing sthg more creative and to write in english to allow for other users to enjoy the wit of your arguments.

i insist, if you have sthg to mention about what i wrote then do it and it would be my pleasure to read. if on the other hand, you want to write political and racist insults in greek (so that non-greek users cannot understand), still you are welcome to continue. --Greece666 03:13, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Since you admitted you are not a leftist, you removed your only possibility to be a Greek, because, although very very far-fetched, you could be one of those 500 OAKKE guys who supported the Rainbow. Now, I'm 100% sure you are not Greek. My guess is you are a FYROM national who either lives in Greece or just knows some Greek. --   Avg    03:23, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

You got it!--Greece666 03:25, 14 May 2006 (UTC)


Greece666, καλώς όρισες. I have no idea whether you are a Greek citizen, an ethnic Greek, or whatever, and I do not care. From what I have seen, your contributions appear to be constructive and well-balanced. In any case, there is no excuse for Avg, Miskin, or anyone else to insult you. --Macrakis 03:28, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Totally disagree. If I build today a username like Makedonski666 claiming that my name is Kristo and I come from FYROM and then I start writing to relevant newsgroups pushing Greek POV, I would certainly raise some questions about my behaviour. This user can of course write whatever he wants, but not claiming to be something that he isn't. --   Avg    03:33, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

hi macracis, i do not think nationality is of particular relevancy either. my initial intention was to help rewrite the article on macedonia in order to make it more NPOV.thanks for your comment. best--Greece666 03:37, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Greece666, good luck, feelings run high, so it will be hard to make the Macedonia articles more NPOV. Have you read any of the books in the bibliography of Macedonians (ethnic group)? You might find them informative and helpful. --Macrakis 03:56, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

If nationality is unimportant to you, why you claim to be Greek and you have a username like "Greece666"? --   Avg    03:50, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Why don't you just ignore the user name and concentrate on the substance? That is the WP way. After all, Miskin isn't Russian, either. --Macrakis 03:56, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

"Miskin isn't Russian, either", wow what an argument. I missed the part where my username was RUSSIA69 and stated "Hello, my name is Ivan, I'm Russian" in my userpage. Point it to me and you'll have a point. For the time being, Greece666 has adopted a hypocritical behaviour which falls under trolling. Miskin 04:09, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Oh, please, all the remarks above were snide and uncivil. Just because Greece666 disagrees with you, you label him "FYROMian" and "Albanian" and "leftist" (in Greek, of course, so that admins can't read it). Please just stick to the substance. --Macrakis 04:47, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
You do understand that the username is borderline offensive, since it is coming from a non Greek and describing Greece as "evil".--   Avg    03:59, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
If Macrakis fails to indicate the "insult", then he's trolling as well as wiki-stalking (nothing out of the usual for him). If Greece666 fails to indicate the part where I was being "racist", then he needs to apologize for delivering a personal attack to me. Miskin 04:06, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
Oh, please. --Macrakis 04:47, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
Neither Miskin nor I have insulted Greece666. The only offensive thing in this page is Greece666's username, under WP:U and especially "non-inflammatory usernames", since, I repeat, he is not Greek.--   Avg    04:12, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

If there is somebody who is doing inflammatory comments, this is you guys. to state that i am not Greek because I have a different point of view from you is simply ridiculous. If you think that my name falls under the "inflammatory usernames" category report it to wikipedia. here you are wasting your time. thanks--Greece666 04:23, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

miskin: to call somebody "second-generation albanian" just because of the opinion he expressed in a discussion, is a racist comment, at least in my point of view. (and i want to clarify that i have nothing against albanians or immigrants- the racist comment consists of deducting my nationality from my point of view). again, if you think that what i wrote is unfair, pls report it to wikipedia, not to me. thanks--Greece666 04:27, 14 May 2006 (UTC)


Guys, I agree with Macrakis here. Accusing someone of lying about their identity, without a shred of evidence other than that they have expressed an opinion untypical of people of that identity, is absolutely unacceptable. No matter if it's true or not. (And may I remind you all that Greece666 has already made a number of very good contributions showing that he has intimate knowledge of Greek history and culture.) Avg and Miskin, please apologize to Greece666. Now. (i.e. before I have to translate your Greek comments to InShaneee or someone else.) Lukas (T.|@) 10:09, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

