Talk:FN SCAR

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Contents

[edit] Not up to date

It is now early 2006, therefore this article is not exactly up to date. Dessydes

And nothing new has happened. It's only been three months or so since it was selected. Give them some time.--Asams10 22:31, 22 January 2006 (UTC)
The SCAR has failed a few military testing. Reliability is one of the major concerns. Special force personnel wasn't impress by it. I doubt it will deploy anytime soon. Most likely it will be cancel by the military. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 70.161.25.43 (talk) 07:54, 30 January 2007 (UTC).
Your comments are completely lacking in credibility and are, at best, wild conjecture. It IS deployed already and SF personnel DO like it. Please study the English language a bit more before you troll.--Asams10 06:36, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
Give me proof that SF used SCAR? They don't. People have to learn that any new weapon needs to meet standards. They just don't hand them out because it is cool looking. They don't. Even passing testing doesn't mean it is going into service. This is common knowledge. One year everybody happy about this state of the art rifle, next year it is a piece of junk. Don't be surprise because it happen to every rifle that complete against the AR. BTW this year is the HK416. Next year it will be rifle XXX. FN SCAR is old news and if the military does order any it will be very small amount like hundreds or less then that. SCAR is DEAD http://www.socnetcentral.com/vb/showthread.php?t=64231 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 70.161.25.43 (talk • contribs) 01 Apr 2007.
Okay, hard to deal with you when you: 1) don't sign your posts, 2) don't use the English language, 3) cite chat forums to back up your point, 4) don't really know what you are talking about. I'll cite a credible source for ya. SOF is getting 1,200 more rifles this FY. [1] Up till now, they've been testing the 2nd generation guns in places you read about in the news but might not have been. --Asams10 02:33, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

So WHY was this rifle developed and deployed? There's no 'SCAR competition' article, so it would be nice to have things clear in this article about why the U.S. wanted ARs other than the M-16 for their Special Forces. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 4.43.102.66 (talk • contribs) 09 Jun 2006.

Signing your posts would help. There was a competition. Robinson Armament had the second place entry. [2]. I don't know who else was involved. For the record, this isn't an "AR", it's a new weapon that is more compact, more reliable, more modular, etc. The reason was that M4's were not getting the job done. Special Ops folks have always had their pick of weapons.--Asams10 17:56, 9 June 2006 (UTC)
Actually, the XCR was never tested. It was booted from the competition after Robinson failed to deliver Blank Firing Adapters on time. Robison even complained about it on his website. HK was a no show, although it is reported that XM8 carbines equipped with rails were entered by a third party. Cobb's entry was reportedly eliminated due to a Daniel Defense rail prototype that became loose repeatedly. According to an article by Chris Bartocci (the author of Black Rifle II) in the July 2006 issue of Small Arms Review, the three Colt entries placed 2nd, 3rd, and 4th. --D.E. Watters 00:00, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
Colt had entries? Where could I research this. Hadn't heard that yet. I've seen recent pictures of an old gas piston conversion design Colt had floated back in the 60's updated with rails and a quick change barre. The Colt LE1020 is what I think it's called. Looked like it solved most of the problems with the M16 family.--Asams10 01:48, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
Bartocci only made brief mention of them in his article. He has stated on AR15.com that there will be a full article on the Colt SCAR entries in a later issue. --D.E. Watters 02:40, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
The SCAR is NOT YET deployed. It is still a project, and needs some testing. It's likely that the US SOCOM might cancel the program because of a lack of performance of that weapon equipped with a sound suppressor. A few batches have been sold to France and Spain so far, and Slovenia could buy a few thousands too in the near future. -Armorersdream 20:23, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
SCAR is a complete failure. It has reliability issues and SOCOM has more or less given up on it.

[edit] Another Name?

Isn't Another name for the FN SCAR the SCFR with the HW and LW types?

209.120.160.28 15:39, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

I'm not sure about that. However, I am curious what the progress of the SCAR is as of now, late May 2007. Still delayed, or being deployed?

Delayed, not deployed yet ! Armorersdream 19:44, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Man, when the heck is the SCAR coming out for SOCOM then? Don't tell me they made this big of a fuss over this weapon and gave up on it...

Patience is a virtue.--Asams10 07:02, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

Good point, man, but there has been a major slowdown of info on the status of this gun. It seems that SOCOM is letting FN fix the gun and then they are retesting it, but I just wish for a status report and when the gun will be ready for the enxt evaluation.

