Talk:Firebender/Archive

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Bending lightning needs grammatical clean up H2P 05:25, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

Contents

[edit] Blue Fire

http://firebender.com/e1/images/524.jpg There, Azula uses blue fire bending in Avatar State, now stop changing it.

Also, as a quick note, lightning seems to require the circular movement with the Bender's arms. So unless you see them do that, it's probably not lightning.

Blue fire, or fire in general, does not shoot that quickly and in such a stright line, the fire always goes out a little then expands as fire ussually does. And remember, that attack was not powerful lightning, it was just to knock Zuko away, so it didn't take this "circle movement".

Oh and those straight lined fire blasts the monks shot in Winter Solstice were just flukes. Lightning requires the circle movements. With one hand you disconnect the negative energy and with the other the positive, then you touch the two together and shoot out the lightning. Go rewatch all lightning scenes, they all have this. In the Avatar State, Azula's blue fire shot also makes the same noise as fire where as lightning sounds more staticy. H2P 23:55, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

It was lightning. That shoot was zig zaggy like lightning. It isn't confirmed that you must make circle movements, it was asmall lightning shot. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.215.86.186 (talk • contribs) 13:17, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

I agree with H2P on this. Every other example of confirmed lightning has the circular movements and, frankly, what is shot looks more like lightning than that. It is true that this picture shows a somewhat "wavy" fireblast, but it doesn't appear wavy enough to be lightning. Furthermore, what Azula shot at Zuko in this picture is one large mass--every picture of a firebender using lightning that we've seen has shown there to be multiple streams of electricity (e.g. http://firebender.com/e9/images/163.jpg). In light of this, and the noise made when this is shot which resembles regular firebending and not lightning, I'd say that the picture H2P has provided does indeed show blue firebending. Prototime 19:44, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

This little edit war isn’t helping anyone. I suggest we either find a way to settle this or remove the mention of when blue fire was first used altogether. Anyone know of, perhaps, a third party resource that might have information on the subject, something like that? Anyway, this back-and-forth editing needs to stop… Fyre2387 20:10, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

This is out of hand. Right or wrong, an edit war isn’t the right way to resolve a dispute. See Wikipedia:Resolving disputes for the right way to settle it. Fyre2387 17:41, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm not "resolving" this, I know I'm right. There was no circle movement like every other lightning use, it was spread like fire, not sharp like lightning, and it makes the fire noise. I have replayed the scene 4 times now as well as compared it to Azula's other fire sounds. It's blue fire. 19:59, 4 July 2006 (UTC)
"I'm right" doesn’t make an edit war OK. There are procedures for dealing with this sort of situation, and you aren't following them.Fyre2387 23:27, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

As the first use of Blue Fire continues to be disputed, I’ve added the Disputed Assertion template to the line. I’d still encourage involved parties to review Wikipedia:Resolving disputes.--Fyre2387 04:53, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

...And I put it back after 24.205.142.99 removed it. Please, people, at least leave the template there while the fact is disputed!--Fyre2387 22:45, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
Why is this disputed? Look at the picture, listen to the noise. It's blue fire H2P 00:12, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

Although I agree with H2P on the issue of whether or not this is blue fire, I also agree with Fyre2387 that this edit war isn't helping anyone, and that the proper channels should be used to sort this out. Prototime 06:03, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

Guys its really only one person that is doing it. He's not a registered user and the only thing he edits is this page. I think he keeps changing it just to upset people. It's vandalism masked by an edit war. H2P 02:47, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Okay, I'm done. Whatever, it is lightning. It really can't be proven either way. This edit war isn't helping anyone so I give up. Peace. H2P 02:58, 10 July 2006 (UTC) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.205.142.99 (talk • contribs) 17:48, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

