Talk:Garry Bushell

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography. For more information, visit the project page.
Biography Portal
Start This article has been rated as start-Class on the project's quality scale. [FAQ]
This article is supported by the Arts and Entertainment work group.

Contents

[edit] Enoch Powell

I heard Garry Bushell on Radio4 describing Enoch Powell as "that great Englishman". Is this information available in some form that makes it possible to include in this article? The rant left me with the impression that Bushell is lacking in his hero's erudition.--Oxonian2006 00:26, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Gay bar appearance?

A very good (gay) friend of mine claims he has often seen bushell drinking in gay bars and pubs around London- interesting in the light of the almost obsessive homophobia he exhibits in his newspaper columns... quercus robur 2 July 2005 20:34 (UTC)

That was probably me -- we look very similar. Taxonomyyeti 16:18, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

so what does that make him gay? at least he has the confidence to go in there if it was him that was even seen

[edit] NPOV/Clean up needed

Tagged. The first section in particular needs a lot of cleaning up, and there are a few instances of unencyclopaedic language here and there. Badgerpatrol 02:50, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

Although if it was said that he probably had a screw loose it has to be said that there is probably more accurate that anything else that could be said on the subject of Gary Bushell, he is like the human incarnate version of the Tower of Babel and if anybody could reproduce the works of Shakespeare with an unlimited amount of typewriter ribbon and limitless supplies of paper and random typing I'm sure he could! As such probably with regard to Gary Bushell an Uncyclopedia article on him is always probably going to have the problem of being overly factual even if it is entirely made up, just as with Hunter S. Thompson--Lord of the Isles 18:45, 29 July 2006 (UTC)

It's hard to read too ... doesn't flow very well.

[edit] Unreferenced

I have tagged this article as unreferenced. Please see the verifiability policy. Alun 05:56, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Election

just a clarification note, but although it wasn't on the same date as elsewhere in the UK it was still the General Election ballot and not a by-election. --Vamp:Willow 11:11, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Homophobia cat

I've removed Category:Homophobia again for two reasons:

  1. He isn't homophobia
  2. Homophobia isn't central to who he is or what he did. See Category talk:Homophobia for consensus on how/wen the cat should be used. He's certainly made some homophobic remarks, but he has an openly gay man as godfather to his child - hardly central to who he is.

Please comment here before reverting. Thanks! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 03:58, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

