Talk:Flower/Archive 1

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[edit] Image placement

The sunflower image overlaps the text in Opera browser. Part of the para on the right of the flower cannot be read. This displays fine in IE. Jay 13:54, 18 Oct 2003 (UTC)

Is it any better now? Angela 14:12, Oct 18, 2003 (UTC)
Yes image and text are separated now. Thanx :) The text still touches the image in Opera, where as there is a tiny gap in IE. But they are browser incompatibilites I guess. Another good reason to always have the image on the right side of the page. Jay 14:24, 18 Oct 2003 (UTC)
Wow, that is bad (Opera). There are lots of images on the left in Wikipedia. Could it have been something else about the layout (not just the fact was placed on left) but maybe the formatting used to place on left? - Marshman 17:14, 18 Oct 2003 (UTC)
It was ok on the left. Someone else has changed it since it was fixed. Angela 17:22, Oct 18, 2003 (UTC)
I think the image placement follows the general standards of wikipedia image placement, so nothing wrong with that. I checked out with some other pages also, and the problem still exists with Opera. e.g., Arundhati Roy (this uses DIV tag). The images and text separation is fine in Opera for some left sided images, e.g., in Mohandas Gandhi and Shah Jahan. Thats because it uses TABLE tag. So DIV is the culprit. Jay 19:10, 18 Oct 2003 (UTC)


Are you sure divs are the problem. When this was in a div and on the left it worked in Opera. Angela 20:21, Oct 18, 2003 (UTC)
Just to clarify, we're talking abt the problem of text touching image and not image overlapping text. The latter problem was solved by Angela's edit. I checked out the left-side image suggestions from Wikipedia:Image markup. If the markup is followed exactly, the image and text come out beautifully in Opera as well. What's missing here in the DIV tag is a "margin:0 1em 1em 0;" whatever that means. Include that and it works fine. Jay 20:46, 18 Oct 2003 (UTC)
I can see that, I am using Opera too. Maybe right-align will be better? --FallingInLoveWithPitoc 01:44, 19 Oct 2003 (UTC)
I moved the image to the right, as there are lot of images posed on the right too, see History_of_the_PRC_(1976-present). Jay's right, adding "margin:0 1em 1em 0;" can solve the problem, it works ok in Opera then. --FallingInLoveWithPitoc 01:54, 19 Oct 2003 (UTC)
I cannot tell from above what works and what does not on Opera. But if the problem is (was) only the text touching the image then the margin statement should fix that. For information, "margin:0 1em 1em 0" means the following: "Add the following spaces around the image: top none, right 1, bottom 1, and left none" (note clockwide from top) and would be appropriate for a left aligned (left side) image. - Marshman 00:48, 20 Oct 2003 (UTC)

[edit] Floral formula

Could somebody explain what a floral formula is, either here or in its own article? Tuf-Kat 04:31, Mar 8, 2004 (UTC)

Good idea. I'll put something up - Marshman 00:00, 9 Mar 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Flower Evolution

I'd like to see discussion of the evolution of the flower.

[edit] Flower in Daily Life/Romantic Love

Could somebody write about flower in daily life or in romantic love? Which kind of flower should I bring to sick people, to love one, or for funeral, etc.Roscoe x 18:52, 19 Sep 2004 (UTC)

An interesting question, Roscoe X. There are many flowers that have special symbolism, so that would be a worthwhile subject to cover in an article. As for "doing the right thing" in the situations you describe, I hold that when uncertain, juist bring what pleases you. Few people really hold to the symbolisms anyway, so it is doubtful you could make a social blunder by bringing the wrong kind of floral arrangement. - Marshman 17:27, 20 Sep 2004 (UTC)
I've started a new category on flowers as symbols in the hope that someone will expand on it. honeydew 13:47, 26 Nov 2004 (UTC)
Mistletoe is not a flower - Marshman 18:10, 26 Nov 2004 (UTC)
That's true; didn't think of that. I've taken it out. Anyone know of any more examples to add? - honeydew 01:46, 27 Nov 2004 (UTC)
There are flowers that are symbolic of countries or regimes - Marshman 02:41, 27 Nov 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Incorrect Link

The flower encyclopedia link has been discontinued or moved or something. I just tried it, and it didn't work. Does anyone know what happened or if there's a way to note that the link doesn't work? - Clevomon 21:14, 23 Dec 2005 (UTC)

I had no problem. Outside links do not always work, but there would be no point in noting anything other than what information one might expect to find there. Not our responsibility if not working, as long as only temporary. If permernant, then delete link from article. - Marshman 02:59, 24 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] New image

Some arranged flowers
Some arranged flowers

I'd like to propose this image for inclusion in the article.

