Talk:Golden Temple

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[edit] Miscellaneous discussion

The Operation Blue Star section of this page states: "He and some followers took refuge in the Golden Temple, and resisted the police..." This statement is unbelievable biased as it seems to depict the militants in a peaceful manner. They did not take "refuge," they seized the temple. They did not "resist" the police, they tried to kill the police. Someone really should have corrected this by now. <arponline> 27 Oct 2007 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.12.90.237 (talk) 03:36, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

What is Darbar? Why the redirect? <KF> 23:06, 12 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Is the water suitable for drinking, or only bathing?

You should not however it had a costly filter system installed a year back.

The Encyclopedia Britannica has Harmandir (rather than Harmindar); is there an authoritative source on which is correct?

Harmindar is "less correct". The Punjabi is ਹਰਿਮੰਦਰ or "harimaṃdar" which is commonly transliterated as Harmandir or Hari Mandir. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 10:31, 17 September 2005 (UTC)

Bhindrenwale is not a saint, he is better known and was killed because he was a terrorist, a person who killed and instigated others to kill.

Well i think in his early days he was okay person and latter on leading to 1984 he changed.

--Girish 12:35, Mar 21, 2005 (UTC)

Heres proof for the name change http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/1040018.cms

Gsingh 03:04, Jun 18, 2005 (UTC) The page should be reverted to its prior version because someone put the writing in all caps. Gsingh 21:17, 13 September 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Temple Layout

I removed the empty header. If someone wants to write about the layout, then put it back with some content, but we don't need a placeholder for something that might never get written. FireWorks 03:46, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Suggestion

Is the "In film and television" section and the "notable visits" section really all that necessary? Also to note I think its quite funny how PM Singhs visit to Harmandar Sahib is noted (2004) implying its his first visit seeing how one can assume that a turbaned Sikh of his age from India would have visited the site many times.

It is notable because it is his first visit in his position as Prime Minister of India. Don't think of him as PM Singh, more like PM. Also, Notable Visits could be useful if there are only official visits in a persons capacity as...whatever they are, be it Queen or PM, but I'm not so sure about the TV guy, since I've never heard of him. After reading his article real quick, I'd let that stand as well. --Phant 23:05, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Categories

Shouldn't this gurdwara be listed in the gurdwara's, sikhism and structures of india categories?? Gsingh 15:47, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

Due to the way categories work, we only need to put it into the "Gurdwaras of India" category. The Gurdwaras of India category falls into the "Places of worship in India" and 'Gurdwara' category, which inturn falls into the 'Sikhism' category. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 16:40, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

Ok thanks for clearing it up. Gsingh 23:19, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

I am not sure whether it is required to mention the dignitaries who visited the temple. It leads to the belief that our temple was graced by these dignitaries' presence while it should be the other way around i.e. the people get blessed by a visit to the temple. It is a bliss to just even look at the temple leave alone visiting the complete premises.

Dieresis 09:19, 29 September 2006 (UTC) Which graces which is a matter of opinion and doesn't belong in an encyclopedia article. I don't think a section of "notable visits" is necessary. If a particular visit has some greater significance, then mention of the visit should be incorporated into the article in the appropriate section.

[edit] Non-Sikhs entering site

Are non-Sikhs allowed to enter the site?

Anyone is allowed to enter the site. You need to cover your head and remove your shoes/socks before entering though. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 14:54, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] It sould be spelled with a space in between HARI MANDIR

Their should be a space between HAR & MANDIR....HAR MANDIR...It doesnt matter what any website says BECAUSE the term in India has always been HARI...not Har...Yes their are people who say Har but they are not pronoucning it right. Yes their are websites that spell it HAR but that is because they go by what people say...The correct Indian term is HARI....For example people say Hari Krishan...Hari Ria...Hari Ram...Hari OM....So it should be ARI MANDIR....AND SECONDLY....Even if u disagree with me....u should at least have a space between HAR & MANDIR...IT SHOULD BE WRITTEN AS HAR MANDIR....THESE ARE SEPERATE WORDS, SO I DONT UNDERSATND WHY YOUR TYPING IT AS ONE WORD. 204.102.210.1 19:41, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