That's plainly pathetic Lucas. And not because you're accusing us for something we haven't done (insulting), but because you're making schoolboy-like threats. I would be delighted to bring this up to Inshanee, I've already told him about yours and Macrakis' wiki-stalking, and this is ultimate example. As far as I'm concerned Greece666 owes me an apology for calling me a racist. Miskin 10:37, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
Apologise for what? For finding his username offensive? Well I do. About my other comments, I did not make an insult, but, yes, I believe he is assuming a false identity to push his POV. No one forced him to say that he is "Giorgo" from Athens, no one forced him to pick this specific username but he did. --   Avg    12:34, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

User:Greece666, you self-identify as a Greek, and it is your right to assert this with your user name and in your user page as many others do. As long as there is no valid reason to believe that you assume a false identity, we have to believe this. You also have the right to express your opinion. If somebody wants to deny your Greek identity because of your opinions, I would regard this as insulting. The notion that you cannot be Greek because you call citizens of the Republic of Macedonia "Macedonians" is unjustified: ethnicity has nothing to do with opinion. Poeple with minority opinions such as voters for the Rainbow Party are nevertheless Greeks.   Andreas   (T) 23:58, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

Actually, User:Greece666 is from FYROM. The whole world knows that by now (he did something that gave himself away). --Telex 00:46, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
Εἴσαι μακριὰ νυκτωμένος, ὦ βασιλεὺ τηλεγράφων. If Greece666 is a FYROMian, I'm the Pope. :-) Lukas (T.|@) 14:19, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Mirësevjen

Tung, a je shqiptar? Kërkoj se shikova që Miskin the që mbase je shqiptar në Greqi. Nëse je, mos mban mendjen me atë që thonë. --Telex 13:01, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

i do not speak albanian or whatever this language is(though id like very much too). best--Greece666 16:26, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

I'm sorry, it's just because Miskin mentioned that you may be Albanian I thought I'd inquire. Regards, --Telex 16:30, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

no problem--Greece666 16:36, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] They don't like it up them

Hey man, welcome to Wikipedia. For the above arguments, see No true Scotsman. No real Greek can be such a traitor that he doesn't care what name another country has! - FrancisTyers 13:29, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

thx francis- i d never thought that macedonia and porridge are after all the same--Greece666 16:29, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Well, I'm sure no true Scotsman would put Macedonia on their porridge either. Although - it might be nice, after all... :-) Anyway, welcome, and I'm sorry we've all been abusing your talkpage for being unnice. (One reason I reacted so strongly to what these guys were telling you is that I've seen the exact same mistake made in another case too - and boy, if they only knew how wrong they were that time...!) Lukas (T.|@) 17:07, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
You mean "those" (bad) guys and "us" (good) guys? It's interesting to observe how people can reach such extreme conclusions and at the same time regard themseves as the protectors of justice and order. What I see here is that in the middle of a personal yet civilised discussion between three people of common nationality and interests, we have a group of aggressors burging in with threats and creating a hostile environment. So uless you believe that Macrakis' line "In any case, there is no excuse for Avg, Miskin, or anyone else to insult you." means anything other than "be on my side, those guys are bad", you must realize that the only hostility arose after you two intervened. Macrakis' manipulative comment caused Greece666 to adapt an aggressive attitude, and Lucas' threats and irrational overtones ("you two apologize, NOW!!!) added the cherry on the cake. But I think Macrakis' comment in Inshanee's page (about how Don Miskin and his "gang" are bullying people) is the most informative element on the purity of his motives. Congratulations Batman and Robin, you saved the day. Miskin 17:47, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
So your idea of a "personal yet civilized discussion between three people of common nationality..." includes comments like "something stinks, Georgie, and it's coming from where you are" and "a Greek who calls Skopians 'Macedonians' doesn't exist"? These were before I entered the discussion to supposedly create a 'hostile environment'. Interesting. --Macrakis 19:41, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