Please sign your posts. It hasn't been too long, really. They made PROTOTYPES and a pre-production batch. There is nothing to FIX, but there are adjustments that always have to be made. In the Gun Industry, you're lucky if that takes less than 2 years, funding or no. --Asams10 14:05, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

Right Asams, you're well informed. The SCARs prototypes are to be tested on the field by the SOCOMs in the second half of this year, and the first quarter of 2008.Orders may then follow if the results are satisfying enough. Good point is that the guns are entering the second phase.Armorersdream 19:44, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

Initial, official information released by FNH referred to the SCAR as "S.O.F. Capable Assault Rifle"[1]. This article and other sources refer to it as "S.O.F. Combat Assault Rifle". Someone needs to find out the correct name and cite it, preferably from an official FNH webpage. 68.162.31.125 (talk) 01:00, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

Old information[3] and new information[4] from FNH USA both indicate "S.O.F. Combat Assault Rifle" -- Hayden120 (talk) 01:34, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Just wondering

I was just wondering why the army would want to replace the m4. I read the issues section, but none of those things that i saw required a whole new rifle. Ben.yarmis 04:04, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

Um, yeah. When you pull the trigger and the gun "don't go boom," you die. That's not just an 'issue' that's a tragedy. --Asams10 04:30, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
Have you even shot an M16/M4 or are you talking out of your ass. Asams? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.161.25.43 (talk) 20:45, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

The M4 is based on the M16 and inherited its default, mainly a reliability that would not be accepted for a modern weapon. The accuracy is an issue too. The SCAR is a class I reliability weapon and it will last long.Armorersdream 18:36, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

AR-15 rifles are actually very accurate due to less moving parts; the reliability of the direct impingement system is the issue. Hayden120 (talk) 01:37, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:SCAReglm.jpeg

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BetacommandBot 19:16, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Marines and the SCAR

I was curious if the Marine will use the FN SCAR, because I read online that they were not going to rule out the SCAR L to replace their M16's and M4's, but I don't know how long ago that article was created. Also, will Force Recon use the SCAR?24.15.64.119 19:02, 13 August 2007 (UTC)Jake

At this point, only the SOCOM is testing and plans to order the SCAR in all versions. But as always, when the SOCOM adopts a weapon, the Army and the Navy tend to use the same equipment, since it's field-proven. So I think that in I'd say something like 2 years you could see the first orders for the other military units. Armorersdream 17:19, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

FWIW: Just this month, USMC Systems Command - Infantry Weapons Systems announced its intent to purchase two Mk 16 SCAR-L, two Mk 17 SCAR-H, one Mk 13 EGLM, two HK416, and two HK417. D.E. Watters 19:04, 16 August 2007 (UTC)


And if SOCOM uses it, doesn't that mean that the Marine branch of SOCOM (is it MARSAC?) will also use it? Like the elite recon units and whatnot?24.15.64.119 05:34, 17 August 2007 (UTC)Jake

Of course, if SOCOM eventually buys the SCAR, all the special units under its command will have it ;) Armorersdream 18:15, 17 August 2007 (UTC)


I know alot of people have their doubts over the FN SCAR, but if its good enough for SOCOM and MARSOC, its good enough for me.24.15.64.119 03:48, 18 August 2007 (UTC)Jake

I dought it will go into regular use soon or ever. The M16 will be used for at least another 15 years not becuase of how well it will performs it a cost issue. SOCOM can buy all these weapons as they only have to buy mayby 600 but the standard military command has to but 50,000 or them. It will probaly cost a little over a billion to replace the weapons so i highly dought it will become standard issue unless they can use allllot of the parts of the M16.(ForeverDEAD 19:41, 21 August 2007 (UTC))

Obviously you now nothing about that market. The SOCOM should shortly order a batch of a few thousand weapons for eval, then they will start ordering bigger quantities if they are satisfied (and they look so). So the SCAR is just a matter of time, but probably next year some units will already be aquipped with it. And NO, they are absolutely not compatible with the M16 so the parts and the guns will probably be sold to some other countries still using that old design.Armorersdream 16:56, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

My comment about regular use seems vague to me and to clear up any misunderstanding by regular use i ment normal troops like the first infrantry division.(ForeverDEAD 19:41, 22 August 2007 (UTC))

Of course, it will also be a matter of budget Armorersdream 21:41, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Redirect

could some one have Mk. 16 and Mk. 17 redirect to this page —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.109.102.105 (talk) 20:01, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

I'd do it but I don't know how. Sorry, I'm knew. Help Required.13Tawaazun14 (talk) 02:48, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

There, I just did it. — DanMP5 03:21, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks mate.13Tawaazun14 (talk) 15:24, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] in use yet?

