Talk:Frankenstein's monster

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Contents 1 Alternative names for the Monster 2 Article Title 3 The Bolt 4 Origin of the film look 5 Non-notable? 6 The demon? 7 Victor Frankenstein being saved by the ship 8 Pictures 9 Name of the Monster 10 Image on the page 11 Fictional Murderers listing 12 Arabian?

[edit] Alternative names for the Monster

The reason I removed "sometimes 'the fiend' or 'the creature'" from the initial description of the monster is that, out of context, no one would know you meant Frankenstein's Monster if you talked about simply the Fiend or the Creature. It's true that these words (uncapitalised) are how he is usually referred to throughout the novel, so I put a note in to that effect.

I have seen "Frankenstein's Creature" and "the Frankenstein Monster" in other places, so I put them back in. Hope this seems reasonable. Robin Johnson 08:36, 19 August 2005 (UTC)

Frankenstein is not the name of Frankenstein's Monster. I'm just trying tp make that clear. 70.69.229.164 23:06, 30 October 2007 (UTC)Proper

[edit] Article Title

On a point of pedantry, I don't know how to rename an article, but Monster should be a capital M there. (Yes, the Creature is a monster, small-m, but "Frankenstein's Monster" is a proper name.) Robin Johnson 10:32, 15 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] The Bolt

It's been changed back and forth a few times now, so I suggest we discuss this. I'm not a Frankenstein expert, so I'm suprised to see much of my original text in here. That's beside the point.

The bolts in his neck. Were they always there or not? Modern invention? Does it matter?

--Fourthgeek 06:04, 14 August 2005 (UTC)

They're certainly not mentioned in the novel. I believe Boris Karloff has them in the 1931 film; that's probably the origin of most of the 'popular culture' image of the Monster. I think there should be separate discussions of the physical description of the monster in the novel (on which very little information is actually given) and the popular image - maybe I'll hack osmething in later. (...later: done.) Robin Johnson 10:13, 15 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Origin of the film look

At least one author[*] claims that the now-iconic flat-headed look of Frankenstein's monster in the films is based on a Francisco Goya etching, Los Chinchillas (the seated/reclining figure; see this image). I don't find any mention of that in this or any of our related articles (or elsewhere online, for that matter), which credit Boris Karloff and Jack Pierce with inventing the look without mentioning Goya as its ultimate origin. Does anyone know if any other authors have mentioned this connection, either confirming it or else saying that the similarity is merely coincidental?

[*] Richard Davenport-Hines. Gothic: Four Hundred Years of Excess, Horror, Evil and Ruin. North Point Press, 1999, pp. 160-61.

--Delirium 03:36, 29 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Non-notable?

I notice that several examples of Frankenstein's Monster in other media I added were removed as "nonnotable." According to whom? "Weird Science" and "Frankenberry" are notable but "Dragonball" and "Castlevania" are not? That's remarkably illogical and highly POV. If we're going to have a section of pop culture references in this article, either include everything or nothing. --Do Not Talk About Feitclub (contributions) 13:14, 15 December 2005 (UTC)

I didnt remove it, but "everything or nothing" is not the case, this is not meant to be a complete list but notable/important ones. If you want a complete list make a "List of.." article, there must be thousands. --Stbalbach 15:26, 15 December 2005 (UTC)

"Weird Science" and "Frankenberry" are notable but "Dragonball" and "Castlevania" are not? Yeah... And that's pretty obvious too if you think about it, as first two are long term memorable references directly related to the core nature of the reference (remove the Frankenstein reference from Frankenberry or WEird science and there's nothing left), while the two you mention are current references to flash in the pan popular items that haven't stood up to the test of time and don't use the figure very prominently at all (remove the Frankenstein reference and nobody would even notice, because it's not central). All or nothing on the listing of references is an absolutely ridiculous idea... that's not a recipe for an encyclopedia, it's a recipe for a fanlisting website. If you go to a real encyclopedia and look up Frankenstein, do you think they'd mention such trivial references? Absolutely not. It sounds like you need to get a basic grip on the concept of what an encylopedia is for. You can start by looking at WP:ENC, which is one of the more important policies here, written in a way that even fans of Dragonball and Castlevania should be able to understand. DreamGuy 16:44, 15 December 2005 (UTC)

