Talk:George Costanza

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This article is within the scope of the Seinfeld WikiProject, which aims to improve Wikipedia's coverage of Seinfeld-related articles. If you would like to participate, you can visit the project page and add your name to the members list.
??? This article has not yet been assigned a rating on the quality scale.
??? This article has not yet been assigned a rating on the importance scale.

His original job when the series started was as a real estate agent; he ended up getting fired after he slipped his boss a mickey. Didn't George get fired for yelling at his boss and then as revenge try to slip him a mickey? [User:TimSPC|Tim] 20:53, 7 December 2005

yes, but his boss rehired him at the party, but it was too late to get the mickey away from him, so he wound up fired after all.


Contents

[edit] Interview

"Alexander related in an interview that, early in the creation of the show, he once expressed having problems acting out a scene in the script, because he felt no one would ever behave in "such a way". David replied to him that the exact situation had actually happened to him, and he had reacted in exactly "that way". Alexander said that this was a breakthrough for him in portraying the character, giving him valuable insight into both David and George."

It would be good to have a citation for this. --Mattucd 22:55, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

it's in the first episode of "Curb your Enthusiasm" (The Mocumentary one where Larry is preparing for an HBO stand up special that doesn't happen

It's in the extras to the seinfeld box. The 'extra' is called: 'larry + jason = george'

[edit] Parallelism

We should try to make the articles on Cosmo Kramer, George Costanza, and Elaine Benes parallel.

[edit] Relatives

Shouldn't the list of relatives on the right include "Leo (Uncle)"? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.39.74.58 (talk) 20:16, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

No. Leo is Jerry's Uncle. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.221.133.226 (talk) 09:59, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] George Costanza moments

We need to hack down this section -- there is just way too much material. We don't need to list every plotline that George was involved in. Perhaps it would be best to isolate particular characteristics that George exhibits -- dishonesty, extravagant plots, overreaction to small things, etc. -- and give one or two examples for each one. This would not only make the section more managable, but easier to gain an understanding of who George is. Dylan 20:35, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

Support - the list is meaningless as is, as it seems to be a synopsis of just about every episode he was in. A list of attributes with some examples would be far more useful.
I've gone ahead and redone the list - some of the stuff I've deleted but can be added in - I would suggest that not just a laundry list of "stuff George did" be added, but it should be something that George has done that exemplifies a particular trait, followed by the way in which his character trait made things backfire on him.

Stuff like the answering machine message is more like "trivia" and should go under a separate section. Michael Dorosh 16:22, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

This section still has major style problems. Particularly tense confusion. Plot summaries of this kind should, as a rule, be written consistently in the present tense. Calaf 08:36, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Strange question

Has George Costanza ever attended college? He called his bathroom at Play Now "Xanadu" so he had some exposure to Coleridge, worked in the publishing industry and seems to be smart enough to be gifted with some degree of cunning/lying. --Blue387 21:38, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

Yes. When Estelle is encouraging him to take a civil service test, he replies, "I'm a college graduate; you want me to be a mailman?" ("The Puffy Shirt") Dylan 03:40, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
He also mentions in one episode that his college roommate was uncircumcised. Kakashi-sensei 22:49, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Alter Ego

I'm not sure "alter ego" is the correct term for Costanza ("The character of George is based on the alter ego of the show's co-creator, Larry David."). I forget the exact phrase Larry David uses, but alter ego implies a second personality, and Costanza is essentially a fairly close representation of Larry David. Interestingly enough, Art Vandalay is listed as an alter ego of George Costanza in the entry for alter ego!

I removed the phrase "alter ego" because it isn't the correct term at all. I can't think of the proper term either, but it would just be easier to say he is based on Larry David, which is completely true. Kakashi-sensei 22:48, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Article Length

This article's starting to get on the verge of being too long and unwieldy. Please don't summarize every detail that happened in an episode - that's what the episode articles are for. Let's stick to concise small bullet points or small paragraphs Mezaco 12:40, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

-Yeah It's kind of ironic that the length of this article is longer than Jason Alexanders

[edit] Religion and ethnic background of George Costanza

hey all! George Costanza is italian, right?!?! please let me know.