Has the FN SCAR been issued in the field yet? 82.47.137.100 19:23, 20 October 2007 (UTC)

No not yet, though i could be wrong. Last time i checked it was going through final testing so unless canceld it should be in use soon ForeverDEAD 19:32, 20 October 2007 (UTC)


Actually the SCAR is delayed yet again with problems with the handle and suppressor. It might not get adopted at all. I know this from a Marine. He says that SOCOM is getting sick of waiting for FN to fix the weapon. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.15.64.119 (talk) 21:44, 1 January 2008 (UTC)


His infos are not reliable then. The sound suppressor is working well and meets the requirements. The first phase of field testing is just finished and the results are very positive. So stay optimistic, it's just a matter of months.Armorersdream (talk) 22:31, 5 January 2008 (UTC)


Well, he was involved in testing of the weapon. He doesn't like it personsally. Also when he tested it, and I believe he is part of MARSOC, he said they had many problems with it. He did say that when USASOC tested it it was positive, though. He just doesn't think the SCAR is going to be accepted. If you find out more info, Armorersdream, I would appreciate it if you posted it here; specifically if the gun passes testing or fails, etc. I would like to know when it is going to be in use.24.15.64.119 (talk) 23:08, 21 January 2008 (UTC)jake


One more thing: I misspoke when I said the problem was with the suppressor. the problems they experienced in testing was overall wear and tear of the weapon. They yested SCARs that were previously used along with fresh test models. He said the ones that fired about 1000 rounds started to break down. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.15.64.119 (talk) 23:10, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] 7.62x39

I just noticed that the article mentions near the top that FN is not offering the SCAR-H in 7.62x39, but that directly contradicts the statement in the purchases section that indicates that thousands have been sold in that caliber. I've also read comments by an FN employee to this effect, that 7.62x39 is in production now, and will still be for the civilian version.

Anybody got a solid reference to support this? CrunchRiff (talk) 12:48, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

Well, since this is your conjecture now, would you like to reference it? FN is not currently marketing a SCAR version in 7.62x39mm, however there was some talk about it early on.--Asams10 (talk) 16:26, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

No and no, no SCAR has been made in 7.62x39 and no scar has therefore ever been sold in that caliber :) When the 7.62x51 and the 5.56x45 will be in mass production, then maybe a third version in that caliber will be made. Armorersdream (talk) 22:34, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

How about the numbers in the procurement section, then? Was there a Low Rate Initial Production in 7.62x39 or no? If not, where'd those numbers come from? It's very strange to me that this feature would be dropped because this caliber is a big part of the reason the SCAR program was started in the first place. I'll look for the ref.CrunchRiff (talk) 12:43, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Not sure if you're actually reading these, LRIP has just STARTED for the other two versions, and you're wondering if there was ever LRIP for the 7.62x39mm version? As yet, there is no confirmation of a Prototype let alone pre-prodction or LRIP. There is no real advantage to the 7.62x39mm operationally (well, for the US at least) except in the minds of some non-operators. FN would probably like to market their gun to countries currently using the 7.62x39mm, however a 6.8mm, 6.5mm, or 5.45mm are just as marketable at this point. As I've heard the story, FN said, "We're even going to give you a 7.62x39mm version because we know you want one," and to that, Delta, at least, gave a resounding, "What?" --Asams10 (talk) 13:05, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

See here: http://www.dtic.mil/ndia/2006smallarms/smith.pdf LRIP is concluded, as are the initial end user evaluations.

