Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Pierce Brosnan/archive1

The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was not promoted 00:34, 18 April 2008.

[edit] Pierce Brosnan

Well on the way to FA Ultra! 23:42, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

Comments

• A large number of your refs lack publisher information and some also lack last access date information
  • Done Ultra! 16:22, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
    • Second reference (Hello!) is lacking publisher information. I'd also have to say the title would probaby be "Actor Profile: Pierce Brosnan", not "HELLO" which is the name of the magazine's site. And two more at the bottom of the ref list, current refs 65 (the official Pierce brosnan site) 66 (sustainable style foundation) and 70 (sea shepherds). Also current ref 75 is a bald link.
• http://theblobsite.filmbuffonline.com//News/2005/NewBondNamed.htm deadlinks for me as does http://triad.bizjournals.com/triad/stories/2006/07/10/daily18.html
  • Done the second is no more dead. Ultra! 16:15, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
    • First one is still dead, and http://www.the-numbers.com/movies/series/JamesBond.php now deadlinks.
• Does http://www.showbiz.ie/about/ have a reputation for fact checking? Granted the information it's referencing isn't contentious)
• http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001096/bio is probably not a reliable source for Timonthy Dalton's biography.
• What makes http://www.moviehole.net/ a reliable source?
• WHat makes http://www.mi6.co.uk/mi6.php3 a reliable site?
• You format the Pierce Brosnan website different ways: piercebrosnan.com or The Official Pierce Brosnan, be consistent.
  • Done Ultra! 16:39, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
    • Still a few inconsistencies.
• What makes http://www.ecorazzi.com/2007/04/11/pierce-brosnan-and-co-win-battle-against-natural-gas-terminal/ a reliable source?
  • Done Ultra! 16:50, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

All other links checked out fine with the link checker tool. Ealdgyth - Talk 02:18, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

Just to chip in, MI6.co.uk is a reliable source. Alientraveller (talk) 12:05, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

I've seen boxofficemojo cited all over the web for release figures and would probably consider it reliable. Karanacs (talk) 19:00, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Yes, it's accepted by film guidelines. Ultra! 16:24, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

I'd also like to echo the statements by the other reviewers. Leaving a note on my talk page just saying "Please strike comments" I saw as somewhat demanding. It would have helped if instead of just "done" you'd told me what you had done exactly on the various issues. With thihngs like putting in publishers, I don't need notes on what you did, but for others where you might have changed out a reference or other problems, it helps if I have some idea of what was done. especially as I'm traveling at the moment and on a laptop which makes finding changes harder. Ealdgyth - Talk 14:51, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Comments—This is not yet up to standard in terms of 1a. Keep working on the prose; preferably, find a collaborator who's unfamiliar with it and can use her strategic distance to advantage. Easy to find problems, just in the lead. The whole text is at issue, not just these examples.

• "Brosnan desired to be an artist"—Please use plain English: "wanted to be". When I read "artist", I thought it was referring to his acting (as an art); then we're hit with "but". Do you mean "graphic artist"?
  • done Ultra! 16:34, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
• Please delink trivial chronological items such as "1996".
  • done Ultra! 16:24, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
• "He became a naturalized United States citizen in 2004."—Am I missing something? Can we dispense with "naturalized"?
  • done Ultra! 16:34, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
• MOS breach: "His current projects are"—How long will they be current for? Use an unlinked "As of 2008, his ...". TONY (talk) 12:20, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
  • done Ultra! 16:34, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Comment Definitely needs a copyedit. --Una Smith (talk) 21:02, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

*Oppose: criterion three concerns:

• • I’m not comfortable with Image:PierceBrosnan(CannesPhotoCall).jpg. Self-made photos rarely have such a candid vantage point, rarely have such small, non-standard dimensions (400 × 606) and rarely fail to contain camera metadata (this has only Photoshop tags); these are big red flags. Was this image taken from this site? The uploader has a talk page with several concern/deletion notifications. I’m not comfortable with the article utilizing this image. Quack.
    • done. Ultra! 18:32, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
  • Image:Young Brosnan.jpg appears to violate WP:NFCC#3A which says “one [fair use image] is used only if necessary”. Why is it necessary to see a young Brosnan? What significant contribution does this photo make to our understanding (required per NFCC#8)? Free images of Brosnan as an adult are both capable of being obtained and perfectly adequate to facilitate understanding (NFCC#1).
    • done. Ultra! 18:32, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
  • Image:Brosnan at Madame Tussauds.jpg does not have the correct license. The Flickr user has released it under Attribution 2.0 Generic, not Attribution 3.0. ЭLСОВВОLД _talk 14:47, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
    • done. Ultra! 18:32, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
      • Stricken of my own accord. Please allow reviewers to strike their own comments going forward so Sandy/Raul can ensure they have been addressed to the reviewer's satisfaction. ЭLСОВВОLД _talk 18:45, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