In Hindi or Punjabi people say HARIMANDIR real fast that it sounds like one word. But when you write it in English it should be spelled with a space between Hari & Mandir. For example one guru was named HARI KRISHAN with a space right? So their should be a space beteen Hari & Mandir. ALso remember that when non Indians read this they dont undersatnd HARIMANDIR in one word. They will easily understand HARI MANDIR with a space....Hope you change it thanx 71.107.54.199 23:53, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

If you look at the home page of the SGPC home page SGPC Homepage you will see that they refer to it as Harimandir. Since the SGPC is the leading authority over the Harimandir Sahib, I think we should stick to the official name. Gsingh 02:57, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

It doesnt matter what that website says. U cant go by what a stinkin website says. Their are lots of websites out their and its a matter of opinion when it comes to their beliefs....USE YOUR COMMON SENSE.....Mandir is a word....HARI is a word....They seperate HAR KRISHN....they seperate HAR RAI...They seperate HAR GOHBIND....BUT OOO NO U WONT SEPERATE HAR MANDIR?....again....think.....its a Mandir....and Hari is a sighn of respect...so it should be HAR MANDIR....not Harmanider....Whats wrong with u, i mean your a Singh and u your arguing against me? 71.107.54.199 05:54, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

If you search on google for "Harimandir Sahib" you will get 12,300 links if you search "Hari Mandir Sahib" you will get 1810 links, it is quite clear that Harimandir Sahib is used more. I think we should follow what is official, if we weren't using official and proper names than this page would be called The Golden Temple, which the majority of the world uses for the name not Hari Mandir Sahib. Gsingh 21:46, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedia policy is to use the most common English term for the page. On that alone, this page should be called "Golden Temple". However, here are the options:

ਹਰਿਮੰਦਰ Harimandar
ਹਰਿਮੰਦਿਰ Harimandir
ਹਰਮੰਦਰ Harmandar
ਹਰਮੰਦਿਰ Haramandir

The "hari-" portion is almost never separated in modern Punjabi and so there is no need to separate it in English. The 'i' at the end of Hari is almost never pronounced (if it is, it's done very slightly) and so it's often written Har. Mandir is written Mandar in Punjabi, but the SGPC decides to transliterate it as Mandir because that's common in English. As a result, I'd stick to "Harimandir".

However, you should note that in the original Guru Granth Sahib (the joined up version that is), it is written as "ਹਰਿਮੰਦਰ" exclusively which is "Harimandar". Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 15:14, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

We cannt use the Golden Temple name becauase that is not its name, search Kalcutta and it will redirect to Kolkata, search Bombay and it will redirect to Mumbai, what makes this different. Gsingh 20:37, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

I'm not advocating the name change (which is a bit ambiguous anyway) however I was stating that Wikipedia policy wise, that is probably what it should be labelled. The SGPC's decision to officially rename it is not really relevant insomuch that the English usage has barely changed. I would however advocate moving it to Harimandir Sahib. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 21:51, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

Sure I'll agree with Harimandir Sahib, we should wait a little bit for the person above to state their responseGsingh 23:07, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

Look I understand if u want to call it Harmandir instead of HARImandir....You are entitled to your opinion so no problem....But at least leave a space between the word....U can call it HARMANDIR....or u can call it HARIMANDIR...But their should be a space.....I mean look at other examples....HAR KRISHAN (SPACE)....HAR RAI (SPACE)...HARI RAM (SPACE)....HAR GOHBIND (SPACE)...so Why is HARIMANDIR as one word? It should be HARI MANDIR.....by the way...it doesnt matter how many results come up that way on the internet. Thats not a valid argument....I mean most websites are from opinions and people who just copy older websites....Dont go by the layman popular way...go by the correct way 71.107.54.199 08:45, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

Ok, the problem with changing the name is that we must go with the most used term, in this case Harimandir is the most commonly said word as shown in the facts above, if you can refer to a website which discusses the names of the Harimandir Sahib it would be helpful for all of us. Gsingh 13:19, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

There is nothing incorrect about Hari Mandir per se (indeed, Sahib is an honorific and probably shouldn't be there on Wikipedia - it's not called Harimandir Sahib in the GGS, just Harimandir).