HA HA HA. Oh man. What makes this funny, besides the fact that you wrote my name to make yourself feel like the winner, is that if you check the edit section you can see who it was that posted this. What are you like 12? H2P 05:26, 11 July 2006 (UTC)
Can I request editing bans for impersonaiting another user? Because the more I think about it, the more I feel violated by this childish act of forgeryH2P 00:07, 12 July 2006 (UTC)
After this, you may want to get an admin to look around...I'd say this is proof of bad faith.--Fyre2387 01:30, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

Just leave it as it is, I lost. H2P , 11 July 2006 (UTC) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.205.142.99 (talk • contribs) 17:17, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

Yes you did lose, 24.205.142.99, big time, the moment you started impersonating H2P... we're not idiots, we can tell who is writing those self-defeat messages you fakely sign as H2P; anyone who looks at the talk page history can. I'm not quite sure how you thought doing this could help you. And H2P: I concur with Fyre2387; an admin should look at this pronto. Prototime 03:05, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
And how do I do that without going through 10 pages of "click here to solve problem"? H2P 06:02, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
I have not had the pleasure of having to deal with this sort of problem before, so I couldn't tell you. You'll probably have to go through with searching through Wikipedia policies, assuming you want an admin to deal with this. Prototime 00:20, 18 July 2006 (UTC)
I'm tired of this, I left a note on the Admin Noticeboard about what he's been doing here with the impersonation and such. I'd say its pretty clear he's not acting in good faith anymore.--Fyre2387 03:51, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

I don't want to get in any of your wars here, but it looks like lightning to me. Although I can tell how some people could look at it as fire, and to be honest, none of you know the real thing. So it'd be best to just leave out the mention in the first place. - RodneyLove

Actually, this went well beyond who was right when this guy started impersonating others, as you can see by Fyre's note above you. I actually do have proof that Azula used blue fire in Avatar State. The first is the sound created. When comparing the sound in Avatar state with the sound Azula's blue fire makes and the sound that Azula's lightning makes, the sound is identicle to her blue fire. As well, Azula did not use the circle motion to create the blue fire in Avatar State, which means it isn't lightning. As of now, ALL uses of lighting have required that circular motion. The fire is also small and only about three feet in diameter. All other uses of lightning have been very long and stringy and usually stay connected to the bender until the energies have finished releaseing. H2P 20:23, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

Acutally H2P, you really don't have "proof" you have speculation based on a screenshoot. You can call it proof after you see a CLEAR shot with NO doubt, which some people on this discussion clearly have. I still have my doubts too. IN fact many of your points are speculation, it is not proven that ALL lightning uses circular motions just all the uses we've seen so far use it. I'm not trying to start a fight here, but it'd be best if we left out that point entirely on the article. - RodneyLove

You're telling us to leave it out but at the same time you are not deleting the statement, you are changing the episode to Return to Omashu, which by what I have presented is wrong information. You are also presenting an argument that is false. Iroh and Azula are both master firebenders and both still require the circular motion, so unless the Avatar can do it at will, which is unlikely due to the unruly nature of lighting and fire, we have to go off what we know and so far we know it requires a circular motion. It is not speculation when I am only using the facts of what we know. You are the one speculating that lighting can be done in a way different than the standard ways the show has presented. H2P 20:38, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

Whoops, Well, I deleted it now. Your war with McMeaty doesn't seem like it's going to stop. The best thing right now is to just leave out the omission entirely. You still don't have proof. Proof is when you yourself can email Nickolodeon or the show creators and use their words. And unless you can see into the future you don't know if lightning can be done another way, you are still speculating based of some screenshot. I never stated lightning could be done a different way, I just said that it's not proven to only be "one way" to do it. I'm not saying your wrong or anything. I'm just saying you both (you and McMeaty) need to drop this childish edit war because frankly, you both can't prove it either way due to the nature that this is an animated show, not real life, so there is no set way a thing could be done. Since this is an animated universe that is constantly being updated you can't prove anything since new things may come up. - RodneyLove

The problem is, McMeaty is not acting in good faith, we know this. Previously, he impersonated other users on this very talk page. That's bad faith, plain and simple, and unless he apologizes for that, I don't see how one could possibly think he's acting in good faith, and last time I checked, a bad-faith edit is called vandalism.--Fyre2387 00:01, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