Read through this a while ago, but this was before delays. IIRC, the timeline stated there is actually optomistic by about one year based on current developments. --Asams10 (talk) 18:12, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

As to caliber conversions: (question copied from page 3 of http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=6&f=24&t=228800&page=1) "I know the SCAR H was supposed to also be able to shoot 7.62x39...is that still the case? or are these rifles 223 and 308 only? any info greatly appreciated"

The reply from a (supposed) FNH USA Employee: "Right now only in 5.56 and 7.62... We have a prototype coversion kit (barrel, bolt, and magazine) for the Mk16 (SCAR-L) that converts it to 6.8 SPC, but that is on permanent loan to one of our customers. Once things settle down with the current crop of work I'm sure we'll see more development into other caliber conversions (which will all be based on the Mk17 / SCAR-H receiver)."

I know, don't believe everything you read on forums. Of course. This guy just presents himself believably. At the same time, this answers my question. There is no production of 7.62x39 yet, even for LRIP.CrunchRiff (talk) 16:16, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

As to my earlier comment about the SCAR program, I was under the impression that SCAR grew out of this: http://www.quarterbore.com/kac/sr47.html CrunchRiff (talk) 16:35, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Looks like no sign of a 7.62x39mm anywhere still, but the 6.8 required a mere barrel/bolt/magazine change no changes in the mag well as would be required for the Soviet round. The SR47 was actually predated by several other projects, including one that utilized AK-47 magazines. The SR47 is a high-end product by a company whose firearms are rarely purchased outside of special government contracts. Colt made a 7.62x39mm AR-15 first, again IIRC.--Asams10 (talk) 18:12, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Sorry to disappint you guys, but no prototype has been made in 7.62x39, nor in 6.8 and there is actually NO conversion kit since the initial models are not fully fieldable yet ! As I said before, ths testings give positive results and the SCAR will soon be in production on a large scale. Armorersdream (talk) 20:53, 9 January 2008 (UTC)


Sorry to dissapoint you, Armorer, but the weapon is really not preforming well after a lot of use. And by a lot, I mean 1,000 or so rounds. the weapon has a lot of wear and tear. The Marine over at the discovery channel Futureweapons board who got to fire the SCAR said it does not achieve much over the M4. Really, its just a waste to replace the M4's with it. And you keep saying the weapon will be here "soon" or in large production...I would like to know where you recieved this info, against a real Marine who fired and tested the weapon. I hope just as you do that the weapon turns out great, but you do seem a little too optomistic.24.15.64.119 (talk) 02:54, 12 February 2008 (UTC)jake

[edit] Update this Page!

Will someone with credible weapon knowledge update the status of the SCAR? How is testing going, that sort of thing?24.15.64.119 (talk) 00:23, 20 February 2008 (UTC)jake

It's up to date. Testing is complete; they're in production. --Asams10 (talk) 00:30, 20 February 2008 (UTC)


Wow. Even the Marine I'm friends with at the FutureWeapons board had hands on testing and said he wasn't sure when it would be ready. When do you suppose they will be in service?24.15.64.119 (talk) 00:59, 20 February 2008 (UTC)Jake

Double wow. Like I know a Marine AND a SEAL, AND a Delta Operator at the FuruteWeapons board. Give me a break... Anyway it'll be ready when it's ready, just be patient. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.100.181.55 (talk) 12:58, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

Yeah I know its worded kind of childish...but I don't know their names over there. but seriously, those guys know their ****. And I saw the fnhusa website and it said they plan on putting the weapon onto the field FY2009. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.15.64.119 (talk) 13:27, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] EGLM

Why is the EGLM a part of this article? It can be used with the SCAR, certainly, but it's a separate weapon that was originally designed for the FN F2000. Which predates the SCAR by six years. 71.203.209.0 (talk) 18:16, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

The EGLM is unique to the SCAR AFAIK. --'''I am Asamuel''' (talk) 18:33, 21 April 2008 (UTC)
I can't find anything supporting the FN2000 arguement...you sure it was originally designed for it? Everything that I've seen and heard says it's only for the SCAR rifles. (13Tawaazun14 not signed in)71.179.8.102 (talk) 23:53, 25 April 2008 (UTC)
Just to clear this up, the EGLM is designed specifically for the SCAR family of weapons. The F2000 does have a grenade launcher attachment, much like the M-203 and the new HK grenade launcher for the HK416 and G36. The EGLM however has been developed as part of the SCAR program, and therefore is a part of this article. --Darth Windu (talk) 16:38, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] OK, needs major update

The SCAR has been deployed by this point. The article should express that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.15.64.119 (talk) 19:14, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Do you have a source for this...?13Tawaazun14 (talk) 22:24, 3 June 2008 (UTC)