Let's have a vote to sort this out. I'll add it at the bottom of the page. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 13:52, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "Har" and "Hari"

The above discussion is interesting. Let me add some interesting bits of trivia.

If one looks at the Hindu Trinity, one finds that "Har" is a term for Shiva and "Hari" for Vishnu. There is even a form called Harihara, which means "Vishnu-Shiva" just as there is a form called Ardhnarishwara, which is half-Shiva and half-Parvati (i.e. the amalgamation of masculine and feminine attributes of God represented by Shiva and Shakti respectively).

I remember seeing a fresco of Harihar on one of the walls of the Durgiana Mandir on my first visit to Amritsar during the Diwali of 2003.

Take also for an example, the name Hardwar which I have heard mostly among Punjabi Hindus (my own community) while in other parts of India, the pronunciation is Haridwar

The confusion over whether the correct term is Harimandir/Harimandar or Harmandir/Harmandar is largely due to our Punjabi accents. Perhaps, we find Har easier to pronounce than Hari. However, I have heard both terms being spoken in equal measure.

But I would vouch for Mr. Sukh's view that we should pronounce the name as Harimandir

Rajatjghai 00:05, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Proposed article name change

Proposal to move page to Hari Mandir. Please sign your vote. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 13:54, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

Vote is now closed.

[edit] Support

Rajatjghai 15:14, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
I support a vote for a space between Hari & Mandir 71.107.54.199 09:03, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Oppose

Gsingh 17:58, 17 June 2006 (UTC) Harimandir is more common, if you look at the google search results you will see there are 28,900 links on the other hand when searching for "Hari Mandir" we get 11,800, this is a big difference. Also on the SGPC Homepage they use Harimandir this is the one used by the SGPC, the committee which controls the gurdwara and it is used by most people.
The term "Hari Mandir" is very ambiguous and would require a disambiguation page anyway! Harimandir is my preferred form and is used much much more than Hari Mandir. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 23:59, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
Agree with Gsingh although I got 28k hits against 1k on google. Harmandir/Harimandir/Harimander (ie: as one word) is more popular; is the way it is written in Gurmukhi; is the way it is spelt by official SGPC site here and together the two parts make sense - Its like most Punjabi names: Gurjit/Pritpal/Sukhbir/Baldev/Amardeep, etc we join the two parts and it is not common (yet) to write the name components seperately unless they have three parts. --Hari Singh 02:49, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Comments

Look we all agree that the temple is name HARIMANDIR SAHIB...The question is, when you type it in english, is their a space....Folks its not rocket science....Hari is word of phraise. Mandir is a place of worship...Put 2 & 2 together....It should be spelled with a space....HARI MANDIR SAHIB....I mean they leave a space between Hari Krishan...They leave a space between Hari Rai...They leave a space between Hari Ram....So leave a space between Hari & Mandir....AGAIN...THESE ARE 2 SEPERATE WORDS....Punjabi people just say it fast come on! Im voting for a space! 71.107.54.199 09:03, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

I don't think there is any opposition to moving it to Harimandir Sahib so if this fails, then I will move it to Harimandir Sahib as long as there are no objections. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 20:20, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

What is this vote for? Hari Mandir Sahib or Harimandir Sahib?? I have no opposition to Harimandir Sahib but Hari Mandir Sahib is what I'm opposed to. Gsingh 20:38, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

This is for "Hari Mandir". I was merely saying that everyone seems to approve of Harimandir (over Harmandir), and so if this fails, we move it to Harimandir anyway. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 21:40, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

Ok, I'm sure everyone will agree to that. Gsingh 21:54, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

Ya ok I agree with that. It should be Hari 71.107.54.199 09:05, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Comments

The vote has been up for ten days and there was no consensus to move it to Hari Mandir. Therefore, it shall not be moved there. However, there were no objections to Harimandir, and so I shall move it there.