I've removed the mention entirely. The screenshot can't really be considered proof as anyone may interpret it in his or her own way. We need a written source that identifies the thing in question. It's best to leave it blank for now. Lord of Meat 04:56, 20 August 2006 (UTC) McMeaty

[edit] Bending Lightning

H2P has stated that bending lightning requires one to touch their fingers together. THis is spure speculation and is contridicted on both the main page with Azula generating lightning and in the episode "The Chase" when Azula destroys the walls of rock created by Toph. And also it's also speculation that one needs one hand to control the negative energy and one to control positive. This is all a bunch of fantasy created by an all too avid Avatar fan.

Thanks for not signing your post. I rewatched The Chase and while I admit that I can't tell if her fingers touched or not, she had to use both hands. It's true that we don't know if lightning can be done with one hand, but thus far all uses of lightning have used both hands with the circular motion therefore we can infer that, until disproven, lightning requires the use of both hands. It was Iroh that told us that both sources of energy must be seperated. Since lightning requires both hands, and from most (I still say all) the times that I have seen lightning used it required the energies in each hand to crash together through touch, we also infer that one hand collects negative one collects positive.
Iroh's direct quote: "The energy is both yin and yang, positive energy and negative energy. Only a select few firebenders can seperate these energies. This creates an imbalance, the energy wants to restore balance and in the moment the positive and negative energy come crashing back together you provide release and guidance creating lightning."
Iroh's quote proves that firebenders must seperate the energy, proves that they must be brought back together (maybe not a direct touch but somehow the energies must connect), and tells us that firebenders can not control lightning, only create it and send it in a general direction. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 21:20, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

No one never said that it doesn't use both hands. Reading Comprehension much? And it is still speculation that one must use both hands, one for negative one for positive. It is not a fact, speculation does not have a place on Wikipedia. Oh and your Iroh's quote thing, he never said you need to touch, all he said was that they "come crashing together", this can be interpreted in many ways, and your word is not law. RodneyLove 02:33, 23 August 2006 (UTC) RodneyLove

"and from most (I still say all) the times that I have seen lightning used it required the energies in each hand to crash together through touch," I like how you tend to ignore facts when presented right to you just so you aren't wrong. Remember the chase? Oh and how about the picture of Azula generating electricity.RodneyLove 02:56, 23 August 2006 (UTC)RodneyLove

You aren't presenting any actual rebuttal, all you're doing is attempting some form of character assassination. Iroh tells us that firebenders must seperate the energies. Two energies, two hands in use, no actual lightning shot out until the energy in both hands comes together, that's not speculation it's deductive reasoning. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 03:37, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

Untill you have actual video or written confirmation, this is not "fact" this is speculation. YOU don't know that each one of the hands carries the different energies, you are just speculating on some quote. That's all there is to it, untill you have hard concrete evidence, it's still speculation no matter how you word it. RodneyLove 03:51, 23 August 2006 (UTC) RodneyLove

After watching the Chase again, Azula does NOT use both hands to shoot lightning, the trail of lightning begins on her two right fingers and ends with them, never does her left two fingers ever generate or even touch the electricty. RodneyLove

I think you may be mistaken. This shot from "The Avatar State" pretty clearly shows her using both hands.--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 22:37, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Hear that sound Fyre2387? Thats the sound of the idea completly going over your head. I said in THE CHASE episode, it confirms that bending and shotting lightning does not require two hands as it CLEARY shows Azula doing it with one hand only. Never did her left hand conduct or bend electricity. Just pointing out a detail in the episode. RodneyLove

First off, there's no need to be insulting, that doesn't help anyone. Secondly, I'm not sure I agree. In this shot, from "The Chase", she is indeed using both hands. Its not totally clear if the other is generating electricity, but it is invovled.--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 04:49, 27 October 2006 (UTC)

