Talk:Female science fiction authors

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[edit] non-authors

<2 cents>Please note: Judy-Lynn Del Rey known as an editor (I think also writer). If we have an entry on Women Science Fiction Authors without one on Women in Science Fiction, somebody is sure to producean example of a woman noted for being the latter without also being the former. </2 cents> —Preceding unsigned comment added by Conversion script (talk • contribs) 15:51, 25 February 2002 (UTC)

[edit] ghettoization?

I'm all for increasing the exposure of the talented writers listed here, but must we continue to marginalise women? Surely there should be one category (Science fiction writers), rather than pushing women writers over in the corner in their own category away from the 'real' writers. Too much of this in general, and way too much in the SciFi community. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.26.24.213 (talk) 13:07, 12 July 2005 (UTC)

  • In gender-based categories, btw, people are supposed to be listed under both the gender-subcategory and the larger non-gendered category to avoid just this problem that you point out. However, this is a list; and they luckily don't even run into this problem at all. --lquilter 22:31, 30 January 2007 (UTC)
    • Wiki is replete with lists of people divided into small categories: black lawyers, Arizona state legislators, etc. That in no way excluded them from being regarded and addressed as part of the broader universe to which they also belong. Some people like to have a list of Danish-Americans, or Albanian authors, or whatever, to explore a realm in which they are particularly interested. As long as nobody is saying, "Ursula can be with the boys, but Suzette just goes on the girls' list!" I see no reason to worry. --Orange Mike 22:47, 30 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] women / female, nouns / adjectives

Shouldn't the title of this article be "Female science fiction authors"? "Woman" is a noun, "female" is an adjective. Thue | talk 09:27, 18 December 2005 (UTC)

I'd second that as I first did a search for "Female Science Fiction Writers" and with a nod to the question below about fantasy writers it would be easy enough to call it "Female speculative fiction writers" unless there's an interest in keeping the list focused on science fiction. Marc Kupper (talk) (contribs) 05:54, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
For some reason, it is customary for lists like this to be headed "women" whatever, rather than "female" whatever; maybe it has to do with "female" as a purely biological term? As to the other: the big problem is with the differing interpretations of what constitutes "speculative fiction." Some just use it as another term for "science fiction" that doesn't carry connotations of rocket ships and blasters; some use it as a euphemism for science fiction that lets them sneak it past the English Department's prejudices; some make all sorts of esoteric distinctions that seem to boil down to "science fiction that doesn't actually get read by the kind of nerd who reads that sci-fi crap"; some use it as I think Heinlein and others intended, as a broader term that encompasses science fiction in the narrowest interpretation and various kinds of non-mimetic fiction not normally thought of as encompassed in "science fiction." (If you like science fiction and are annoyed by prejudices, I invite you to read the talk page for The Road (novel), where I'm being assured that the subject book isn't SF because it isn't genre crap.) --Orange Mike 13:22, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
Given that the topic of Women vs. Female has been sitting on this talk page with no discussion I suspect there's little interest in changing the main article title and I added a redirect for Female science fiction authors.
Regarding "speculative fiction" - I had brought it up as, to me, science fiction is a subset of speculative fiction and it seems that Women science fiction authors is about this subset and not fantasy, horror fiction, supernatural fiction, or other subsets of speculative fiction. I wanted to add some authors such as Fiona Patton that would better qualify for a List of women fantasy-genre authors page but was not sure if I should create a new page or expand the scope of this page. Marc Kupper (talk) (contribs) 22:58, 24 April 2007 (UTC)
A lot of the women on this list have written in all the above modes. I'd say just bring Ms. Patton on into this list and let folks know about her, rather than start a bunfight about genre definitions. I believe I've met her a time or two, always at science fiction conventions. --Orange Mike 23:07, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] What about fantasy writers

Tamora Pierce is a fantasy writer. Should she be included in the list? Murray Langton 12:43, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

with Tamora Pierce in mind, then Patricia McKillip should also be included. After all, Anne McCaffrey is very much a fantasy writer. 24.98.68.172 17:09, 30 January 2007 (UTC)

1) It is traditional to include fantasy in with science fiction; for one thing, many writers work in both genres (or sub-genres). 2) McCaffrey is a poor example: if you read her books carefully or talk to her, you will realize that she is not writing fantasy. Neither low-technology settings nor large flying reptiles cause a science fiction book to turn into fantasy. Hers is a strictly science-based universe, with no fantasy elements involved.--Orange Mike 21:27, 30 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Humorous edit summary of the day

"cat women" made me laugh. Avt tor 21:26, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] "Women's literature" as an area of study

(I am posting this message on the discussion pages of several likely articles and lists; sorry for the cross-posting):

I'd like to invite anyone interested in women's writing to read and comment on a draft article, " Women's literature in English." It began in response to the recent removal of " Woman Writers" as a category. It's close to being finished, but a few more eyes would be really helpful. Thanks! scribblingwoman 16:07, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

Update: I just (finally) submitted the category for review for reinstatement. Fingers crossed. scribblingwoman 15:10, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Notable?

What qualifies a writer as "notable?" For example, the list is missing

I know I could add these to the main page but can think of several dozen more names that are probably not as "notable" as the examples I just listed. Marc Kupper (talk) (contribs) 05:44, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

They may be prolific, but are still obscure to me. On the other hand, every year at Wiscon we don't run out of women to discuss in the "More Women SF/F Writers You Never Heard Of" panel either! --Orange Mike 23:15, 24 April 2007 (UTC)
Got it - now I understand that the "gold standard" for inclusion on this list is that they need to have met Orange Mike at least a time or two at a science fiction convention. <wink> I've been looking at the individual author-bio pages to see what the general trend for notability is and think I'm getting a handle on this. I'm surprised Heidi Wyss passed muster as her one SF story is a free-on-the-web thing. Marc Kupper (talk) (contribs) 01:51, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] "about a couple of non-English authors"

I see no reason at all to tag some of these folks, just because they're non-English. (Heck, we see more of Elisabeth at Wiscon than we do of a lot of US-based authors.) --Orange Mike 13:19, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

I tagged because I did not recognize the names and once I realized they are not writing in English (nor have English translations) that they should be tagged so that others know their works are not available in English. It is the English Wikipedia site and presumably the notable non-English authors should be noted as such. If there were many foreign authors I'd break the page into two lists, one of the ones whose works are available in English and another whose works are not.
Also, why did you remove my change of Elizabeth Lynn to Elizabeth A. Lynn? She's credited as Elizabeth A. Lynn on all the books that I have and already has a wiki page under that name. Marc Kupper (talk) (contribs) 19:11, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
Didn't mean to revert E. Lynn; will fix it, if you haven't already. And some works by Vonarburg (a member of the Science Fiction Writers of America, by the way) are available in English; even one of her pieces as "Sabine Verreault" has been translated![1] I don't see any reason to stigmatize authors this way; how do other editors feel?--Orange Mike 20:15, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
Thank you for the fix and note on English translations Mike - I guess the "(country)" notation (or maybe women SF writers) is not a hot topic as no one responded over the weekend. I took a look at a number of wiki lists and it does not seem like "(country)" is a common convention. I had not seen it as a stigma but in thinking about this I suspect this sort of thing better belongs in a database like ISFDB where people could get flagged as being female, Croatian, etc. and then people interested in some mix of characteristics can pull up a list. Marc Kupper (talk) (contribs) 20:06, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Category

Shouldn't this be a category rather than maintaining the list on a page? See Wikipedia:FAQ/Categorization for pro/con of doing this. Marc Kupper (talk) (contribs) 22:11, 28 March 2008 (UTC)