miskin: This not the proper place to make comments about other ppl's (inshanee) talk pages and what other ppl (macrakis) wrote in them. pls do it in a way that these ppl have a chance to reply to you and do not use my talk page as a forum where you expose your conflicts with other wikipedians. thanks--Greece666 17:56, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] sidiropoulos

i ve made a quick translation of the greek wikipedians article on sidiropoulos. all contributions are welcome. --Greece666 17:56, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Very nice. Do you know how to watchlist pages - I'm asking as I can't remember when I found out how to ;-) Telex 17:59, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

thx telex. im already "watching" sidiropoulos page. i take note of your kind offer to help and i ll ask you if i have a problem. --Greece666 18:33, 14 May 2006 (UTC)


[edit] other articles/stubs that need editing/wikifying

panousis, harré, banikas. --Greece666 19:21, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

I tried my hand at the Panousis one (and moved it to Tzimis Panousis, hope you don't mind.) Cheers, Fut.Perf. ☼ 20:08, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
good work. of course i dont mind.--Greece666 20:12, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

new stub: tsarouchis--Greece666 20:56, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Stub on Panhellenic Liberation Movement --Greece666 21:22, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Phanariotes

Sure. I admit I do not have much knowledge of the Phanariote history outside of what is today Romania, though. I think Miskin is attempting to use this article to attets a modern leftover of the Megali Idea, and this is making me weary - especially since the Phanariotes were mostly cosmopolite, and Greek was the lingua franca, while Greek identity was largely synonimous with the Orthodox one - until the Eteria made people pick sides. To define Phanariotes as "Greek" in the modern sense takes a lot of sophistry, and I've seen Miskin use such sophistry before. The modern presence may be Greek (I simply don't know), but that is, IMO, an altogether different issue. This is not to say that I do not aknowledge the fact that things have been more clear since the 1830s (including for the quagmire Ottomans=Turks), but even the Phanariotes spilt over the issue. Consider the complications involved: in Wallachia, a pro-Russian peasant (Tudor Vladimirescu) went to war with the Ottomans backed by a cosmopolitan Wallachian-Phanariote nobilty which resented competition from other Phanariotes, got backing from the Eteria, turned against both the Eteria and the nobilty after the Russians withdrew support, while asking the Sultan (his nominal enemy) that he appoint someone else as Prince (nominating himself, arguably), and then got killed by an alliance of Wallachians and Eterists. Traditional Romanian historiography has turned Tudor into an "anti-Greek" ("positive" sense), while the Greek one one has turned him into an "anti-Greek" (negative sense). Both are wrong, and both pay allegience to a post-factum ethos which had nothing to do with the subtle games of the 1820s. In fact, when the Sultan banned the Phanariotes from occupying the thrones in Bucharest and Jassy, he spared himself the subtleties and did not, in fact, aknowledge that Phanariotes=Greeks=enemies. After all, princes who were of families just as Phanariotes continued to rule under a different constitutional system. I am afraid that retro-nationalism attempts to have these extremely important nuances removed. Dahn 18:10, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