It's funny how you only use the screenshot that only suits your arguement. First of all, even in that screenshot she is not generating electricty with that ahnd. And she is not using both hands for the lightning, it's just there for the sake of form and posture. And from start to begining, no electricity is involved with her left hand. THe fact is that Azula did not need the use of her left hand to "gather negative and positive energy" crap. RodneyLove

You're right, its crap. Clearly you know far more about Firebending than Iroh does.--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 19:53, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

All Iroh said was seperate positive and negative energies. H2P was the one that came up with the one for each hand crap. At least know what the hell you're talking about before spewing out your statements Fyre. Fact is that becasue of the Chase scene, it PROVES that one does not need one hand for negative and one hand for positive as Azula only uses one hand to control and conduct electricity. RodneyLove

Is there a reason you feel the need to insult anyone who disagrees with you? Because really, that doesn't help anything.
Anyway, I'm still not sure she's not using the other hand. In that shot I posted, you can't really tell what she's doing with it, but its clearly doing something.
Oh, and for future reference: I don't know how your keyboard works, but typing on mine doesn't involve spewing anything.--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 21:25, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I don't know who taught you english, but you should have figure of speeches down. DO I have to spoon feed you these things? Hey, should I wipe your ass while I'm at it?RodneyLove

You can wipe mine if you want. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 01:40, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
Will you please stop with the personal attacks? You're not going to accomplish anything by insulting me.--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 03:22, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
I love it when people argue via insults. It convinces me everytime. –} (talk • contribs) 06:20, 31 October

It's not just insults, it's an argument with some insults thrown in. Big differene ;)Just suck it up and get over it, sheesh.

2006 (UTC) RodneyLove

Actually...no, there isn't any difference. Calling everyone else's opinions "crap" is not how debate works. I really suggest you read and follow the terms of WP:NPA. Those rules are there for a reason.--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 16:19, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Aang

Aang has done firebending before in the Jeong Jeong episode so i put him down as a firebender since he's listed in all the other bending arts sections.

I noticed he was removed from the list, and since he did indeed Firebend in "The Deserter", at the very least, I'm curious as to why he was removed.--Fyre2387 19:32, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm not sure about this but Aang firebended while "channeling" Roku in Avatar Roku. I know that it was his past self who bended, I'm confused about this.


I'm the one who did the first post so there's visual evidence that he can firbend so i'm putting it back.


Under the notable firebenders we could just pu the avatar since he or she will always be a firebender natural born or not.

[edit] Speculation?

From Spirituality section:

“This is believed to be, because the Avatar is the spirit of the world. But the comet is otherworldly, and comes from outside the avatar's "jurisdiction", so to speak.“

I don’t ever remember that being said on-screen. We know that the Fire Nation will be unstoppable after the comet comes, but as far as I can tell, the bits about it being outside of the Avatar’s "jurisdiction" is entirely speculative, and if it is, dons’t really belong in the article.

There is absolutely no evidence whatsoever that this is the case. The only thing the show says is that it will give them incredible power. Hence, they will be able to cause so much damage that the Avatar will not be able to stop it. Never once does it mention the fact that it's not from earth. MOF 21:22, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Seems we have a consensus, I’ll remove the line from the article.--Fyre2387 02:58, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Does anyone else find it strange that a comet which are made of ice and rock would give the fire nation power

I don't remember there being literal fire in the sun, or water on the moon either. Point is that there's a degree of symbolism in all this.Sean Patrick Santos 02:08, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Protected this talk page

I've temporarily protected this talk page so that new and anonymous users cannot edit it. JDoorjam Talk 03:54, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

Seems the protect and block didn't do it, he's still at it, now as User: McMeaty. I've filled another report, hopeully we can put an end to this.--Fyre2387 21:39, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

Won't work, I have many many accounts older then 4 days. It's lightning. And IP changing is not very hard at all. Good day.