• Oppose. The article needs a thorough copyedit. There are also a few MOS issues, improperly formatted refs, and I think another look at the organization is in order. Please note that the copyedit concerns below are examples - this is not a full list.
  • Newspaper names should be italicized
  • There is no mention of his marriage until the James Bond section. I see that later in the article there is a Family section; this should be incorporated into the rest of the biography
  • Per WP:ELLIPSES, there should be a space, then three dots, then a space.
    • Done Ultra! 20:55, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
      • Still looks to be formatted incorrectly. Karanacs (talk) 14:44, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
  • The first paragraph of the James Bond section does not flow at all.
    • Done Ultra! 16:37, 14 April 2008 (UTC)]
      • There is still little transition between the thoughts. It doesn't read well. Karanacs (talk) 14:44, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
  • Lots of overly colloquial terms - "got a job", "left the door open", "brought things full circle ", "made" instead of earned/grossed/etc, "kept in mind", "right up until"

Karanacs (talk) 16:00, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

I revisited today. While some of the specific concerns have been addressed (in a very timely fashion!), the overall quality of the prose is not up to FA status. If you don't know any good copyeditors, I'd recommend requesting that the League of Copyeditors give you a hand. My oppose will stand until the article has gotten a thorough copyedit. Karanacs (talk) 14:44, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

• Oppose The prose is very poor. Here are some examples:
  • desired to be ?
    • Done Ultra! 15:52, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
      • No not done: Brosnan desired to be an artist in the Lead.
• Done Ultra! 18:36, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
  • for work as a nurse
    • Done Ultra! 15:52, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
  • William Charmichael.[4][5]Brosnan quickly embraced his mother's new husband as a father figure.[4] Carmichael took Brosnan Is it Charmichael or Carmichael?
    • Done Ultra! 15:52, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
  • Brosnan's first met Albert R. Broccoli, producer of the James Bond films, he visited his first wife ???
    • Done Ultra! 15:54, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

In the UK we don't have High Schools so why When he attended high school, his nickname was "Irish".

• Done Ultra! 15:52, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

And the section about charitable works begins with a whole paragraph about politics: Brosnan supported John Kerry in the 2004 Presidential election and is a vocal supporter of gun control and same-sex marriage.[65] An outspoken environmentalist,[66] Brosnan was named 'Best-dressed Environmentalist' in 2004 by the Sust... GrahamColm^Talk 13:09, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

• Done Ultra! 15:52, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
• And there is more, His portrayal of the Shaw. ? and, and w0ould cause damage to the marinme life there. There are other examples, please check the whole article and not just the points raised here. GrahamColm^Talk 17:38, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
  • Done Ultra! 18:36, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
• PS. WRT the demand you made on my Talk page to strike out my comments, reviewers are not obliged to do this. The onus is on the nominator to explain exactly what , if any, edits have been made in response to reviews. Strike outs are made solely for the benefit of the v. busy FAC directors. I will strike out my comments when I'm convinced that the whole article has been thoroughly copy edited. GrahamColm^Talk 21:25, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

Mere comments ---> oppose declaration. I was asked to return, even though I hadn't formally opposed. Rather, I made comments, which meant that I didn't want to have to come back. But on reflection, I'm moving to an Oppose.

• Why do I find things such as "Brosnan's first met Albert R. Broccoli, producer of the James Bond films, while meeting his first wife, Cassandra Harris, on the set of For Your Eyes Only." Eeuuuwww. Grammar and repetitions; commas are chaotic. That was the first sentence I laid eyes on.
  • Done Ultra! 14:21, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
• Then ellipsis dots without the spaces that are required by MOS.
  • Done Ultra! 14:21, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
• Then "... to replace then Bond Roger Moore"—ah, you mean "... to replace the then Bond, Roger Moore"?
  • Done Ultra! 14:21, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

This is not good enough, and the hard work other reviewers have put in to demonstrate why the writing needs to be significantly improved throughout has not been carried through—merely subverted by the addressing of their examples alone. Sorry to be so blunt. A collaborator is necessary. TONY (talk) 12:43, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.