What I meant was that it was irrelevant to this article (but not irrelevant to the article about Phener). Sorry, I had extended my point beyond that, to cover other concerns I had with the proposed changes - and see what your view on that is. I'm not sure if I have upset you: hope I did not, and hope that I did not seem to be following an anti-Greek logic. Dahn 18:57, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
I did not notice that you had replied to Miskin, and I got confused. Sory. It's good that we share a point, because Romania-related pages are slowly turning into a war between various ethno-nationalisms (including the very annoying Romanian one), and I'm having trouble "defending" them for objectivity. I have not logged in with an e-mail, so I can't be using it. However, I will do my best to keep up with others on talk pages, and hopefully will not be getting lines crossed again :). I actually prefer them in a way - hope you won't mind. Dahn 19:10, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
I need to apologize yet again. I had meant to say that, despite me not having an e-mail accout, I hope we can go on communicating on talk pages (I should have typed "wires" instead of "lines" - meaning that I had misunderstood who you were replying to in the first page, a situation which would have been avoided by e-mails). I am actually looking forward to any contribution of yours on any subject that I have some knowledge of, and hope that you will indeed contribute to the Phanariotes page (especially given that we share a need for objectivity). In fact, I can thing of nothing more welcome than such collaborations. Dahn 19:42, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
I agree with all your points, and I could not possibly have an objection to more info being added (I had not added it because I have no expertise in Greek history, but have some knowledge of Romania). If Miskin was proposing a move to create a new article, one that would have outlined "Greek ethnicity" for the sake of starting another revert war, you can see why I was irritated. About their link with Romania: I find it intrinsic, given that it was the main object of Phanariote careers to rise to the respective thrones for 100 years. Miskin also denied any reality to the claim that not all Phanariotes were Greek-speakers originally (including the Ghica family), as well as the fact that many Phanariotes remained something other than Greek when the choice was made (he dissmissed the fact that many princely and boyar families north of the Danube stayed put and soon after that chose to consider themselves Romanian - a fact that many nationalist Romanians also fail to take into consideration, arguably because "blood" or "birth" is still a criterion for both them and Miskin). I would welcome a section detailing this, and all sections that would expand knowledge of what other positions they occupied (note that I have had added that there was a history of them as dragomans, but did not venture further, expecting people to help with more info). Dahn 20:04, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
I wasn't really upset with him. I had answered him with arguments, and my only crankier statement was left on the edit history, where I had cautioned him that, no matter what he was trying to say, "were those members of the Greek families who reside in Phanar" is ambiguous, or even non-sensical (hence the "adapt your grammar, Miskin" remark). Otherwise, I have answered to his equally cranky answer on my talk page with a set of arguments to which he did not answer. However, from what he had wrote, I saw that he believed that I was defending a Romanian ethos, which is never the case with me. My whole dialectic after that point was proving that this is not what this was about. Dahn 20:25, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Thanks

Thanks for the welcome words. However, I am not so new anymore, with over 4000 edits. I was making a subpage of my user page, it makes the management of the sections much easier. Kim van der Linde at venus 18:31, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

LOL. If you have questions, just ask me... Kim van der Linde at venus 18:47, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] AfD

Hi, I noticed you marked several articles with the AfD tag, but you only did the first step so they aren't listed on the AfD log page, and the AfD tags have been removed so they aren't going through the process - also, if they'd been listed, an admin would've caught the tag deletion. In the case of Burowing owls, a speedy tag would probably have been more appropriate since it's an obvious candidate (there's already a Burrowing owl so the new one would be a redirect at best). --Jamoche 21:53, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

(Jamoche beat me to this...)
Hi, I noticed you have a few incomplete AfD nominations. What's the deal? Do you need help figuring out the system? If you need help, I've personally bookmarked Template:AfD in 3 steps because it delineates each step clearly.
You have incomplete AfDs at Burowing owls, Akatsuki Duelist Clan & Shala staton (Shala staton has had the AfD removed by the editor, fyi). -- Scientizzle 21:57, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
I tagged Shala staton for speedy delete -- it was patent nonsense. -- Scientizzle 22:07, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Halleluja !

  • Yeah! Thanks and good luck next year! Last year I voted for "My number one" =D Dr.Poison 13:08, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Your VandalProof Application

Dear Greece666,

Thank you for applying for VandalProof! (VP). As you may know, VP is a very powerful program, and in fact with the new 1.1 version release it has even more power. As such we must uphold strict protocols before approving a new applicant. Regretfully, I have chosen to decline your application at this time. The reason for this is that unfortunately you do not yet meet the 250 mainspace edit minimum - however please try again soon. Please note it is nothing personal by any means, and we certainly welcome you to apply again in the not too distant future. Thank you for your interest in VandalProof. - Glen TC (Stollery) 23:19, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] objectivity

My objections to "Objectivity may be considered as a synonym of neutral point of view" are well documented on the talk page and in the history of the article, which I deleted because of the the originality of the research, and which is also not allowed at Wiki. I believe the article in its current state is malarky.