The idiot just admitted to using socks... H2P 02:26, 26 July 2006 (UTC)
And socks mean?
Using multiple accounts, usually to get around bans, restrictions, ect. Like a sock puppet. H2P 20:13, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

And what about it? There's nothing you can do about H2P. I can change IPs in less then 30 seconds. You've lost. I'll keep erasing the blue fire mention in the Avatar state, it's lighnting. And I will go on forever.

>:)

Actually, you can be reported at Wikipedia:Abuse reports for your continuous vandalism and impersonations, and consequences leading up to having your entire ISP pulled can be enacted. Sound like fun? I'd highly suggest you stop this. –Prototime (talk • contribs) 22:07, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

Oooo. And if my ISP is pulled, then what? Scary.

You're willing to potentially lose your entire internet connection over blue firebending? Very interesting. –Prototime (talk • contribs) 23:50, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

Well, first I gotta be at least blocked 5 times in on year, so I'm not worried now. Secondly, I can always make changes during my daily trip to the Library and university. And my ISP won't cut my entire internet connection, over this, I've seen these situations before and they never really turn out like you think they do. You don't scare me, nice try though.

Man, you vandals sure are determined sometimes...--Fyre2387 00:32, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Man, you guys sure are annoying.

See, I can be clever too. *giggle*

...can this be unprotected now? It looks like the vandalism stopped, and I'd like to make prose & structure edits... --Tryforceful 19:49, 13 August 2006 (UTC)

I've requested unprotection, hopefully the vandal has lost interest.--Fyre2387 21:34, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Pictures

Can someone post a link of lightning bending in action, besides the one that is in the article page? Thank you. (11987 09:02, 15 August 2006 (UTC))

Thanks to the lovely folks at firebender.com:
is a really nice one, in my opinion.
series of pictures of Azula creating lightning is here.--Fyre2387 15:39, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Zuko Bending Blue Fire

In City of Walls and Secrets, when Zuko is fighting Jet, one of Zuko's swings looks like he bended a small amount of blue fire. I saw it at youtube. at first I thought is was suppost to be an effect of fast swinging, but a closer look at it, I noticed that it wasn't strait, but wavy and extended in some areas more than others.

No. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 20:53, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

You mean "No, it wasn't"? Or are you being sarcastic? I can't read your mind. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.157.207.33 (talk • contribs) .

It's not blue fire. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 00:05, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

Look closely. Jet's weapon has the same effect.Sean Patrick Santos 02:13, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

Okay, the first time I saw it, I didn't think it was blue fire, but after I saw it agian, I'm leaning toward that he did bend blue fire. It was not as noticable as Azula's fire, but I really think that he did. Momoroxmysoxoff 29 September 16:40

It doesn't matter what you think you saw. It's an after image of the blade due to the speed it moves. It's eye candy. Any statement that it is fire is speculation that doesn't belong. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 21:25, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

Could someone then please erase the sentence in the article, that Zuko was lightningbending at this point of episode?

It is speculation so it shouldnt be mentioned in the article. However, i also dont believe it was simply 'eye candy'. Acrually, it looked more like lightning bending...

The proof of all this is on Zuko's talk page. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 15:50, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

No, it wasn't lightningbending. Zuko has not learn to do that because of the turoil in him, as stated by Iroh in Bitter Work and Zuko only know the basics, so he can make blue fire. It was the speed at which he swung the blade, and Jet thought it was Firebending when it wasn't at all.

[edit] Another Blue Fire dispute...

The article claims that after contact blue fire reverts to red fire right? Well, this is definetley true in some cases, but is not totally consistent, like seen in Appa's Lost Days, Return to Omashu etc...should we make a note of this? (11987 13:08, 16 October 2006 (UTC))

I think it's more that when it starts to burn it goes to orange (which happened in ALD). When it's just a fireblast without contact with some sort of tinder it doesn't have the time to lose the oxygen. Fire doesn't need a bender to keep moving, so I think it's more that when Azula stops actually using the fire it starts acting on its own. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 18:11, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Editing

Someone really needs to clean up this article because it's becoming really redundant. We really should avoid being redundant.-Avatarfan18