Homophobia is a category that relates a subject to the topic.
He has done more than make a few homophobic remarks (which are quite relevant to his public persona and is something he has been publicly rapped for). He launched a major campaign against the gay comedian Julian Clary to prevent him from ever appearing on television again (which failed). His relationship with Dale Winton is not relevant. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.65.89.199 (talk) 16:45, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
Yes, he's made public homophobic remarks. I don't disagree that he's homophobic - I'm just saying that he has a close relationship with a gay man, so really doesn't epitomize homophobia - certainly not in the same way that Fred Phelps and Anita Bryant do. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 18:53, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
I don't support his inclusion in the category. Although he certainly has made statements and been offensive the article is clear that he is not known for this in particular.Benjiboi 15:06, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
He may not be the exact same as Fred Phelps or Anita Bryant (yet) but the fact remains that he is widely known for his homophobic remarks, now more than ever after OFCOM recently pasted him for it. He has become far more well known for his homophobic attitude than he has for his punk musician aspirations or his Trotskyist beliefs. His friendship with Dale Winton is not evidence of anything. In the time of slavery, many slave owners treated slaves with kindness and dignity, allowing some to become cooks, housekeepers, and work with their children in their homes instead of out in the plantations. It didn't stop it from still being slavery though. For all we know, Bushell (or his wife) could have made Winton the godfather to his child purely to avoid the tag of "homophobia" (Winton could have had his own reasons for accepting the role). Like most bigots, Bushell doesn't actually like being seen as a bigot.79.65.51.39 20:54, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
Hi, that all may be true but the article that the rest of us have to go on doesn't reflect that the category is appropriate. I recommend looking to add references and content that speaks to this issues and then the article would potentially assert its inclusion. Benjiboi 21:54, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
May I politely suggest that *IF* it's central to who he is, and *IF* it's so widely known, then this article is written entirely wrong? The only mention of his homophobia is one paragraph in the middle of the page describing a recent event. Anita Bryant's article has her homophobia in the lead paragraph, then discusses it for the second half of the article. Fred Phelps's article discusses his homophobia throughout the entire article. Colin Ireland likewise. Tony Marco and Kevin Tebedo are only stubs, but that seems to be all they are known for. Do you really think Bushell stacks up with those? If not, I suggest he doesn't belong in the cat. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 22:03, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
This is likely because Bushell's followers keep editing the article and downplaying the issue - just the way that you are doing right now (if you ever have the time or patience, check through the entire history of the article). The OFCOM ruling a few weeks ago was huge news (it was on television and all over the national newspapers) because of the level of offence that Bushell's remarks caused. Again. You could write a whole section in the Garry Bushell article SOLELY about his homophobic opinions - but the Bushell morons would just keep deleting it, or edit it down so that it really just glosses over the subject. The fact is that for years now, Garry Bushell's homophobic opinions have steadily become a large part of his public persona and have caused quite a storm as recently as this year. The fact that he himself denies being homophobic just means that he wants to avoid being labelled a bigot (as do most bigots). However his actions match the definition of homophobia - whether he and his fans like to see it cast that way or not. It doesn't have the be the ONLY thing he is known for in order for it to be included, as people can fall into various different categories. It just has to be something that he is WIDELY known for - which he is. His actions may not be quite as extreme as Fred Phelps or Anita Bryant, but that does not stop it from being homophobia. 79.65.51.39 23:30, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
I totally agree with that. There have been similar problems on Anita Bryant's page because the homophobes don't want "their hero" being labelled as homophobic so they try to change the facts on her page and remove the categories that are placed there, even though they are more than warranted. To me, categories are not about "labelling" people either positively or negatively, it's about the truth and the grouping of articles that share similar information together into categories. Bryant's actions speak for themselves, as do Bushell's. It's not as if Bushell's homophobic opinions are just a slip or a brief lapse in judgement either...this is something that has become a trait for him and he is now quite famous for it (the OFCOM ruling this year has practically cemented this). The homophobia category should really be a reference point for people who want to find articles that relate to the topic of homophobia, and that should include public personalities who have significantly and publicly demonstrated their homophobic tendencies. I agree that Garry Bushell isn't quite Fred Phelps, but he has still demonstrated that he is homophobic and should therefore be included in the category the same way that he is included in the "journalists" category. It's just something that he is publicly known for.MassassiUK 02:18, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
Then the article needs to show it. As I stated above, it currently looks like a slip-up. If you can write it better, and provide more refs than the one from August this year, then I'll gladly accept the category. Right now, though, it's out of place compared to the others in the cat. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 04:27, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
It looks like a slip-up because his fans who edit the page keep editing it to make it look that way. If the page is rewritten to include the information again, somebody will just come along and delete, get into an edit war, and waste everybody's time. Perhaps the page should be semi-protected so that anonymous editing cannot be made. 79.65.52.66 18:10, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

(outdent) I and possibly others have watchlisted it now, so I'll be on the lookout for "fans" that want to remove properly sourced and relevant material. I don't know about protecting - perhaps if the removers are persistent it can be. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 22:03, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

I'm wondering if, in the paragraph about his talkSPORT slip-up, referring to it as a 'jokey' exchange is POV and should be removed? --ZeroP~(talk) 06:29, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Race?

The opening paragraph states "Bushell has often courted controversy because of statements on race", but the article fails to provide any examples of this. 217.155.20.163 (talk) 12:16, 26 May 2008 (UTC)