You might want to put that in the floristry article since it shows flower arrangement, used for decoration. If you want to put it in this article, try to identify the species. SCHZMO ✍ 13:13, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Flower name

Name this and make me happy!
Name this and make me happy!

Hey, does anybody know the name of the flower in the photo to the left? I've already asked the same question at sci ref desk. __earth (Talk) 07:02, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Plant Vagina

The page Plant Vagina should redirect here, can someone do this for me scince I am not sure how?--GorillazFan Adam 05:39, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] No Flower History?

I was puzzled, upon coming here to check for any new info on flower evolution, to discover that there is not even a section for it in the entire article. I generally think of "evolution of" to be the second most important part of an umbrella "creature" article, like snake, bird, et cetera, and therefore of course of their herbal equivilents. As with learning the history of anything, often much of the best, most useful information on a topic tends to be wrapped up in how it came to be, in the most comprehensive and useful way.

Anyhow, to help rectify this absence, I put together a little Flower evolution section, hopefully it's a tolerable start.--Kaz 16:45, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] WikiProject?

This might be the wrong place to ask this but is there a plants/flowers wikiproject? I have tons of (super-)macro plant photos I've taken sitting on my computer some of which I'm sure would be useful to a WP article somewhere. However the problem is I don't really have a clue what any of the plants are. If I could hand them to an intermediary who knew what they were (e.g. upload them to a WikiProject) then they could be put to good use. --cfp 02:57, 5 August 2006 (UTC)

There is indeed a Plant Wikiproject. :) --NoahElhardt 17:19, 13 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] HTML errors in the beginning??

The article starts with A flower, (<Old French flo(u)r<Latin florem<flos), also know. I wonder, should all those < symbols really be there? Looks wrong/confusing to me. rgrds, mnemo 10:56, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Article Re-Work: Structure

This article is in dire need of a face-lift (see above). Here is a proposed restructuring to get us started. Please feel free to get involved.

Intro

  • Flower function
  • Flower anatomy
    • Floral formula
    • Flower types?
  • Pollination
    • Attraction methods (color, uv, scent, mimmicry)
    • Pollination mechanism
    • Flower - pollinator relationships?
  • Fertilization
  • Seed production
    • Seed distribution?
  • Uses by humans
    • Edible flowers
    • Horticulture/floristry
    • Flowers in art
    • Symbolism

I don't know how much of this is within the scope of this article. Should the whole reproductive cycle of flowering plants be included here? --NoahElhardt 05:41, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

Noel Noah, good start. I think that the evolution of the flower should come after function and before anatomy, because the anatomy should be seen in light of evolution. It can and should be just a single paragraph or two on flower evolution and there should be a main page on flower evolution, considering its importance in evolutionary genetics today. I would suggest Seed production be short, also, as this this should be its own page, too, and that Seed dispersal be a separate subject, rather than a sub-category of seed production, as the role of the flower in pollination, fertilization and dispersal are the major divisions in the flower as part of the life cycle of the angiosperm. Also after flower types, and within that category should be a category on aggregate flowers, or inflorescences, and then linked to the article on inflorescences. I'm assuming there is one. Also there should be a main article on flower types with all the variable types, from the undifferntiated to the highly derived. There is a main article on pollination, I'm assuming, that lists the various mechanisms? The flower pollinator relationships should actually be the section on co-evolution of the flower and its pollinators, I think. This will be a lot of work. Let me know what you think of my comments and additions. KP Botany 21:05, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
I understand your reasoning on the placement of the Flower evolution section (whoops, totally missed that one first time around...), but feel it less important than floral anamoty and pollination/flower cycle, which both deal with what the flower currently is rather than how it got there. Then again, a short section on floral evolution could serve as a "history" section and would work well to introduce the function and need of a flower. I've added a subsection for co-evolution with pollinators, but feel a short section on how the flower color/morphology/blooming time is linked to its specific pollinator(s) would be informative at that point. We can go farther into how those relationships developed later on. How does the following look?:

Intro

  • Flower function
  • Flower anatomy
    • Floral formula
    • Flower types
      • Aggregate flowers
  • Pollination
    • Attraction methods (color, uv, scent, mimmicry)
    • Pollination mechanism
    • Flower - pollinator relationships
  • Fertilization
  • Seed production
    • Seed distribution
  • Evolution of the flower
    • Coevolution with pollinators
  • Uses by humans
    • Edible flowers
    • Horticulture/floristry
    • Flowers in art
    • Symbolism

--NoahElhardt 18:13, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

Noah, I think for a general purpose encyclopedia this might work as well or better than my idea of putting evolution earlier, especially if you include coevolution with pollinators after introducing both the flowers and their pollinators.
Seed dispersal should be its own category, not a sub-category of seed production. It isn't a subcategory of seed production at all. "Dispersal" is the correct term.
How about this? KP Botany 19:11, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