I also might add that a "neutral point of view" in reporting, journalism, and editing according to Wiki policy is fine, but has little to do with the term "objectivity" in philosophy. In writing an article on objectivity in philosophy for Wiki the author should follow the guidelines for Wiki and the neutral point of view demanded for journalism. But such notions have little to do with objectivity as a concept of philosophy. You can check the various Encyclopedias and Dictionaries of philosophy and you won't find much on the concept, and there is a reason for this. The term is basically indefinable according to philosophic standards. For this reason it would be extremely difficult to write the article according to NPOV and without any original research, and the content of the article would also erroneous if referencing NPOV. Thanks for your inquiry at my talk page. Amerindianarts 21:48, 22 May 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Ancient Greek Wikisource

I understand from your userboxes you're interested in Ancient Greek. I've submitted a proposal to add an Ancient Greek Wikisource on Meta, and I'd be very grateful if you could assist me by either voting in Support of the proposal, or even adding your name as one of the contributors in the template. (NB: I'm posting this to a lot of people, so please reply to my talkpage or to Meta) --Nema Fakei 20:10, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Archimedes

There's a pun in there though (in Attic, I believe)...Kino means...uh...well...it begins with an f, has four letters, ends in a k...  ;) And yes, I think you are correct re Archimedes original quote, but it was translated into the "acceptable" Greek the Romans learned. (Much in the same way Cicero rewrote his speeches into "proper" Latin. I hope this idea for the Classical Greek takes off. •Jim62sch• 22:01, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

It was probably some cynic who noticed the pun. I'm sure Archimedes' mind was as clean as his body (he certainly spent enough time in the tub)  ;) •Jim62sch• 22:32, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] severina

You said: "hi yamla, i recently came accross the severina vickovic article and IMO the last paragraph is POV and rather badly written. i ve tried to fix some things up but an anon would revert. i would like to know your opinion on the matter. you might find it useful to have a look at the discussion pg first. best"

Sorry, I've been busy and forgot to respond to this one. I'll keep a closer eye on that article in the near future. --Yamla 02:14, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Kant: Carryover from the Convo on Talk:Ayn Rand

I'm curious as to why you have doubts that the "philosophy" promoted by Immanuel Kant is nothing more than Not-Thinking. For (as according to Kant) if thinking occurs at levels of the mind that are cut off from reason and logic then it can be understood that by extension no one can be held responsible for any of their actions because no one can think in a logical manner because (as stated before) thinking occurs without any connection to reason or logic. Thus you can say (by extension) for example that Hitler wasn't responsible for the creation of the Holocaust because Hitler (and everyone else) was incapable of thinking in the first place. I don't see where you could find room for doubt because this is all based on what Kant himself said and wrote during his lifetime (at least the parts that are connected to his so-called philosophy). The Fading Light 04:10, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Conversion

Sure, Greece666 :) See you around. deeptrivia (talk) 04:19, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Question

Hi, do you think you could comment on the accuracy of User:Telex/Ethnic identity in Greece. I may be missing something. --Telex 21:45, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Reply

Hi, thanks for your words. The contributors to that article dont seem willing to listen to me, but rather accuse me of being "disgusting", "disrespectful" and "trying to hide another Turkish genocide from public view". So really i do not know how to proceed. They dont understand that in Wikipedia you have to reflect academic opinion, and not construct your own. Because this is an article only Greeks seem to know about and contribute to, there is little to no chance of an outsider like me (especially a Turkish Cypriot one) from getting anything changed. It's good to know there are some level headed people here though. Regards, --A.Garnet 14:01, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

Personally I found your stance hypocritical because you pretended to be a supporter of NPOV instead of a supporter of Turkey. It's not by coincidence that you objected to the title of the specific article instead of, say, Organised persecution of ethnic Germans. You keep saying that the term 'genocide' shouldn't be used because it is applied by in Greece. I've proved that this is wrong by providing two credible sources already, which are definitely not biased and non-Greek, and yet you keep repeating the same old story. It's obvious that you have a personal agenda on the topic. Miskin 14:39, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
My general contributions to wikipedia are those relating to Turkey and Turkish Cypriots, because that is where i am most knowledgeable, so i have no interest nor knowledge in Organised persecution of ethnic Germans which would be useful. That you feel i "pretend" and i'm a "supporter of Turkey" are exactly the kind of arguments which discredit your whole approach here. I oppose the misprepresentation and promotion of view helds by nationalsits such as yourself and others who hover round that article. You have provided one source who uses the term "Greek genocide", and in any case it is not clear if he is referring to Pontians or Greeks expelled by nationalists. Your other source makes no reference to Greeks suffering a genocide, indeed I would like to see the full extent of that quotation, because on Amazon online reader it states "Whatever was done to the Armenians is being repeated with the Greeks.23 Massacres most likely did take place at Amisos and other villages in the Pontus. Yet given the large numbers of surviving Greeks, especially relative to the small number of Armenian survivors..." I would like to see the full extent of that last sentence. No encylopedias cover a pontus genocide, no journals through JSTOR cover a pontus genocide, there are no published books cover this topic either. Do you see my point? --A.Garnet 15:22, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Pontian Greek Genocide