Thats funny, I remember more votes here...Did somebody delete them?....Anyway look...I agree the name is HARImandir....But all I am saying is that in English, you type it, HARI Mandir with a space....If u disagree with me, then at least tell me, how come Hari Krishan, Hari Rai, Hari Ram, & Hari Om all have spaces but HARIMANDIR IS ONE WORD? Nobody seems to want to answer this ARYAN818 01:25, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

- Look, I don't know why this is different but look at the facts in google, harimandir:28,000 links hari mandir:11,500 links, this alone should tell you which one is more common. Officially its name is Harimandir so I see no reason to say its wrong. And the votes above were always like this. nothing has changed.Gsingh 03:48, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

Gsingh you & I both agree that its proper name is HARImandir Sahib....But u never seem to answer my question....In English , isn't their supposed to be a space between HARI & MANDIR?....If not....Why is their a space between Hari Krishan, Hari Ram, Hari Rai, Hari Om, etc etc etc....Clicks on google & yahoo dont prove anything....Facts prove them...so im asking you for the 50th time...in the English language isn't their supposed to be a space?....IF YOUR ANSWER IS NOT...THen why is their a space between the other words? ARYAN818 07:59, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

- I do not know why, but my reason for agreeing on Harimandir is that it is more common. I believe that both are right but the most common one should be used. So here's my answer to your questions: I do not know. Here's my reason for choosing Harimandir of Hari Mandir: because of the number of people which used Harimandir. Also in response to the comparison between Hari Krishan, etc.:In many languages there are exceptions and this is one of them. Gsingh 13:32, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

Well since you do not know I will tell you....The reason their is a space between all the Hari words is because....In English they are considered two seperate words!....Its not rocket science....Go to any dictionary, or an English website, and you will see that the correct spelling is always a space between the words....So now that I have answered the question for both of u....I am asking you again....Why do you keep telling me that their is no need for a space?....It doesnt matter what the popular way is...It doesnt matter what any Sikh website says...These are not arguments....Their is a right way & a wrong way...and for the 100th time im telling you, that the correct English structure is to have a space....What dont you get about that? ARYAN818 19:18, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

If you look at the word HARIMANDIR its not an ENGLISH word. Its a PUNJABI word. You cannot put any English rules into a word form another language. So you are wrong in using ENGLISH STRUCTURE FOR A PUNJABI LANGUAGE WORD. You also don't seem to understand the difference between the variants. You are telling me that the correct name is Hari mandir, THIS IS 100% WRONG, the right name is Harimandir. Please just think about what you are arguing. Its like telling someone whose name is Joe that their name is John. When talking about the Gurdwara in Amritsar we ONLY USE HARIMANDIR because that is right. HARI MANDIR is also a word which can be used for anything else. As this is the talk page of the Harimandir Sahib, I am only talking about the correct name of the gurdwara. Not the existence of the word Hari Mandir.Gsingh 19:26, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

Your argument made no sense to me...U just used an example of John & Joe....But their is a difference between JOHN & JOE....BUt their is no difference between HARIMANDIR & HARI MANDIR....Its the same thing Sukh....I agree that the term is HARIMANDIR....HARI & MANDIR is the name of the temple...So why are u giving the example of JOHN AND JOE?....I MEAN JOhn & Joe are completely different from each other....BUt their is no difference between what u and I agree about....except how to spell it in English...Which once again u did not answer ARYAN818 00:00, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] It is not Hari Mandir

Whoever keeps changing the name of the Golden Temple to Harimandir instead of Harmandir needs to stop. The SGPC does not call it the HARIMANDIR it calls the Golden Temple the HARMANDIR so GSingh stop messing this page up you bastard.You too Sukh.