Intro

  • Flower function
  • Flower anatomy
    • Floral formula
    • Flower types
      • Aggregate flowers
  • Pollination
    • Attraction methods (color, uv, scent, mimicry)
    • Pollination mechanism
    • Flower - pollinator relationships
  • Fertilization
  • Seed production
  • Seed dispersal
  • Evolution of the flower
    • Coevolution with pollinators
  • Uses by humans
    • Edible flowers
    • Horticulture/floristry
    • Flowers in art
    • Symbolism

[edit] 2nd image ?

anybody know the proper name for that? I'm no botanist, but I don't think blue summer flower is all that descriptive... Zotel - the Stub Maker 14:12, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

Looks like an Hydrangea (Hydrangea macrophylla) to me. Either way, it should be removed, as it does not add anything to the article, and secondly because it is technically not a flower, but rather a cluster of flowers. --NoahElhardt 15:04, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
Could it be useful as an example of a flower cluster, one of the multiple ways flowers are attache to their "base" plants? Zotel - the Stub Maker 18:58, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Floral variety in images

Can we add some floral variety in images instead of the heavy lily/monocot emphasis? I'm not good at formatting images, so I'm not the person to do, but let's leave one monocot, and add an eudicot, and some basal monocot, and something from horticulture. KP Botany 00:46, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Still really overdoing the monocots, can someone please make sure there are basal angiosperms, monocots, dicots, horticultural, etc., so the images are of a great variety, not concentrated in one area, with half representing monocots, and the other half the rest of the plant kingdom? Love the image of the child sniffing the flower. A water lily or magnolia would be great. KP Botany 00:39, 24 December 2006 (UTC)
I plan to do some more work on this article in the coming week... I have lots of flower images on my laptop (and there's plenty of excellent ones already on the commons), so I'll see what I can do. --NoahElhardt 01:36, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Blue flower picture?

I contacted the owner of the blue flower picture at the top of this article. When ask he did not know what type of flower it was. Does anyone know? If so, please contact me, and feel free to update the caption with the correct name under the picture itself. Thanks. Veracious Rey 00:22, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cleanup

This page really needs some cleanup. Is anyone interested in collaborating to turn this into a well written, organized, and illustrated article? Just as an example, here are a few problems I see just from glancing over the page:

  • The flower anatomy picture used was created (by me) to illustrate Sarracenia flowers in particular, since they are so abnormal. It would be great to illustrate flower anatomy with a picture of a more typical flower. I can probably make one of these.
  • Many flower parts should have their own articles, giving more details on their function. (ex., how does the pollen reach the ovules?)
  • Is the poem in the "Flowers in arts" section really necessary?
  • the "Flowers in gardening and horticulture" section only has a series of links right now.
  • The "list of flowers" in the see also section seem rather random and can never be conclusive, and so serves little or no purpose.
  • This article has a grand total of 1 reference right now. Some more citations would be good.

There is some good material in this article that can be re-used, but a lot of stuff needs clearing out and a lot of material is badly missing. This is probably one of the most imporant articles in biology, and should be quality. Is anyone with me on this? --NoahElhardt 22:34, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

I don't believe the poem is necessary, nor the external link to "Ah Sun-Flower". I lack the background in botany to really help create the type of content needed in this topic but your plan sounds good.Camillia 14:26, 16 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cleanup: posted 12/2006

Well, I've spent the last three hours trying to clean this article up. Whew!!! This is most extensive undertaking I've spent in my time here on Wiki. Anyway, I have deleted a few unnecessary pics, added one new pic, and resized all of them so as to bring uniformity to the article. The different sizes and various placements had everything looking sloppy.

I have merged two sections and added a redirect to the main article on the topic of dispersal. There were two blank headings (if you can believe that), so I simply deleted them. Simple enough! Amazing what you'll find when no one is really paying much attention.

Also, I got rid of some ridiculous links to web pages that are hardly worthy of being on Wikipedia. So I added three more links, one to Britannica and a flower conservatory, and a third to a pretty nifty flower encyclopedia with valuable information. I also cleaned up the "see also" section" with links to related articles, such as plants. I didn't rewrite much in the article, because this isn't my strength as an editor. But after all I've done, I think the article looks much cleaner, more encyclopedic, and will be better recieved by other readers. Feel free to comment on my talk page. I'm going to see about adding a tag letting everyone know this article needs help as far as the written content goes.Veracious Rey 02:01, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Based on a few more comments, I resized to smaller all the pics, and re-added the wiki language tools I accidently deleted. Veracious Rey 08:26, 20 December 2006 (UTC)