I believe so. I think Frank went to Italy to see a relative in one episode. Bean 01:57, Dec 27, 2004 (UTC)
Yes, his heritage is Italian. The show also hints at him sharing a Jewish heritage as well --Will2k 06:26, Dec 29, 2004 (UTC)
I always thought he was Italian because of his name. I suppose there's no reason he can't be Jewish and Italian. There are a number of Italian Jews.\
While trying to chum up to an employee of an Italian calzone shop, George states that his last name is Italian. Dylan 03:42, 2 January 2006 (UTC)
George clearly states the Italian origin of his last name in the Calzone episode, and in another episide, Frank Costanza (George's father) visits a relative in Tuscany. I always thought that the show implied George being of Jewish descent, thus Frank (George's father) could be descended from Italian Jews. In practice, the Constanzas seem agnostic. They celebrate no religious holidays, thus prompting Frank to invent his own early-winter holiday -Festivus ("A Festivus for the rest of us")- to coincide with Christmas and Hanukah seasons. Skyduster 04:29, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
 Shouldnt his religion be put jewish till season 5 becuase he converted to lathvian orthodox in "the conversion"
George is not jewish. Several interviews show that his texts was written showing his family with some new york jewish stereoptypes, but george has never been labeled as jewish by the authors. It's pure speculation, + Frank used to sell christian items 128.135.190.84 09:38, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
Just beause his father sold christian items, doesn't mean Estelle isn't Jewish. Also, did he ever convert from Latvian Orthadox?


George has Italian heritage, and is most likely Catholic in practice. He is written into some "Jewish jokes" throughout the series, but whether of not is Jewish, in whole or part, is left open. His conversion to or from Latvian Orthodox was not genuine, so this has little bearing on this beliefs/hertiage/ethnicity. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.214.146.145 (talk) 19:00, 5 March 2007 (UTC).
As someone else above pointed out, there are Jews from Italy, in fact Italy (after Greece) has the oldest Jewish community in Europe! Most of them have Italianate names , although "Costanza" is not a typical Jewish name amongst the Italian Jews. See: History of the Jews in Italy and Italian Jews for more on this subject. However, there is also the city of Constanţa in Romania, which also had a large Jewish population, prior to the second world war, some Jews in Israel take their name from this city and are called "Kostantza". That said, I don't think the writers of the show ever meant to suggest that Frank Costanza was an Italian Jew--very few of the Italian Jews migrated to Newa York City. In one episode, I recall George mentioning the guilt Jewish mothers cause. While it was never stated so explicitly, I believe the writers suggested that Frank was an Italian (not Jewish) and Estelle, eorge's mother was Jewish, most likely of Eastern European and not Italian heritage.Mixed Eastern European Jewish and Italian Catholic marriages are not at all rare in New York City and its environs, so it is quite reasonable to assume that George could be a product of such a union.
Also, again, while I don't believe George's father was meant to be Jewish, the fact that he sold Christian religious items (in Korea) shouldn't be evidence that he is not a Jew--plenty of Jews have made a living selling Christian religious trinkets to Christians. Just business.
I do recall George lamenting the lack of kosher food somewhere. Of course, Ned Flanders eats kosher food too. 80.138.211.244 23:46, 8 September 2007 (UTC)
I remember an episode where his therapist asks him, "I thought you didn't believe in god?" to which he replies, "only for the bad things" 67.40.172.80 01:36, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Patsy

the article says that Art Vandelay is george's patsy, which the linked article defines as someone you trick. This is not the correct word to describe Art Vandelay is it? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 67.173.242.14 (talk) 01:12, 9 December 2006 (UTC).

[edit] Ricky Gervais?

Why is Ricky Gervais listed at the top of the page as calling George the greatest sitcom character of all time? Hes just another comedian/television personality, and should'nt be said to have a say in the Wikipedia article (maybe in a George Costanza trivia section), unless Time or some official magazine or news source has listed him, that shouldn't be up there. I'm deleting it, put it back if you have a good reason for it.--74.135.48.18 00:07, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Why is this article longer than the entire Seinfeld article? The quote provides a verifiable assessment of the character's significance, and adds context. The alternative would be some mealy-mouthed and unsourced wibble about him being "widely regarded as one of the most memorable characters in sitcom history".
That said, I have no problem with it being moved to a "Critical Reaction" section if one's ever started.
At any rate, the quote is more of an introduction than any of the following six paragraphs, which belong in the body of the article:
The lead should be capable of standing alone as a concise overview of the article, establishing context, explaining why the subject is interesting or notable
chocolateboy 02:58, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