Oh boo hoo. It should be referred to as the Golden Temple, as that is the main English name for the temple. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 10:35, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

Please read WP:NPA. Maybe when you can talk properly, people will listen. Until then... Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 10:36, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Hindu statues

Some websites (faith freedom international, for one) claim that the Golden Temple contained statues of Hindu gods until 1909. Is this true? If so it should be in the article. Arrow740 11:14, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

It's probably false or highly misleading, the author of the right-wing Hindu website that info was originally found hasn't responded to my email after a couple weeks. Arrow740 19:34, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Move to Golden Temple

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Copied from Wikipedia talk:Notice board for India-related topics The article title is Harimandir Sahib. As the Golden Temple is by far the most popular name for the shrine, should it be moved? I support the move. =Nichalp «Talk»= 08:34, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

Support. I had never heard of Harimandir Sahib before (my ignorance). Golden Temple is by far the more popular name. A quick gtest shows that "Golden Temple" is 25 times more popular than "harimandir sahib". - Aksi_great (talk) 08:46, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

Support the move.--Dwaipayan (talk) 09:30, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

Support per popularity. Gizza^Chat ^© 09:42, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

Another support. --Groggy Dice T | C 03:31, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

Support. Arrow740 04:39, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

Support. Amartyabag ^TALK2ME 05:04, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

Oppose. Golden Temple isn't even the name for the temple, its call Harimandir Sahib, which is the official name.Gsingh 12:16, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

So what is the Golden Temple? The wikipedia naming convention goes by the most common name for the temple. See Wikipedia:Naming conventions Generally, article naming should prefer to what the majority of English speakers would most

easily recognize, with a reasonable minimum of ambiguity, while at the same time making linking to those articles easy and second nature. =Nichalp «Talk»= 12:52, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

Golden Temple is the British term for the Harimandir Sahib, like Bombay and Mumbai or Madras and Chennai. harimandir is the official name of the golden temple and even if most english users enter Golden Temple, they will be redirected to the Harimandir Sahib so it is still easy for them to find the pageGsingh 14:33, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

"British term"? -- The name is popular even in India despite it being officially renamed. See NDTV, Hindustan Times. Common name gains first use. =Nichalp «Talk»= 14:49, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

If you go to Punjab were the harimandir sahib is everyone calls it Harimandir Sahib, Wikipedia:Naming conventions is a convention not a rule so there are always exceptions, I think that this is one exception. Naming it the Golden Temple would be wrong. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Gsingh (talk • contribs) 03:20, 12 March 2007 (UTC).

I seriously doubt that. I went to Amritsar in January and as far as I can recall, everyone was calling it the Golden Temple. =Nichalp «Talk»= 09:01, 12 March 2007 (UTC)

Doubt means that you do not know. If you lived in Punjab before than you will only know, I have stayed there for for holidays, sometimes for a month or two, if you understand Punjabi you will notice no one will call it Golden Temple but Harimandir Sahib. Another example would be the Rogers Centre in Toronto, Canada, everyone calls it by its old name Skydome but its still called Rogers Centre on the wikipedia article. This is because the Rogers Centre is the official name. This should apply also to the Harimandir Sahib.Gsingh 08:00, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

I don't think you need to extrapolate my statement for "not knowing". I gave you my honest opinion on what was the ground situation was like when I visited Amritsar. Saying "no one will call it Golden Temple" needs to be backed up by some credible cite, else it is really your personal opinion. If Harimandir Sahib is the more popular name in Punjabi, it can inherit the article name in the pa: wikipedia. I really can't comment for events and places in Canada. =Nichalp «Talk»= 08:23, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Anyways I got a good cite to refute your claim: Pak rangers visit Golden Temple", coming from a well-known English newspaper based in the capital of Punjab; quite some months after the holy place was officially renamed. =Nichalp «Talk»= 09:41, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Well we should be looking at other similar cases, because it forms precedent, we should follow other similar cases so we can keep uniformity. Here's a link talking about the change of name, SikhNN. The SGPC has even told all people that Harimandir Sahib is the only name that will be used by the SGPC, the governing authority on the Harimandir Sahib.Gsingh 03:03, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Another source, from UNESCO, and the name "Sri Harimandir Sahib" was submitted to UNESCO by the Ministry of Environment of Forests, Government of India. So this is proof that it is the name to be used.Gsingh 03:10, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