Hello,

Thanks for the info. Would you be able to help fix up the article? Perhaps a complete rewrite? I want the article to be as neutral as possible. Thanks. —Khoikhoi 01:22, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

Ok, cool. See you around. —Khoikhoi 01:43, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

Of course I don't mind 666. :) The article looks better now. :) No, actually I am not really interested in gathering over genocides as others would gather over a cup of tea and cakes, I prefer to keep writing on localities. but...but...but...:) Cretanforever

I read it in full now. It's an interesting article. And for Cretan Turks, there is more and more treatment of them (us!) in Turkey too, mostly in novellised form, but some insights with value as history material as well. I will develop Cretan Turks article. As for Pontian Greek Genocide article, have an eye for the fact that some view wikipedia as some sort of continuous game. :) I read some of the above. :) Regards. Cretanforever

[edit] Phanariotes reloaded

Hi. I think the whole article will need redoing, and even bulk info moved to a new article strictly for rules over Romania, but I'm waiting to see people fill in the non-Romanian part. I think we shouls consider changes when such info is available, so we don't get tangled up in text issues (especially since Miskin did not present a picture that would be fundamentally diferent from "Main article: Phanariotes: A sentence about Greeks in Istanbul" and "See also: an article 140 times the main article's size"). The article as is mainly deals with Romania (which I never said should remain the case); a new one with more info from Greek perspectives (and I'm counting on you not to let it slip into nationalist idiocy) will have justification for different headers etc. The moment that happens, we'll see what belongs in the main, and one belongs in "over Romania", and we will do all that should be done for the text not to be anachronistical (dichotomic) in format. I'd rather wait for the opportunity of a radical change than make minor changes that may just as well become futile. Also, when article is divided (if ever), I would chose something like "Phanariote rules over Wallachia and Moldavia" rather than "over Romania" (it would be more appropriate). Another reason for my weariness to change yet is that it will involve a lot of changes in other articles, and I am not sure if these will stay (consider that, beyond pushing the agenda, Miskin - who was the main person intrigued by the current text - has not added anything relevant anywhere). This is, of course, not to say that the moment we will deal with such cahenges we wouldn't be able to collaborate on the new format, Greece666. Dahn 18:37, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

Looking forward to it. Dahn 18:51, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Mark Mazower article

Hi,

It was an interesting article, especially where he states "The redoubtable traveller Edith Durham once remarked that Europe was quick to condemn Muslim violence towards Christians but remained indifferent when the tables were turned. Even today, no connection is made between the genocide of the Armenians and Muslim civilian losses: the millions of Muslims expelled from the Balkans and the Russian Empire through the long 19th century remain part of Europe's own forgotten past.". I like that he raises this, in fact i would say it is still relevant today. Some have questioned for example whether Europe would have intervened in the Balkans in the 90's quicker had the massacres been against Christians. I think it is part of many Turks perception of the West that they are still inherently biased towards Christians, and much of this comes from their ignorance of the death of Ottoman Muslims, yet continue to support the Armenians cause today. --A.Garnet 23:27, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