[edit] Blue Fire

Is blue fire actually "advanced firebending"? Iroh, Roku, and Fire Lord Ozai are all more skilled than Azula, but used ordinary flames. doesn't this suggest this isn't really advanced firebending, but a personal, custom style exclusive to her? Otherwise we'd hear talk of it, but they only discuss lightning. Xepeyon 04:23, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

I don't think it's in Iroh's and Roku's nature to use such a hot fire and we haven't really seen Ozai do firebending. So I'd say it's advanced, but just not something sane people use. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 04:28, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
What it seems to me is that the blue fire, which is also normally smaller, more precise (and more intense) blasts than others, may not be employed by the other masters just because it has no real purpose other than killing, or at least wounding severely. Iroh, for one, isn't a stone cold killer the way Azula is. As for Ozai, the only time we've seen him bending was when he burnt Zuko, and there he wasn't trying to kill, just humiliate him. I would say, though, that it is entirely possible it may be a sort of "trademark" move for Azula.--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 04:34, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
Welllll, we have at least scene ONE fire lord bend in "winter solstice" where one shoots fire from his mouth. It happens when Roku is talking to Aang. Anyway, we also know that firebending's power comes from emotions (specifically, anger most often) due to Iroh's talk with Zuko in bitter work. Perhaps the blue color comes from her inability to restrain her anger and hatred. A disciplined bender, such as Jeong Jeong, knows how to avoid this mistake due to its negative tendencies. In someone like azula, however, who, while still being skilled at the art despite inability to control herself (unlike Zhao, who only had the former), it may be manipulated into the bending style she displays.

[edit] Origin

So we don't get into a revert war, I'd like us to start a discussion here instead of trying to communicate via the Notes section on new edits.

Within Avatar, we've never seen Roku's dragon breathe fire and never heard anybody mention fire breathing dragons; we don't even know if dragons in Avatar breathe fire (Fire breathing is a trait of the western dragons, not eastern; though I admit I'm not positive here).

The sun was specifically mentioned by Jeong Jeong as a source of Fire and, even though it was never pointed to as the source of Fire knowledge, it has definitely been mentioned as having a connection, dragons haven't even been tentatively connected.

It's not definite that the sun is the source, and it is mentioned as such within the origin section of the article, but it has at least been mentioned, dragons have not. JBK405 18:34, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

I believe the point you made in the second paragraph is refuted by the most recent avatar episode in which Iroh demonstrates that the reason he is called "the dragon of the west" is because of his skill in breathing fire. Also, Iroh mentioned in the very first episode that the key to firebending was in the breath; firebenders use their own body heat to generate their attacks. To say that lack of sun makes for no firebending proves that the sun is the origin would be like saying lack of earth to bend makes for no earthbending proves that the ground itself is what taught earthbenders to bend. I insist that, for want of solid evidence for either side, it at least be mentioned that there is a possibility for the dragon to be firebending's origin. In addition, the moon's effect on waterbending is hardly the same as the sun's effect on firebending. The moon literally pushes and pulls the water (in the form of tides), exactly as waterbenders do. The sun, however, does not control fire in any way. It would be a waste of time to look to the sun for a way of manipulating flames.

I just saw the latest episode and, though Iroh truly kicked ass, all he said was that he got his nickname from breathing fire, not that fire came from dragons. The Big Bad Hippo from The Blind Bandit didn't act like a Hippo or do any Hippo-style fighting, he was just huge and had hippo-style teeth, but he took the name anyway. In addition, Firebending may come from the breath, true, but all creatures breathe, and a fighting style doesn't necessarily imply the source (Airbenders are nimble and light, but the Flying Bison themselves are huge and heavy). Iroh didn't say anything specific about dragons; there's yet to be even a mention of real dragons breathing fire. Also, Flying Bison have only been seen to fly and make gusts of wind straight out or straight in (Swatting air with his tail or sucking it in with his mouth), yet the Airbenders learned to move the air side-to-side and whatnot; just because the original Bender doesn't do something doesn't mean it's completely outside a Benders possibility. Afterall, the moon doesn't create tsunamis or freeze water, yet Waterbenders do. It's their inspiration, and the sun might have been the original inspiration to create fire (Jeong Jeong did say that it was the worlds greatest source of fire).