You've only shown me the citation for it being the official name which I don't dispute. But what takes precedence here is how common the use of the word "Golden Temple" is. For example, see Marine Drive which is officially Netaji Subhash Chandra Bose Road; as to how common name takes precedence. (Anyways another personal opinion here: I did not know that the name was changed until I read this article and searched through news sites. Nowhere in Amrtistar did I see the word "Harimandir Sahib".) =Nichalp «Talk»= 17:02, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

I have already given an article, Rogers Centre that is using the official name even though the former name Skydome is still the most popular, so if we are using the official name for places than I think it should also be used for this place also. Another one is Ivan the Terrible who is actually Ivan IV of Russia, the informal name is much more popular but the official name is still used. This should be followed with the Harimandir Sahib.Gsingh 17:42, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

As I said, I can't comment on places in Canada, or the reasons why Ivan the Terrible is not used since I do not have a background on the topics. See Mark Twain vs Samuel Langhorne Clemens for common names. =Nichalp «Talk»= 17:51, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

So, we both have examples now, it could be named either Harimandir Sahib or Golden Temple depending on which example we follow. What is the procedure to solve this problem. Gsingh 02:20, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

The common name takes precedence as discussed here. =Nichalp «Talk»= 15:55, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Why should the common name take precedence, what is your basis for this, why can't this can be an exception like the examples I have shown.Gsingh 18:16, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Re: My sources cited, and as I said, what happens in Canada or Russia is very different. I can't comment on the reasons for that. And of course the points raised by Indian and non-Indian wikipedians. Have you read the relevent policy? I'd rather you comment on this: [Wikipedia:Naming conventions]] Generally, article naming should prefer to what the majority of English speakers would most easily recognize, with a reasonable minimum of ambiguity, while at the same time making linking to those articles easy and second nature. rather than trying to make this an abberration. =Nichalp «Talk»= 18:25, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Can you comment on WP:NCONDealing with self-identifying terms states, "Where self-identifying names are in use, they should be used within articles." Since the SGPC, the governing authority of the Harimandir Sahib, has already self-identified itself as Harimandir Sahib, that name should be followed. Gsingh 08:14, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

You haven't taken the liberty to answer my question, but I'll answer yours: From that page: A city, country or people, by contrast, is a self-identifying entity. Common use would override it until the name Harimandir Sahib comes into more popular usage. Bear in mind, we are not excising the word Hari Mandir, but rather saying, "The Golden Temple (officially renamed as the Hari Mandir Sahib)..." —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Nichalp (talk • contribs) 16:53, 16 March 2007 (UTC).

What will the name of the article be?Gsingh 18:50, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

The Golden Temple, as I've stated above. =Nichalp «Talk»= 06:03, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

But you just said you weren't excising the word Harimandir Sahib, and why would you include 'the' in Golden Temple? If you look at Encylopedia Brittanica you will see that they also refer to the temple as [[Harimandir Sahib. I don't understand why wikipedia cannot respect other religions views on what their own temple should be called. The SPGC has already told all businesses to stop using the Golden Temple name so why shouldn't we follow this, when all other major sources are (UNESCO, Indian Central Govt., Brittanica, Encarta) And also, the examples provided above (spec. Rogers Centre) do apply to this because it is part of the English wikipedia, and all articles can be used as examples and are applicable to this discussion.218.248.47.43 10:41, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

Here is the letter from SPGC. Gsingh 10:46, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

"SGPC Asr <info@sgpc.net> To GSingh <*******@gmail.com> Date Mar 17, 2007 3:58 PM Subject Re: harimandir sahib

Dear Sardar Ji

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

The Official name is Sri Darbar Sahib or Sri Harmandir Sahib and not Golden Temple.