Perhaps I will read that book. I know the Cretan Turks also diminished in population rapidly, and as a Turkish Cypriot, I am aware that had Nicos Sampson been sucessful in Cyprus, the same could have been done to the Turkish community. The only author i know who has covered the fate of Ottoman Muslims is Justin McCarthy in Death and Exile: The Ethnic Cleansing of Ottoman Muslims, 1821-1922, hopefully i can read both when i have time. --A.Garnet 23:58, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
About the McCarthy book, here it is on Amazon.com http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0878500944/103-8190395-9477467?v=glance&n=283155. --A.Garnet 11:33, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Hristo Botev

Another bearded hero from the 1800's. I think, in the context of an encyclopedia, the word "enemy" should be avoided, although it does not shock me -whoever it refers to- when used within strict combat situations. I really don't see the point of a poem in Bulgarian in the English wikipedia though. At that token, I could attach poems in Turkish to about a hundred biographies here. I have put poetry here (translated into English), but -in my view- there was a point in putting some.Cretanforever

Hi Greece. I added a tag to the section you mentioned, but I don't see the word "enemy" used there, but in the section below. Are there still problems with the article? —Khoikhoi 01:46, 4 June 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Back

Thanx for your contributuions to my user page, I was away, I'm now back to wiki (time affording) after a real life vacation. I find it funny that many Greeks do not believe you are one of them (I do!). As for the pains of religious fervour in Greece, see the second half of this link those images depicting papadhes and various fanatics speak eloquently for themselves. Apostolos Margaritis 09:36, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Article Improvement Drive (WP:AID)

 Thank you for your support of the Article Improvement Drive.
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[edit] Andreas Embirikos

Hi Greece666, someone has created an article Andreas Empeirikos duplicating the Andreas Embirikos written by you. Could you have a look at how to merge the two? Thanks! Fut.Perf. ☼ 20:49, 2 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Greek history: Souli

Me again. We need a real historian for once. Would you be interested in commenting on a matter of (as usual, slightly ideological POV-pushing) dispute about Greek history? It's about the Souliotes, and we are having the usual ethnic disputes, this time about the weight of the contribution of the Albanian population element in pre-modern Epirus. We badly need some proper academic references, people are working on the basis of cheap patriotic history booklets from the Greek mass market... Thanks! Fut.Perf. ☼ 19:10, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Phanariotes

Hi. So sorry about that: I had noticed it, but couldn't reply just then; I forgot all about it, and, when I archived my pages, I thought it was one of your older ones.

All your proposals seem fine to me. I cannot add much in that respect, since I do not have enough knowledge to cover Phanariote history ouside of the Danubian Principalities (partly taking blame for that is the ethnocentrism of our history studies). Dahn 00:20, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Name day

G'day, I am from Poland, we've had someone recently approach us with a question, namely: when is the name day for Dike? Is this a common Greek name used nowadays? Any insight would be helpful. I just chose you, well, randomly, to be frank :) Feel free to answer here or on my talk page. Thanks in advance. This is basically curiosity and wikiness at work. Regds. --Ouro 19:44, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] PG Genocide (again)

Hey Greece,

Thanks for the info, that's pretty interesting. Sorry for not replying earlier, I was in Israel this past month. Take care, —Khoikhoi 23:31, 28 July 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Homosexuality in Ancient Greece

This article is nominated for deletion. I thought you might be interested in expressing your opinion on the talk page of that article.66.233.19.170 04:21, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] David Ben-Gurion on the Wikipedia:Article Creation and Improvement Drive

Thanks for supporting the selection of David Ben-Gurion on the Wikipedia:Article Creation and Improvement Drive. Respectfully, Republitarian 23:40, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Ancient Greek Wikisource

Hello Greece666. I am sending you this notice because you were one of the users who participated in the discussion on Meta for the creation of, and are willing to work on the Ancient Greek Wikisource: meta:Request_for_new_languages/grc. I am glad to announce you that the wiki has been approved!

The testing has already commenced on the Wikimedia Incubator. The Main Page of the testing is located here: incubator:Ws/grc. Currently the discussion about it takes place in the Greek Wikisource's Γραμματεία. You are more than welcome to participate!

This message will be or has already been sent to the other participators who expressed their will to work on the Ancient Greek Wikisource. You are encouraged to tell about the wiki to others who might be interested.

Greetings, --Dead3y3 Talk page 01:56, 2 December 2006 (UTC)