On the subject of notability: Thanks, User:Stbalbach, for suggesting that the USA Today citation is perhaps notable in the popular culture article. And completists should note Don Glut's The Frankenstein Catalog (Ann Radcliffe Award winner)[1][2]: http://www.donaldfglut.com/credits.html -- haven't checked to see if it's on the pop culture article yet. (And, no, I'm NOT suggesting taht all of the infor froom it go here -- I'm just ointing out that Glut and the book pass the notability test from having won an award.)

Other notes on the AR Award and the Count Dracula Society (for future refernces if anyone wants): [3] [4] Icarus 23 16:15, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

Oh, and here's a link to {http://www.donaldfglut.com/|Don's web site]. Icarus 23 17:33, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

I think DreamGuy's summary is pretty good, and it should be codified as policy for popular culture references of all kinds, especially in cases, such as this one, where there is no shortage of trivial mentions across media. In a nutshell, the reference ought to be such that it forms an integral part of the referrer, as is the case with Weird Science --Agamemnon2 11:02, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] The demon?

It's been a LONG time since i've read the novel, but I seem to recall that Victor referred to him as "the demon" more than any other name. Am I just wrong here, or is it possible that these other names are being taken from the 1931 film and its sequels? --MateoP 17:42, 4 February 2006 (UTC)

I am currently reading the novel, and Shelley called the monster all of these things in the book. Thorns Among Our Leaves 23:02, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

I mentioned this in the book article but I recall on at least the on occasion on the glacier that he was refered to as the Destroyer. As in, It was the destroyer approaching. Though this may seem like referanced to thewretch and the fiend, both those seem to be descriptives while the Destroyer would appear to be a title earned by his actions. 63.138.247.2 04:51, 16 December 2006 (UTC) ken

[edit] Victor Frankenstein being saved by the ship

I don't remember Frankenstein's sled falling into the sea and being saved by the ship as this article states. As I remember it he disassembled part of the sled so as to float and row towards the ship. Could this be a difference between the two versions of the book (the 1818 and 1831 editions), or am I mistaken? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Thepatriots (talk • contribs).

You are probably right, in the 1818 edition he does not fall into the ice, but breaks up his sled to build oars which to row his floating ice-raft over to the ship and safety. -- Stbalbach 19:40, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Pictures

I think that a picture should be added of Frankenstein from Van Helsing. Son of Kong.

[edit] Name of the Monster

What name was the Monster given in the play by Peggy Webling?

[edit] Image on the page

I feel that a picture that portrays the creature's appearance as described in the book (such as the one from the 1831 edition) would be far more suiting for this page than that of Boris Karloff. The Karloff picture just doesn't seem suiting and it's already featured on the page for "Frankenstein in popular culture" anyways. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.123.72.51 (talk) 17:11, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Fictional Murderers listing

Shouldn't Frankenstein's monster also be listed under fictional murderers? In the story, he murders Frankenstein's brother. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.36.203.83 (talk) 21:35, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Arabian?

I seem to remember that the "Arabian" Safie was actually Turkish. However, she is called an Arabian in the novel (by Felix), so would it be appropriate to correct this? Also, the De Laceys cannot really be called "peasants". --Kannan91 (talk) 18:39, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

I am actually reading the book right now, and you are correct. Safie is Turkish. I'm not sure what I would do about the article, though. Good point. 99.142.41.183 (talk) 15:59, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Safie is a Arabian, it's her father who's Turkish. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.180.228.186 (talk) 05:39, 11 April 2008 (UTC)