Then why put any "been considered the greatest character of all time" in the introduction? Ricky Gervais is just another actor, it'd be the same if you put Jim Carrey or whoever as saying that. Cut that part out and wait for a critical reaction section, or make it yourself. Plus, Ricky Gervais has no significance to Seinfeld, and that article you linked to was just a small paragraph of mention. --74.134.12.230 01:31, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Then why put any "been considered the greatest character of all time" in the introduction?
It said "described by Ricky Gervais as" rather than "been considered", but: for the reason mentioned above: context as per Wikipedia:Lead section.
I've reinstated it as an anonymous quote with two references. I agree that namechecking Gervais is distracting. However, summarizing the character's status in the cultural landscape ("[explain] why the subject is interesting or notable") is standard practice.
chocolateboy 22:47, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Thank you, I like that a lot better, but if a critical reaction section ever shows up we should move it there, agreed? --74.134.12.230 01:57, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Lists of Jobs

It says that George was a bra salseman, but he lost it within seconds of getting it, does it really count?

He was hired, so it counts —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.122.127.162 (talk) 02:58, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Birthday

Although we do know George was born in April, the birth year of 1959 is not known and is actually probably inaccurate and just chosen as it is Jason Alexander's birth year. An entire episode is detailed aorund George having the high score for Frogger back in highschool, a game that wasn't released until 1981. If Jerry and George played it the very year it came out, and were 18 and seniors at the time (making them the oldest they could possibly be for The Frogger to be accurate) than at earliest George was born in 1963. --148.61.207.67 19:27, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Refactored

I've trimmed the overlong intro as per the comments above (by moving its contents to a new Characteristics section and demoting negative and positive characteristics to subsections), and removed the {{unreferenced}} template as the article had only one statement that was marked with that tag. The bulk of the (bulky) article references Seinfeld shows. "In such and such an episode, George reveals that his password is 'Bosco'" (or whatever) clearly doesn't need an external reference. A citation to establish the veracity of the statement isn't needed, though one to establish its notability might be. There are problems with the article, but a more accurate tag than {{unreferenced}} should be used.

Maybe it's just too long: {{verylong}}.

chocolateboy 07:47, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

I've boldly removed the positive and negative characteristics sections as they appear to be the main sources of listmaniacal bloat. I guess they could be moved to a different article, but I doubt it would survive an AfD. I've also moved the Characteristics intro up so it serves a similar purpose to its original incarnation. I can't see any evidence that an exhaustive enumeration of George's negative traits is somehow essential to an encyclopedia article on the character. Peter Mehlman talks at length in Writing Seinfeld-Style about how characters on Seinfeld scheme and lie, but that applies to all of them, not just George.

chocolateboy 08:12, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] References

This is an excellent essay and full of references. The claim that this article is unreferenced is absurd. Gregpalmerx (talk) 15:10, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] What about Kramer?

I realized that something definetely missing is nothing other than the time he hangs around Kramer. For his characteristics, I hope their is a way to integrate at least a small summary when he hangs around with him. It will be interesting and it will work on the page. That's all. Johnnyauau2000 (talk) 03:16, 1 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] "Loosely based on David and Alexander"

Without looking at the Season 5 DVD, I wonder if Johnnyauau may be more correct in deleting the reference to Jason Alexander. I've never heard that the character was "based on" J.A. at all. Of course the actor is going to influence the character. The character G.C. is not L.D. But as far as the character as written -- what's in the script as far as his actions, reactions, responses to what's put before him, etc. -- isn't the basis of the character only L.D.? "Jason + Larry = George" then would mean the actor + the creator = the character. Again, I haven't watched the feature referred to. Does it say the character is actually based on Jason Alexander?  ~ InkQuill  23:33, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

I was probably a bit hasty to revert that edit. Sorry. I have reverted my revert. I will watch that feature when I get the time to be sure. Joelster (talk) 04:11, 7 April 2008 (UTC)
Well if it's based on Jason Alexander, than George would've been more different changing Seinfeld and putting it downhill like that. Anyway long story short, Jason's sensitivity becomes George's insensitivity is the only thing that stands out in the documentary. The rest is Larry David's alter ego with the exception of "The Revenge". Anyway, make up your mind. Johnnyauau2000 (talk) 11:15, 7 April 2008 (UTC)