With Regards

Secretary SGPC, Amritsar.

[reindenting] I don't see any point in further discussion here. You keep pushing the official name of the location, which I do not deny, while refusing to comment on the common name policy of wikipedia. And to add to it, you mention 'respect other religions'. Where is the case of any disrespect here? =Nichalp «Talk»= 13:42, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

Because the people that govern the Harimandir Sahib have told everyone to stop calling it Golden Temple, when you keep calling it that its called disrespect. Do you know what Harimandir Sahib means, The Temple of God, Golden Temple has a different meaning. And I have already commented on the Wikipedia policy, its a guideline not a law, so this is an exception because the common name is wrong, it is not right to use it.218.248.47.43 14:13, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

Well, according to what you say then, Marine Drive is also wrong. So too Crawford Market. This is not a place to raise sentiment, I can't see how the name is disrespectful when it was called so for decades without any significant opposition. As you can see from the posts by other users in India, the name Golden Temple is more popular. =Nichalp «Talk»= 14:50, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

Support as common name in English per Nichalp. Gene Nygaard 16:16, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

According to my memory, ethnically orininating from Punjab (though admittedly Hindu, not Sikh) everyone I know in India calls it Golden Temple. Keeping the official Punjabi name is like changing the name of the India article to Bharat even though most people outside India will have no idea what Bharat means. Gizza^Chat ^© 10:23, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

You are correct, while Bharat is the correct name if you look at the CIA World Factbook, in the Country name area, it says the conventional long name is Republic of India/Bharatiya Ganarajya meaning both are official names, so it is right to use either. But for the Harimandir Sahib, the only official name is Harimandir Sahib, in fact the SGPC clearly stated it last year in a letter.Gsingh 03:03, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Support In the United States, at least, Golden Temple is the way this wonderful place is described. I have never even seen the other name anywhere but here despite fairly extensive reading on Indian subjects including Sikhism. I lived for several months is a Sikh ashram, and never heard the name. --Nemonoman 03:27, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

This article has been renamed from Harimandir Sahib to Golden Temple as the result of a move request. --Stemonitis 14:53, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] simplifying

this is very very very long

Hello I'm making a presentation about the golden temple and DOAS ANYONE MAYBE KNOW HOW BIG THE TEMPLE IS?? AND HOW BIG THE POOL IS????? IT'S VERY URGENT ! THANKS —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.162.118.192 (talk) 13:51, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] New Photo

I did edit the article several months ago to include a new photo, that was then promptly removed for reasons unknown to me. It is indeed my own work, and I think it's a much better photo than the other ones available. I have uploaded it onto the commons, here's the link http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Harminder_sahib5.jpg#Summary . Someone feel free to update the article to use that photo as the main indentifying photograph, as I'm unsure as to how to do it properly. Jsu (talk) 19:17, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Visits

I think that we should keep the noteable visits to international leaders, the list is getting a little to long. What does everyone else think? Gsingh (talk) 06:31, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

Since no one has responded I will update the noteable visits to only include International Leaders Gsingh (talk) 18:02, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Talk:Golden Temple

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Contents

[edit] Miscellaneous discussion

[edit] Temple Layout

[edit] Suggestion

[edit] Categories

[edit] Non-Sikhs entering site

[edit] It sould be spelled with a space in between HARI MANDIR

[edit] "Har" and "Hari"

[edit] Proposed article name change

[edit] Support

[edit] Oppose

[edit] Comments

[edit] Comments

[edit] It is not Hari Mandir

[edit] Hindu statues

[edit] Move to Golden Temple

[edit] simplifying

[edit] New Photo

[edit] Visits

Views

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