I'm not saying that there is solid evidence for the "Fire from sun" theory, it's just vague hints, but there has been absolutely no evidence for the dragon theory, not even vague hints. The lack of a moon takes away Waterbending because they emulated the moon, and it's stated that the lack of the sun takes away Firebending. Again, I'm not saying that it proves Firebending came from the sun, but it does prove that there is some connection, which they have not done so for dragons.

All creatures breathe, and multiple people have been seen with animal-style nicknames; so far there has been no connection made between dragons and Firebending.JBK405 05:50, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

Okay, I added an additional sentence about the dragons, the fact that Iroh got the name only because of that one skill implies that there's at least some resemblance (The Big Bad Hippo did look like a Hippo afterall), but right now that's all we have to go on. I think it's a good balance. JBK405 06:13, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

I added a comment about Roku's guide.

Sorry, but I took it away. A persons mount isn't an indication of their bending inspiration, Earthbenders learned to bend from badgermoles, but they ride ostrich horses. It hasn't been established that a persons animal companion is connected to their art. JBK405 15:22, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Color of the Elements

I'm just wondering, The Water Tribe wear blue because the water looks blue, but the swamp water benders wear green, because the water looks green. So why does Azula wear Red? Why doesn't she wear blue cloths, because of her Lightning and Blue Hot Fire?

Umm...they were green because their clothes are made of vines and leaves. Besides, it's even possible they were originally white but got diry from the green water. Azula wears red because, for one thing, blue is more closely associated with water than fire. Red is simply the mascot color of fire. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.61.200.253 (talk • contribs) 23:42, 3 December 2006 (UTC).

She might bend blue, but the majority of Fire is red/orange; natural fire as well (It's very rare to find blue-flames in the wild). It might not be her personal style, but red is still the general color of Fire. JBK405 23:36, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

Besides, the clothing colors are probably a cultural thing. Firebenders don't wear red because the bend red fire, the wear red because the is the style of their nation. Exhibit A 23:52, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Breathing Fire

In the latest episode, The Crossroads of Destiny, Iroh breathes fire. Would you be able to say that firebenders emulate the western dragon. He did say "Dragon of the West".Boywonder18 04:50, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

That's because the Fire Nation IS IN THE WEST! H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 04:52, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

But still though, since the show has an Asian theme and the Asian dragon doesn't breathe fire. Could you say that the dragons in the show emulate both the eastern and western versions of the dragon.Boywonder18 05:40, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

The dragon seen with Avatar Roku had wings, a totally western trait, and I remember hearing somewhere that the creators put the wings on it in order to blend the eastern and western dragons, but we're still lacking solid proof that the Firebenders learned Fire from dragons (Or even that Avatar dragons breathe fire at all). JBK405 05:52, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

Make sure no one changes that until we have solid proof where firebending originates from. Should someone put both theories on the origin section ? I was just wondering... Boywonder18 06:05, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Agni Kai

What is the name and number of the episode when the prince had to face his father in the agni kai arena? I think this is when he got the scar on his face.(Ghostexorcist 09:32, 6 December 2006 (UTC))

It happened before the start of the series, but it was detailed in flashbacks in The Storm, episode 12 of Book 1. JBK405 15:46, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Disappearing

are Firebenders really able to disappear in a ball of Fire? We've seen Azula do it in the chase, and we've seen Jeong Jeong do it when surrounded by Firebenders. 72.154.89.221 13:57, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

It's less disappearing and more smoke screen. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 14:14, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Think of it as you would a small smoke bomb, ninjas do it all the time in movies and television shows. It just disguises their exit. JBK405 15:18, 13 December 2006 (UTC)